Insurrection Hearings 6/9-6/23

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I never donated a dime to Trump. And I admit that I am not all that sad that people were defrauded by this guy when he collected millions to fight election fraud that he knew didn’t exist. And that he used those funds for other things (possibly lining his own pockets but the committee hasn’t shown that yet). But it sort of astonishes me that his supporters aren’t pissed off. They’ve been played and everyone knows it. Why are they still looking to cover up for this loon? They can still hate brown people and worry about their children being indoctrinated and talk about democrats murdering babies and have fun gun fetishes and even blame all the ills of the world on the democrats. None of that has to change to reject Trump.

The Committee has showed evidence that hundreds of thousands went to the Trump Organization and that $60,000 went to Kimberly Guilfoyle for 2.5-minute speech. What else do you think they have that we haven’t seen?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I never donated a dime to Trump. And I admit that I am not all that sad that people were defrauded by this guy when he collected millions to fight election fraud that he knew didn’t exist. And that he used those funds for other things (possibly lining his own pockets but the committee hasn’t shown that yet). But it sort of astonishes me that his supporters aren’t pissed off. They’ve been played and everyone knows it. Why are they still looking to cover up for this loon? They can still hate brown people and worry about their children being indoctrinated and talk about democrats murdering babies and have fun gun fetishes and even blame all the ills of the world on the democrats. None of that has to change to reject Trump.

Because they have all been telling us how amazing he is for years while we told them he was a crook. Admitting they were wrong makes them look dumb. This is very common for people who a victims of scams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

If it wasn't alcohol, then it was something else. He was under the influence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

Hard to say. It’s my understanding that he’s inebriated quite frequently, but he also appears to have dementia and is a liar, so who knows. My hunch is that he was drinking that night, and I don’t mean Diet Pepsi.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

If it wasn't alcohol, then it was something else. He was under the influence.

Who cares? I’ve never once tried to overthrow a government or planned to do so when I’ve been drunk. The drinking isn’t the problem, the fascistic thinking is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

If it wasn't alcohol, then it was something else. He was under the influence.

Who cares? I’ve never once tried to overthrow a government or planned to do so when I’ve been drunk. The drinking isn’t the problem, the fascistic thinking is.

I think the point is that every sober, mentally stable person around Trump was telling him that there was no fraud and he’d lost, but a drunk counseled him to declare victory and claim fraud, and guess whose advise Trump decided to follow?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I never donated a dime to Trump. And I admit that I am not all that sad that people were defrauded by this guy when he collected millions to fight election fraud that he knew didn’t exist. And that he used those funds for other things (possibly lining his own pockets but the committee hasn’t shown that yet). But it sort of astonishes me that his supporters aren’t pissed off. They’ve been played and everyone knows it. Why are they still looking to cover up for this loon? They can still hate brown people and worry about their children being indoctrinated and talk about democrats murdering babies and have fun gun fetishes and even blame all the ills of the world on the democrats. None of that has to change to reject Trump.

Because they have all been telling us how amazing he is for years while we told them he was a crook. Admitting they were wrong makes them look dumb. This is very common for people who a victims of scams.

I think it's more like cult followers don't realize that they have been fooled. When you are surrounded by only the type of media and people who continue to claim the election was stolen, you are not going to believe anything else.

They think all of the "evidence" is manufactured against Trump by disloyal people who have their own agenda.

I honestly don't think you will change their hearts and minds. The only way to do that is with cult de-programming techniques.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

If it wasn't alcohol, then it was something else. He was under the influence.

Who cares? I’ve never once tried to overthrow a government or planned to do so when I’ve been drunk. The drinking isn’t the problem, the fascistic thinking is.

I think the point is that every sober, mentally stable person around Trump was telling him that there was no fraud and he’d lost, but a drunk counseled him to declare victory and claim fraud, and guess whose advise Trump decided to follow?

The whole story that it was Guiliani who told him to declare victory is ridiculous. Trump was telegraphing that this was his plan for months. There were articles in lots of newspapers and magazines pointing out that Trump was likely to do this based on the things Trump was saying over and over again. It was not spontaneous. It was planned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Republican politicians are paying close attention and these hearings have the potential to sway their political direction.

None of them privately want Trump to be President again. However a lot of them have publicly supported him to gain a fund-raising advantage on the back of the right's massive efforts to find election fraud. They desperately need an external pivot, because they've boxed themselves in with Trump, despite wanting another conservative as President, someone who can win against Biden (easier in times of high inflation) and unite the Republican party, which is fractured right now in Trump and anti-Trump camps.

So everyone's watching and waiting for a few high-profile Republicans to lead them away from Trump.

DeSantis is loving this, and is the right-wing conservative a lot of voters could pivot to. On the other hand, Hogan can bill himself as a never-Trumper and a fresh start. Liz Cheney can ride on bipartisanship and the one who finally closed the chapter on Trump. The field is wide open, and the hearings are significantly decreasing Trump's chances of running again by showing that people in his orbit really thought he was crazy.

The problem is that all of the likely leaders have spent years calling Trump the second-coming. It will take a "we were always at war with Eastasia" propaganda effort to overcome this. On the bright side, the republican party has a massive propaganda machine that is able to convince its followers of just about any absurd thing it wants to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

If it wasn't alcohol, then it was something else. He was under the influence.

Who cares? I’ve never once tried to overthrow a government or planned to do so when I’ve been drunk. The drinking isn’t the problem, the fascistic thinking is.

I think the point is that every sober, mentally stable person around Trump was telling him that there was no fraud and he’d lost, but a drunk counseled him to declare victory and claim fraud, and guess whose advise Trump decided to follow?

The whole story that it was Guiliani who told him to declare victory is ridiculous. Trump was telegraphing that this was his plan for months. There were articles in lots of newspapers and magazines pointing out that Trump was likely to do this based on the things Trump was saying over and over again. It was not spontaneous. It was planned.

Yes, that's what the hearings have been showing. But they are also showing that on election day and afterwards, multiple people told Trump that he lost and to knock off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Why aren't they dedicating more time to the financial grift?

Since no one seems to be moved by ethics and morals on the Trump side, perhaps the electorate who donated hard earned money will only be persuaded by this the financial fraud aspect of this.

I'm not sure they mind being fleeced to finance the lifestyles of these shameless con artists. After all, they continue to send their cash to the NRA to pay for Wayne LaPierre's private jets for his family to vacay in the Caribbean.

It is very hard to admit you've been conned. It's embarrassing.

The more this goes on while other much more serious issues are ignored, the more conservative I become.

what is more serious than the losing candidate trying to steal an election he lost? and the other issues (i guess you are referring to the economy and inflation) they are not ignored and the US is facing them like all other major economies in the world (and everybody else, and at least we are not facing starvation)

DP.. this is what liberals don't get. A lot of people don't really care about our democracy. Money trumps everything. They care more about day to day living, having sh1t to buy, than whether our democracy is under threat or there is a corrupt dictator in the WH.

Germans circa 1930s is a perfect example of how people really don't care about real freedoms.

Americans have never lived under an actual dictator (thankfully, Trump was hamstrung by external and internal forces), so they take our political system and the thin veneer of a civilized society for granted.

This is why many people who lived under the former USSR would rather go back to that than the type of "democracy" they have now because at least back then they had government rationed food. When "democracy" came, it was harder for them.

People are willing to look the other way if they can be guaranteed their creature comforts. It's also why Melania Trump looks the other way from Trump's many infidelities and corruptions.

Well, okay. That's a snapshot of today.

But on January 6, the insurrectionists weren't looking for lower inflation or food. They wanted Trump to steal (stop the steal) the presidency.

I am very concerned about the lack of security that day. I understand Trump asked for extra coverage in advance that day and it was turned down by the house. Is that true?

That is not at all true. From where do you understand that?

Here’s a timeline I saw. It has PDF links

https://adnamerica.com/en/united-states/trump-pentagon-first-offered-national-guard-capitol-four-days-jan-6-riots-memo-shows

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

If it wasn't alcohol, then it was something else. He was under the influence.

Who cares? I’ve never once tried to overthrow a government or planned to do so when I’ve been drunk. The drinking isn’t the problem, the fascistic thinking is.

I think the point is that every sober, mentally stable person around Trump was telling him that there was no fraud and he’d lost, but a drunk counseled him to declare victory and claim fraud, and guess whose advise Trump decided to follow?

The whole story that it was Guiliani who told him to declare victory is ridiculous. Trump was telegraphing that this was his plan for months. There were articles in lots of newspapers and magazines pointing out that Trump was likely to do this based on the things Trump was saying over and over again. It was not spontaneous. It was planned.

Yes, that's what the hearings have been showing. But they are also showing that on election day and afterwards, multiple people told Trump that he lost and to knock off.

Trump’s natural inclination was to declare that the election was rigged if he didn’t win. He would have done that no matter what. But he needed someone with an air of authority to stand with him, and some attorneys who either had absolutely no scruples or were batshit crazy in order to mount any sort of legal defense. That’s where Rudy fits into this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Turns out Rudi WASN"T drunk.

If it wasn't alcohol, then it was something else. He was under the influence.

Who cares? I’ve never once tried to overthrow a government or planned to do so when I’ve been drunk. The drinking isn’t the problem, the fascistic thinking is.

I think the point is that every sober, mentally stable person around Trump was telling him that there was no fraud and he’d lost, but a drunk counseled him to declare victory and claim fraud, and guess whose advise Trump decided to follow?

The whole story that it was Guiliani who told him to declare victory is ridiculous. Trump was telegraphing that this was his plan for months. There were articles in lots of newspapers and magazines pointing out that Trump was likely to do this based on the things Trump was saying over and over again. It was not spontaneous. It was planned.

The point is that drunk Giuliani was the only one telling Trump that Trump should do what Trump wanted to do, and that everyone else in the room was telling Trump not to do that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Why aren't they dedicating more time to the financial grift?

Since no one seems to be moved by ethics and morals on the Trump side, perhaps the electorate who donated hard earned money will only be persuaded by this the financial fraud aspect of this.

I'm not sure they mind being fleeced to finance the lifestyles of these shameless con artists. After all, they continue to send their cash to the NRA to pay for Wayne LaPierre's private jets for his family to vacay in the Caribbean.

It is very hard to admit you've been conned. It's embarrassing.

The more this goes on while other much more serious issues are ignored, the more conservative I become.

what is more serious than the losing candidate trying to steal an election he lost? and the other issues (i guess you are referring to the economy and inflation) they are not ignored and the US is facing them like all other major economies in the world (and everybody else, and at least we are not facing starvation)

DP.. this is what liberals don't get. A lot of people don't really care about our democracy. Money trumps everything. They care more about day to day living, having sh1t to buy, than whether our democracy is under threat or there is a corrupt dictator in the WH.

Germans circa 1930s is a perfect example of how people really don't care about real freedoms.

Americans have never lived under an actual dictator (thankfully, Trump was hamstrung by external and internal forces), so they take our political system and the thin veneer of a civilized society for granted.

This is why many people who lived under the former USSR would rather go back to that than the type of "democracy" they have now because at least back then they had government rationed food. When "democracy" came, it was harder for them.

People are willing to look the other way if they can be guaranteed their creature comforts. It's also why Melania Trump looks the other way from Trump's many infidelities and corruptions.

Well, okay. That's a snapshot of today.

But on January 6, the insurrectionists weren't looking for lower inflation or food. They wanted Trump to steal (stop the steal) the presidency.

I am very concerned about the lack of security that day. I understand Trump asked for extra coverage in advance that day and it was turned down by the house. Is that true?

That is not at all true. From where do you understand that?

Here’s a timeline I saw. It has PDF links

https://adnamerica.com/en/united-states/trump-pentagon-first-offered-national-guard-capitol-four-days-jan-6-riots-memo-shows

None of the links in that article actually point anywhere. Do you have more reliable sourcing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Why aren't they dedicating more time to the financial grift?

Since no one seems to be moved by ethics and morals on the Trump side, perhaps the electorate who donated hard earned money will only be persuaded by this the financial fraud aspect of this.

I'm not sure they mind being fleeced to finance the lifestyles of these shameless con artists. After all, they continue to send their cash to the NRA to pay for Wayne LaPierre's private jets for his family to vacay in the Caribbean.

It is very hard to admit you've been conned. It's embarrassing.

The more this goes on while other much more serious issues are ignored, the more conservative I become.

what is more serious than the losing candidate trying to steal an election he lost? and the other issues (i guess you are referring to the economy and inflation) they are not ignored and the US is facing them like all other major economies in the world (and everybody else, and at least we are not facing starvation)

DP.. this is what liberals don't get. A lot of people don't really care about our democracy. Money trumps everything. They care more about day to day living, having sh1t to buy, than whether our democracy is under threat or there is a corrupt dictator in the WH.

Germans circa 1930s is a perfect example of how people really don't care about real freedoms.

Americans have never lived under an actual dictator (thankfully, Trump was hamstrung by external and internal forces), so they take our political system and the thin veneer of a civilized society for granted.

This is why many people who lived under the former USSR would rather go back to that than the type of "democracy" they have now because at least back then they had government rationed food. When "democracy" came, it was harder for them.

People are willing to look the other way if they can be guaranteed their creature comforts. It's also why Melania Trump looks the other way from Trump's many infidelities and corruptions.

Well, okay. That's a snapshot of today.

But on January 6, the insurrectionists weren't looking for lower inflation or food. They wanted Trump to steal (stop the steal) the presidency.

I am very concerned about the lack of security that day. I understand Trump asked for extra coverage in advance that day and it was turned down by the house. Is that true?

That is not at all true. From where do you understand that?

Here’s a timeline I saw. It has PDF links

https://adnamerica.com/en/united-states/trump-pentagon-first-offered-national-guard-capitol-four-days-jan-6-riots-memo-shows

That’s not Trump offering anything or Pelosi refusing anything. That’s a DoD bureaucrat asking a Capitol Police bureaucrat whether they would be requesting National Guard troops, and Patel lying about what that meant. Nobody should want National Guard to be front-line law enforcement at the Capitol. That isn’t an appropriate use. The Guard was misused in the fascist police state action in Lafayette Square and no one wanted a repeat of that. The problem at the Capitol was not the absence of the National Guard. It was the President inciting a fascist coup attempt.