50% rule is going away. Is that true?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

MOST of my working class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are already working under the table and learning practical skills in fields ranging from food service to lawn care to cosmetology to automotive repair. I’m not terribly worried that they will struggle with completing assigned hands on tasks in trade school or the world of work. I AM concerned that they will struggle to understand and address in a timely manner licensing agency communications or contracts with suppliers.

In contrast, MOST of my middle class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are struggling with poor mental health. They are currently incapable of completing assignments successfully. They are unlikely to go to college immediately after graduation and their families probably turn up their noses at trade school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

MOST of my working class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are already working under the table and learning practical skills in fields ranging from food service to lawn care to cosmetology to automotive repair. I’m not terribly worried that they will struggle with completing assigned hands on tasks in trade school or the world of work. I AM concerned that they will struggle to understand and address in a timely manner licensing agency communications or contracts with suppliers.

In contrast, MOST of my middle class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are struggling with poor mental health. They are currently incapable of completing assignments successfully. They are unlikely to go to college immediately after graduation and their families probably turn up their noses at trade school.

So you're arguing the 50% rule helps kids struggling with mental health? I'm not sure this is a real problem. Half the kids at our school have straight A's.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

Sounds like you don’t understand how trade school works. Sure there are programs that require significant outside study. But there are also programs that are 100% hands on learning with no traditional tests and no outside assignments. And people who completed these programs are probably instrumental in keeping your day to day life afloat.

People have such a ridiculous knee jerk reaction to the 50% rule, like the kids who benefit would somehow compete with their kids for anything in life. They never even bother to consider the kids who benefit. The scorn for kids who are troubled is disturbing and the failure to see the larger harm for ignoring troubled kids, kids whose families cannot support them and kids with special needs is astounding. If a kid doesn’t get a HS diploma, likely someone is going to have to be supporting them later, like us taxpayers.

I have posted this before. I have a son who benefited from the 50% rule several times in HS. He screwed up or totally did not understand a concept. The 50% helped him recovered grade wise for the semester. There seems to be this idea that everyone is just turning in a series a blank papers and handed a diploma. Many kids benefit occasionally while working hard and mostly doing fine. He is college grad and is self supporting. I think the 50% rule has a place in education...though like all things it can certainly be abused.

What the grading policy is now saying is that students do not automatically earn 50% anymore. If there is an honest attempt, then a minimum of 50% must be assigned to the grade. If a student does no work or does much much less than 50% of the assignment, then they can earn a zero. To me, that’s fair. It’s an accurate assessment of what they have earned and will clearly demonstrate need if a trend starts to show up. It forces kids to try now instead of always asking what assignments are graded and what aren’t. They thing they are gaming the system but instead they are missing out on an accurate assessment of their skills. Until more colleges do away with grades as a standard of learning this will always be a contentious issue in education. Standards-based would be a more accurate reflection but that could mean an overhaul of how we assess grades and would be a bit of an undertaking to ensure it would be done equitably among all secondary schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

Sounds like you don’t understand how trade school works. Sure there are programs that require significant outside study. But there are also programs that are 100% hands on learning with no traditional tests and no outside assignments. And people who completed these programs are probably instrumental in keeping your day to day life afloat.

People have such a ridiculous knee jerk reaction to the 50% rule, like the kids who benefit would somehow compete with their kids for anything in life. They never even bother to consider the kids who benefit. The scorn for kids who are troubled is disturbing and the failure to see the larger harm for ignoring troubled kids, kids whose families cannot support them and kids with special needs is astounding. If a kid doesn’t get a HS diploma, likely someone is going to have to be supporting them later, like us taxpayers.

So you think people in trade school don't have to make an effort? Yikes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

Sounds like you don’t understand how trade school works. Sure there are programs that require significant outside study. But there are also programs that are 100% hands on learning with no traditional tests and no outside assignments. And people who completed these programs are probably instrumental in keeping your day to day life afloat.

People have such a ridiculous knee jerk reaction to the 50% rule, like the kids who benefit would somehow compete with their kids for anything in life. They never even bother to consider the kids who benefit. The scorn for kids who are troubled is disturbing and the failure to see the larger harm for ignoring troubled kids, kids whose families cannot support them and kids with special needs is astounding. If a kid doesn’t get a HS diploma, likely someone is going to have to be supporting them later, like us taxpayers.

So you think people in trade school don't have to make an effort? Yikes.

You are intentionally twisting what I said. What I said is that for some trade schools there are no assignments or tests not that kids don’t need to make an effort. It’s a different type of learning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

MOST of my working class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are already working under the table and learning practical skills in fields ranging from food service to lawn care to cosmetology to automotive repair. I’m not terribly worried that they will struggle with completing assigned hands on tasks in trade school or the world of work. I AM concerned that they will struggle to understand and address in a timely manner licensing agency communications or contracts with suppliers.

In contrast, MOST of my middle class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are struggling with poor mental health. They are currently incapable of completing assignments successfully. They are unlikely to go to college immediately after graduation and their families probably turn up their noses at trade school.

So you're arguing the 50% rule helps kids struggling with mental health? I'm not sure this is a real problem. Half the kids at our school have straight A's.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

MOST of my working class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are already working under the table and learning practical skills in fields ranging from food service to lawn care to cosmetology to automotive repair. I’m not terribly worried that they will struggle with completing assigned hands on tasks in trade school or the world of work. I AM concerned that they will struggle to understand and address in a timely manner licensing agency communications or contracts with suppliers.

In contrast, MOST of my middle class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are struggling with poor mental health. They are currently incapable of completing assignments successfully. They are unlikely to go to college immediately after graduation and their families probably turn up their noses at trade school.

So you're arguing the 50% rule helps kids struggling with mental health? I'm not sure this is a real problem. Half the kids at our school have straight A's.

I have seen them t be immensely helpful to kids with mental health issues. You have a kid who is hospitalized and out for weeks and it’s overwhelming to try to catch up. If the student has otherwise mastered the material, giving zeros for assignments that can’t be completed is yet another kick when they are down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

Sounds like you don’t understand how trade school works. Sure there are programs that require significant outside study. But there are also programs that are 100% hands on learning with no traditional tests and no outside assignments. And people who completed these programs are probably instrumental in keeping your day to day life afloat.

People have such a ridiculous knee jerk reaction to the 50% rule, like the kids who benefit would somehow compete with their kids for anything in life. They never even bother to consider the kids who benefit. The scorn for kids who are troubled is disturbing and the failure to see the larger harm for ignoring troubled kids, kids whose families cannot support them and kids with special needs is astounding. If a kid doesn’t get a HS diploma, likely someone is going to have to be supporting them later, like us taxpayers.

The bigotry of low expectations is really something. You think you’re doing “troubled kids” a favor by believing they simply can’t do better or accomplish as much as their peers because of their circumstances. That is more prejudiced and biased than those of us who want all kids to be honestly measured and evaluated on their genuine effort.

So sad.

[Anonymous]

Its extra insulting to students who out forth effort and it's devaluing of the institution of education to pass anyone along just through pity and not demonstration of learning. Grades are not suppose to be a reflection of emotions but of learning. If a student does not know jow to read and fails an English class we should not pass them along because if they get a pity A we are giving them a certificate that basically says this person can read fine. You wouldn't give a blind man a driver's liscense because you felt sorry for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

MOST of my working class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are already working under the table and learning practical skills in fields ranging from food service to lawn care to cosmetology to automotive repair. I’m not terribly worried that they will struggle with completing assigned hands on tasks in trade school or the world of work. I AM concerned that they will struggle to understand and address in a timely manner licensing agency communications or contracts with suppliers.

In contrast, MOST of my middle class students who get lots of 50% rule grades are struggling with poor mental health. They are currently incapable of completing assignments successfully. They are unlikely to go to college immediately after graduation and their families probably turn up their noses at trade school.

I see your point, but most of my students using the 50% are in class doing very little work and skipping school/classes. It is a very strategic choice on their part. In the past it has been amusing seeing some students finally coming to school in the last week of the semester and meeting their teachers for the first time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kids in college often do expect 50% rules and retakes as freshman. Professors are also under more pressure to pass kids along because now the students are paying.

Parents have also been known to contact professors. Luckily at that point to students are adults so due to privacy laws the professors can’t talk about the student to the parent.

Ivies are complaining about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Its extra insulting to students who out forth effort and it's devaluing of the institution of education to pass anyone along just through pity and not demonstration of learning. Grades are not suppose to be a reflection of emotions but of learning. If a student does not know jow to read and fails an English class we should not pass them along because if they get a pity A we are giving them a certificate that basically says this person can read fine. You wouldn't give a blind man a driver's liscense because you felt sorry for them.

A better way to think about it is that we have much too low a threshold for entering the next level. Whether a kid got a D in Geometry through sustained effort or through gaming the 50% rule, they shouldn’t move on to Algebra 2. They lack the requisite skills to do the work so the cycle will repeat. In fact, they lacked the requisite skills for Geometry as well.

We need 70% overall average to be the floor for passing. Or we need a test that students must pass.

Secondly, offer Algebra 2 as a two year course for struggling HS students so that it moves through the material slowly enough for them. Similar to how MS offer Spanish 1 as a two year course. Students who are well-prepared can still take it in a year. Advanced students should be allowed to take it as a one semester course followed by pre-Calc. My kids took Algebra 2 one summer to advance in math. If it can be taught in 6 weeks, it can be taught in 18.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Its extra insulting to students who out forth effort and it's devaluing of the institution of education to pass anyone along just through pity and not demonstration of learning. Grades are not suppose to be a reflection of emotions but of learning. If a student does not know jow to read and fails an English class we should not pass them along because if they get a pity A we are giving them a certificate that basically says this person can read fine. You wouldn't give a blind man a driver's liscense because you felt sorry for them.

A better way to think about it is that we have much too low a threshold for entering the next level. Whether a kid got a D in Geometry through sustained effort or through gaming the 50% rule, they shouldn’t move on to Algebra 2. They lack the requisite skills to do the work so the cycle will repeat. In fact, they lacked the requisite skills for Geometry as well.

We need 70% overall average to be the floor for passing. Or we need a test that students must pass.

Secondly, offer Algebra 2 as a two year course for struggling HS students so that it moves through the material slowly enough for them. Similar to how MS offer Spanish 1 as a two year course. Students who are well-prepared can still take it in a year. Advanced students should be allowed to take it as a one semester course followed by pre-Calc. My kids took Algebra 2 one summer to advance in math. If it can be taught in 6 weeks, it can be taught in 18.

Yes. I agree. D should not be "passing." C should be passing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. The grading policy was quietly changed. Thank goodness.

I know! It's so wonderful that we can now ensure these good-for-nothings get an F- instead of F. Honestly, you think they'd have better things to worry about.

Professor here. This change will help prepare kids for college, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points.

Uh, professor, the kids who routinely get 50 percent grades are not headed to college either way.

This change will help prepare kids for trade school, where they have to make an effort in order to earn points. Better?

Sounds like you don’t understand how trade school works. Sure there are programs that require significant outside study. But there are also programs that are 100% hands on learning with no traditional tests and no outside assignments. And people who completed these programs are probably instrumental in keeping your day to day life afloat.

People have such a ridiculous knee jerk reaction to the 50% rule, like the kids who benefit would somehow compete with their kids for anything in life. They never even bother to consider the kids who benefit. The scorn for kids who are troubled is disturbing and the failure to see the larger harm for ignoring troubled kids, kids whose families cannot support them and kids with special needs is astounding. If a kid doesn’t get a HS diploma, likely someone is going to have to be supporting them later, like us taxpayers.

So you think people in trade school don't have to make an effort? Yikes.

You are intentionally twisting what I said. What I said is that for some trade schools there are no assignments or tests not that kids don’t need to make an effort. It’s a different type of learning.

So if an electrician does no work, you want him to get credit for half the job. Got it.

[Anonymous]

A “D” can be passing because some courses are terminal. However, the prerequisite for some courses needs to be a “C or better” for some courses.