APS -- Want to return but spouse resistant -- please clarify curriculum 5th grade

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We left APS for Langley early in the pandemic, as our DD was struggling with the isolation of remote school and had trouble reading so much on the screen.

We have had a good experience at Langley, but it is quite expensive for us, DD misses her friends, and we would love to be part of a neighborhood school again.

Spouse believes reading and writing are underemphasized in APS, so can someone who has just finished 5th grade help me win this argument:

How many novels were assigned for 5th grade students to read on their own at home? Langley had DD read 5 novels, then write essays and do a quiz on them. Which spouse really appreciates since our DD is a reluctant reader, so having it "assigned" has made it much easier to get her to read independently.

Ha. You should be looking farther down the road than 5th grade. 5 novels is more than either of my kids read in their Arlington high school English classes.
And they don't even necessarily read the complete novel when they work on one. This is our experience from both general ed and intensified English classes.

Let me know overstate it, these were short novels like Long Walk to Water and Red Kayak. Something an adult reader would finish in a day or so.

Surely they are assigned at least that much reading by middle school? I want to sway my spouse and save this tuition!

I don't think having the whole class read the same novel is typcially a central feature of 3-6th grade public school English classes. The in class work is usually focused around shorter reading passages where the kids are taught concepts and expected to extract information. Closer to what shows up on the SOL. Any novels tend to be read independently.

IMO, this makes sense as there's still a pretty large range in reading ability. It's better to have kids choose novels at their reading level. It would be difficult to have the whole class the same thing at the same speed. My advanced reader who polishes off 1000 pages a week would be bored to tears while the slower readers would struggle to keep up.

They talk about differentiation, why not just break into small reading club groups and assign novels? Reading a novel or longer text is way different than just reading passages, as helpful as that is for SOLs

My DD is now a junior in Arlington but this is what they did in her English class in 8th grade. There was a list of options to choose from so some kids would read the same books. I also recall back in 6th or 7th grade that there was a reading thing where they read a book every month and had to choose from a long list of "projects" for each one (they were not generally very time consuming).

[Anonymous]

I don’t remember ever having a book assigned to read in 4th or 5th grade when I was in school. I was an avid reader and I remember my teacher reading to us (I recall the boxcar children in 5th grade!). My APS daughter has read about 2 books per year for 4th and 5th grade. She reads a ton outside of that on her own. Teachers only have about an hour a day for reading instruction, there is. It really time for lots of independent reading. And most APS schools are no homework since it isn’t supported by research.

Parents on here always complain. If you want your kids to read more books, take them to the library or Barnes and noble and get them some books to read! And of your kid likes graphic novels, let them read graphic novels. Those are books too.

[Anonymous]

And again, why can’t APS emphasize reading and writing in school?
I don’t think parents are unreasonable for asking for a rigorous English curriculum in school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t remember ever having a book assigned to read in 4th or 5th grade when I was in school. I was an avid reader and I remember my teacher reading to us (I recall the boxcar children in 5th grade!). My APS daughter has read about 2 books per year for 4th and 5th grade. She reads a ton outside of that on her own. Teachers only have about an hour a day for reading instruction, there is. It really time for lots of independent reading. And most APS schools are no homework since it isn’t supported by research.

Parents on here always complain. If you want your kids to read more books, take them to the library or Barnes and noble and get them some books to read! And of your kid likes graphic novels, let them read graphic novels. Those are books too.

I won’t get dragged into the “no homework” argument, but this is about assigning a particular book for the class to read, have discussion, and specific analysis and question about to ensure comprehension is sound and foster more in depth reading.

Just saying “page thru a graphic novel and never speak of it again” does not have same benefits.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And again, why can’t APS emphasize reading and writing in school?
I don’t think parents are unreasonable for asking for a rigorous English curriculum in school.

It’s a numbers game. It’s easy to check math problems for 30 kids; simply reading 30 essays is laborious, let along thoughtful commentary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And again, why can’t APS emphasize reading and writing in school?
I don’t think parents are unreasonable for asking for a rigorous English curriculum in school.

It’s a numbers game. It’s easy to check math problems for 30 kids; simply reading 30 essays is laborious, let along thoughtful commentary.

My APS 7th grader looked at me like I was crazy when I asked if he had ever had to write an essay.

Sad, because I remember this being a fundamental practiced skill at my very mediocre school back in the day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And again, why can’t APS emphasize reading and writing in school?
I don’t think parents are unreasonable for asking for a rigorous English curriculum in school.

It’s a numbers game. It’s easy to check math problems for 30 kids; simply reading 30 essays is laborious, let along thoughtful commentary.

My APS 7th grader looked at me like I was crazy when I asked if he had ever had to write an essay.

Sad, because I remember this being a fundamental practiced skill at my very mediocre school back in the day.

I’m sure he has written a lot just not called it an essay

[Anonymous]

Your 7th grader must be confused. Every APS grade from at least 4th up writes multiple essays per year. I teach 4th and following the APS curriculum we have written a realistic fiction piece, opinion essay, persuasive essay written as a letter, and a literary essay. Obviously these are guided units as they are teaching the basic 5-paragraph essay structure. In 5th grade there are more plus the writing SOL which is a 5 paragraph opinion piece.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your 7th grader must be confused. Every APS grade from at least 4th up writes multiple essays per year. I teach 4th and following the APS curriculum we have written a realistic fiction piece, opinion essay, persuasive essay written as a letter, and a literary essay. Obviously these are guided units as they are teaching the basic 5-paragraph essay structure. In 5th grade there are more plus the writing SOL which is a 5 paragraph opinion piece.

Maybe my kid is not a reliable reporter, but they did seem confused like they had never heard of an essay before... (and they have 100% in English). But 5th grade for us ended in spring 2020 with essentially no more work and no SOLs that year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And again, why can’t APS emphasize reading and writing in school?
I don’t think parents are unreasonable for asking for a rigorous English curriculum in school.

It’s a numbers game. It’s easy to check math problems for 30 kids; simply reading 30 essays is laborious, let along thoughtful commentary.

My APS 7th grader looked at me like I was crazy when I asked if he had ever had to write an essay.

Sad, because I remember this being a fundamental practiced skill at my very mediocre school back in the day.

My APS 8th grader has been writing essays for years. Starting in 4th grade.

Ask if they’ve written any “multi paragraph assignments”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And again, why can’t APS emphasize reading and writing in school?
I don’t think parents are unreasonable for asking for a rigorous English curriculum in school.

It’s a numbers game. It’s easy to check math problems for 30 kids; simply reading 30 essays is laborious, let along thoughtful commentary.

My APS 7th grader looked at me like I was crazy when I asked if he had ever had to write an essay.

Sad, because I remember this being a fundamental practiced skill at my very mediocre school back in the day.

My APS 8th grader has been writing essays for years. Starting in 4th grade.

Ask if they’ve written any “multi paragraph assignments”.

I fully believe there is plenty of writing assigned, But this thread was asking about reading assignments and analysis of that material? Do they write essays on the books they have read? How much feedback on the essays did I get, like is it corrected for grammar and spelling and they have a chance to rewrite?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We left APS for Langley early in the pandemic, as our DD was struggling with the isolation of remote school and had trouble reading so much on the screen.

We have had a good experience at Langley, but it is quite expensive for us, DD misses her friends, and we would love to be part of a neighborhood school again.

Spouse believes reading and writing are underemphasized in APS, so can someone who has just finished 5th grade help me win this argument:

How many novels were assigned for 5th grade students to read on their own at home? Langley had DD read 5 novels, then write essays and do a quiz on them. Which spouse really appreciates since our DD is a reluctant reader, so having it "assigned" has made it much easier to get her to read independently.

Ha. You should be looking farther down the road than 5th grade. 5 novels is more than either of my kids read in their Arlington high school English classes.
And they don't even necessarily read the complete novel when they work on one. This is our experience from both general ed and intensified English classes.

Let me know overstate it, these were short novels like Long Walk to Water and Red Kayak. Something an adult reader would finish in a day or so.

Surely they are assigned at least that much reading by middle school? I want to sway my spouse and save this tuition!

Hate to tell you, OP... Here's a sample of the assigned high school reading from the experience of our two high schoolers:

First kid:
Freshman year general ed English: "To Kill a Mockingbird "(took over 8 weeks to get through - but at least they actually read the entire book). About to begin "Romeo and Juliet" when COVID shut everything down and APS determined "no new material."
Sophomore year general ed English: PART of "1984." Kid doesn't remember what else; but I can't recall other novels, either. This was COVID distance learning year (so there should have been PLENTY of time for reading!)
Junior year general ed English: "The Invisible Man" as independent reading only. "Every Day." Some other book my kid doesn't remember, though still not a "classic" - rather what my kid calls "a teenager book."

Second kid:
Freshman intensified English: short story "Rockinghorse Winner." PARTS of "The Odyssey." Teacher decided in the later part (after skipping a middle part in order to read the book chronologically rather than in the order it was written, to assign chapters and have students give presentations "instead of everybody having to read it all.") WATCHED "Romeo and Juliet" -- did not read a single chapter of it.
My freshman has learned from another kid they know in a different (general ed) English class that their class actually did 4 books, including "To Kill a Mockingbird" "R&J," "The Odyssey," and forgets the 4th. It is not clear, however, whether they actually read each one completely, or if those were just the works they covered. My child's intensified class spent a good deal of time on R&J, even though they never read a single page of it - hence "studied" it.

There are usually other short stories and poetry units each year as well, and maybe some "independent reading" for a reading log - the amount of that reading of course being dependent on the student. So there's more total reading than the list of novels indicates. Still, extremely light on reading complete books and relatively few books at all.

There was more reading at the middle school level than high school. And perhaps this is just our experience, or just the experience at one of the high schools. Maybe others can give you a sample of what their high school kids have had to read. Regardless, maybe you'll be fine for middle school; but you might want to return to Langley for high school unless the other Arlington high schools/programs are significantly different. I'm looking forward to AP English to see if there's a significant up-tick in expectations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We left APS for Langley early in the pandemic, as our DD was struggling with the isolation of remote school and had trouble reading so much on the screen.

We have had a good experience at Langley, but it is quite expensive for us, DD misses her friends, and we would love to be part of a neighborhood school again.

Spouse believes reading and writing are underemphasized in APS, so can someone who has just finished 5th grade help me win this argument:

How many novels were assigned for 5th grade students to read on their own at home? Langley had DD read 5 novels, then write essays and do a quiz on them. Which spouse really appreciates since our DD is a reluctant reader, so having it "assigned" has made it much easier to get her to read independently.

Ha. You should be looking farther down the road than 5th grade. 5 novels is more than either of my kids read in their Arlington high school English classes.
And they don't even necessarily read the complete novel when they work on one. This is our experience from both general ed and intensified English classes.

Let me know overstate it, these were short novels like Long Walk to Water and Red Kayak. Something an adult reader would finish in a day or so.

Surely they are assigned at least that much reading by middle school? I want to sway my spouse and save this tuition!

Hate to tell you, OP... Here's a sample of the assigned high school reading from the experience of our two high schoolers:

First kid:
Freshman year general ed English: "To Kill a Mockingbird "(took over 8 weeks to get through - but at least they actually read the entire book). About to begin "Romeo and Juliet" when COVID shut everything down and APS determined "no new material."
Sophomore year general ed English: PART of "1984." Kid doesn't remember what else; but I can't recall other novels, either. This was COVID distance learning year (so there should have been PLENTY of time for reading!)
Junior year general ed English: "The Invisible Man" as independent reading only. "Every Day." Some other book my kid doesn't remember, though still not a "classic" - rather what my kid calls "a teenager book."

Second kid:
Freshman intensified English: short story "Rockinghorse Winner." PARTS of "The Odyssey." Teacher decided in the later part (after skipping a middle part in order to read the book chronologically rather than in the order it was written, to assign chapters and have students give presentations "instead of everybody having to read it all.") WATCHED "Romeo and Juliet" -- did not read a single chapter of it.
My freshman has learned from another kid they know in a different (general ed) English class that their class actually did 4 books, including "To Kill a Mockingbird" "R&J," "The Odyssey," and forgets the 4th. It is not clear, however, whether they actually read each one completely, or if those were just the works they covered. My child's intensified class spent a good deal of time on R&J, even though they never read a single page of it - hence "studied" it.

There are usually other short stories and poetry units each year as well, and maybe some "independent reading" for a reading log - the amount of that reading of course being dependent on the student. So there's more total reading than the list of novels indicates. Still, extremely light on reading complete books and relatively few books at all.

There was more reading at the middle school level than high school. And perhaps this is just our experience, or just the experience at one of the high schools. Maybe others can give you a sample of what their high school kids have had to read. Regardless, maybe you'll be fine for middle school; but you might want to return to Langley for high school unless the other Arlington high schools/programs are significantly different. I'm looking forward to AP English to see if there's a significant up-tick in expectations.

Wow. What an embarrassing dearth of reading for high school English. Good lord we are going to be basically doing a private reading curriculum to supplement. Won’t be the same as doing it as part of a class with discussion and essays. This is embarrassing for high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your 7th grader must be confused. Every APS grade from at least 4th up writes multiple essays per year. I teach 4th and following the APS curriculum we have written a realistic fiction piece, opinion essay, persuasive essay written as a letter, and a literary essay. Obviously these are guided units as they are teaching the basic 5-paragraph essay structure. In 5th grade there are more plus the writing SOL which is a 5 paragraph opinion piece.

I'm a parent and I can confirm what the teacher here says. Unfortunately, the emphasis on those same essays continues into high school without ever developing into longer written papers. My oldest child wrote more extensive essays in 5th grade than they have had to write in 3 years of high school.

There's a lot of "online discussion" assignments whereby each student in the class has to provide a paragraph response to a topic and respond to at least two other students' comments. Limited usefulness in learning to conduct online discussions respectfully; but no real benefit to developing analytical and writing skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And again, why can’t APS emphasize reading and writing in school?
I don’t think parents are unreasonable for asking for a rigorous English curriculum in school.

It’s a numbers game. It’s easy to check math problems for 30 kids; simply reading 30 essays is laborious, let along thoughtful commentary.

My APS 7th grader looked at me like I was crazy when I asked if he had ever had to write an essay.

Sad, because I remember this being a fundamental practiced skill at my very mediocre school back in the day.

My APS 8th grader has been writing essays for years. Starting in 4th grade.

Ask if they’ve written any “multi paragraph assignments”.

I fully believe there is plenty of writing assigned, But this thread was asking about reading assignments and analysis of that material? Do they write essays on the books they have read? How much feedback on the essays did I get, like is it corrected for grammar and spelling and they have a chance to rewrite?

Lots of small writing assignments like that. Our oldest child had lots of "rewrite" opportunities their freshman year. Honestly don't know about this year, or about my younger child's class because I don't think that child usually needs to rewrite anything. But very little class discussion - discussions are often "online." And no full-length papers. My kids freak out when a teacher tells them they want 3 pages and one really panicked when their science teacher expected a 12-page, double-spaced paper on their science experiment.