Using Noetic Math Contest Results in TJ Application?

[Anonymous]

AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

DP. MAA gives the csv files, so it's pretty easy to tabulate results. In the Jan 2022 AMC 8, 105 VA kids made at least the top 5% honor roll. Most of these kids are from NoVa. In the Nov 2021 AMC 10a, only 16 VA kids had AIME qualifying scores (6 7th graders and 10 8th graders). This would all suggest that making the AMC 8 honor roll is not that spectacular, especially if the kid is taking AoPS/RSM classes or is in an AAP center middle school with a strong math club. Qualifying for AIME in middle school is still pretty rare for NoVa kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

DP. MAA gives the csv files, so it's pretty easy to tabulate results. In the Jan 2022 AMC 8, 105 VA kids made at least the top 5% honor roll. Most of these kids are from NoVa. In the Nov 2021 AMC 10a, only 16 VA kids had AIME qualifying scores (6 7th graders and 10 8th graders). This would all suggest that making the AMC 8 honor roll is not that spectacular, especially if the kid is taking AoPS/RSM classes or is in an AAP center middle school with a strong math club. Qualifying for AIME in middle school is still pretty rare for NoVa kids.

Of the 16 middle school AIMEs, how many USAJMOs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

DP. MAA gives the csv files, so it's pretty easy to tabulate results. In the Jan 2022 AMC 8, 105 VA kids made at least the top 5% honor roll. Most of these kids are from NoVa. In the Nov 2021 AMC 10a, only 16 VA kids had AIME qualifying scores (6 7th graders and 10 8th graders). This would all suggest that making the AMC 8 honor roll is not that spectacular, especially if the kid is taking AoPS/RSM classes or is in an AAP center middle school with a strong math club. Qualifying for AIME in middle school is still pretty rare for NoVa kids.

Of the 16 middle school AIMEs, how many USAJMOs?

Probably 0.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

I did and it's lower.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

DP. MAA gives the csv files, so it's pretty easy to tabulate results. In the Jan 2022 AMC 8, 105 VA kids made at least the top 5% honor roll. Most of these kids are from NoVa. In the Nov 2021 AMC 10a, only 16 VA kids had AIME qualifying scores (6 7th graders and 10 8th graders). This would all suggest that making the AMC 8 honor roll is not that spectacular, especially if the kid is taking AoPS/RSM classes or is in an AAP center middle school with a strong math club. Qualifying for AIME in middle school is still pretty rare for NoVa kids.

Of the 16 middle school AIMEs, how many USAJMOs?

Probably 0.

For that year, it was actually 1. He didn't get selected for TJ in the new admissions process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

I did and it's lower.

Then you did it badly. I pulled in the csv file from 2022. There were 105 kids total from VA listed on the top 1% and top 5% honor rolls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

DP. MAA gives the csv files, so it's pretty easy to tabulate results. In the Jan 2022 AMC 8, 105 VA kids made at least the top 5% honor roll. Most of these kids are from NoVa. In the Nov 2021 AMC 10a, only 16 VA kids had AIME qualifying scores (6 7th graders and 10 8th graders). This would all suggest that making the AMC 8 honor roll is not that spectacular, especially if the kid is taking AoPS/RSM classes or is in an AAP center middle school with a strong math club. Qualifying for AIME in middle school is still pretty rare for NoVa kids.

Of the 16 middle school AIMEs, how many USAJMOs?

Probably 0.

For that year, it was actually 1. He didn't get selected for TJ in the new admissions process.

Do you know if he made it as a Froshmore?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

I did and it's lower.

Then you did it badly. I pulled in the csv file from 2022. There were 105 kids total from VA listed on the top 1% and top 5% honor rolls.

Generally, 10+ VA elementary school kids make it onto at least the top 5% honor roll. It's really not that special.

[Anonymous]

There is a separate honor roll for sixth graders, usually a score of 15+.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

I did and it's lower.

Then you did it badly. I pulled in the csv file from 2022. There were 105 kids total from VA listed on the top 1% and top 5% honor rolls.

I count 100+31, with 56 8th graders in the 5% not 1% list. Northern Virginia is at least 94 of the 100.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

I did and it's lower.

Then you did it badly. I pulled in the csv file from 2022. There were 105 kids total from VA listed on the top 1% and top 5% honor rolls.

Generally, 10+ VA elementary school kids make it onto at least the top 5% honor roll. It's really not that special.

I know! It's like maybe 0.0001% of the MS population so not all that special. :/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

I did and it's lower.

Then you did it badly. I pulled in the csv file from 2022. There were 105 kids total from VA listed on the top 1% and top 5% honor rolls.

Generally, 10+ VA elementary school kids make it onto at least the top 5% honor roll. It's really not that special.

I know! It's like maybe 0.0001% of the MS population so not all that special. :/

There's a huge gulf between "pin the certificate on the wall and brag to other parents/coworkers" type of special and "tj should auto-admit these kids" kind of special. It's not the latter, no matter how much you want it to be. Over 100 VA kids make it on the AMC 8 honor rolls each year. This just shows that any kids who are reasonably strong in math who also either attend RSM or AoPS classes or have a strong middle school math competition program can make the honor roll for AMC 8.

Only 10-20 middle schoolers in VA qualify for AIME. Only 4 qualify for mathcounts nationals. Somewhere between 0-2 kids make USAJMO. You could make an argument that these kids deserve to have the red carpet rolled out by TJ. You can't plausibly make the same argument for all 100+ of the AMC 8 honor roll kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AMC8 in the 1980s was much easier, so students will get high scores if these are used as practice tests. The honor rolls from recent years are available on the MAA website if people want to get the count from northern Virginia. It is much higher than 50.

I did and it's lower.

Then you did it badly. I pulled in the csv file from 2022. There were 105 kids total from VA listed on the top 1% and top 5% honor rolls.

Generally, 10+ VA elementary school kids make it onto at least the top 5% honor roll. It's really not that special.

I know! It's like maybe 0.0001% of the MS population so not all that special. :/

There's a huge gulf between "pin the certificate on the wall and brag to other parents/coworkers" type of special and "tj should auto-admit these kids" kind of special. It's not the latter, no matter how much you want it to be. Over 100 VA kids make it on the AMC 8 honor rolls each year. This just shows that any kids who are reasonably strong in math who also either attend RSM or AoPS classes or have a strong middle school math competition program can make the honor roll for AMC 8.

Only 10-20 middle schoolers in VA qualify for AIME. Only 4 qualify for mathcounts nationals. Somewhere between 0-2 kids make USAJMO. You could make an argument that these kids deserve to have the red carpet rolled out by TJ. You can't plausibly make the same argument for all 100+ of the AMC 8 honor roll kids.

I agree that 6/7th grade AIME qualifiers should be auto-accepted. Mathcounts nationals team is set at 4, so you always get 4 every year.

AMC8 Honor roll is still very very good - I imagine that 90% of the 2500 TJ applicants took the AMC8 and less than 10% of those made honor roll. It's like making a 1550+ on the SAT - it shouldn't guarantee admissions into [insert college], but it should tip the scale in the applicant's favor.

[Anonymous]

Placing in the top 5% of the AMC 8 in 8th grade is a big deal. It is not an easy or trivial accomplishment. Most of the kids taking the test are strong math students, which means that they make the test more difficult to challenge those kids. Yes, there are going to be younger kids who place in the top 5% of the AMC 8 and the AMC 10 but those kids are the outliers. Arguing that because a small percentage of top scorers are younger means that the 8th grade kids who score in the top 5% is just not a big deal undermines the work that kids put in.