Ostentatious Christianity

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jesus never said that Government should feed the people.

We need to take care of the poor, we need to help the poor, and we need to make sure that all people are treated equally, but if you examine the issue of mission trips, churches and religious people do a better job of helping those in need than governments.

Jesus does not ask people to give up their money. He talked about being humble not being about being rich. Poverty is not a blessing. Being humble is a blessing. Many times money can make a person feel that they are more important or entitled than another person. This is what Jesus was talking about. It is a very far jump to advocate for redistribution to the government for them to take over your life.

What? I think that certainly is the implication of Matthew 19:21:

"Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me."

The Bible makes it clear that possession of wealth involves responsibility, including a responsibility to be compassionate to the poor. But the Bible doesn’t say that all Christians should sell everything they have and give the proceeds to the poor. The hearts of some people, like the rich young ruler’s heart, may require such drastic measures. But for others, giving away everything would be an act of poor stewardship—an unwillingness to make wise, compassionate use of the gifts given by God.

https://questions.org/attq/does-jesus-expect-his-followers-to-give-up-all-of-their-possessions/

What? That's exactly what Matthew 19:21 says.

Matthew 19:21 is specifically about the conversation Jesus had with a very wealthy young ruler/King.

This man loved his wealth and possessions above all.

The advice Jesus gave that man was for that man to replace his love for his wealth and possessions in his heart, not advice for Christians to impoverish their families and beg for food and shelter themselves to prove they are righteous.

A wealthy young man came to Jesus and asked what special deeds he should do to gain eternal life. Jesus responded that there was no need to ask him, because God had already told him in the Ten Commandments what he should do (Matthew 19:16-19). The man boasted that he had kept most of the commandments, but Jesus saw that at least he had failed in the last, which said ‘Do not covet’. While people around him were suffering from hunger and poverty, he was building up wealth. His desire for comfort and prosperity prevented him from giving himself to God, and so prevented him from receiving eternal life. If he wanted eternal life, he would have to get rid of the things that stood in its way (Matthew 19:20-22).

Wealth makes people independent of others, and for this reason the rich often find it difficult to acknowledge that they are not independent of God. Their wealth makes them no better in God’s sight than anyone else. As a result few of the rich enter the kingdom of God. Actually, no one at all could enter that kingdom apart from the work of God. By his grace he accepts those who humble themselves before him (Matthew 19:23-26).

Nevertheless, those who make sacrifices for the sake of Jesus will find that what they receive in eternity is incomparably greater than anything they may have lost in the present world. They may have to sacrifice wealth, status, family or friends, but in the age to come they will reign with Christ (Matthew 19:27-30).

https://www.studylight.org/commentary/matthew/19-21.html

more in depth study and examination here.

lmao looks like a bunch of people don’t know what they spout here, no surprise.

People who take snippets here and there and don’t truly know what they are talking about…

yeah, like you. We all know it's harder for a rich man to get into heaven than for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle.

According to a paper from the World Bank in 2012, if you make more than $50,000 annually, you are in the global 1 percent.

Compared to others in your geographic area, you might consider yourself to be middle class, or your income may even hover near your local poverty line. But if you know how to read and write, if your home has electricity, and if the device on which you are reading this article belongs to you, chances are that you are in the top tier of the world’s most wealthy people.

See? Camel gang rise up, that’s all of us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To begin with, just know that I have faith. My faith is very personal to me and I discuss it with no one. I do not believe that it's necessary to clue people in on my faith. I don't think that's how faith works (unless you are in an environment - eg a house of worship - where faith is integral to your experience/belonging there).

I work with a woman who's annoying in some ways - always trying to one-up others, says "I don't really tell people this but my husband's on the board" (you actually do tell us this all the time), and generally sucks the air out of the room. Self-involved is a good descriptor. Something she does frequently is talk about how much she loves Jesus, how she's praying for us, etc etc. I notice this kind of behavior generally from (white, evangelical) Christians. I find it extraordinarily grating. We get it. You're a Christian. It's as though the person - and I'm not just referring to my colleague - is trying to gain kudos for proclaiming their faith. It feels tacky and superficial. Anyone else have this observation?

"Actually, you've mentioned that several times now."

As for the preachy stuff - ignore. She's probably been taught that she has to spread the word. Don't react or respond. However -

I have an obvious physical disability. I used to work with a woman who would routinely grab my hand and say "I'm praying for you" if I was moving slower than usual. Finally I said "First of all, don't grab me, it affects my balance. Second - can you pray without continually telling me about it? Thanks."

Usually though, just ignore. "I'm praying for you" is almost an automatic response for some people.

+1

Op has main character syndrome and an annoying coworker. If you have a job, you have an annoying coworker. In fact, you could be the annoying coworker.

I look for the good in all people, and try to avoid the bad. If that’s the worst issue op has in her life and job, she’s doing great!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jesus never said that Government should feed the people.

We need to take care of the poor, we need to help the poor, and we need to make sure that all people are treated equally, but if you examine the issue of mission trips, churches and religious people do a better job of helping those in need than governments.

Jesus does not ask people to give up their money. He talked about being humble not being about being rich. Poverty is not a blessing. Being humble is a blessing. Many times money can make a person feel that they are more important or entitled than another person. This is what Jesus was talking about. It is a very far jump to advocate for redistribution to the government for them to take over your life.

What? I think that certainly is the implication of Matthew 19:21:

"Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me."

The Bible makes it clear that possession of wealth involves responsibility, including a responsibility to be compassionate to the poor. But the Bible doesn’t say that all Christians should sell everything they have and give the proceeds to the poor. The hearts of some people, like the rich young ruler’s heart, may require such drastic measures. But for others, giving away everything would be an act of poor stewardship—an unwillingness to make wise, compassionate use of the gifts given by God.

https://questions.org/attq/does-jesus-expect-his-followers-to-give-up-all-of-their-possessions/

What? That's exactly what Matthew 19:21 says.

Matthew 19:21 is specifically about the conversation Jesus had with a very wealthy young ruler/King.

This man loved his wealth and possessions above all.

The advice Jesus gave that man was for that man to replace his love for his wealth and possessions in his heart, not advice for Christians to impoverish their families and beg for food and shelter themselves to prove they are righteous.

A wealthy young man came to Jesus and asked what special deeds he should do to gain eternal life. Jesus responded that there was no need to ask him, because God had already told him in the Ten Commandments what he should do (Matthew 19:16-19). The man boasted that he had kept most of the commandments, but Jesus saw that at least he had failed in the last, which said ‘Do not covet’. While people around him were suffering from hunger and poverty, he was building up wealth. His desire for comfort and prosperity prevented him from giving himself to God, and so prevented him from receiving eternal life. If he wanted eternal life, he would have to get rid of the things that stood in its way (Matthew 19:20-22).

Wealth makes people independent of others, and for this reason the rich often find it difficult to acknowledge that they are not independent of God. Their wealth makes them no better in God’s sight than anyone else. As a result few of the rich enter the kingdom of God. Actually, no one at all could enter that kingdom apart from the work of God. By his grace he accepts those who humble themselves before him (Matthew 19:23-26).

Nevertheless, those who make sacrifices for the sake of Jesus will find that what they receive in eternity is incomparably greater than anything they may have lost in the present world. They may have to sacrifice wealth, status, family or friends, but in the age to come they will reign with Christ (Matthew 19:27-30).

https://www.studylight.org/commentary/matthew/19-21.html

more in depth study and examination here.

lmao looks like a bunch of people don’t know what they spout here, no surprise.

People who take snippets here and there and don’t truly know what they are talking about…

yeah, like you. We all know it's harder for a rich man to get into heaven than for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle.

According to a paper from the World Bank in 2012, if you make more than $50,000 annually, you are in the global 1 percent.

Compared to others in your geographic area, you might consider yourself to be middle class, or your income may even hover near your local poverty line. But if you know how to read and write, if your home has electricity, and if the device on which you are reading this article belongs to you, chances are that you are in the top tier of the world’s most wealthy people.

See? Camel gang rise up, that’s all of us.

Sounds about right. So ignore those parts of the Bible that don't really apply that much anymore? Seems like that would be most of it.

[Anonymous]

Luke 12:33

"Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys."

Naw, the Bible doesn't mean what it says exactly. Just pick out the parts you like best and ignore the rest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Luke 12:33

"Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys."

Naw, the Bible doesn't mean what it says exactly. Just pick out the parts you like best and ignore the rest.

Sell your possessions and give to the poor. (Luke 12:33)

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be saved. Being rich is wrong because ‘it’s hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom’.”

No. It is harder for the rich and self-sufficient to receive from the abundance of God’s grace, but the kingdom is received, not purchased. “Your Father is pleased to give you the kingdom,” says Jesus.

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be blessed. ‘Blessed are the poor.’

No. The poor are blessed if their poverty leads them to Jesus, but poverty is not a blessing. Nor do we earn the Lord’s favor by selling our stuff.

I don’t know why you insist that Jesus wants Christians to give away all their money and become homeless and not have medical care and rely on government programs, it’s absolutely absurd.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Luke 12:33

"Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys."

Naw, the Bible doesn't mean what it says exactly. Just pick out the parts you like best and ignore the rest.

Sell your possessions and give to the poor. (Luke 12:33)

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be saved. Being rich is wrong because ‘it’s hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom’.”

No. It is harder for the rich and self-sufficient to receive from the abundance of God’s grace, but the kingdom is received, not purchased. “Your Father is pleased to give you the kingdom,” says Jesus.

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be blessed. ‘Blessed are the poor.’

No. The poor are blessed if their poverty leads them to Jesus, but poverty is not a blessing. Nor do we earn the Lord’s favor by selling our stuff.

I don’t know why you insist that Jesus wants Christians to give away all their money and become homeless and not have medical care and rely on government programs, it’s absolutely absurd.

I dunno. Because I read it in the Bible? Of course those were different times back then, but you can't have it both ways: either the words in the Bible mean what they say or they don't.

[Anonymous]

Maybe we need a new translation of the Bible, updated for the vernacular of modern secular America and Western Europe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a Christian who attends services weekly and donates a lot to my church and I never bring it up at all except to close friends or others who I know are also religious. Idk why but people like your coworker who talk about it all the time to everyone just make my skin crawl. I think it signals a lack of sincerity maybe?

This is what irritates me (OP here). Why the need to constantly announce and bring it up?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe we need a new translation of the Bible, updated for the vernacular of modern secular America and Western Europe.

We have an abundance of Bible translations and versions available today.

What pp is missing is that Christians impoverishing themselves and their families helps no one, and just makes more people who need help in the world.

Jesus said in various ways and to various people that making money your God was not the way to live.

I am not wealthy and I am Christian. I cannot sell all my worldly possessions and become homeless to stand on a street corner and preach the gospel.

I need to take care of my family and have a home for them. I need to provide food and medical care for my family and myself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe we need a new translation of the Bible, updated for the vernacular of modern secular America and Western Europe.

We have an abundance of Bible translations and versions available today.

What pp is missing is that Christians impoverishing themselves and their families helps no one, and just makes more people who need help in the world.

Jesus said in various ways and to various people that making money your God was not the way to live.

I am not wealthy and I am Christian. I cannot sell all my worldly possessions and become homeless to stand on a street corner and preach the gospel.

I need to take care of my family and have a home for them. I need to provide food and medical care for my family and myself.

I agree with all of this. The Christianity of 1st Century BCE just isn't a good fit for modern secular America. You have to make allowances and accommodations, which means picking the parts of the Bible you like and disregarding the rest (like most of it).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Luke 12:33

"Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys."

Naw, the Bible doesn't mean what it says exactly. Just pick out the parts you like best and ignore the rest.

Sell your possessions and give to the poor. (Luke 12:33)

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be saved. Being rich is wrong because ‘it’s hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom’.”

No. It is harder for the rich and self-sufficient to receive from the abundance of God’s grace, but the kingdom is received, not purchased. “Your Father is pleased to give you the kingdom,” says Jesus.

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be blessed. ‘Blessed are the poor.’

No. The poor are blessed if their poverty leads them to Jesus, but poverty is not a blessing. Nor do we earn the Lord’s favor by selling our stuff.

I don’t know why you insist that Jesus wants Christians to give away all their money and become homeless and not have medical care and rely on government programs, it’s absolutely absurd.

I dunno. Because I read it in the Bible? Of course those were different times back then, but you can't have it both ways: either the words in the Bible mean what they say or they don't.

Jesus was speaking specifically to a very wealthy man who loved his wealth and possessions. He loved his wealth and possessions so much, he worshiped them as his God. Jesus told that man to free himself from those things to find and worship God.

That’s what those words mean. They don’t mean for everyone to have nothing. You are not factually correct in your posts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Luke 12:33

"Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys."

Naw, the Bible doesn't mean what it says exactly. Just pick out the parts you like best and ignore the rest.

Sell your possessions and give to the poor. (Luke 12:33)

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be saved. Being rich is wrong because ‘it’s hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom’.”

No. It is harder for the rich and self-sufficient to receive from the abundance of God’s grace, but the kingdom is received, not purchased. “Your Father is pleased to give you the kingdom,” says Jesus.

Jesus is saying we have to sell our stuff to be blessed. ‘Blessed are the poor.’

No. The poor are blessed if their poverty leads them to Jesus, but poverty is not a blessing. Nor do we earn the Lord’s favor by selling our stuff.

I don’t know why you insist that Jesus wants Christians to give away all their money and become homeless and not have medical care and rely on government programs, it’s absolutely absurd.

I dunno. Because I read it in the Bible? Of course those were different times back then, but you can't have it both ways: either the words in the Bible mean what they say or they don't.

upload pic



Matthew 19:16-22
New King James Version
Jesus Counsels the Rich Young Ruler(A)
16 (B)Now behold, one came and said to Him, (C)“Good[a] Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life?”

17 So He said to him, [b]“Why do you call Me good? [c]No one is (D)good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, (E)keep the commandments.”

18 He said to Him, “Which ones?”

Jesus said, (F)“‘You shall not murder,’ ‘You shall not commit adultery,’ ‘You shall not steal,’ ‘You shall not bear false witness,’ 19 (G)‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, (H)‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ ”

20 The young man said to Him, “All these things I have (I)kept [d]from my youth. What do I still lack?”

21 Jesus said to him, “If you want to be perfect, (J)go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”

22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions.

We know from the four Gospels that Jesus did not call all of his hearers to give away all their possessions. Not all people are as burdened by their possessions as this young man was. In his case, the challenge was radical because of his strong attachment to wealth (Matt. 19:22). God knows precisely what is in our hearts and what is needed as we serve him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe we need a new translation of the Bible, updated for the vernacular of modern secular America and Western Europe.

We have an abundance of Bible translations and versions available today.

What pp is missing is that Christians impoverishing themselves and their families helps no one, and just makes more people who need help in the world.

Jesus said in various ways and to various people that making money your God was not the way to live.

I am not wealthy and I am Christian. I cannot sell all my worldly possessions and become homeless to stand on a street corner and preach the gospel.

I need to take care of my family and have a home for them. I need to provide food and medical care for my family and myself.

I agree with all of this. The Christianity of 1st Century BCE just isn't a good fit for modern secular America. You have to make allowances and accommodations, which means picking the parts of the Bible you like and disregarding the rest (like most of it).

You missed the point and are completely wrong. The scripture pp keeps referencing is a great illustration of a very wealthy person who is moral and desires for a relationship with God and eternal life in heaven, but desires his wealth and material goods more.

It is not a teaching for Christians, who may be humble and working class, to impoverish themselves. It’s really hard to understand if you only read parts of scripture and not the entire scripture.

No new translations are needed, especially if people aren’t going to read and understand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To begin with, just know that I have faith. My faith is very personal to me and I discuss it with no one. I do not believe that it's necessary to clue people in on my faith. I don't think that's how faith works (unless you are in an environment - eg a house of worship - where faith is integral to your experience/belonging there).

I work with a woman who's annoying in some ways - always trying to one-up others, says "I don't really tell people this but my husband's on the board" (you actually do tell us this all the time), and generally sucks the air out of the room. Self-involved is a good descriptor. Something she does frequently is talk about how much she loves Jesus, how she's praying for us, etc etc. I notice this kind of behavior generally from (white, evangelical) Christians. I find it extraordinarily grating. We get it. You're a Christian. It's as though the person - and I'm not just referring to my colleague - is trying to gain kudos for proclaiming their faith. It feels tacky and superficial. Anyone else have this observation?

I agree with you and I also find it grating.

It kind of helps me to remember that "evangelical" literally means going out and trying to convert people to your way of thinking. So, she absolutely thinks she is helping you. It's still annoying, but it helps me understand where these people are coming from.

Most mainline religions may say they evangelize, but in my experience with two mainstream denominations, they're mostly hands-off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To begin with, just know that I have faith. My faith is very personal to me and I discuss it with no one. I do not believe that it's necessary to clue people in on my faith. I don't think that's how faith works (unless you are in an environment - eg a house of worship - where faith is integral to your experience/belonging there).

I work with a woman who's annoying in some ways - always trying to one-up others, says "I don't really tell people this but my husband's on the board" (you actually do tell us this all the time), and generally sucks the air out of the room. Self-involved is a good descriptor. Something she does frequently is talk about how much she loves Jesus, how she's praying for us, etc etc. I notice this kind of behavior generally from (white, evangelical) Christians. I find it extraordinarily grating. We get it. You're a Christian. It's as though the person - and I'm not just referring to my colleague - is trying to gain kudos for proclaiming their faith. It feels tacky and superficial. Anyone else have this observation?

I agree with you and I also find it grating.

It kind of helps me to remember that "evangelical" literally means going out and trying to convert people to your way of thinking. So, she absolutely thinks she is helping you. It's still annoying, but it helps me understand where these people are coming from.

Most mainline religions may say they evangelize, but in my experience with two mainstream denominations, they're mostly hands-off.

That is so condescending. WTF?