What the heck is left for AO to consider

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why do we care about a six year old article in Edweek? All one has to do is compare percentage of class graduating with 4.0 at local publics v. Local privates
When many of the pubkic schools have 20 percent or more of kids with 4.0, that’s grade inflation. You won’t find that at top local private schools. Not sure why there is even a dispute about this.

So you have any data to support that actually happening?

If you are a regular here, you’ve seen the MoCo and NoVa examples. Do your own research,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are first generation or URM.

White supremacy is an ugly thing.

If you haven't been paying attention the last 30+ years, it's not about white people. The Asians are the ones getting shafted.

Not true in the UC system. UC Berkeley is 36% Asian, 22% White.

And if Berkeley was "race blind" in their admissions, do you think it would be more than 36% Asian? A qualified student should not be denied admission because of their race, in favor of a less qualified student of a different ("under represented" race.)

Why do you assume they’re losing to “less qualified” students? Perfect stat kids are a dime a dozen.

If all of these students are equally qualified, there should be no reason to even ask race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all schools have grade inflation. That'a actually a benefit of many private schools. They don't inflate grades so colleges have a better read on an applicant. No retakes means their students get what they get. No need to try to figure out of the grade is the result of multiple attempts.

My 10th grader has no retakes at MCPS all honors and AP classes, the only grades that are “easy” are Health and Music. The rest he has to work for, and has high Bs currently in two classes! (The horror!)I also have a child at an “intense” private in DC. They have to study more for an A, but not that much. I think this comment I heard people throw around of “all public schools have inflated grades” is not true. School and Teacher dependent. My private school student can raise test grades with test corrections, while my public school kid has teachers who do not allow retakes and will not raise grade with test corrections. Go figure?

This, from the MoCo policies, seems to indicate that one could average 85 for the semester (90 in one quarter and 80 in the other) and still get an A for the semester:

c) Grade 6 to Grade 12 Academic Grades
A 90-100 Outstanding level of performance
B 80-89 High level of performance
C 70-79 Acceptable level of performance
D 60-69 Minimal level of performance
E Unacceptable level of performance
E3 Students who have five or more unlawful absences in
the class
d) Semester Grade Calculations for High School Credit-bearing
Courses, Based on Marking Period 1 and Marking Period 2 Grades
AA = A* BA = A CA = B DA = B EA = C
AB = A BB = B CB = B DB = C EB = C
AC = B BC = B CC = C DC = C EC = D
AD = B BD = C CD = C DD = D ED = D
AE = C BE = C CE = D DE = E** EE = E**
*How to read chart: For example, an A in the first marking period
of the semester and an A in the second marking period of the
semester results in an A for the semester

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are first generation or URM.

White supremacy is an ugly thing.

If you haven't been paying attention the last 30+ years, it's not about white people. The Asians are the ones getting shafted.

Not true in the UC system. UC Berkeley is 36% Asian, 22% White.

And if Berkeley was "race blind" in their admissions, do you think it would be more than 36% Asian? A qualified student should not be denied admission because of their race, in favor of a less qualified student of a different ("under represented" race.)

This is why AOs reject certain kids. Once they discovered that their parents are racist, they predict that the apple does not fall far from the tree. It is a racist trope to assume that the URM student is less qualified. In many cases they are more qualified. Please take your racism and fragility someone else because you do not speak for Asians. Also, it is most definitely white supremacist ideology which bemoans the 2-3% of URM students that are attending these predominately wealthy and white institutions.

For all this talk about URMs, the majority of top universities in the United States are overwhelmingly white and wealthy. URMs are not even 10% or in most cases 5% of the student population, however you will not attack the admission of less qualified legacy and athletic students because as long as they are white it is okay.

"I have no valid argument, so I have to accuse you of being racist!"

[Anonymous]

It is a racist trope to assume that the URM student is less qualified. In many cases they are more qualified. Please take your racism and fragility someone else because you do not speak for Asians. Also, it is most definitely white supremacist ideology which bemoans the 2-3% of URM students that are attending these predominately wealthy and white institutions. For all this talk about URMs, the majority of top universities in the United States are overwhelmingly white and wealthy. URMs are not even 10% or in most cases 5% of the student population, however you will not attack the admission of less qualified legacy and athletic students because as long as they are white it is okay.

"I have no valid argument, so I have to accuse you of being racist!"

Actually, it's spot on. The numbers don't lie.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It is a racist trope to assume that the URM student is less qualified. In many cases they are more qualified. Please take your racism and fragility someone else because you do not speak for Asians. Also, it is most definitely white supremacist ideology which bemoans the 2-3% of URM students that are attending these predominately wealthy and white institutions. For all this talk about URMs, the majority of top universities in the United States are overwhelmingly white and wealthy. URMs are not even 10% or in most cases 5% of the student population, however you will not attack the admission of less qualified legacy and athletic students because as long as they are white it is okay.

"I have no valid argument, so I have to accuse you of being racist!"

Actually, it's spot on. The numbers don't lie.

Whatever. Once I see the "racist" bs I stop reading. It's obvious you have no valid argument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all schools have grade inflation. That'a actually a benefit of many private schools. They don't inflate grades so colleges have a better read on an applicant. No retakes means their students get what they get. No need to try to figure out of the grade is the result of multiple attempts.

Unless there has been a more recent study, grade inflation is worse in independent schools than public schools

https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/grade-inflation-is-greater-in-wealthier-schools-study-says/2017/08#:~:text=Private%20independent%20(not%20religious)%20schools,3.26%20to%203.28%20(0.6%20percent)

The gist of this - that grade inflation is more rampant in well-educated areas seems intuitive. There was a recent post about a kid who came down with a fever in school and took a test and his mom was going to email his advisor to see if he could retake. That sort of parent advocacy isn’t happening on the whole at low-performing schools.

Saying that, I bet these stats skew by zip code more than private v public. Would love to see someone break that out.

Much better indicator really.

Our HS has an average SAT over 1300. the national avg is just over 1000. Of course there will be a significant percent of students with excellent grades---these are smart kids with parents who expect that and get tutors if they need it (ie don't have an A for many). So yes, we don't have weighted GPAs and over 50% of the graduating class typically has over a 3.5 (UW), most of those with 4+ AP courses.

Parents are involved (over involved really) but that does lead to kids doing well in school and learning, because they don't fall thru the cracks

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are first generation or URM.

White supremacy is an ugly thing.

If you haven't been paying attention the last 30+ years, it's not about white people. The Asians are the ones getting shafted.

Not true in the UC system. UC Berkeley is 36% Asian, 22% White.

Yes but that was before the uc system went test blind.

Not sure what you mean. The UC system has only been blind for one admissions cycle, not long enough for the numbers to jump,that drastically.

Prop 209 basically took race out of the equation. If other top colleges did the same, you'd see similar numbers of Asian Americans, even with SAT scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all schools have grade inflation. That'a actually a benefit of many private schools. They don't inflate grades so colleges have a better read on an applicant. No retakes means their students get what they get. No need to try to figure out of the grade is the result of multiple attempts.

Unless there has been a more recent study, grade inflation is worse in independent schools than public schools

https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/grade-inflation-is-greater-in-wealthier-schools-study-says/2017/08#:~:text=Private%20independent%20(not%20religious)%20schools,3.26%20to%203.28%20(0.6%20percent)

The gist of this - that grade inflation is more rampant in well-educated areas seems intuitive. There was a recent post about a kid who came down with a fever in school and took a test and his mom was going to email his advisor to see if he could retake. That sort of parent advocacy isn’t happening on the whole at low-performing schools.

Saying that, I bet these stats skew by zip code more than private v public. Would love to see someone break that out.

But doesn't living in a well educated area also mean its possible that there really are a higher number of kids capable on getting As? I mean, there are a lot of really, really smart and well educated kids in the DC areas. I am not at all surprised if more kids get As around here.

YES!!! My HS has 600+ Seniors, and typically 300+ have 3.5+ UW gpa. Avg Sat is over 1350 (pre covid when everyone took it). Many of those 300+ are taking 4+ (many 10+) AP courses but dont' get any weight for them. So yes kids who live in richer households/households with a higher education level tend to do better academically, simply because they grow up in an environment that expects it and provides resources for it (tutoring, academic camps, being read too since they were tiny, etc)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are first generation or URM.

White supremacy is an ugly thing.

If you haven't been paying attention the last 30+ years, it's not about white people. The Asians are the ones getting shafted.

Not true in the UC system. UC Berkeley is 36% Asian, 22% White.

And if Berkeley was "race blind" in their admissions, do you think it would be more than 36% Asian? A qualified student should not be denied admission because of their race, in favor of a less qualified student of a different ("under represented" race.)

I'm confused. Berkeley is race blind in its admissions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you are first generation or URM.

White supremacy is an ugly thing.

If you haven't been paying attention the last 30+ years, it's not about white people. The Asians are the ones getting shafted.

To the extent this is true, they’re getting shafted by white people, not the underrepresented groups so often cited here; privilege and connections disproportionately held by white people (e.g. legacy preference, philanthropy, private school attendance) are a huge factor in admissions. All you have to do is look at the numbers—the percentages of Black, Hispanic, and Native American students at selective schools rarely exceed the single digits, well below their representation in the US population. If you think the reason Asian students aren’t getting into selective colleges is because a school increased its Black student population from 5% to 6% over a number of years, you’re pretty lost in the sauce.

And the white people working to maintain that privilege are THRILLED you bought into it. They want nothing more than to pit people of color against each other in some sort of zero sum game.

+1

Well stated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all schools have grade inflation. That'a actually a benefit of many private schools. They don't inflate grades so colleges have a better read on an applicant. No retakes means their students get what they get. No need to try to figure out of the grade is the result of multiple attempts.

Unless there has been a more recent study, grade inflation is worse in independent schools than public schools

https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/grade-inflation-is-greater-in-wealthier-schools-study-says/2017/08#:~:text=Private%20independent%20(not%20religious)%20schools,3.26%20to%203.28%20(0.6%20percent)

The gist of this - that grade inflation is more rampant in well-educated areas seems intuitive. There was a recent post about a kid who came down with a fever in school and took a test and his mom was going to email his advisor to see if he could retake. That sort of parent advocacy isn’t happening on the whole at low-performing schools.

Saying that, I bet these stats skew by zip code more than private v public. Would love to see someone break that out.

Much better indicator really.

Our HS has an average SAT over 1300. the national avg is just over 1000. Of course there will be a significant percent of students with excellent grades---these are smart kids with parents who expect that and get tutors if they need it (ie don't have an A for many). So yes, we don't have weighted GPAs and over 50% of the graduating class typically has over a 3.5 (UW), most of those with 4+ AP courses.

Parents are involved (over involved really) but that does lead to kids doing well in school and learning, because they don't fall thru the cracks

I attended a T14 law school (not YLS). We had all scored high on the LSAT, but the grades were still distributed on a bell curve.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all schools have grade inflation. That'a actually a benefit of many private schools. They don't inflate grades so colleges have a better read on an applicant. No retakes means their students get what they get. No need to try to figure out of the grade is the result of multiple attempts.

Unless there has been a more recent study, grade inflation is worse in independent schools than public schools

https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/grade-inflation-is-greater-in-wealthier-schools-study-says/2017/08#:~:text=Private%20independent%20(not%20religious)%20schools,3.26%20to%203.28%20(0.6%20percent)

The gist of this - that grade inflation is more rampant in well-educated areas seems intuitive. There was a recent post about a kid who came down with a fever in school and took a test and his mom was going to email his advisor to see if he could retake. That sort of parent advocacy isn’t happening on the whole at low-performing schools.

Saying that, I bet these stats skew by zip code more than private v public. Would love to see someone break that out.

But doesn't living in a well educated area also mean its possible that there really are a higher number of kids capable on getting As? I mean, there are a lot of really, really smart and well educated kids in the DC areas. I am not at all surprised if more kids get As around here.

YES!!! My HS has 600+ Seniors, and typically 300+ have 3.5+ UW gpa. Avg Sat is over 1350 (pre covid when everyone took it). Many of those 300+ are taking 4+ (many 10+) AP courses but dont' get any weight for them. So yes kids who live in richer households/households with a higher education level tend to do better academically, simply because they grow up in an environment that expects it and provides resources for it (tutoring, academic camps, being read too since they were tiny, etc)

If this reasoning were correct, grades at a top private would be similarly scaled high, but they aren’t. It’s all an issue of how rigorous grading and expectations are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all schools have grade inflation. That'a actually a benefit of many private schools. They don't inflate grades so colleges have a better read on an applicant. No retakes means their students get what they get. No need to try to figure out of the grade is the result of multiple attempts.

Unless there has been a more recent study, grade inflation is worse in independent schools than public schools

https://www.edweek.org/teaching-learning/grade-inflation-is-greater-in-wealthier-schools-study-says/2017/08#:~:text=Private%20independent%20(not%20religious)%20schools,3.26%20to%203.28%20(0.6%20percent)

The gist of this - that grade inflation is more rampant in well-educated areas seems intuitive. There was a recent post about a kid who came down with a fever in school and took a test and his mom was going to email his advisor to see if he could retake. That sort of parent advocacy isn’t happening on the whole at low-performing schools.

Saying that, I bet these stats skew by zip code more than private v public. Would love to see someone break that out.

Much better indicator really.

Our HS has an average SAT over 1300. the national avg is just over 1000. Of course there will be a significant percent of students with excellent grades---these are smart kids with parents who expect that and get tutors if they need it (ie don't have an A for many). So yes, we don't have weighted GPAs and over 50% of the graduating class typically has over a 3.5 (UW), most of those with 4+ AP courses.

Parents are involved (over involved really) but that does lead to kids doing well in school and learning, because they don't fall thru the cracks

I attended a T14 law school (not YLS). We had all scored high on the LSAT, but the grades were still distributed on a bell curve.

Different situation entirely. In HS you still have kids at all levels (at least in public), even at the wealthiest publics.
If 90% of the class earns 90%+ on exams, then they should all get A's. Heck, that's even true IMO in college even at T20 schools.

However, in a T14 law school, you have already skimmed off the cream several times to get to that level of law school. However, I'd still argue, that if everyone gets 90%+, they should all get an A.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It is a racist trope to assume that the URM student is less qualified. In many cases they are more qualified. Please take your racism and fragility someone else because you do not speak for Asians. Also, it is most definitely white supremacist ideology which bemoans the 2-3% of URM students that are attending these predominately wealthy and white institutions. For all this talk about URMs, the majority of top universities in the United States are overwhelmingly white and wealthy. URMs are not even 10% or in most cases 5% of the student population, however you will not attack the admission of less qualified legacy and athletic students because as long as they are white it is okay.

"I have no valid argument, so I have to accuse you of being racist!"

Actually, it's spot on. The numbers don't lie.

Whatever. Once I see the "racist" bs I stop reading. It's obvious you have no valid argument.

Of course you stopped reading because you are accustomed to throwing out your garbage without anyone refuting you. It's valid to point out that you want to parade a racist trope that is rooted in degrading people of color especially Latino and black people. You are the one who claim that URM are getting accepted into schools in which they are unqualified. Do you know how many unqualified wealthy white kids who get accepted into universities? Do you realized that most universities still favor the ED candidates who are in large wealthy whites who can pay to play even though they did not have the stats to be at these institutions. Are you loosing your mind over the thousands of white students sitting in seats that were meant for high stat Asians? No, but you are comfortable with branding URMs as less qualified.

You purposedly pitted Asians against other minorities. Only a bigot does that. Creating discord amongst minority groups is definitely a white supremacist practice. Asians are usually not the ones whining over URMs. It is white parents who are upset about URMs getting the crumbs on the floor from the pie that they refuse to share.

Your attitude only tells me that we still have a long way to go in this country to fight injustice. With that said most AOs are not admitting unqualified students into their universities. Just because you do not have experiences or encounters with phenomenal high stats URMs doesn't mean that AOs have to turn them away.