IB Programs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The IB world history HL was more in-depth reading and writing than AP courses. Less memorizing although there is that, but more analysis and depth to writing requirements. Not teaching to the test so much. My kid loved it.

Both IB History and English are a lot more like the courses they’ll experience in college than their AP counterparts are.

And the writing for AP classes is much more circumscribed: IB teaches you how to write research papers for several different academic disciplines (using each field’s standard style guide), while AP teaches you to write an essay for an AP exam.

Your assertions are bizarre considering AP classes, including the writing intensive ones in humanities are designed to be substitutes for college classes.

AP teaches you how to write an essay for the AP exam? Sorry, but you don’t seem to have the slightest clue about the curriculum in the AP class or what’s being tested on the exam.

IB English assessment includes a 1200-1500 word essay.

AP English exam essay is 3x 45 minute essays.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My sophomore is thinking of taking IB program. She does great in her AP classes and is getting A's and is ok with the workload but we are worried if she takes IB the intensity may be too much. All of her friends are doing it and she mentions it gives a great bump for college acceptances. Curious if anyone would share their experience. Thanks!

The IB’s great bump for college acceptance is a myth, same as the supposed superiority for writing in IB compared to AP. I’ve never seen any independent evidence to support these claims.

The problem with IB is that it’s really light on actual classes, only 6 over two years, to end up with a shaky general knowledge foundation. In exchange you get busywork classes like Theory of Knowledge, “extracurricular” activities etc. When people extol the “analysis” and “critical thinking” in IB, it’s just to mask the lack of breadth and depth in the curriculum.

A comparable schedule for an AP student would be 5-8 AP classes plus a few regular ones. If you’re careful with your choices you can get a solid preparation in either sciences and humanities because it’s a la carte, so you can align the coursework with your interests.

AP is different than IB in terms of writing. All IB classes, even STEM, require a lot of analytical writing. AP classes not so much. The amount of writing is different between the two.

That said, you can indeed get a solid education with taking just AP classes.

You'll never convince a "words are dumb" STEM bigot who is insecure about their poor communication and research skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My sophomore is thinking of taking IB program. She does great in her AP classes and is getting A's and is ok with the workload but we are worried if she takes IB the intensity may be too much. All of her friends are doing it and she mentions it gives a great bump for college acceptances. Curious if anyone would share their experience. Thanks!

The IB’s great bump for college acceptance is a myth, same as the supposed superiority for writing in IB compared to AP. I’ve never seen any independent evidence to support these claims.

The problem with IB is that it’s really light on actual classes, only 6 over two years, to end up with a shaky general knowledge foundation. In exchange you get busywork classes like Theory of Knowledge, “extracurricular” activities etc. When people extol the “analysis” and “critical thinking” in IB, it’s just to mask the lack of breadth and depth in the curriculum.

A comparable schedule for an AP student would be 5-8 AP classes plus a few regular ones. If you’re careful with your choices you can get a solid preparation in either sciences and humanities because it’s a la carte, so you can align the coursework with your interests.

AP is different than IB in terms of writing. All IB classes, even STEM, require a lot of analytical writing. AP classes not so much. The amount of writing is different between the two.

That said, you can indeed get a solid education with taking just AP classes.

+1. You can do well with either and one might be better than another for a given kid but to suggest that IB lacks depth or gives you a shaky foundation is just dumb (as in do you work for the College Board dumb)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:IB programs are not the best form STEAM. Students do not do well on SAT or ACT.

eh.. RMIB kids did very well on the math SATs. My own DC got a 800, first try. The other RMIB kids I know also did well on the math section.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IB programs are not the best form STEAM. Students do not do well on SAT or ACT.

eh.. RMIB kids did very well on the math SATs. My own DC got a 800, first try. The other RMIB kids I know also did well on the math section.

to add. my DC and their friends are mostly STEM majors, CS and Eng.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My sophomore is thinking of taking IB program. She does great in her AP classes and is getting A's and is ok with the workload but we are worried if she takes IB the intensity may be too much. All of her friends are doing it and she mentions it gives a great bump for college acceptances. Curious if anyone would share their experience. Thanks!

The IB’s great bump for college acceptance is a myth, same as the supposed superiority for writing in IB compared to AP. I’ve never seen any independent evidence to support these claims.

The problem with IB is that it’s really light on actual classes, only 6 over two years, to end up with a shaky general knowledge foundation. In exchange you get busywork classes like Theory of Knowledge, “extracurricular” activities etc. When people extol the “analysis” and “critical thinking” in IB, it’s just to mask the lack of breadth and depth in the curriculum.

A comparable schedule for an AP student would be 5-8 AP classes plus a few regular ones. If you’re careful with your choices you can get a solid preparation in either sciences and humanities because it’s a la carte, so you can align the coursework with your interests.

AP is different than IB in terms of writing. All IB classes, even STEM, require a lot of analytical writing. AP classes not so much. The amount of writing is different between the two.

That said, you can indeed get a solid education with taking just AP classes.

You'll never convince a "words are dumb" STEM bigot who is insecure about their poor communication and research skills.

PP here.. my RMIB grad is a STEM major, straight As in college, taking mostly STEM classes as second year senior. They didn't need to take most of the GenEd classes because of all the credits. Went in as almost a junior.

One of their classes in college is a tech writing class.

[Anonymous]

IB teacher here—this is strictly anecdotal evidence, but every year I am surprised with the college acceptances of many of my students who have mediocre grades in their IB courses and average to slightly above average standardized test scores. Of course, other factors are at play, and many of these students have extensive resumes, but so do many of the other people applying to top tier schools.

I also hear from former students that they felt they were way more prepared for college than their peers who didn’t take IB, and that the workload seemed extremely easy in comparison. I can’t speak to feedback of AP students; perhaps they also feel the same way.

I can confidently say that the removal of “pre-IB” courses and widespread implementation of “honors for all” are two of the worst decisions MCPS could have made for our advanced programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The IB world history HL was more in-depth reading and writing than AP courses. Less memorizing although there is that, but more analysis and depth to writing requirements. Not teaching to the test so much. My kid loved it.

Both IB History and English are a lot more like the courses they’ll experience in college than their AP counterparts are.

And the writing for AP classes is much more circumscribed: IB teaches you how to write research papers for several different academic disciplines (using each field’s standard style guide), while AP teaches you to write an essay for an AP exam.

Your assertions are bizarre considering AP classes, including the writing intensive ones in humanities are designed to be substitutes for college classes.

AP teaches you how to write an essay for the AP exam? Sorry, but you don’t seem to have the slightest clue about the curriculum in the AP class or what’s being tested on the exam.

IB English assessment includes a 1200-1500 word essay.

AP English exam essay is 3x 45 minute essays.

Not to be too fixated to the number of words because I don’t think it’s an indicator of good writing, but each AP English essay is about 700 words for a 5, look up examples on the college board website. I doesn’t look like IB is necessarily better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My sophomore is thinking of taking IB program. She does great in her AP classes and is getting A's and is ok with the workload but we are worried if she takes IB the intensity may be too much. All of her friends are doing it and she mentions it gives a great bump for college acceptances. Curious if anyone would share their experience. Thanks!

The IB’s great bump for college acceptance is a myth, same as the supposed superiority for writing in IB compared to AP. I’ve never seen any independent evidence to support these claims.

The problem with IB is that it’s really light on actual classes, only 6 over two years, to end up with a shaky general knowledge foundation. In exchange you get busywork classes like Theory of Knowledge, “extracurricular” activities etc. When people extol the “analysis” and “critical thinking” in IB, it’s just to mask the lack of breadth and depth in the curriculum.

A comparable schedule for an AP student would be 5-8 AP classes plus a few regular ones. If you’re careful with your choices you can get a solid preparation in either sciences and humanities because it’s a la carte, so you can align the coursework with your interests.

AP is different than IB in terms of writing. All IB classes, even STEM, require a lot of analytical writing. AP classes not so much. The amount of writing is different between the two.

That said, you can indeed get a solid education with taking just AP classes.

+1. You can do well with either and one might be better than another for a given kid but to suggest that IB lacks depth or gives you a shaky foundation is just dumb (as in do you work for the College Board dumb)

The point is in IB you don’t get enough breadth and depth from the number of classes you take. Is one single humanities class enough preparation if you’re interested in this area? I’m doubtful.

Supposedly there’s more “analytical writing” in IB. What does that even mean? There’s less of it in AP, is that teacher dependent, built in the curriculum? Posters in this thread make a lot of assertions that don’t stand even the most cursory scrutiny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:IB teacher here—this is strictly anecdotal evidence, but every year I am surprised with the college acceptances of many of my students who have mediocre grades in their IB courses and average to slightly above average standardized test scores. Of course, other factors are at play, and many of these students have extensive resumes, but so do many of the other people applying to top tier schools.

I also hear from former students that they felt they were way more prepared for college than their peers who didn’t take IB, and that the workload seemed extremely easy in comparison. I can’t speak to feedback of AP students; perhaps they also feel the same way.

I can confidently say that the removal of “pre-IB” courses and widespread implementation of “honors for all” are two of the worst decisions MCPS could have made for our advanced programs.

The problem with these anecdotes is that they are narrated from a narrow point of view with insufficient and incomplete information. Three post later the RMIB parent will disclose that the IB poster child also took AP Calculus BC and multivariable. Is the success of the student due to the IB program or the fact that RMIB is a magnet that attracts well prepared students and has a broad course offering that goes way beyond the typical IB program.

IB programs only have a less than stellar track record.

[Anonymous]

One thing I don’t like about writing in IB is it’s emphasis on volume. All assignments come with a word count requirement, which creates an incentive for a verbose if not rambling style of writing.

AP courses have a more varied style and tend put more emphasis on structure. IB writing is more of a one size fits all, with a lot of writing but very similar approach and content. You get the obligatory “what do we know and how do we know it”, “it could be this because of that, or an alternative because of something else”. To some this passes as “analytical writing”, but it doesn’t always work. Its great for a major in medieval French comparative literature, it falls short for a lab report or economics paper. Because of all this you see IB papers on math and science with atrocious first person narrative stylistic choices. For what is worth a lab report in AP chemistry will look like a lab report with proper organization and concise and to the point style.

Most of the writing style in college is actually closer to AP than IB.

[Anonymous]

When administrators try to switch high schools from AP to IB they face strong opposition from parents. That’s all you need to know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My sophomore is thinking of taking IB program. She does great in her AP classes and is getting A's and is ok with the workload but we are worried if she takes IB the intensity may be too much. All of her friends are doing it and she mentions it gives a great bump for college acceptances. Curious if anyone would share their experience. Thanks!

The IB’s great bump for college acceptance is a myth, same as the supposed superiority for writing in IB compared to AP. I’ve never seen any independent evidence to support these claims.

The problem with IB is that it’s really light on actual classes, only 6 over two years, to end up with a shaky general knowledge foundation. In exchange you get busywork classes like Theory of Knowledge, “extracurricular” activities etc. When people extol the “analysis” and “critical thinking” in IB, it’s just to mask the lack of breadth and depth in the curriculum.

A comparable schedule for an AP student would be 5-8 AP classes plus a few regular ones. If you’re careful with your choices you can get a solid preparation in either sciences and humanities because it’s a la carte, so you can align the coursework with your interests.

AP is different than IB in terms of writing. All IB classes, even STEM, require a lot of analytical writing. AP classes not so much. The amount of writing is different between the two.

That said, you can indeed get a solid education with taking just AP classes.

Have you ever taken any stem classes in college? There’s not of “analytical writing” happening in those classes. Mostly it’s problem sets and lab reports.

Seriously I’m wondering what that “analytical writing” looks for Calculus I for example.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My sophomore is thinking of taking IB program. She does great in her AP classes and is getting A's and is ok with the workload but we are worried if she takes IB the intensity may be too much. All of her friends are doing it and she mentions it gives a great bump for college acceptances. Curious if anyone would share their experience. Thanks!

The IB’s great bump for college acceptance is a myth, same as the supposed superiority for writing in IB compared to AP. I’ve never seen any independent evidence to support these claims.

The problem with IB is that it’s really light on actual classes, only 6 over two years, to end up with a shaky general knowledge foundation. In exchange you get busywork classes like Theory of Knowledge, “extracurricular” activities etc. When people extol the “analysis” and “critical thinking” in IB, it’s just to mask the lack of breadth and depth in the curriculum.

A comparable schedule for an AP student would be 5-8 AP classes plus a few regular ones. If you’re careful with your choices you can get a solid preparation in either sciences and humanities because it’s a la carte, so you can align the coursework with your interests.

AP is different than IB in terms of writing. All IB classes, even STEM, require a lot of analytical writing. AP classes not so much. The amount of writing is different between the two.

That said, you can indeed get a solid education with taking just AP classes.

+1. You can do well with either and one might be better than another for a given kid but to suggest that IB lacks depth or gives you a shaky foundation is just dumb (as in do you work for the College Board dumb)

The point is in IB you don’t get enough breadth and depth from the number of classes you take. Is one single humanities class enough preparation if you’re interested in this area? I’m doubtful.

Supposedly there’s more “analytical writing” in IB. What does that even mean? There’s less of it in AP, is that teacher dependent, built in the curriculum? Posters in this thread make a lot of assertions that don’t stand even the most cursory scrutiny.

Arguing that IB lacks depth because some of its classes require 2 years is a good example of an assertion that doesn’t stand the most cursory scrutiny.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:IB teacher here—this is strictly anecdotal evidence, but every year I am surprised with the college acceptances of many of my students who have mediocre grades in their IB courses and average to slightly above average standardized test scores. Of course, other factors are at play, and many of these students have extensive resumes, but so do many of the other people applying to top tier schools.

I also hear from former students that they felt they were way more prepared for college than their peers who didn’t take IB, and that the workload seemed extremely easy in comparison. I can’t speak to feedback of AP students; perhaps they also feel the same way.

I can confidently say that the removal of “pre-IB” courses and widespread implementation of “honors for all” are two of the worst decisions MCPS could have made for our advanced programs.

The problem with these anecdotes is that they are narrated from a narrow point of view with insufficient and incomplete information. Three post later the RMIB parent will disclose that the IB poster child also took AP Calculus BC and multivariable. Is the success of the student due to the IB program or the fact that RMIB is a magnet that attracts well prepared students and has a broad course offering that goes way beyond the typical IB program.

IB programs only have a less than stellar track record.

Your insistence that IB is trash and AP is superior, despite teachers, students and parents sharing their positive experiences with the program, belies that you have a bias and an agenda.