Moving in Childhood Contributes to Depression More Than Poverty

[Anonymous]

think it's a shit study. Drawing shit conclusions that's going to be used to stress parents out , shame them. and pit them against each other.

[Anonymous]

What? Nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A study of more than a million Danes found that frequent moves in childhood had a bigger effect than poverty on adult mental health risk."

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/17/health/moving-childhood-depression.html

What do you think? Also, do you think changing schools several times without moving has the same affect?

I think Danish poverty isn’t American poverty (all Danes get health care!), so this doesn’t translate here.

Danish cuture is also insular and outside of Copenhagen families are generations deep in their towns. I don't think this translates well into US culture.

Have you spent time in anyplace rural in America? Maine, Wyoming, Michigan, Maine. How do you know so much about Denmark, but nothing about America?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: think it's a shit study. Drawing shit conclusions that's going to be used to stress parents out , shame them. and pit them against each other.

Who is getting pitted against who? Moving is incredibly stressful for children and has long term impacts. Most people could guess this without a study. If you’re a parent moving good kids you should feel guilty and ashamed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: think it's a shit study. Drawing shit conclusions that's going to be used to stress parents out , shame them. and pit them against each other.

Who is getting pitted against who? Moving is incredibly stressful for children and has long term impacts. Most people could guess this without a study. If you’re a parent moving good kids you should feel guilty and ashamed.

*your

[Anonymous]

Probably depends on why you were moving. I moved a lot when I was a kid. My parents were foreign grad students, then they got naturalized and we moved frequently until we settled down. Then we moved within the same area. Some moves were better. I did fine but I do think my brother suffered. I was always a strong student while my brother couldn’t keep up, especially since our moves were upgrades in school districts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it's likely correlation, not causation. My horribly selfish and mentally ill mother moved us from one part of the country to another one month into the school year (3rd grade for me, 1st for my sister). Away from our grandparents and everything we knew. There were subsequent moves due to new husbands that were awful. Yes, moving was hard -- but it was part of a big picture of a hard life.

+1

[Anonymous]

This seems so obvious to me. Moving frequently makes it hard to develop your support system. I recall a study that found that it takes most people about 3 years to develop a solid friendship, so if you’re moving often, that’s a potential problem.

My dad was easily bored and moved us a lot: Michigan, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Florida; 6 different cities about every 3 years. I’m an introvert and hated always being the new kid/ outsider. I vowed to do better for my kids. Older DS moved once, after 6th grade, younger DS remained in the same school system K-12.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe it. My parents were middle class and we didn’t struggle on income like some of my peers. But they were unstable and unhappy and I changed schools frequently - K-2 in Catholic school, 3rd at public, moved in 4th to a different public, 5th/6th Catholic, 7th public, moved in 8th to the district where I finished HS in public. Every school and district is different with a different vibe and set of kids, and in a lot of places - maybe not the DC area which is more transient but a lot of other places - the new kid is always the outsider. Remember that in a lot of places in the US, families have lived there or near there for generations. You won’t get social capital or connections in a new place when the Jones family has their name on half the businesses in town and has lived there since the 1880s.

OP again. Thanks for sharing your experience. Do you think my plan for my own kids is a bad idea? Preschool-K at a Montessori school; 1st-6th in public school; 7th-8th at a religious private school (about 60-80 kids per grade); public high school. All the schools are local to me. I worry about the transitions right before and after middle school, which is a vulnerable time for many kids.

Their friends from elementary school will have forgotten about them by the time they return in high school. It will be difficult for them. I’d almost thing it would be easier to go to a brand new high school in another town then leave for 2 years for private and then slink back to public with the same cohort of kids.

Why not do preschool at Montessori and then public all the way through? What are two years at the religious private going to do? Do those years align with your local middle school? Most middle schools are 5-8 or 6-8. And the religious school is K-8 and they will be entering in the last two years. It sounds like you are going to willfully put your kids in multiple difficult situations for absolutely no justifiable reason. I wouldn’t ever plan to do this to my children. And why not have them start public K with everyone else?

OP again. We were going to put our oldest DC in public K, but a neighboring family went through it a year ahead of us and complained about the program to us. They switched their child to private school 2 months into the school year. Thus, we enrolled DC in the Montessori school for K. DC is a complete night owl and hates early mornings (like the rest of the family), so I wanted to try the public school for the rest of elementary because it has the latest start time. However, the public middle school is the furthest away from us and has the earliest start time. Meanwhile, there's a nice religious school nearby. Ultimately, we want our kids to go to public school for HS because the large size means more class offerings. I guess this is a bad plan, so we should pick either public or private and stick with it.

What about the kids who go to magnet high schools? Do they find the transition disruptive and upsetting?

It is totally bizarre that you changed school plans based on one family that was so unhappy they moved to another school eight weeks in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"A study of more than a million Danes found that frequent moves in childhood had a bigger effect than poverty on adult mental health risk."

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/07/17/health/moving-childhood-depression.html

What do you think? Also, do you think changing schools several times without moving has the same affect?

I think Danish poverty isn’t American poverty (all Danes get health care!), so this doesn’t translate here.

Danish cuture is also insular and outside of Copenhagen families are generations deep in their towns. I don't think this translates well into US culture.

Have you spent time in anyplace rural in America? Maine, Wyoming, Michigan, Maine. How do you know so much about Denmark, but nothing about America?

I’ve spend time in both, and the cultures are just different. Even Americans in rural areas are not as insular and reserved as Danes generally, even though you could find exceptions here and there. Why is it so hard to believe that people in different countries have different cultures? Does America really need to be “the most” of everything for you? Even the most clannish and insular?

[Anonymous]

There are so many different types of poverty. We were extremely poor. When people talk about second hand stores, I would have love to have them. They didn't even exist. Getting someone else's coat was a celebration.
None of us were impacted by any of it, because we just didn't know any better. Didn't even know rich people or bananas existed. Everyone had holes everywhere and everyone was always wet and cold. We are all tough as nails now. Few people moved growing up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe it. My parents were middle class and we didn’t struggle on income like some of my peers. But they were unstable and unhappy and I changed schools frequently - K-2 in Catholic school, 3rd at public, moved in 4th to a different public, 5th/6th Catholic, 7th public, moved in 8th to the district where I finished HS in public. Every school and district is different with a different vibe and set of kids, and in a lot of places - maybe not the DC area which is more transient but a lot of other places - the new kid is always the outsider. Remember that in a lot of places in the US, families have lived there or near there for generations. You won’t get social capital or connections in a new place when the Jones family has their name on half the businesses in town and has lived there since the 1880s.

OP again. Thanks for sharing your experience. Do you think my plan for my own kids is a bad idea? Preschool-K at a Montessori school; 1st-6th in public school; 7th-8th at a religious private school (about 60-80 kids per grade); public high school. All the schools are local to me. I worry about the transitions right before and after middle school, which is a vulnerable time for many kids.

Their friends from elementary school will have forgotten about them by the time they return in high school. It will be difficult for them. I’d almost thing it would be easier to go to a brand new high school in another town then leave for 2 years for private and then slink back to public with the same cohort of kids.

Why not do preschool at Montessori and then public all the way through? What are two years at the religious private going to do? Do those years align with your local middle school? Most middle schools are 5-8 or 6-8. And the religious school is K-8 and they will be entering in the last two years. It sounds like you are going to willfully put your kids in multiple difficult situations for absolutely no justifiable reason. I wouldn’t ever plan to do this to my children. And why not have them start public K with everyone else?

OP again. We were going to put our oldest DC in public K, but a neighboring family went through it a year ahead of us and complained about the program to us. They switched their child to private school 2 months into the school year. Thus, we enrolled DC in the Montessori school for K. DC is a complete night owl and hates early mornings (like the rest of the family), so I wanted to try the public school for the rest of elementary because it has the latest start time. However, the public middle school is the furthest away from us and has the earliest start time. Meanwhile, there's a nice religious school nearby. Ultimately, we want our kids to go to public school for HS because the large size means more class offerings. I guess this is a bad plan, so we should pick either public or private and stick with it.

What about the kids who go to magnet high schools? Do they find the transition disruptive and upsetting?

Your kid is so young and will change so much, I wouldn’t worry about it now. By the time they are in late elementary school, you will know if they can handle the early start time, make friends easily, want a change or are excited about going to middle school with their friends. Just stay flexible, listen to, and observe your kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe it. My parents were middle class and we didn’t struggle on income like some of my peers. But they were unstable and unhappy and I changed schools frequently - K-2 in Catholic school, 3rd at public, moved in 4th to a different public, 5th/6th Catholic, 7th public, moved in 8th to the district where I finished HS in public. Every school and district is different with a different vibe and set of kids, and in a lot of places - maybe not the DC area which is more transient but a lot of other places - the new kid is always the outsider. Remember that in a lot of places in the US, families have lived there or near there for generations. You won’t get social capital or connections in a new place when the Jones family has their name on half the businesses in town and has lived there since the 1880s.

OP again. Thanks for sharing your experience. Do you think my plan for my own kids is a bad idea? Preschool-K at a Montessori school; 1st-6th in public school; 7th-8th at a religious private school (about 60-80 kids per grade); public high school. All the schools are local to me. I worry about the transitions right before and after middle school, which is a vulnerable time for many kids.

Their friends from elementary school will have forgotten about them by the time they return in high school. It will be difficult for them. I’d almost thing it would be easier to go to a brand new high school in another town then leave for 2 years for private and then slink back to public with the same cohort of kids.

Why not do preschool at Montessori and then public all the way through? What are two years at the religious private going to do? Do those years align with your local middle school? Most middle schools are 5-8 or 6-8. And the religious school is K-8 and they will be entering in the last two years. It sounds like you are going to willfully put your kids in multiple difficult situations for absolutely no justifiable reason. I wouldn’t ever plan to do this to my children. And why not have them start public K with everyone else?

OP again. We were going to put our oldest DC in public K, but a neighboring family went through it a year ahead of us and complained about the program to us. They switched their child to private school 2 months into the school year. Thus, we enrolled DC in the Montessori school for K. DC is a complete night owl and hates early mornings (like the rest of the family), so I wanted to try the public school for the rest of elementary because it has the latest start time. However, the public middle school is the furthest away from us and has the earliest start time. Meanwhile, there's a nice religious school nearby. Ultimately, we want our kids to go to public school for HS because the large size means more class offerings. I guess this is a bad plan, so we should pick either public or private and stick with it.

What about the kids who go to magnet high schools? Do they find the transition disruptive and upsetting?

It is totally bizarre that you changed school plans based on one family that was so unhappy they moved to another school eight weeks in.

This. Op really buried the lead here. Op you sound insane and need help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I believe it. My parents were middle class and we didn’t struggle on income like some of my peers. But they were unstable and unhappy and I changed schools frequently - K-2 in Catholic school, 3rd at public, moved in 4th to a different public, 5th/6th Catholic, 7th public, moved in 8th to the district where I finished HS in public. Every school and district is different with a different vibe and set of kids, and in a lot of places - maybe not the DC area which is more transient but a lot of other places - the new kid is always the outsider. Remember that in a lot of places in the US, families have lived there or near there for generations. You won’t get social capital or connections in a new place when the Jones family has their name on half the businesses in town and has lived there since the 1880s.

OP again. Thanks for sharing your experience. Do you think my plan for my own kids is a bad idea? Preschool-K at a Montessori school; 1st-6th in public school; 7th-8th at a religious private school (about 60-80 kids per grade); public high school. All the schools are local to me. I worry about the transitions right before and after middle school, which is a vulnerable time for many kids.

Their friends from elementary school will have forgotten about them by the time they return in high school. It will be difficult for them. I’d almost thing it would be easier to go to a brand new high school in another town then leave for 2 years for private and then slink back to public with the same cohort of kids.

Why not do preschool at Montessori and then public all the way through? What are two years at the religious private going to do? Do those years align with your local middle school? Most middle schools are 5-8 or 6-8. And the religious school is K-8 and they will be entering in the last two years. It sounds like you are going to willfully put your kids in multiple difficult situations for absolutely no justifiable reason. I wouldn’t ever plan to do this to my children. And why not have them start public K with everyone else?

OP again. We were going to put our oldest DC in public K, but a neighboring family went through it a year ahead of us and complained about the program to us. They switched their child to private school 2 months into the school year. Thus, we enrolled DC in the Montessori school for K. DC is a complete night owl and hates early mornings (like the rest of the family), so I wanted to try the public school for the rest of elementary because it has the latest start time. However, the public middle school is the furthest away from us and has the earliest start time. Meanwhile, there's a nice religious school nearby. Ultimately, we want our kids to go to public school for HS because the large size means more class offerings. I guess this is a bad plan, so we should pick either public or private and stick with it.

What about the kids who go to magnet high schools? Do they find the transition disruptive and upsetting?

It is totally bizarre that you changed school plans based on one family that was so unhappy they moved to another school eight weeks in.

This. Op really buried the lead here. Op you sound insane and need help.

If you think changing school plans is insane, then you are the one who clearly needs help.

[Anonymous]

There are some caveats with this study. Danes (and Europeans in general) do not move with the frequency that Americans move. They move far less often and for shorter distances. It follows that kids who do move in Denmark are in a small minority in their new community. If depression is linked to feeling isolated due to being shut out of social opportunities, that is not as often the case in the us, where many cities and communities are more transient, and sports clubs, social clubs etc are not as entrenched with longtime locals.

In communities where moving is not a frequent occurrence, it also follows that schools, churches, and other social groups are not as well set up for newcomers. Sports teams might not be as amenable for the super star that just moved to town. School moms might not have welcome coffees for new families. Your kid’s elementary class might have had 2 new kids join them since they were 5. This is the problem with studies, they don’t see the full picture. More studies are needed.

I moved 6 times between college and getting married. My hardest move by far, was moving back to my medium sized hometown. My high schools friends had all left, and most people there had grown up there and were not interested in making new friends. They were friendly, but they already had their well established friends. It was much easier to move to ny, San Francisco, dc, Boston etc, where many other people are also new and were interested in meeting people.