2 Year Old Dragged into Water by Gator at Disney Resort

[Anonymous]

Pictures of the area. This was a tragic mistake, but the child should not have been playing in a foot of this water. The moment the child was heading towards it, the parents should have intervened. It's a sad mistake all around, but this is obviously not play-able water area.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3642167/Two-year-old-child-dragged-water-alligator-near-Disney-s-Grand-Floridian-resort.html

[Anonymous]

"If the lagoon is this dangerous, Disney shouldn't have a beach there"

The resorts have been operating around this lagoon for almost half a century and it has grown into the most popular tourist destination in the world. In 45 years, there has not been a single alligator attack until now.

From a statistical standpoint, you'd have a difficult time arguing that the beaches are "this dangerous."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:How dumb are these parents? Who in the United States doesn't know that ANY body of water in FL (besides the ocean), no matter how pretty or inviting it may seem likely has gators and/or venomous things. I love that we're splitting hairs between swimming and wading, when this child shouldn't have been touching water, period. Even if the signs don't say it - why risk it?

Wonder how close the dad was to the kid - bc I would think a dad standing right there could grab the kid under the armpits end pull hard enough to pull him out. Though I guess that also depends on the gators grip.

Sad but I don't want to see Disney paying out huge sums here.

Okay, for one thing, if you believe that every single person in the US is aware of the dangers of alligators in Florida, you are a moron. Full stop.

Secondly, even if this kid was standing 12 inches away, not touching the water, the alligator still could have gotten him.

Really? I would wager that people who don't know about gators in Florida are the idiots.

Yes, I know that you would wager that. Because you don't know shit about how the world works.

We're not talking about the world. We're talking about the US. And if the US school system hasn't taught families well off enough to visit Disney that there are gators in Florida, they're morons.

I am highly educated. I live in New England and visit beaches nearly every day. I am aware that alligators live in Florida, and specifically in the Everglades. I would never dream that there are alligators at the shoreline of a Disney advertised "white sands" beach where families are encouraged to play and watch fireworks. Absent signage saying "No Wading" due to bacteria, alligators, whatever, my 2 year old would certainly have been allowed to go in the water up to his ankles as I stood nearby.

There but by the grace of God go I. Just horrifying.

This is what confuses me. Why is Disney somehow separate from Florida? Is it not in Florida? How would you reasonably expect them to ensure there is no wildlife in their waters? Seriously. How?

We all know how Disney is so meticulous about controlling things, creating a sterile fantasy, that I would think Disney would not deign to allow wildlife in its man-made lagoon next to a man-made lake at a family resort.

But...how would they be able to do this??? The lagoon is connected to bigger bodies of water. Apparently, they DO kill them when they know they are there. I just...can't wrap my mind around people thinking Disney controls wildlife. Wow.

The issue will be negligence and justice for the family. This will be an existential fight for Disney as it calls into question the premise behind the lagoon hotels. I imagine that all lawyers are at battle stations.

Let's see...do people swim in the canals in Venice? Hop into the Chicago River? No.

The Disney lake isn't used for swimming today, but it is used for boating. As it should be.

People are just going to have to accept there are risks in life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I always thought those lagoon beaches were gross. Why would you set up a beach for kids to run around on next to an alligator infested lagoon. The Disney "illusion" is that all is safe. There are no warnings about alligators.

Lots of things have the illusion of being safe. You still need to use your head. I can't believe people want a warning about alligators in FLORIDA.

How many times does this bear repeating? PEOPLE FROM OTHER PARTS OF THE COUNTRY ARE SIMPLY IGNORANT OF ALLIGATOR BEST PRACTICES.

This is not something we are taught in the Northeast, Midwest, or West coast. I know about alligators and to stay away from them. But I had no idea that they eat in the evening, that they could be lurking next to a white sand beach on a seemingly "safe" Disney property that they encourage families to use, that they could snatch a toddler in only a few inches of water. Parents from Nebraska will not know any of this. I'm well educated, an Eagle Scout and very outdoorsy (love to hike, camp, surf, etc) and I did not know about these rules. Absent information about gators lurking nearby, I'd probably let my kids dip their toes in the water at this "beach" given the setup.

Disney did not properly communicate the risks.

Well, then you're an idiot. If you're visiting an area, you should always learn about the dangers, what to avoid, what to expect, etc.

Seriously, STFU troll. You're basically calling the parents idiots, too.

Families pay LOTS of money to stay at the Disney resort because they want a safe, hassle-free experience. When they go camping in the Everglades, they realize that they need to take more precautions. Families let their guard down and do not have a defensive mindset when they are on a Disney resort property. In fact, I would argue that Disney encourages people to relax their defensiveness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I always thought those lagoon beaches were gross. Why would you set up a beach for kids to run around on next to an alligator infested lagoon. The Disney "illusion" is that all is safe. There are no warnings about alligators.

Lots of things have the illusion of being safe. You still need to use your head. I can't believe people want a warning about alligators in FLORIDA.

If Yellowstone and Yosemite can go to great extent to warn people about wild animals in a wilderness park where one of the main attractions is to see animals in the wild then, yes, a company attracting visitors from all over the world to Florida should know they should provide warnings about alligators!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pictures of the area. This was a tragic mistake, but the child should not have been playing in a foot of this water. The moment the child was heading towards it, the parents should have intervened. It's a sad mistake all around, but this is obviously not play-able water area.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3642167/Two-year-old-child-dragged-water-alligator-near-Disney-s-Grand-Floridian-resort.html

That water looks scary during the day (too dark to see what's lurking), let alone at night.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How dumb are these parents? Who in the United States doesn't know that ANY body of water in FL (besides the ocean), no matter how pretty or inviting it may seem likely has gators and/or venomous things. I love that we're splitting hairs between swimming and wading, when this child shouldn't have been touching water, period. Even if the signs don't say it - why risk it?

Wonder how close the dad was to the kid - bc I would think a dad standing right there could grab the kid under the armpits end pull hard enough to pull him out. Though I guess that also depends on the gators grip.

Sad but I don't want to see Disney paying out huge sums here.

Okay, for one thing, if you believe that every single person in the US is aware of the dangers of alligators in Florida, you are a moron. Full stop.

Secondly, even if this kid was standing 12 inches away, not touching the water, the alligator still could have gotten him.

Really? I would wager that people who don't know about gators in Florida are the idiots.

Yes, I know that you would wager that. Because you don't know shit about how the world works.

We're not talking about the world. We're talking about the US. And if the US school system hasn't taught families well off enough to visit Disney that there are gators in Florida, they're morons.

I am highly educated. I live in New England and visit beaches nearly every day. I am aware that alligators live in Florida, and specifically in the Everglades. I would never dream that there are alligators at the shoreline of a Disney advertised "white sands" beach where families are encouraged to play and watch fireworks. Absent signage saying "No Wading" due to bacteria, alligators, whatever, my 2 year old would certainly have been allowed to go in the water up to his ankles as I stood nearby.

There but by the grace of God go I. Just horrifying.

This is what confuses me. Why is Disney somehow separate from Florida? Is it not in Florida? How would you reasonably expect them to ensure there is no wildlife in their waters? Seriously. How?

It's a big state. I didn't realize it was so uniformly infested with alligators.

Maybe it's not. But, when near fresh water, assume the worse. Better safe than sorry.

I will now.

[Anonymous]

My heart dropped, the moment I saw this news.... I cannot imagine losing my child like this.... My heart goes out to the family...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How dumb are these parents? Who in the United States doesn't know that ANY body of water in FL (besides the ocean), no matter how pretty or inviting it may seem likely has gators and/or venomous things. I love that we're splitting hairs between swimming and wading, when this child shouldn't have been touching water, period. Even if the signs don't say it - why risk it?

Wonder how close the dad was to the kid - bc I would think a dad standing right there could grab the kid under the armpits end pull hard enough to pull him out. Though I guess that also depends on the gators grip.

Sad but I don't want to see Disney paying out huge sums here.

Okay, for one thing, if you believe that every single person in the US is aware of the dangers of alligators in Florida, you are a moron. Full stop.

Secondly, even if this kid was standing 12 inches away, not touching the water, the alligator still could have gotten him.

Really? I would wager that people who don't know about gators in Florida are the idiots.

Yes, I know that you would wager that. Because you don't know shit about how the world works.

We're not talking about the world. We're talking about the US. And if the US school system hasn't taught families well off enough to visit Disney that there are gators in Florida, they're morons.

I am highly educated. I live in New England and visit beaches nearly every day. I am aware that alligators live in Florida, and specifically in the Everglades. I would never dream that there are alligators at the shoreline of a Disney advertised "white sands" beach where families are encouraged to play and watch fireworks. Absent signage saying "No Wading" due to bacteria, alligators, whatever, my 2 year old would certainly have been allowed to go in the water up to his ankles as I stood nearby.

There but by the grace of God go I. Just horrifying.

+1

+2. And I find the poster calling the parents morons to be truly disgusting.

This. I am highly educated as well, and know that there are alligators in FL. But I also know how Disney controls the theme park experience end-to-end and that they installed a beach at the resort along this lagoon. Despite the "no swimming" signs, I would never expect an alligator to come out of the water and attack my child at the Grand Floridian. And I don't think it's reasonable to expect families visiting from all over the world to know about the alligators in FL and guard themselves against this while on Disney property. If the lagoon is this dangerous, Disney shouldn't have a beach there, nor hold movie nights, fireworks, etc. There should be signs everywhere. As much as I like Disney, I would absolutely sue them in this case. And my heart breaks for these poor parents.

Again, Disney can not control wildlife in their water. Can they remove them, if found? Sure. But to expect them to know at all times what lurks in their waters is asinine. They told you "No Swimming" and that should be enough. Now, if alligators were all over their sandy beaches, that's another story.

As has been explained to you numerous times, "no swimming" does not equal "don't walk in the shallows due to alligator risk". Disney hosts people from all over the country and all over the world, and there is zero reason that a family from Nebraska (or Bethesda) would know that there is a risk in allowing a child to play in shallow water on a sandy beach. I can guarantee you in that situation, my behavior would be very different if a sign said "no swimming" vs "danger - alligators".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People blame the parents because they are in denial. They want to feel in control of everything in their lives and don't want to believe that something so horrible can happen in very normal and common circumstances. They don't know how to process that. So instead they make it seem like the parents could have prevented it.

I get it, guys. It's hard to accept that we're helpless sometimes. But your words are very cruel toward those parents experiencing the worst kind of grief. Please think before you lash out at the parents. What if they saw what you wrote?

I agree with this. However, I tHink it is the same motivation that causes people to blame Disney. No one wants to believe that terrible accidents just happen. Someone must have been to blame, and if they hadn't been negligent, this would have been prevented. Some posters on here seem to believe that Disney should have somehow prevented the real world from existing within the boundaries of their property. It was a terrible tragedy. But terrible tragedies happen everywhere. That doesn't mean either the parents or Disney was at fault. THe alligator was just doing what alligators do. Now if you want to talk about those who have insisted that alligators be protected to the extent that their populations have exploded in close proximity to people, we can have a discusision.....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How have they not found the boy yet?

The ugly truth is that the Gator may have eaten him. They don't normally actually eat people - the bite can kill, but they rarely actually eat people - but this was a small child.

I'm amazed at the people asking how a Gator got into the lagoon. We have two gators (that I know of) in the man made retention pond in our back yard. Wildlife control will relocate them when they reach 6 feet. Every house on our lake has kids. The kids are outside all the time and know not to play in the water. I worry more about the water moccasins than about the gators.

It's been said so many times in this thread - In Florida you assume all fresh water has gators.

You can't have it both ways - either gators are a risk in "all fresh water" in Florida, and you make that risk known at your resort where you host people not from Florida, or you don't post a warning about gators because it's such a rare and freak thing to happen. What you do not do is have an explicit "no swimming" warning, including numerous signs picturing a person swimming in a circle with a line though it, when the risk isn't really about swimming. Not everyone knows the whole state is infested with alligators.

I am in SHOCK that so many people are so ignorant.

Really? Do you know about all the wildlife in other states? Like New Mexico and Arizona?

[Anonymous]

We honeymooned in Mexico and our resort had "cocodillo" signs all over the place. We didn't go near the water.

I'm sorry, but "No Swimming" is one thing and "Beware: Crocodiles" is something else. If I see "No Swimming" I can totally see my kid(s) putting their feet in the water since that isn't swimming. But if I see "Beware: Crocodiles" bet you ass my kids are not putting their feet in any kind of water.

If dangerous, life-threatening wildlife are on your property, you should probably mention that.

That poor, poor family. I am simply haunted by this whole story.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I always thought those lagoon beaches were gross. Why would you set up a beach for kids to run around on next to an alligator infested lagoon. The Disney "illusion" is that all is safe. There are no warnings about alligators.

Lots of things have the illusion of being safe. You still need to use your head. I can't believe people want a warning about alligators in FLORIDA.

How many times does this bear repeating? PEOPLE FROM OTHER PARTS OF THE COUNTRY ARE SIMPLY IGNORANT OF ALLIGATOR BEST PRACTICES.

This is not something we are taught in the Northeast, Midwest, or West coast. I know about alligators and to stay away from them. But I had no idea that they eat in the evening, that they could be lurking next to a white sand beach on a seemingly "safe" Disney property that they encourage families to use, that they could snatch a toddler in only a few inches of water. Parents from Nebraska will not know any of this. I'm well educated, an Eagle Scout and very outdoorsy (love to hike, camp, surf, etc) and I did not know about these rules. Absent information about gators lurking nearby, I'd probably let my kids dip their toes in the water at this "beach" given the setup.

Disney did not properly communicate the risks.

Well, then you're an idiot. If you're visiting an area, you should always learn about the dangers, what to avoid, what to expect, etc.

Seriously, STFU troll. You're basically calling the parents idiots, too.

Families pay LOTS of money to stay at the Disney resort because they want a safe, hassle-free experience. When they go camping in the Everglades, they realize that they need to take more precautions. Families let their guard down and do not have a defensive mindset when they are on a Disney resort property. In fact, I would argue that Disney encourages people to relax their defensiveness.

And, THAT'S the problem. You're on vacation but that does not mean you get to leave your common sense at home. While Disney has done a great job at being considered a magical place to assume that no hurt, harm or danger will come to you while there is asinine.

If you want to go wading/swimming in a dark and large body of water AT NIGHT while knowing Disney will keep you safe, have at it. While you're at it, when in their pools, don't bother with a life jacket if you can't swim. Disney has you covered!

[Anonymous]

Re: the discussion of possible lawsuits -- I'm curious whether surrounding resorts and attractions post alligator warnings? If it is standard practice, it's going to look bad on Disney.

Also, surrounding bystanders could claim emotional distress. I think it's reasonable to suffer distress from witnessing or being in close proximity to the immediate fall out of this event. I've only read about it and am really upset thinking about it. I imagine those who were there when it happened are suffering some sort of distress as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"If the lagoon is this dangerous, Disney shouldn't have a beach there"

The resorts have been operating around this lagoon for almost half a century and it has grown into the most popular tourist destination in the world. In 45 years, there has not been a single alligator attack until now.

From a statistical standpoint, you'd have a difficult time arguing that the beaches are "this dangerous."

Alligators were also hunted and endangered so it's only relatively recently that they have been proliferating. Disney warned people not to "swim" in the water because it has a steep drop off and and deep water (that's what the signs say). Not because an alligator could grab a child standing in a couple inches of water. You want to run a resort in FL and invite people to hang out on your beach, then take the time to inform them about Florida wildlife and what Disney can and can't do to minimize the risk (they stated that they relocate alligators above a certain size, if they can see and find them)