Athletic Ivy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended an Ivy (though not Harvard) and counted plenty of athletes among my friends. I assure you that the overwhelming majority of them were phenomenal students in addition to being talented athletes. Outside of luring some top football and basketball recruits, top colleges do not generally have to lower their admission standards much, if at all, to bring in athletes.

I went to an Ivy and wasn’t a jock sniffer and I can say that they do lower admissions standards quite substantially for athletes in all sports.

Jock sniffer, eh? Thanks for proving that even an education cannot instill class in some people.

Oh I’m sorry does “people who irrationally worship and make excuses for athletes” make you feel better?

In fact it is the hatred of college athletes and constant efforts to represent them as academically unqualified that is irrational.

Lots of students with other talents are also academically qualified but a big chunk of spots go to these students that can also run fast or throw a ball. It is not logical. There is no basketball major at Harvard

It is perfectly logical from the school’s’ perspective. Lots of athletes leads to a healthier, happier student body with more wealthy, connected alums who donate more to the school and help build or maintain its brand. You only find it illogical because you are thinking either that Harvard, etc., should follow the admissions practices of universities in some other country or because to you, “logical” means ought to favor kids exactly like yours. This schools’ have sound reasons for liking athletics even if you are not objective enough to understand this.

What do you mean like mine? I have one of these which is why I understand this silly game. Athletic recruiting largely favors a wealthy white demographic. I can't control that or change it and I would be stupid to ignore it or not play the game. But I can look at it say I think it is misguided.

You said it’s not logical. It’s perfectly logical from the school’s perspective for the reasons mentioned by many of us. What’s “misguided” about it? You seem to be saying that the schools should have a different emphasis and admit students other than the ones they do now. I’m sure each of us would have a different idea of how we would structure admissions if we got to design our perfect university, but that’s not the same as saying the schools’ current policies make no sense or are misguided.

I said I think it is misguided and I am entitled to that opinion. It's not that I see no value in sports but IMO the youth sports industrial complex has gotten out of control. It sucks up way too much time, energy, money at the expense of some other important endeavors and it is very exclusionary by income. I respect that you have a different opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Believe it or not, some kids can be athletes, artists, athletes, musicians AND strong students.

Please don't put the athletic admits into a box of being dumb jocks. At places like IVYs and NESCAC, these are generally incredibly multi-talented kids. That is why they are accepted.

They can be but in almost all cases they are not

True that’s why the top 1% end up at great schools with scholarships. (Yes I know Ivy schools don’t have scholarships, at least not ones given by the school.)

They might be the top 1% compared to other athletes but they are in the bottom 10% compared to class of admitted students. They got a massive advantage just admit it. Why is that so hard for you?

But they aren’t in general, their average GPA is > than the overall average.

A few are, that is because somebody has to be at the bottom of the class and Ivy schools found that smart kids in the bottom 10% kill themselves but artists and athletes don’t.

That’s why.

You can’t look at performance in college. It’s what they looked like when they were admitted. And the data shows that the vast majority of admitted athletes have academic scores that would have seen them rejected otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended an Ivy (though not Harvard) and counted plenty of athletes among my friends. I assure you that the overwhelming majority of them were phenomenal students in addition to being talented athletes. Outside of luring some top football and basketball recruits, top colleges do not generally have to lower their admission standards much, if at all, to bring in athletes.

I went to an Ivy and wasn’t a jock sniffer and I can say that they do lower admissions standards quite substantially for athletes in all sports.

Jock sniffer, eh? Thanks for proving that even an education cannot instill class in some people.

Oh I’m sorry does “people who irrationally worship and make excuses for athletes” make you feel better?

In fact it is the hatred of college athletes and constant efforts to represent them as academically unqualified that is irrational.

The data doesn’t lie. Look it up sometime. But I know you won’t because you like living in your fantasy world.

The data doesn’t show they are unqualified. Try again.

“The Academic Index (AI) is used by Ivy League schools to ensure that athletes are not admitted with significantly lower academic qualifications than the general student population. The index is based on GPA, SAT/ACT tests scores, and SAT Subject test scores. All athletes must have at least a 176 to play at any of the “Ancient Eight” schools… no team at an Ivy League school may have an average AI of more than one standard deviation below the average AI of all students at the college.“

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended an Ivy (though not Harvard) and counted plenty of athletes among my friends. I assure you that the overwhelming majority of them were phenomenal students in addition to being talented athletes. Outside of luring some top football and basketball recruits, top colleges do not generally have to lower their admission standards much, if at all, to bring in athletes.

I went to an Ivy and wasn’t a jock sniffer and I can say that they do lower admissions standards quite substantially for athletes in all sports.

Jock sniffer, eh? Thanks for proving that even an education cannot instill class in some people.

Oh I’m sorry does “people who irrationally worship and make excuses for athletes” make you feel better?

In fact it is the hatred of college athletes and constant efforts to represent them as academically unqualified that is irrational.

+1

NP. I think there is one athlete-hater poster on DCUM who is obsessed beyond rationality with athletes. Their posts are exceptionally nasty and also they never listen to reason or evidence. It is rather sad.

[Anonymous]

There is an athlete on the U. of Chicago tennis roster and he could have attended Ivies with a 1250 SAT but he only got 1200 on the SAT, after several attempts. He ended up at UVA for one year and transferred to U. of Chicago after his freshman year. Athletes are always treated differently as they should be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The data doesn’t show they are unqualified. Try again.

“The Academic Index (AI) is used by Ivy League schools to ensure that athletes are not admitted with significantly lower academic qualifications than the general student population. The index is based on GPA, SAT/ACT tests scores, and SAT Subject test scores. All athletes must have at least a 176 to play at any of the “Ancient Eight” schools… no team at an Ivy League school may have an average AI of more than one standard deviation below the average AI of all students at the college.“

This is actually funny.  There are the rules and there are ways to work around the rules.  The schools have to put out something but no one knows if the rules are actually being followed.

It reminds me of my employer's company policy that I can not hire or supervise anyone related to me  due to favoritism or nepotism; however, it is completely legit for me to hire my neighbor or their kids even though they might not qualified for the job but since I have the final say in the hiring process, it is completely legal. 

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Believe it or not, some kids can be athletes, artists, athletes, musicians AND strong students.

Please don't put the athletic admits into a box of being dumb jocks. At places like IVYs and NESCAC, these are generally incredibly multi-talented kids. That is why they are accepted.

They can be but in almost all cases they are not

True that’s why the top 1% end up at great schools with scholarships. (Yes I know Ivy schools don’t have scholarships, at least not ones given by the school.)

They might be the top 1% compared to other athletes but they are in the bottom 10% compared to class of admitted students. They got a massive advantage just admit it. Why is that so hard for you?

But they aren’t in general, their average GPA is > than the overall average.

A few are, that is because somebody has to be at the bottom of the class and Ivy schools found that smart kids in the bottom 10% kill themselves but artists and athletes don’t.

That’s why.

You can’t look at performance in college. It’s what they looked like when they were admitted. And the data shows that the vast majority of admitted athletes have academic scores that would have seen them rejected otherwise.

The data shows most would have been admitted but a small % of superstars are at the lower end of the admitted students. They all meet the Ivy index.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended an Ivy (though not Harvard) and counted plenty of athletes among my friends. I assure you that the overwhelming majority of them were phenomenal students in addition to being talented athletes. Outside of luring some top football and basketball recruits, top colleges do not generally have to lower their admission standards much, if at all, to bring in athletes.

I went to an Ivy and wasn’t a jock sniffer and I can say that they do lower admissions standards quite substantially for athletes in all sports.

Jock sniffer, eh? Thanks for proving that even an education cannot instill class in some people.

Oh I’m sorry does “people who irrationally worship and make excuses for athletes” make you feel better?

You're reading an awful lot into the previous post. What happened to you? Were you bullied by a lacrosse player or something?

His boss must be an Ivy League lax bro

Your posts are the last refuge of someone who knows they’re wrong.

No it empathy for someone who is mental and obviously hurt at some point in your life but still not over it.

The more you make this about me, the more you admit I’m right.

You need serious therapy it’s sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Believe it or not, some kids can be athletes, artists, athletes, musicians AND strong students.

Please don't put the athletic admits into a box of being dumb jocks. At places like IVYs and NESCAC, these are generally incredibly multi-talented kids. That is why they are accepted.

They can be but in almost all cases they are not

True that’s why the top 1% end up at great schools with scholarships. (Yes I know Ivy schools don’t have scholarships, at least not ones given by the school.)

They might be the top 1% compared to other athletes but they are in the bottom 10% compared to class of admitted students. They got a massive advantage just admit it. Why is that so hard for you?

But they aren’t in general, their average GPA is > than the overall average.

A few are, that is because somebody has to be at the bottom of the class and Ivy schools found that smart kids in the bottom 10% kill themselves but artists and athletes don’t.

That’s why.

You can’t look at performance in college. It’s what they looked like when they were admitted. And the data shows that the vast majority of admitted athletes have academic scores that would have seen them rejected otherwise.

Most don’t take SATs more than once nor do they test prep so it’s not a good comparison. They get the Ivy index on the 1st try why prep?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In some sports at harvard the athletes are dominated by international students. So its not even American athletes getting the boost.

Correct.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In some sports at harvard the athletes are dominated by international students. So its not even American athletes getting the boost.

Correct.

The odds of American kids being athletically recruited to Ivies for niche sports such as fencing, squash, field hockey,etc… are slim because of this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended an Ivy (though not Harvard) and counted plenty of athletes among my friends. I assure you that the overwhelming majority of them were phenomenal students in addition to being talented athletes. Outside of luring some top football and basketball recruits, top colleges do not generally have to lower their admission standards much, if at all, to bring in athletes.

I went to an Ivy and wasn’t a jock sniffer and I can say that they do lower admissions standards quite substantially for athletes in all sports.

Jock sniffer, eh? Thanks for proving that even an education cannot instill class in some people.

Oh I’m sorry does “people who irrationally worship and make excuses for athletes” make you feel better?

You're reading an awful lot into the previous post. What happened to you? Were you bullied by a lacrosse player or something?

His boss must be an Ivy League lax bro

Your posts are the last refuge of someone who knows they’re wrong.

No it empathy for someone who is mental and obviously hurt at some point in your life but still not over it.

The more you make this about me, the more you admit I’m right.

You need serious therapy it’s sad.

It is hilarious that you think this has any impact on anyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended an Ivy (though not Harvard) and counted plenty of athletes among my friends. I assure you that the overwhelming majority of them were phenomenal students in addition to being talented athletes. Outside of luring some top football and basketball recruits, top colleges do not generally have to lower their admission standards much, if at all, to bring in athletes.

I went to an Ivy and wasn’t a jock sniffer and I can say that they do lower admissions standards quite substantially for athletes in all sports.

Jock sniffer, eh? Thanks for proving that even an education cannot instill class in some people.

Oh I’m sorry does “people who irrationally worship and make excuses for athletes” make you feel better?

In fact it is the hatred of college athletes and constant efforts to represent them as academically unqualified that is irrational.

+1

NP. I think there is one athlete-hater poster on DCUM who is obsessed beyond rationality with athletes. Their posts are exceptionally nasty and also they never listen to reason or evidence. It is rather sad.

Read the Harvard study. Oh wait every time that’s mentioned you get offended.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I attended an Ivy (though not Harvard) and counted plenty of athletes among my friends. I assure you that the overwhelming majority of them were phenomenal students in addition to being talented athletes. Outside of luring some top football and basketball recruits, top colleges do not generally have to lower their admission standards much, if at all, to bring in athletes.

I went to an Ivy and wasn’t a jock sniffer and I can say that they do lower admissions standards quite substantially for athletes in all sports.

Jock sniffer, eh? Thanks for proving that even an education cannot instill class in some people.

Oh I’m sorry does “people who irrationally worship and make excuses for athletes” make you feel better?

In fact it is the hatred of college athletes and constant efforts to represent them as academically unqualified that is irrational.

The data doesn’t lie. Look it up sometime. But I know you won’t because you like living in your fantasy world.

The data doesn’t show they are unqualified. Try again.

“The Academic Index (AI) is used by Ivy League schools to ensure that athletes are not admitted with significantly lower academic qualifications than the general student population. The index is based on GPA, SAT/ACT tests scores, and SAT Subject test scores. All athletes must have at least a 176 to play at any of the “Ancient Eight” schools… no team at an Ivy League school may have an average AI of more than one standard deviation below the average AI of all students at the college.“

The words “significantly lower” are doing a lot of lifting in that paragraph. So they can all be lower just not significantly so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In some sports at harvard the athletes are dominated by international students. So its not even American athletes getting the boost.

Correct.

The odds of American kids being athletically recruited to Ivies for niche sports such as fencing, squash, field hockey,etc… are slim because of this.

Add men’s soccer to the list