APS Most Likely Moving to Standards-Based Grading/Grading for Equity Next School Year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have mixed feelings about this. I struggled with the idea last year that my kid worked his butt off and turned all his assignments in but then teacher were told they weren't allowed to mark kids down for not turning in assignments because of the unique situation. I did not tell my kid this and he still continued to work. I don't know how grades went for everything (he got As and I know some kids got "not enough information to grade") so I guess it eventually impacted them but they didn't get a failing grade.


I don't necessarily see a problem with retakes, there are rarely times in life where you make a mistake you can't fix. I think that teaching kids to talk with someone and attempt to correct a mistake is fine.

As for late penalties. I think there needs to be some cut off. A grace period is fine IMO (that is how real life works anyway). I will also note that my husband just told me a story from growing up in the 80s/90s about turning in late work and not getting penalized for it, so this isn't a new concept.

BAck in the old days---circa late 80s in Fairfax Co:

What used to happen was that they would give you the test or paper and show you what you did wrong, so you could learn and not make the same mistake. BUT-you didn't get a grade bump on tests or essays for corrections. Learning the mistakes and working on them was designed so the next test you would do better. We also had only 1 Valedictorian and zero grade inflation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I read the book (a while ago, so I've forgotten quite a bit) and my kid's independent school uses this approach to grading. Read the book - it really is thought provoking, and makes you think about what school is for. What is the point?

For my kid's school, this approach has reinforced that grades are measuring learning. The point is to learn the material, so if you retake a test, and you've learned the material by the second try, cool. Yeah, you don't get as many points as the person who got it right on the first try (retakes are for 80% of credit or something) but you still get rewarded for learning.

They also provide points for a variety of activities, some of which my kid is better able to do than get a good grade on a test. He is dyslexic and tests are not terribly good measures of his knowledge. He is always the one leading the group work and making sure the group project gets done well, though. So he gets points for that. But it is all very clear - everyone is eligible for the same number of points for the same tasks, and anyone can retake a test or redo an assignment for the same percent credit.

So its not only APS - some independent schools are using this approach, too.

+ 1

Haven’t read the book but these are all things our private school does anyway.

OOoof. My son's private HS does not do this. The grade you get on test day is the grade that goes in the book. No corrections or re-takes. Same goes for missing assignments. You don't turn it in, you get a '0'. There are also pop quizzes, etc.

I love it. The school also provides a ton of support and early notification when a student has below a C. If you are not doing well, you will receive an 'interim report' that goes out to parents. If you are above the threshhold and doing well, you do not get the interim report.

The kids know where they stand the entire academic year and the expectations are clear cut. It is preparing them for college, hence a 'college preparatory school'.

[Anonymous]

Is APS actually moving to standards based grading?

I didn't see that proposal in the slides but I didn't watch the work session.

Did they say during the work session that they want to move to standards based grading system wide?

[Anonymous]

I would rather they have a class on study skills, organization, etc. My nephew had a class like that in 6th and it was amazing.

I actually don’t think they should dock points for not being organized if you’re not going to actually teach that skill. They just expect kids to pick it up as they go. If this is about preparing kids for the future, they shouldn’t be left to flounder by just repeatedly getting bad grades, or by not expecting organization at all.

Plus I do think that middle and high school expects more in the way of organization than college and the workforce. Juggling the expectations of six or seven different teachers (their grading system, where they assign the assignments and how to access them, how to hand them in, their policy on allowing late work if you talk to them in advance, etc. it’s kind of a mess and I don’t actually think employers could get away with expecting something like this out of employees).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is APS actually moving to standards based grading?

I didn't see that proposal in the slides but I didn't watch the work session.

Did they say during the work session that they want to move to standards based grading system wide?

They want the SB to vote for this six months from now, and put it in effect next fall.

Third to last slide: https://go.boarddocs.com/vsba/arlington/Board.nsf/files/C7XLVB557627/$file/101421%20School%20Board%20Work%20Session%20-%20Grading%20%26%20Homework.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is APS actually moving to standards based grading?

I didn't see that proposal in the slides but I didn't watch the work session.

Did they say during the work session that they want to move to standards based grading system wide?

They want the SB to vote for this six months from now, and put it in effect next fall.

Third to last slide: https://go.boarddocs.com/vsba/arlington/Board.nsf/files/C7XLVB557627/$file/101421%20School%20Board%20Work%20Session%20-%20Grading%20%26%20Homework.pdf

Note, the third to last slide says nothing about public comment. They’re hoping the SB will just rubber stamp it I guess

[Anonymous]

I visited the website, and it describes equity as only evaluating work that's done in school.

OK, maybe. I liked that my kids didn't get grades from K-2. I cared about the social/emotional part of school in early elementary. And I wouldn't be terribly sad if later elementary homework went away.

But I don't think it's reasonable to have no homework in AP or IB classes, and I'm not sure it will work for more-advanced kids in MS or HS, either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is APS actually moving to standards based grading?

I didn't see that proposal in the slides but I didn't watch the work session.

Did they say during the work session that they want to move to standards based grading system wide?

They want the SB to vote for this six months from now, and put it in effect next fall.

Third to last slide: https://go.boarddocs.com/vsba/arlington/Board.nsf/files/C7XLVB557627/$file/101421%20School%20Board%20Work%20Session%20-%20Grading%20%26%20Homework.pdf

Note, the third to last slide says nothing about public comment. They’re hoping the SB will just rubber stamp it I guess

I agree -- they know that there will be mass outcry if they put it out for comment. My youngest is in 6th grade and has yet to receive a letter grade in school. Elementary adopted standards-based grading when she was in grade 3. And now she won't get any letter grades until high school. She gets "M"s which means she meets the bare minimum standard set by the state of VA. To me, that should equal a grade of "C". The whole point of this is for you not to know how well your kid is being taught an to only identify the most direly struggling children. Which sure, they should get additional support. Average and better kids in APS are left to their own devices.

[Anonymous]

In my 7th graders’ intensified algebra class, homework is assigned but not required. DD does it anyway (even though she is generally pretty disorganized thanks to ADHD) because she knows that homework helps her learn the material. If a kid can learn the material without doing the homework, it makes sense to me that they won’t be penalized for not jumping through that hoop.

[Anonymous]

My APS middle schooler's school started this last year, and it has been mostly a frustrating experience. So they use SBG for the assignments, but convert to A/B/C etc. for the report cards... but each teacher seems to convert the grades differently.

For example, some teachers decided that having more than one 3 = a B. So if a kid has ten 4s and two 3s, they get a B. If they have more than one 2, a C and so on... in traditional grading, scores are averaged, so a good grade can help bring up a bad one, but not in that way of using SBG. You could have 100 4s but those two 3s still bring you down an entire letter grade. Other teachers equate 4 to A, 3 to B, etc., but this is confusing because is a 4 a 90, a 95, or a 100? It doesn't really make sense.

Most of the work the kids do does not count for a grade at all. In some cases, only 2-3 assignments per quarter count for a grade. Since kids were blowing off the "formative" (not for a grade) assignments last year, this year, they made a rule that kids are not allowed to take the "summative" (for a grade) tests, etc. unless they have completed all of the formative work.

Being able to retake tests has been nice (for the kids), but there wasn't consistency regarding how many retakes were allowed (most teachers just allowed one; some allowed as many as the students wanted).

Also, the kids need to write a paragraph "justifying" their grade at the end of each quarter-- proving why they should get the grade they claim. Then the teacher can approve it, or not. That seems like the opposite of equity to me. Grades to be based on data, no persuasive writing skills (unless that's the assignment).

Finally, no extra credit allowed, even if you are only using the resources APS provides, like the ipad. They claim extra credit isn't "fair," but that only makes sense if it's extra credit requiring supplies provided at home, for example. I have tried to read more about SBG to better understand it, but so far, NOT a fan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly are the equity concerns with grades?

Everyone is not getting a trophy like on the sports field.

Arlington now wants to apply 'everyone gets a trophy' to academics as well.

APS was already sub-par compared to FCCPS and the top schools in FCPS and now they want to race harder to the bottom?

FCCPS switched to SBG in 2019 for some classes and is now almost 100% SBG. No one really understands what it means or how it works, and the implementation across different classes is mixed depending on how well the teacher understands/believes in SBG.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is APS actually moving to standards based grading?

I didn't see that proposal in the slides but I didn't watch the work session.

Did they say during the work session that they want to move to standards based grading system wide?

They want the SB to vote for this six months from now, and put it in effect next fall.

Third to last slide: https://go.boarddocs.com/vsba/arlington/Board.nsf/files/C7XLVB557627/$file/101421%20School%20Board%20Work%20Session%20-%20Grading%20%26%20Homework.pdf

Wow. School board is actually going to have to weigh in on something meaningful other than the calendar and boundaries!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:APS and the School Board last night had their first working session to discuss setting a new grading policy by the end of this school year, with changes driven by equity concerns (based off of the book "Grading for Equity" by Joe Feldman, which 100+ at APS are reading right now and every SB member received a copy of last night).

Some proposals include:
a) Eliminating late penalties for turning in homework late
b) Allowing retakes of tests
c) Eliminating extra credit
d) Having more ungraded formative assessments (and presumably less graded homework, classwork and labs)

Here are the board slides:
https://rb.gy/cl2icr

And the working session video:
https://www.apsva.us/school-board-meetings/school-board-work-sessions-meetings/

Thoughts? Anyone know about empirical results? Downsides?

Sounds really good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's insane that a kid can earn an A and then another kid that never turns in homework on-time, repeatedly gets a bad grade and gets to turn that assignment or correct that test OVER AND OVER again will end up with the same GPA. WTF?

I am so glad I pulled both my kids from APS after middle school. One 8th grader left.

Our private HS teaches consequences and instills work habits that they will need in college and for life. It sucks, but that's life. Getting downgraded and having it effect your course grade, is a consequence of not doing the work. And, if the course is too challenging you need to drop down or get help after school.

Why is it insane? The purpose of school is to learn the material, not to ration grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hasn't this shipped sailed long ago???

I mean when you have 27 Valedictorians, it tells you something.

In Fairfax County in the 80s/90s, we had one.

Valedictorian: a student (singular), typically having the highest academic achievements of the class, who delivers the valedictory at a graduation ceremony.

The private schools still have one Valedictorian and one Salutatorian.

Salutatorian: the student who ranks second highest in a graduating class and delivers the salutatory. a graduating class and delivers the salutatory.

The terms have come to mean very little in public HS.

And that is OK. Virtuous, even.