Turning down T10

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This hypothetical question doesn't exist in real world. If you can get in T10, many (so many) SLACs will give you a full ride. Williams being the most generous, but Amherst, Swarthmore, Pomona, ..., all give out generous aids like there is no tomorrow.

This is true! if you can gain admission to a T10, you likely can find several schools outside the T25-30 that will give your kid great merit and that includes many in the 30-100 range (really 30-70 range as well). So if you apply accordingly, you can attend a T50/60 for $40-50K.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This hypothetical question doesn't exist in real world. If you can get in T10, many (so many) SLACs will give you a full ride. Williams being the most generous, but Amherst, Swarthmore, Pomona, ..., all give out generous aids like there is no tomorrow.

Yes, but only if you qualify for it financially. How much is the max a family can make and still get full aid at WASP? Probably $200K or $250K. For a family with other children, perhaps with special needs, or with dependent aging parents, it could be a hard to turn down free.

I do agree, however, that outside the top 100 seems a big jump. Seems there would be schools in the T30-99 that would also give v generous merit aid to a T10-admitted student

There are.

My kid was deferred/WL/rejected at all T30's they applied to. They got $42K/year at a T50 bringing costs to ~$40-45K/year. They had a T70 that would only cost $50K.
They found all of that and we were not searching merit---kid is attending a T40 at $90K/year because we can afford it and they liked that school better than the T50

But for a kid qualified for a T10, they can find great merit just a step or two down, don't need to go to 100+

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If I can afford any of the schools in the T10, my kid would be going to the T10 if they feel they will be happy there.

Really, 400k for 4 years of happiness? Or Only for finance, pre law, pre med and cs? Is that where the happy kids are?

The key is "if I can afford it". And IMO, if you can also afford to help with graduate/professional school (if that is in your kid's future). If you can easily afford it, why not spend? That is why you save

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It is also your social and professional network for the rest of your life.

Not true for many people.

Especially those who attend grad school.

Stinks to be you. For many people I know, particularly those who went away to elite schools, it is.

Attended both elite undergrad and grad programs. I have good friends from both, but my best friends in life are from the last 30+ years of working and living life. I'm still friends with those 5-10 people, but we live in different places. I made most of my friends post college and I think that is what many people do. Sure your wedding might have been 50% people from college, and you likely got married within 5-8 years of college graduation. But are they all still your besties now, unless you live in same area?

[Anonymous]

I went to an Ivy and I am in vague touch with my college friends. My closest friends are other moms who I met when I moved to DC twenty years ago and we raised our kids together in the neighborhood. They are from a totally random smattering of schools, some of which I had never even heard of growing up. I live in a wealthy neighborhood and my neighbors went to every kind of school you can imagine - state, SLAC, Ivy, etc.

The whole college networking thing is way overblown. You make professional contacts thought your first few jobs out of school.

My husband has 3 degrees from Ivies and he is in closer contact with his college friends, but his closest friends are actually from high school. For work related stuff, he does draw on his law school classmates, but that's to be expected.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know two families that had their kids attend the less expensive public options over T-10’s. The decision was driven by finances. Both families solidly middle class with both parents working full time, living in suburbs with good Public schools. The elite privates need to do better when it comes to being accessible to top students from middle class families. My kid is at a private T-30 and most of the kids there are either very well-to-do or on generous financial aid.

This doesn’t make sense. The median US HHI is $80k. That’s solidly MC. Any kid from that demographic would go for free to an elite private. $0 COA.

Heck, now you get free tuition if your HHI is $200k…which is way above MC.

My guess is you have your own definition of MC which isn’t reality.

You do? Where and under what circumstances? Sign me up!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Depends on my financial situation. Not if I could afford a T 10.

+1

100% depends upon your financial situation.

If you have the $400K plus enough for graduate school/professional school (if that's the path your kid might want) saved/readily available, then no I wouldn't make my kid turn down a T10. They would get to pick their top school for them/best fit without concern for finances.

If I can only comfortably afford $40K/year, then yes my kid would likely take the full ride and start their life debt free.

😂 “only” 160k for an undergrad degree…basically pocket change

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hypothetically Northwestern for full pay vs full ride at University of Missouri. So many variables but the financial factor can be significant depending on the family’s situation.

As a HH making less than $200k without enough saved to pay $400k for NU, *I* would encourage the full ride and pursue grad school

+1

All T10 are great schools but they are not worth $200-400K+ of debt. A kid that got into one of those will go far in life, no matter where they go. But they will go even farther if they are debt free and can attend Graduate school when desired without as much debt either (assuming you would help them pay for it since undergrad was free)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hypothetically Northwestern for full pay vs full ride at University of Missouri. So many variables but the financial factor can be significant depending on the family’s situation.

As a HH making less than $200k without enough saved to pay $400k for NU, *I* would encourage the full ride and pursue grad school

If it’s a state flagship in the T100 range, I think it’s ok. People understand that college is expensive. But Not a random small school. Why aren’t there any T30-T70 colleges in the mix? If this kid hass gotten into T10, those would give scholarships too.

Because many people apply to 8-10 T25 schools and then a few safeties, assuming their kid will get into at least several of the T25. Not realizing that if you apply to many in the 30-70 range, your kid can get great merit. My own kid did just that and we were not even searching for merit. It just happened. Had we been looking, we would have had many more merit offers as well

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If I can afford any of the schools in the T10, my kid would be going to the T10 if they feel they will be happy there.

Really, 400k for 4 years of happiness? Or Only for finance, pre law, pre med and cs? Is that where the happy kids are?

It is also your social and professional network for the rest of your life. My spouse and I went to top tier schools. Many of our friends are friends from college or people we met through those friends. Half of our bridal party was college friends.

That being said, it depends on your financial circumstances, your goals, your family situation, and so much more. But the binary here is pretty extreme. If it was top 10 vs. top 50 it would be a different discussion.

This is purely anecdotal

It is the truth for virtually everyone I know. And it is not just for top tier schools. My friends who went to mid-range flagship state schools had similar experiences. Sorry it didn't work out for you.

I went to HYP and the same.
But here is something more important: I wasn't a social climber. My friends were not people who were looking to be rich, even though I had plenty of peers whose goals were that. My best friends from college I am still in contact with are very succesful, but not in positions to get me jobs necessarily.
So if your kid gravitates toward people who are gunners, then they will have friends who are gunners.

This is sort of the key thing about choosing a college for its “network.” You meet tons of interesting and eventually successful people in college but they aren’t necessarily people who can help you career wise (obviously you should have and sustain friendships for other reasons, but speaking from a purely professional perspective). Sure, alumni may help, but more likely not especially once you are well removed from school.

Also, if you are "truly T10 material" then you likely will do well in school and forge your own path. And that means once you get your first job, you likely build your contacts in the industry and thru your own work and never look back. Both my spouse and I did that. Both graduated T10 and grad school at T15. We never used our connections from those "schools" or the alumni network. Because we never needed to---we advanced quite well on our own connections thru the jobs. And you build your own network. So sure I suppose we could use the T10 alumni networks, but why? if the one we have built is working well.

(and by working well, I'd say spouse being a CEO at 41 and us being UHNW by 48 is "working well")

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went to an Ivy and I am in vague touch with my college friends. My closest friends are other moms who I met when I moved to DC twenty years ago and we raised our kids together in the neighborhood. They are from a totally random smattering of schools, some of which I had never even heard of growing up. I live in a wealthy neighborhood and my neighbors went to every kind of school you can imagine - state, SLAC, Ivy, etc.

The whole college networking thing is way overblown. You make professional contacts thought your first few jobs out of school.

My husband has 3 degrees from Ivies and he is in closer contact with his college friends, but his closest friends are actually from high school. For work related stuff, he does draw on his law school classmates, but that's to be expected.

This! Smart motivated people make professional contacts through their first few jobs and build their own network. Rarely does it involve having to contact the alumni network at your university.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know two families that had their kids attend the less expensive public options over T-10’s. The decision was driven by finances. Both families solidly middle class with both parents working full time, living in suburbs with good Public schools. The elite privates need to do better when it comes to being accessible to top students from middle class families. My kid is at a private T-30 and most of the kids there are either very well-to-do or on generous financial aid.

This doesn’t make sense. The median US HHI is $80k. That’s solidly MC. Any kid from that demographic would go for free to an elite private. $0 COA.

Heck, now you get free tuition if your HHI is $200k…which is way above MC.

My guess is you have your own definition of MC which isn’t reality.

You do? Where and under what circumstances? Sign me up!

The PP is not bright. Most schools who offer "meet financial needs" are T20-25 schools, with single digit acceptance rates. And while you might get some aid at $200K HHI, you are not getting full tuition.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Depends on my financial situation. Not if I could afford a T 10.

+1

100% depends upon your financial situation.

If you have the $400K plus enough for graduate school/professional school (if that's the path your kid might want) saved/readily available, then no I wouldn't make my kid turn down a T10. They would get to pick their top school for them/best fit without concern for finances.

If I can only comfortably afford $40K/year, then yes my kid would likely take the full ride and start their life debt free.

😂 “only” 160k for an undergrad degree…basically pocket change

Why is that shocking to you?!?! If you planned for your kid to attend college, is was obvious that by now, instate schools would be $30K+. So many MC/just above MC people did save to be able to afford that. It is called planning.

But if you were not able to, then you find schools you can afford.
You do dual entry in HS so you have your AA and only need 2-2.5 years at State U.
Or you start at CC and then transfer. Your kid can easily work to pay for CC, live at home, and you as a parents only cost is room and board in your house until they go to 4 year college for last 2 years.
First way can be done for $80 K (if $40K school) and your kid can pay for $10K of it yearly.
The 2nd is no extra cost to you until the last 2 years, and then it's at most $80K.

Or you find a 4 years school that will give your kid merit and/or FA. Step down 1-2 tiers from your kid's reach and you open up a whole world of great merit. My 1220/3.5UW/no AP kid had 2 state schools that were under $20K each, and multiple schools ranked 80-100 that were only $40K with merit (private schools close to $65K normally). And we were not "searching" for merit. Now imagine what we could have found if we made an effort

The fact that after HS college is likely the next step for your kid is not a shock/shouldn't be a shock. The fact it costs $$ also isn't a shock. So you should be planning for that, and saving over time. So yes, it is not that difficult to have a path to spending $30-40K/year for college---you had 18 years to plan. And if that doesn't work, then I've laid out several plans that can do college for under $80K total and you take one of those. Most of us live in areas where kids can earn $10K/year to put towards college that with $5.5K in fed loans and you are at 15K contributed and you as a parent can help figure out the remainder. Or you find a school that gives great merit and lower your price.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know two families that had their kids attend the less expensive public options over T-10’s. The decision was driven by finances. Both families solidly middle class with both parents working full time, living in suburbs with good Public schools. The elite privates need to do better when it comes to being accessible to top students from middle class families. My kid is at a private T-30 and most of the kids there are either very well-to-do or on generous financial aid.

This doesn’t make sense. The median US HHI is $80k. That’s solidly MC. Any kid from that demographic would go for free to an elite private. $0 COA.

Heck, now you get free tuition if your HHI is $200k…which is way above MC.

My guess is you have your own definition of MC which isn’t reality.

You do? Where and under what circumstances? Sign me up!

MIT, Penn and several others raised the limit to $200k…many others it’s free tuition at $150k.