Anonymous wrote:Stop blaming teachers. By HS, students know what they need to do, the just choose not to do it. They think sports is a priority, their phone, their friends, etc., not their school work.
What did we do before parentvue?
Parents need to take responsibility of their kids. Show teachers some respect, then students will learn to respect teachers.
Before ParentVUE we had textbooks and not a blizzard of mishmash handouts for every class.
We had handouts in the 80s. Xeroxed. I remember at the end of the year, throwing away folders of papers. Don't act like we didn't have handouts before. You gotta move into the new century. We all gotta keep up with technology.
It's not technology that is holding us back, it's parents who don't discipline their kids, kids who don't respect adults, too many phones during class time.
Parents taking kids on vacation during the school year and expecting the teacher to follow up with the kids individually. We didn't take a vacation during the school year. We focused on school.
Parent expectation is unreal.
Most of us discipline our kids, restrict and monitor phones and reach out to teachers to check on our kids and work together.
We haven’t had a vacation, even a weekend away in 8 years. Not even during the summer.
Textbooks are helpful. For history we have them and they are great. Math too but teachers choose not to use them.
As a teacher it’s on you to control your classroom and find ways to reach students. Stop blaming parents. Plenty of teachers are strict and control phones. Sounds like a you problem and you need to rethink what you do.
And that summer vacation money you have, we spend it on tutors to make up for the bad curriculum and teaching.
Anonymous wrote:How about a rule where teachers and admin need to respond to parents within three days. We have teachers and admin who clearly read the messages and don’t respond. How about teachers needing to consistently post assignments online so parents know what’s going on. How about teachers grade within a week so kids know how they are doing? We have teachers who still have not graded or posted in a month. Not ok. Kids can only be successful if teachers also put in the effort.
Most teachers are putting in the effort. But that effort requires time. We’ve done this math multiple times but here it is again:
150 students x 5min an assignment =750mins / 60mins in an hour = 12.5 hours . Thats the total time to grade one assignment. If a teacher got one class period free per day let’s say 47mins x 5 days =235 mins /60 =3.9 hours. That’s how much time they had in their work week to potentially grade. There other 8.6 hours comes from their personal life.
Out of seven teachers, three are putting in effort. Getting a month behind on grading and not responding to parents is not ok.
Thank those three. They gave up their weekends and evenings for you.
The other four are giving you what they are paid for.
Some, yes, some no. It’s their job. Not ok to not grade. As of today still no grades posted for the past month.
I’m a DP, but I’m happy to repeat the math for you:
I have 150 students. A writing assignment can take 15 minutes to grade. That’s 37.5 hours of grading. I get approximately 3.5 hours a week of time to get my work done.
And that’s just one assignment. Just one. That doesn’t include emails I need to respond to, reports I have to update, plans I have to revise.
So literally half my job has to be done on my own time. Over 30 hours a week.
So… SHOULD this be my job?
How do you think your students will improve without written feedback? I get that it takes time, but isn’t this a huge part of learning and the job?
I am a middle school teacher. My students do not read the feedback. They look at their grade and come up to me and say 'why did I get a B/C?' I ask them about looking at the feedback and they say nope.
As parents, we are going in and reading it. And, if that many kids are struggling, maybe you need to take some more time to reinforce the concepts they are struggling with.
Yep, keep blaming the teacher. At what point does the student have any accountability.
“Please read my feedback and if you have additional questions, we can meet at x time.”
The teacher mentioned middle schoolers. She needs to train them in the way she wants to behave. You get tweens to be accountable by telling and holding them what the standards are.
I know that it is difficult to believe, so I will ask it again, what time during the day do I have to meet with 150 middle schoolers to go over their feedback? I don't have office hours. If I am not teaching a class, I am in a meeting or planning or grading. If I open up time to meet individually with students, what should I not do? Plan or grade? Oh, you want me to be like the PP who works 70 hours a week. I am not going to do that. And you can continue to assume that I am a bad teacher, but this is a job. Until MCPS can give me the appropriate time to do my job, things won't get done. The only reason the public school system is not failing is because teachers are giving up their lives to hold it together. And for what? For parents to still not value what we do. I will say it again. Please fight for teachers to have the time to implement this new grading policy with fidelity. Demand MCPS gives us time to do this.
If the idea that you would meet with a kid before school, at lunch, or after school is so unfathomable to you, you are worse than I thought. My children are in high school and fortunately we have yet to encounter a teacher who is so extreme.
DP here.
I’m genuinely curious. How do you think the teacher above is going to meet with 150 students individually?
Let’s say she meets with 2 students before school each day, 2 at her lunch, and 3 after school. That’s 7 a day she can meet with if she gives up any and all available time she has. (And that’s assuming that time wasn’t already taken up by other requirements.) She can meet with 35 students a week. It’ll take her 5 weeks to meet with all 150 and that’s by giving up ALL the time she has.
Did you think this through, PP?
Did you read what I wrote? My kids have always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it. Do you really think all 150 students are trying to meet with the teacher outside of class? Did you think through the assumptions in your math? How many kids do you think are going to ask to meet outside of class? Do you think every meeting is one-on-one. Do you even know any high schoolers? You need to post that goblin math to excuse lame teacher like the one above who posted.
Your rudeness is beyond unnecessary. You are responding to a teacher who has over 7 hours of meeting time A WEEK for students. I am available before and after school every day. You even said yourself that you have "always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it." So I'm not sure why you need to be rude.
And, as a teacher, I'm very aware of how many students ask for help versus how many don't. That's simply not the point of this subthread. If you follow the conversation, it started with the suggestion that teachers meet individually for verbal feedback. That, as I stated above, simply can't be done.
Once again: no need to be absolutely rude with your "lame teacher" and "goblin math" comments. Some of us are working extremely hard FOR YOU and don't need to be put down at every chance. It gets old, you know?
I am responding to the poster who tried to defend you while insulting me. I am perfectly aware of how this subthread started — I helped start it. Do you think it’s helpful for the conversation for the poster to pretend it would take you 5 weeks to meet with each individual students on every individual assignment? I don’t. That poster is not serious and need not be taken seriously. If you are the teacher above who defended your decision not to meet with their students outside of class because it’s just a job, then you are indeed lame.
In middle school there is no 'outside of class' time to meet with students. This is what we call a toxic relationship. Teachers tells you they do not have enough time in the day to do their job. Parents say if we just did more or were better organized or gave up our lives we could do it. That one teacher who works over 70 hours a week does, so we should too. You call us lame when we don't do agree with you. Keep blaming the teachers. This is what MCPS wants. If parents actually wanted things to change they would demand that MCPS gave us time to implement these changes.
It’s not the parents responsibility to advocate, it’s yours and your union.
Sure, sure. And, understanding that, the parents need to accept what they get because that's all they advocated for. The teachers teach the class. Expecting them to then personally hold little Janie/Jonny's hand and remind them eleven times to turn in their work and then stay in at lunch and after school to re-teach the classwork they already taught is unreasonable. You want the teachers to put in the work to teach your kid study skills because you didn't/don't. That's not their responsibility, it's yours. If you insist on offloading that responsibility and putting the burden on the teachers, then yes, you DO have to get involved to figure out how and when, exactly, they're supposed to do all of that on top of their actual job of teaching the curriculum during school hours.
Algebra class is about Algebra, not study skills. You're expected to provide that, just like all other necessary school supplies. Do your job.
Problem is not all teachers teach. In math we e has teachers send links to videos and tell the kids to use them. Teachers need to teach study skills and time management. Parents can support. Instead we are the ones teaching our kids algebra or working ourselves to pay for tutors so our kids can be successful.
My favorite is in English when they show a video or play a recording of the book vs actually reading it. Kids don’t even get a copy of the book except if we buy it.
As a teacher you advocate for your needs as should your union. As parents we advocate for our kids. As an adult stop expecting others to do your job and meet your needs.
This isn’t a battle. As a teacher, I’m not fighting to have my needs met. I’m fighting to provide more for my students. That may look like advocating for more grading time, but that’s so my students can receive more timely feedback. Everything we do is for our students. We are not in competition with you, as your last paragraph suggests. We want to work with you.
And curriculum is not set by individual teachers, so you are going to battle against the wrong people anyway.
Again, those are things you, your coworkers and union need to advocate for. Testify at the BOE, write letters, push the union to handle it. Stop putting it on parents.
Correct. It's insane that some teachers seem to expect more from parents to improve their work environment rather than the union that they pay dues to and holds far more power and influence with MCPS than parents.
Chat, what is a democracy? Why can’t I can’t get top tier service at rock bottom prices without paying any attention?
MCPS is not a democracy. It's a fiefdom, and the teachers' union, which is staffed with paid employees and has the leverage of a contractual agreement with MCPS, carries more weight and heft than the all-volunteer MCCPTA, which is the closest thing parents have to a union in MCPS and carries none of the contractual heft and weight that the labor agreements MCEA has with MCPS.
Or teachers can keep doing the job they were paid to do and you can keep crying about it anonymously on a message board instead of engaging with the School Board hearings or Central Office outreach.
School board and central office ignore parents. Many of us have tried.
Correct. Which is the point I tried to make to the teachers that they don't seem to get. MCPS and the BOE can ignore parents because:
1) Individual parents don't carry enough weight
2) There's no legal or financial consequence to ignoring a local PTA or MCCPTA
3) Parents cycle out of schools as their kids make their way through the system, so MCPS/BOE can just wait out pesky parents
4) Parents have to fit their advocacy on top of their full-time jobs, so there isn't always the capacity to do that work (you'd think the folks who are complaining they have to grade school work in their personal time would grasp this but alas....)
Do you forget the nightmare that was Open MCPS that advocated all the way to the governor’s office? Parents absolutely have the loudest voice. Believe me. We get written up, put on action plans, demoted, given unfair performance evaluations (via observations), get put in transfer lists, are forced to change subjects or grades we teach with little notice, are ignored when asked for support….shall I go on?
Look what happened with the Farquhar scandal. We ARE NOT LISTENED TO. And if we do speak up? Then we pay for it. So please knock it off. Teachers have way more to lose than you realize. We are asking for help! And we are getting excuses and pushback and shame. Just like we get from MCPS. So now maybe we can understand why education is going down a path it might not recover from when no one of any substance is willing to teach anymore.
Re: Open MCPS. At this point, the people who were advocating to reopen schools sooner were right and those who were advocating to remain closed were wrong. So how is that example helpful? And despite that group's efforts, MCPS was one of the school districts in the nation that remained closed the longest. So how is that helping your cause?
In terms of Farquahar: Teachers won that fight! It was anonymous teacher complaints, complete with statements from MCEA, that made its way to the Washington Post and brought Beidleman down! How is that an example that teachers lack power and influence in MCPS???
Oh bless your heart.
Please research before you type. The only reason why MCPS responded was because an undercover substitute teacher exposed them on a national level! Otherwise there would be a sexual predator in charge of your kids! But I guess that would be the teachers fault too.
How does Alexandra Robbins being an undercover substitute teacher and one of the authors of the WaPo stories that brought Beidleman, MCPS and McKnight down negate my point that teachers won that fight?
Are you from central? You sure sound like the miscreants from there. The point is, since it has to be spelled out for you, is that should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly. Which they didn’t. And still do not. Or did you not read the outside legal reports?
Absolutely agreed that "should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly." But again, that does not negate the fact that the teachers and MCEA won that fight.
When teachers and their unions act, things happen.
Prince George's County Public Schools will soon be without a superintendent, after the school system announced Thursday night that the Board of Education agreed to "separate their employment relationship" with Millard House II.
The superintendent's last day will be June 18, according to PGCPS.
The agreement between House and the Board of Education, comes just over one week after Prince George's County's largest teachers' union issued a vote of no-confidence against the superintendent.
Again: In the hierarchy of public education, teachers and their unions have more power and weight than their parent counterparts do.
With McKnight gone then, why aren’t things better then? Do you have a citation for how much MCPS has improved since she was outsed too?
I guess I just have a higher standard of expectation for all stakeholders to do what they can to improve things. Not just push it off to the lowest person on the totem pole they can complain to.
I really don’t want to argue anymore. I hate it that’s all we seem to do. I mean, you could just coast in education I assume, but it’s a really stressful and overly demanding job now - when it really doesn’t have to be. Burnout is a major reason why we leave. It’s too much. So I said my truth. You can take it or leave it. But I’m almost out of steam to continue fighting a fight with MCPS. It’s truly a toxic organization at its core, when it honestly could be truly great in full.
Anonymous wrote:How about a rule where teachers and admin need to respond to parents within three days. We have teachers and admin who clearly read the messages and don’t respond. How about teachers needing to consistently post assignments online so parents know what’s going on. How about teachers grade within a week so kids know how they are doing? We have teachers who still have not graded or posted in a month. Not ok. Kids can only be successful if teachers also put in the effort.
Most teachers are putting in the effort. But that effort requires time. We’ve done this math multiple times but here it is again:
150 students x 5min an assignment =750mins / 60mins in an hour = 12.5 hours . Thats the total time to grade one assignment. If a teacher got one class period free per day let’s say 47mins x 5 days =235 mins /60 =3.9 hours. That’s how much time they had in their work week to potentially grade. There other 8.6 hours comes from their personal life.
Out of seven teachers, three are putting in effort. Getting a month behind on grading and not responding to parents is not ok.
Thank those three. They gave up their weekends and evenings for you.
The other four are giving you what they are paid for.
Some, yes, some no. It’s their job. Not ok to not grade. As of today still no grades posted for the past month.
I’m a DP, but I’m happy to repeat the math for you:
I have 150 students. A writing assignment can take 15 minutes to grade. That’s 37.5 hours of grading. I get approximately 3.5 hours a week of time to get my work done.
And that’s just one assignment. Just one. That doesn’t include emails I need to respond to, reports I have to update, plans I have to revise.
So literally half my job has to be done on my own time. Over 30 hours a week.
So… SHOULD this be my job?
How do you think your students will improve without written feedback? I get that it takes time, but isn’t this a huge part of learning and the job?
I am a middle school teacher. My students do not read the feedback. They look at their grade and come up to me and say 'why did I get a B/C?' I ask them about looking at the feedback and they say nope.
As parents, we are going in and reading it. And, if that many kids are struggling, maybe you need to take some more time to reinforce the concepts they are struggling with.
Yep, keep blaming the teacher. At what point does the student have any accountability.
“Please read my feedback and if you have additional questions, we can meet at x time.”
The teacher mentioned middle schoolers. She needs to train them in the way she wants to behave. You get tweens to be accountable by telling and holding them what the standards are.
I know that it is difficult to believe, so I will ask it again, what time during the day do I have to meet with 150 middle schoolers to go over their feedback? I don't have office hours. If I am not teaching a class, I am in a meeting or planning or grading. If I open up time to meet individually with students, what should I not do? Plan or grade? Oh, you want me to be like the PP who works 70 hours a week. I am not going to do that. And you can continue to assume that I am a bad teacher, but this is a job. Until MCPS can give me the appropriate time to do my job, things won't get done. The only reason the public school system is not failing is because teachers are giving up their lives to hold it together. And for what? For parents to still not value what we do. I will say it again. Please fight for teachers to have the time to implement this new grading policy with fidelity. Demand MCPS gives us time to do this.
If the idea that you would meet with a kid before school, at lunch, or after school is so unfathomable to you, you are worse than I thought. My children are in high school and fortunately we have yet to encounter a teacher who is so extreme.
DP here.
I’m genuinely curious. How do you think the teacher above is going to meet with 150 students individually?
Let’s say she meets with 2 students before school each day, 2 at her lunch, and 3 after school. That’s 7 a day she can meet with if she gives up any and all available time she has. (And that’s assuming that time wasn’t already taken up by other requirements.) She can meet with 35 students a week. It’ll take her 5 weeks to meet with all 150 and that’s by giving up ALL the time she has.
Did you think this through, PP?
Did you read what I wrote? My kids have always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it. Do you really think all 150 students are trying to meet with the teacher outside of class? Did you think through the assumptions in your math? How many kids do you think are going to ask to meet outside of class? Do you think every meeting is one-on-one. Do you even know any high schoolers? You need to post that goblin math to excuse lame teacher like the one above who posted.
Your rudeness is beyond unnecessary. You are responding to a teacher who has over 7 hours of meeting time A WEEK for students. I am available before and after school every day. You even said yourself that you have "always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it." So I'm not sure why you need to be rude.
And, as a teacher, I'm very aware of how many students ask for help versus how many don't. That's simply not the point of this subthread. If you follow the conversation, it started with the suggestion that teachers meet individually for verbal feedback. That, as I stated above, simply can't be done.
Once again: no need to be absolutely rude with your "lame teacher" and "goblin math" comments. Some of us are working extremely hard FOR YOU and don't need to be put down at every chance. It gets old, you know?
I am responding to the poster who tried to defend you while insulting me. I am perfectly aware of how this subthread started — I helped start it. Do you think it’s helpful for the conversation for the poster to pretend it would take you 5 weeks to meet with each individual students on every individual assignment? I don’t. That poster is not serious and need not be taken seriously. If you are the teacher above who defended your decision not to meet with their students outside of class because it’s just a job, then you are indeed lame.
In middle school there is no 'outside of class' time to meet with students. This is what we call a toxic relationship. Teachers tells you they do not have enough time in the day to do their job. Parents say if we just did more or were better organized or gave up our lives we could do it. That one teacher who works over 70 hours a week does, so we should too. You call us lame when we don't do agree with you. Keep blaming the teachers. This is what MCPS wants. If parents actually wanted things to change they would demand that MCPS gave us time to implement these changes.
It’s not the parents responsibility to advocate, it’s yours and your union.
Sure, sure. And, understanding that, the parents need to accept what they get because that's all they advocated for. The teachers teach the class. Expecting them to then personally hold little Janie/Jonny's hand and remind them eleven times to turn in their work and then stay in at lunch and after school to re-teach the classwork they already taught is unreasonable. You want the teachers to put in the work to teach your kid study skills because you didn't/don't. That's not their responsibility, it's yours. If you insist on offloading that responsibility and putting the burden on the teachers, then yes, you DO have to get involved to figure out how and when, exactly, they're supposed to do all of that on top of their actual job of teaching the curriculum during school hours.
Algebra class is about Algebra, not study skills. You're expected to provide that, just like all other necessary school supplies. Do your job.
Problem is not all teachers teach. In math we e has teachers send links to videos and tell the kids to use them. Teachers need to teach study skills and time management. Parents can support. Instead we are the ones teaching our kids algebra or working ourselves to pay for tutors so our kids can be successful.
My favorite is in English when they show a video or play a recording of the book vs actually reading it. Kids don’t even get a copy of the book except if we buy it.
As a teacher you advocate for your needs as should your union. As parents we advocate for our kids. As an adult stop expecting others to do your job and meet your needs.
This isn’t a battle. As a teacher, I’m not fighting to have my needs met. I’m fighting to provide more for my students. That may look like advocating for more grading time, but that’s so my students can receive more timely feedback. Everything we do is for our students. We are not in competition with you, as your last paragraph suggests. We want to work with you.
And curriculum is not set by individual teachers, so you are going to battle against the wrong people anyway.
Again, those are things you, your coworkers and union need to advocate for. Testify at the BOE, write letters, push the union to handle it. Stop putting it on parents.
Correct. It's insane that some teachers seem to expect more from parents to improve their work environment rather than the union that they pay dues to and holds far more power and influence with MCPS than parents.
Chat, what is a democracy? Why can’t I can’t get top tier service at rock bottom prices without paying any attention?
MCPS is not a democracy. It's a fiefdom, and the teachers' union, which is staffed with paid employees and has the leverage of a contractual agreement with MCPS, carries more weight and heft than the all-volunteer MCCPTA, which is the closest thing parents have to a union in MCPS and carries none of the contractual heft and weight that the labor agreements MCEA has with MCPS.
Or teachers can keep doing the job they were paid to do and you can keep crying about it anonymously on a message board instead of engaging with the School Board hearings or Central Office outreach.
School board and central office ignore parents. Many of us have tried.
Correct. Which is the point I tried to make to the teachers that they don't seem to get. MCPS and the BOE can ignore parents because:
1) Individual parents don't carry enough weight
2) There's no legal or financial consequence to ignoring a local PTA or MCCPTA
3) Parents cycle out of schools as their kids make their way through the system, so MCPS/BOE can just wait out pesky parents
4) Parents have to fit their advocacy on top of their full-time jobs, so there isn't always the capacity to do that work (you'd think the folks who are complaining they have to grade school work in their personal time would grasp this but alas....)
Do you forget the nightmare that was Open MCPS that advocated all the way to the governor’s office? Parents absolutely have the loudest voice. Believe me. We get written up, put on action plans, demoted, given unfair performance evaluations (via observations), get put in transfer lists, are forced to change subjects or grades we teach with little notice, are ignored when asked for support….shall I go on?
Look what happened with the Farquhar scandal. We ARE NOT LISTENED TO. And if we do speak up? Then we pay for it. So please knock it off. Teachers have way more to lose than you realize. We are asking for help! And we are getting excuses and pushback and shame. Just like we get from MCPS. So now maybe we can understand why education is going down a path it might not recover from when no one of any substance is willing to teach anymore.
Re: Open MCPS. At this point, the people who were advocating to reopen schools sooner were right and those who were advocating to remain closed were wrong. So how is that example helpful? And despite that group's efforts, MCPS was one of the school districts in the nation that remained closed the longest. So how is that helping your cause?
In terms of Farquahar: Teachers won that fight! It was anonymous teacher complaints, complete with statements from MCEA, that made its way to the Washington Post and brought Beidleman down! How is that an example that teachers lack power and influence in MCPS???
Oh bless your heart.
Please research before you type. The only reason why MCPS responded was because an undercover substitute teacher exposed them on a national level! Otherwise there would be a sexual predator in charge of your kids! But I guess that would be the teachers fault too.
How does Alexandra Robbins being an undercover substitute teacher and one of the authors of the WaPo stories that brought Beidleman, MCPS and McKnight down negate my point that teachers won that fight?
Are you from central? You sure sound like the miscreants from there. The point is, since it has to be spelled out for you, is that should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly. Which they didn’t. And still do not. Or did you not read the outside legal reports?
Absolutely agreed that "should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly." But again, that does not negate the fact that the teachers and MCEA won that fight.
When teachers and their unions act, things happen.
Prince George's County Public Schools will soon be without a superintendent, after the school system announced Thursday night that the Board of Education agreed to "separate their employment relationship" with Millard House II.
The superintendent's last day will be June 18, according to PGCPS.
The agreement between House and the Board of Education, comes just over one week after Prince George's County's largest teachers' union issued a vote of no-confidence against the superintendent.
Again: In the hierarchy of public education, teachers and their unions have more power and weight than their parent counterparts do.
With McKnight gone then, why aren’t things better then? Do you have a citation for how much MCPS has improved since she was outsed too?
I guess I just have a higher standard of expectation for all stakeholders to do what they can to improve things. Not just push it off to the lowest person on the totem pole they can complain to.
I really don’t want to argue anymore. I hate it that’s all we seem to do. I mean, you could just coast in education I assume, but it’s a really stressful and overly demanding job now - when it really doesn’t have to be. Burnout is a major reason why we leave. It’s too much. So I said my truth. You can take it or leave it. But I’m almost out of steam to continue fighting a fight with MCPS. It’s truly a toxic organization at its core, when it honestly could be truly great in full.
I also am not trying to fight you. And though I'm a parent, I know teacher burnout is real.
Which is why I'm pointing my finger at the MCEA. Who is paid, on behalf of teachers, to fight and advocate to improve the system for your wellbeing.
As for whether the system has improved with McKnight, I would argue no! But people need to decide to stop kissing Taylor's butt and say that out loud more consistently in public and TO HIS FACE. Stop saying Taylor is great when MCPS is in the state it's in.
Anonymous wrote:How about a rule where teachers and admin need to respond to parents within three days. We have teachers and admin who clearly read the messages and don’t respond. How about teachers needing to consistently post assignments online so parents know what’s going on. How about teachers grade within a week so kids know how they are doing? We have teachers who still have not graded or posted in a month. Not ok. Kids can only be successful if teachers also put in the effort.
Most teachers are putting in the effort. But that effort requires time. We’ve done this math multiple times but here it is again:
150 students x 5min an assignment =750mins / 60mins in an hour = 12.5 hours . Thats the total time to grade one assignment. If a teacher got one class period free per day let’s say 47mins x 5 days =235 mins /60 =3.9 hours. That’s how much time they had in their work week to potentially grade. There other 8.6 hours comes from their personal life.
Out of seven teachers, three are putting in effort. Getting a month behind on grading and not responding to parents is not ok.
Thank those three. They gave up their weekends and evenings for you.
The other four are giving you what they are paid for.
Some, yes, some no. It’s their job. Not ok to not grade. As of today still no grades posted for the past month.
I’m a DP, but I’m happy to repeat the math for you:
I have 150 students. A writing assignment can take 15 minutes to grade. That’s 37.5 hours of grading. I get approximately 3.5 hours a week of time to get my work done.
And that’s just one assignment. Just one. That doesn’t include emails I need to respond to, reports I have to update, plans I have to revise.
So literally half my job has to be done on my own time. Over 30 hours a week.
So… SHOULD this be my job?
How do you think your students will improve without written feedback? I get that it takes time, but isn’t this a huge part of learning and the job?
I am a middle school teacher. My students do not read the feedback. They look at their grade and come up to me and say 'why did I get a B/C?' I ask them about looking at the feedback and they say nope.
As parents, we are going in and reading it. And, if that many kids are struggling, maybe you need to take some more time to reinforce the concepts they are struggling with.
Yep, keep blaming the teacher. At what point does the student have any accountability.
“Please read my feedback and if you have additional questions, we can meet at x time.”
The teacher mentioned middle schoolers. She needs to train them in the way she wants to behave. You get tweens to be accountable by telling and holding them what the standards are.
I know that it is difficult to believe, so I will ask it again, what time during the day do I have to meet with 150 middle schoolers to go over their feedback? I don't have office hours. If I am not teaching a class, I am in a meeting or planning or grading. If I open up time to meet individually with students, what should I not do? Plan or grade? Oh, you want me to be like the PP who works 70 hours a week. I am not going to do that. And you can continue to assume that I am a bad teacher, but this is a job. Until MCPS can give me the appropriate time to do my job, things won't get done. The only reason the public school system is not failing is because teachers are giving up their lives to hold it together. And for what? For parents to still not value what we do. I will say it again. Please fight for teachers to have the time to implement this new grading policy with fidelity. Demand MCPS gives us time to do this.
If the idea that you would meet with a kid before school, at lunch, or after school is so unfathomable to you, you are worse than I thought. My children are in high school and fortunately we have yet to encounter a teacher who is so extreme.
DP here.
I’m genuinely curious. How do you think the teacher above is going to meet with 150 students individually?
Let’s say she meets with 2 students before school each day, 2 at her lunch, and 3 after school. That’s 7 a day she can meet with if she gives up any and all available time she has. (And that’s assuming that time wasn’t already taken up by other requirements.) She can meet with 35 students a week. It’ll take her 5 weeks to meet with all 150 and that’s by giving up ALL the time she has.
Did you think this through, PP?
Did you read what I wrote? My kids have always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it. Do you really think all 150 students are trying to meet with the teacher outside of class? Did you think through the assumptions in your math? How many kids do you think are going to ask to meet outside of class? Do you think every meeting is one-on-one. Do you even know any high schoolers? You need to post that goblin math to excuse lame teacher like the one above who posted.
Your rudeness is beyond unnecessary. You are responding to a teacher who has over 7 hours of meeting time A WEEK for students. I am available before and after school every day. You even said yourself that you have "always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it." So I'm not sure why you need to be rude.
And, as a teacher, I'm very aware of how many students ask for help versus how many don't. That's simply not the point of this subthread. If you follow the conversation, it started with the suggestion that teachers meet individually for verbal feedback. That, as I stated above, simply can't be done.
Once again: no need to be absolutely rude with your "lame teacher" and "goblin math" comments. Some of us are working extremely hard FOR YOU and don't need to be put down at every chance. It gets old, you know?
I am responding to the poster who tried to defend you while insulting me. I am perfectly aware of how this subthread started — I helped start it. Do you think it’s helpful for the conversation for the poster to pretend it would take you 5 weeks to meet with each individual students on every individual assignment? I don’t. That poster is not serious and need not be taken seriously. If you are the teacher above who defended your decision not to meet with their students outside of class because it’s just a job, then you are indeed lame.
In middle school there is no 'outside of class' time to meet with students. This is what we call a toxic relationship. Teachers tells you they do not have enough time in the day to do their job. Parents say if we just did more or were better organized or gave up our lives we could do it. That one teacher who works over 70 hours a week does, so we should too. You call us lame when we don't do agree with you. Keep blaming the teachers. This is what MCPS wants. If parents actually wanted things to change they would demand that MCPS gave us time to implement these changes.
It’s not the parents responsibility to advocate, it’s yours and your union.
Sure, sure. And, understanding that, the parents need to accept what they get because that's all they advocated for. The teachers teach the class. Expecting them to then personally hold little Janie/Jonny's hand and remind them eleven times to turn in their work and then stay in at lunch and after school to re-teach the classwork they already taught is unreasonable. You want the teachers to put in the work to teach your kid study skills because you didn't/don't. That's not their responsibility, it's yours. If you insist on offloading that responsibility and putting the burden on the teachers, then yes, you DO have to get involved to figure out how and when, exactly, they're supposed to do all of that on top of their actual job of teaching the curriculum during school hours.
Algebra class is about Algebra, not study skills. You're expected to provide that, just like all other necessary school supplies. Do your job.
Problem is not all teachers teach. In math we e has teachers send links to videos and tell the kids to use them. Teachers need to teach study skills and time management. Parents can support. Instead we are the ones teaching our kids algebra or working ourselves to pay for tutors so our kids can be successful.
My favorite is in English when they show a video or play a recording of the book vs actually reading it. Kids don’t even get a copy of the book except if we buy it.
As a teacher you advocate for your needs as should your union. As parents we advocate for our kids. As an adult stop expecting others to do your job and meet your needs.
This isn’t a battle. As a teacher, I’m not fighting to have my needs met. I’m fighting to provide more for my students. That may look like advocating for more grading time, but that’s so my students can receive more timely feedback. Everything we do is for our students. We are not in competition with you, as your last paragraph suggests. We want to work with you.
And curriculum is not set by individual teachers, so you are going to battle against the wrong people anyway.
Again, those are things you, your coworkers and union need to advocate for. Testify at the BOE, write letters, push the union to handle it. Stop putting it on parents.
Correct. It's insane that some teachers seem to expect more from parents to improve their work environment rather than the union that they pay dues to and holds far more power and influence with MCPS than parents.
Chat, what is a democracy? Why can’t I can’t get top tier service at rock bottom prices without paying any attention?
MCPS is not a democracy. It's a fiefdom, and the teachers' union, which is staffed with paid employees and has the leverage of a contractual agreement with MCPS, carries more weight and heft than the all-volunteer MCCPTA, which is the closest thing parents have to a union in MCPS and carries none of the contractual heft and weight that the labor agreements MCEA has with MCPS.
Or teachers can keep doing the job they were paid to do and you can keep crying about it anonymously on a message board instead of engaging with the School Board hearings or Central Office outreach.
School board and central office ignore parents. Many of us have tried.
Correct. Which is the point I tried to make to the teachers that they don't seem to get. MCPS and the BOE can ignore parents because:
1) Individual parents don't carry enough weight
2) There's no legal or financial consequence to ignoring a local PTA or MCCPTA
3) Parents cycle out of schools as their kids make their way through the system, so MCPS/BOE can just wait out pesky parents
4) Parents have to fit their advocacy on top of their full-time jobs, so there isn't always the capacity to do that work (you'd think the folks who are complaining they have to grade school work in their personal time would grasp this but alas....)
Do you forget the nightmare that was Open MCPS that advocated all the way to the governor’s office? Parents absolutely have the loudest voice. Believe me. We get written up, put on action plans, demoted, given unfair performance evaluations (via observations), get put in transfer lists, are forced to change subjects or grades we teach with little notice, are ignored when asked for support….shall I go on?
Look what happened with the Farquhar scandal. We ARE NOT LISTENED TO. And if we do speak up? Then we pay for it. So please knock it off. Teachers have way more to lose than you realize. We are asking for help! And we are getting excuses and pushback and shame. Just like we get from MCPS. So now maybe we can understand why education is going down a path it might not recover from when no one of any substance is willing to teach anymore.
Re: Open MCPS. At this point, the people who were advocating to reopen schools sooner were right and those who were advocating to remain closed were wrong. So how is that example helpful? And despite that group's efforts, MCPS was one of the school districts in the nation that remained closed the longest. So how is that helping your cause?
In terms of Farquahar: Teachers won that fight! It was anonymous teacher complaints, complete with statements from MCEA, that made its way to the Washington Post and brought Beidleman down! How is that an example that teachers lack power and influence in MCPS???
Oh bless your heart.
Please research before you type. The only reason why MCPS responded was because an undercover substitute teacher exposed them on a national level! Otherwise there would be a sexual predator in charge of your kids! But I guess that would be the teachers fault too.
How does Alexandra Robbins being an undercover substitute teacher and one of the authors of the WaPo stories that brought Beidleman, MCPS and McKnight down negate my point that teachers won that fight?
Are you from central? You sure sound like the miscreants from there. The point is, since it has to be spelled out for you, is that should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly. Which they didn’t. And still do not. Or did you not read the outside legal reports?
Absolutely agreed that "should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly." But again, that does not negate the fact that the teachers and MCEA won that fight.
When teachers and their unions act, things happen.
Prince George's County Public Schools will soon be without a superintendent, after the school system announced Thursday night that the Board of Education agreed to "separate their employment relationship" with Millard House II.
The superintendent's last day will be June 18, according to PGCPS.
The agreement between House and the Board of Education, comes just over one week after Prince George's County's largest teachers' union issued a vote of no-confidence against the superintendent.
Again: In the hierarchy of public education, teachers and their unions have more power and weight than their parent counterparts do.
With McKnight gone then, why aren’t things better then? Do you have a citation for how much MCPS has improved since she was outsed too?
I guess I just have a higher standard of expectation for all stakeholders to do what they can to improve things. Not just push it off to the lowest person on the totem pole they can complain to.
I really don’t want to argue anymore. I hate it that’s all we seem to do. I mean, you could just coast in education I assume, but it’s a really stressful and overly demanding job now - when it really doesn’t have to be. Burnout is a major reason why we leave. It’s too much. So I said my truth. You can take it or leave it. But I’m almost out of steam to continue fighting a fight with MCPS. It’s truly a toxic organization at its core, when it honestly could be truly great in full.
I also am not trying to fight you. And though I'm a parent, I know teacher burnout is real.
Which is why I'm pointing my finger at the MCEA. Who is paid, on behalf of teachers, to fight and advocate to improve the system for your wellbeing.
As for whether the system has improved with McKnight, I would argue no! But people need to decide to stop kissing Taylor's butt and say that out loud more consistently in public and TO HIS FACE. Stop saying Taylor is great when MCPS is in the state it's in.
Taylor de nothing this year to make things better. All show, no substance.
Anonymous wrote:How about a rule where teachers and admin need to respond to parents within three days. We have teachers and admin who clearly read the messages and don’t respond. How about teachers needing to consistently post assignments online so parents know what’s going on. How about teachers grade within a week so kids know how they are doing? We have teachers who still have not graded or posted in a month. Not ok. Kids can only be successful if teachers also put in the effort.
Most teachers are putting in the effort. But that effort requires time. We’ve done this math multiple times but here it is again:
150 students x 5min an assignment =750mins / 60mins in an hour = 12.5 hours . Thats the total time to grade one assignment. If a teacher got one class period free per day let’s say 47mins x 5 days =235 mins /60 =3.9 hours. That’s how much time they had in their work week to potentially grade. There other 8.6 hours comes from their personal life.
Out of seven teachers, three are putting in effort. Getting a month behind on grading and not responding to parents is not ok.
Thank those three. They gave up their weekends and evenings for you.
The other four are giving you what they are paid for.
Some, yes, some no. It’s their job. Not ok to not grade. As of today still no grades posted for the past month.
I’m a DP, but I’m happy to repeat the math for you:
I have 150 students. A writing assignment can take 15 minutes to grade. That’s 37.5 hours of grading. I get approximately 3.5 hours a week of time to get my work done.
And that’s just one assignment. Just one. That doesn’t include emails I need to respond to, reports I have to update, plans I have to revise.
So literally half my job has to be done on my own time. Over 30 hours a week.
So… SHOULD this be my job?
How do you think your students will improve without written feedback? I get that it takes time, but isn’t this a huge part of learning and the job?
I am a middle school teacher. My students do not read the feedback. They look at their grade and come up to me and say 'why did I get a B/C?' I ask them about looking at the feedback and they say nope.
As parents, we are going in and reading it. And, if that many kids are struggling, maybe you need to take some more time to reinforce the concepts they are struggling with.
Yep, keep blaming the teacher. At what point does the student have any accountability.
“Please read my feedback and if you have additional questions, we can meet at x time.”
The teacher mentioned middle schoolers. She needs to train them in the way she wants to behave. You get tweens to be accountable by telling and holding them what the standards are.
I know that it is difficult to believe, so I will ask it again, what time during the day do I have to meet with 150 middle schoolers to go over their feedback? I don't have office hours. If I am not teaching a class, I am in a meeting or planning or grading. If I open up time to meet individually with students, what should I not do? Plan or grade? Oh, you want me to be like the PP who works 70 hours a week. I am not going to do that. And you can continue to assume that I am a bad teacher, but this is a job. Until MCPS can give me the appropriate time to do my job, things won't get done. The only reason the public school system is not failing is because teachers are giving up their lives to hold it together. And for what? For parents to still not value what we do. I will say it again. Please fight for teachers to have the time to implement this new grading policy with fidelity. Demand MCPS gives us time to do this.
If the idea that you would meet with a kid before school, at lunch, or after school is so unfathomable to you, you are worse than I thought. My children are in high school and fortunately we have yet to encounter a teacher who is so extreme.
DP here.
I’m genuinely curious. How do you think the teacher above is going to meet with 150 students individually?
Let’s say she meets with 2 students before school each day, 2 at her lunch, and 3 after school. That’s 7 a day she can meet with if she gives up any and all available time she has. (And that’s assuming that time wasn’t already taken up by other requirements.) She can meet with 35 students a week. It’ll take her 5 weeks to meet with all 150 and that’s by giving up ALL the time she has.
Did you think this through, PP?
Did you read what I wrote? My kids have always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it. Do you really think all 150 students are trying to meet with the teacher outside of class? Did you think through the assumptions in your math? How many kids do you think are going to ask to meet outside of class? Do you think every meeting is one-on-one. Do you even know any high schoolers? You need to post that goblin math to excuse lame teacher like the one above who posted.
Your rudeness is beyond unnecessary. You are responding to a teacher who has over 7 hours of meeting time A WEEK for students. I am available before and after school every day. You even said yourself that you have "always had teachers who meet with students who ask for it." So I'm not sure why you need to be rude.
And, as a teacher, I'm very aware of how many students ask for help versus how many don't. That's simply not the point of this subthread. If you follow the conversation, it started with the suggestion that teachers meet individually for verbal feedback. That, as I stated above, simply can't be done.
Once again: no need to be absolutely rude with your "lame teacher" and "goblin math" comments. Some of us are working extremely hard FOR YOU and don't need to be put down at every chance. It gets old, you know?
I am responding to the poster who tried to defend you while insulting me. I am perfectly aware of how this subthread started — I helped start it. Do you think it’s helpful for the conversation for the poster to pretend it would take you 5 weeks to meet with each individual students on every individual assignment? I don’t. That poster is not serious and need not be taken seriously. If you are the teacher above who defended your decision not to meet with their students outside of class because it’s just a job, then you are indeed lame.
In middle school there is no 'outside of class' time to meet with students. This is what we call a toxic relationship. Teachers tells you they do not have enough time in the day to do their job. Parents say if we just did more or were better organized or gave up our lives we could do it. That one teacher who works over 70 hours a week does, so we should too. You call us lame when we don't do agree with you. Keep blaming the teachers. This is what MCPS wants. If parents actually wanted things to change they would demand that MCPS gave us time to implement these changes.
It’s not the parents responsibility to advocate, it’s yours and your union.
Sure, sure. And, understanding that, the parents need to accept what they get because that's all they advocated for. The teachers teach the class. Expecting them to then personally hold little Janie/Jonny's hand and remind them eleven times to turn in their work and then stay in at lunch and after school to re-teach the classwork they already taught is unreasonable. You want the teachers to put in the work to teach your kid study skills because you didn't/don't. That's not their responsibility, it's yours. If you insist on offloading that responsibility and putting the burden on the teachers, then yes, you DO have to get involved to figure out how and when, exactly, they're supposed to do all of that on top of their actual job of teaching the curriculum during school hours.
Algebra class is about Algebra, not study skills. You're expected to provide that, just like all other necessary school supplies. Do your job.
Problem is not all teachers teach. In math we e has teachers send links to videos and tell the kids to use them. Teachers need to teach study skills and time management. Parents can support. Instead we are the ones teaching our kids algebra or working ourselves to pay for tutors so our kids can be successful.
My favorite is in English when they show a video or play a recording of the book vs actually reading it. Kids don’t even get a copy of the book except if we buy it.
As a teacher you advocate for your needs as should your union. As parents we advocate for our kids. As an adult stop expecting others to do your job and meet your needs.
This isn’t a battle. As a teacher, I’m not fighting to have my needs met. I’m fighting to provide more for my students. That may look like advocating for more grading time, but that’s so my students can receive more timely feedback. Everything we do is for our students. We are not in competition with you, as your last paragraph suggests. We want to work with you.
And curriculum is not set by individual teachers, so you are going to battle against the wrong people anyway.
Again, those are things you, your coworkers and union need to advocate for. Testify at the BOE, write letters, push the union to handle it. Stop putting it on parents.
Correct. It's insane that some teachers seem to expect more from parents to improve their work environment rather than the union that they pay dues to and holds far more power and influence with MCPS than parents.
Chat, what is a democracy? Why can’t I can’t get top tier service at rock bottom prices without paying any attention?
MCPS is not a democracy. It's a fiefdom, and the teachers' union, which is staffed with paid employees and has the leverage of a contractual agreement with MCPS, carries more weight and heft than the all-volunteer MCCPTA, which is the closest thing parents have to a union in MCPS and carries none of the contractual heft and weight that the labor agreements MCEA has with MCPS.
Or teachers can keep doing the job they were paid to do and you can keep crying about it anonymously on a message board instead of engaging with the School Board hearings or Central Office outreach.
School board and central office ignore parents. Many of us have tried.
Correct. Which is the point I tried to make to the teachers that they don't seem to get. MCPS and the BOE can ignore parents because:
1) Individual parents don't carry enough weight
2) There's no legal or financial consequence to ignoring a local PTA or MCCPTA
3) Parents cycle out of schools as their kids make their way through the system, so MCPS/BOE can just wait out pesky parents
4) Parents have to fit their advocacy on top of their full-time jobs, so there isn't always the capacity to do that work (you'd think the folks who are complaining they have to grade school work in their personal time would grasp this but alas....)
Do you forget the nightmare that was Open MCPS that advocated all the way to the governor’s office? Parents absolutely have the loudest voice. Believe me. We get written up, put on action plans, demoted, given unfair performance evaluations (via observations), get put in transfer lists, are forced to change subjects or grades we teach with little notice, are ignored when asked for support….shall I go on?
Look what happened with the Farquhar scandal. We ARE NOT LISTENED TO. And if we do speak up? Then we pay for it. So please knock it off. Teachers have way more to lose than you realize. We are asking for help! And we are getting excuses and pushback and shame. Just like we get from MCPS. So now maybe we can understand why education is going down a path it might not recover from when no one of any substance is willing to teach anymore.
Re: Open MCPS. At this point, the people who were advocating to reopen schools sooner were right and those who were advocating to remain closed were wrong. So how is that example helpful? And despite that group's efforts, MCPS was one of the school districts in the nation that remained closed the longest. So how is that helping your cause?
In terms of Farquahar: Teachers won that fight! It was anonymous teacher complaints, complete with statements from MCEA, that made its way to the Washington Post and brought Beidleman down! How is that an example that teachers lack power and influence in MCPS???
Oh bless your heart.
Please research before you type. The only reason why MCPS responded was because an undercover substitute teacher exposed them on a national level! Otherwise there would be a sexual predator in charge of your kids! But I guess that would be the teachers fault too.
How does Alexandra Robbins being an undercover substitute teacher and one of the authors of the WaPo stories that brought Beidleman, MCPS and McKnight down negate my point that teachers won that fight?
Are you from central? You sure sound like the miscreants from there. The point is, since it has to be spelled out for you, is that should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly. Which they didn’t. And still do not. Or did you not read the outside legal reports?
Absolutely agreed that "should not have been a fight to begin with if MCPS had effective leadership to address concerns promptly." But again, that does not negate the fact that the teachers and MCEA won that fight.
When teachers and their unions act, things happen.
Prince George's County Public Schools will soon be without a superintendent, after the school system announced Thursday night that the Board of Education agreed to "separate their employment relationship" with Millard House II.
The superintendent's last day will be June 18, according to PGCPS.
The agreement between House and the Board of Education, comes just over one week after Prince George's County's largest teachers' union issued a vote of no-confidence against the superintendent.
Again: In the hierarchy of public education, teachers and their unions have more power and weight than their parent counterparts do.
With McKnight gone then, why aren’t things better then? Do you have a citation for how much MCPS has improved since she was outsed too?
I guess I just have a higher standard of expectation for all stakeholders to do what they can to improve things. Not just push it off to the lowest person on the totem pole they can complain to.
I really don’t want to argue anymore. I hate it that’s all we seem to do. I mean, you could just coast in education I assume, but it’s a really stressful and overly demanding job now - when it really doesn’t have to be. Burnout is a major reason why we leave. It’s too much. So I said my truth. You can take it or leave it. But I’m almost out of steam to continue fighting a fight with MCPS. It’s truly a toxic organization at its core, when it honestly could be truly great in full.
I also am not trying to fight you. And though I'm a parent, I know teacher burnout is real.
Which is why I'm pointing my finger at the MCEA. Who is paid, on behalf of teachers, to fight and advocate to improve the system for your wellbeing.
As for whether the system has improved with McKnight, I would argue no! But people need to decide to stop kissing Taylor's butt and say that out loud more consistently in public and TO HIS FACE. Stop saying Taylor is great when MCPS is in the state it's in.
Taylor de nothing this year to make things better. All show, no substance.
Isn't this new change to the grading system (which, by the way, is supposed to be the topic of this thread) making things better?
Anonymous wrote:As someone who went to school in mcps in the 90s and early 2000s, the disdain for teachers in this thread is unreal.
Frightening really.
My youngest just graduated from MCPS and I agree with you. And I think the entitlement, the lack of understanding, the low expectations of their kids with the corresponding demand that teachers coddle.
I mean, keeping track of assignments and turning them in is a skill that MCPS starts to teach in 6th grade. To expect teachers of seniors to make sure mommy knows each assignment and each due date after years of teaching their child to do this independently scares me.
These parents are in for a huge awakening in college. They will either realize their kids played them when magically they are independently successful as a freshman or they will realize their kids may be lost causes and only have themselves to blame because they didn’t force accountability when they had more control. Blaming teachers and expecting hand holding is not going to make kids independent.
Anyways, MCPS teachers, my family appreciates you. You did a great job with all three of my kids. I am impressed at how hard you work and how much you accomplish when you are under resourced and have to deal with the behavioral challenges of the modern school experience.
+1
My 2 graduated and 2 more to go. They were accountable to teachers and themselves. They asked for help when needed and took the constructive criticism. They attend T20 colleges and doing very well. Stop beating up on teachers and MCPS.
Anonymous wrote:Stop blaming teachers. By HS, students know what they need to do, the just choose not to do it. They think sports is a priority, their phone, their friends, etc., not their school work.
What did we do before parentvue?
Parents need to take responsibility of their kids. Show teachers some respect, then students will learn to respect teachers.
Before ParentVUE we had textbooks and not a blizzard of mishmash handouts for every class.
We had handouts in the 80s. Xeroxed. I remember at the end of the year, throwing away folders of papers. Don't act like we didn't have handouts before. You gotta move into the new century. We all gotta keep up with technology.
It's not technology that is holding us back, it's parents who don't discipline their kids, kids who don't respect adults, too many phones during class time.
Parents taking kids on vacation during the school year and expecting the teacher to follow up with the kids individually. We didn't take a vacation during the school year. We focused on school.
Parent expectation is unreal.
Most of us discipline our kids, restrict and monitor phones and reach out to teachers to check on our kids and work together.
We haven’t had a vacation, even a weekend away in 8 years. Not even during the summer.
Textbooks are helpful. For history we have them and they are great. Math too but teachers choose not to use them.
As a teacher it’s on you to control your classroom and find ways to reach students. Stop blaming parents. Plenty of teachers are strict and control phones. Sounds like a you problem and you need to rethink what you do.
And that summer vacation money you have, we spend it on tutors to make up for the bad curriculum and teaching.
Sorry you po’, angry, and bitter. A vacation might help. Sorry your kids are not that bright. I’ve never had to pay for tutors for my kids. They work hard.
Anonymous wrote:Stop blaming teachers. By HS, students know what they need to do, the just choose not to do it. They think sports is a priority, their phone, their friends, etc., not their school work.
What did we do before parentvue?
Parents need to take responsibility of their kids. Show teachers some respect, then students will learn to respect teachers.
Before ParentVUE we had textbooks and not a blizzard of mishmash handouts for every class.
We had handouts in the 80s. Xeroxed. I remember at the end of the year, throwing away folders of papers. Don't act like we didn't have handouts before. You gotta move into the new century. We all gotta keep up with technology.
It's not technology that is holding us back, it's parents who don't discipline their kids, kids who don't respect adults, too many phones during class time.
Parents taking kids on vacation during the school year and expecting the teacher to follow up with the kids individually. We didn't take a vacation during the school year. We focused on school.
Parent expectation is unreal.
Most of us discipline our kids, restrict and monitor phones and reach out to teachers to check on our kids and work together.
We haven’t had a vacation, even a weekend away in 8 years. Not even during the summer.
Textbooks are helpful. For history we have them and they are great. Math too but teachers choose not to use them.
As a teacher it’s on you to control your classroom and find ways to reach students. Stop blaming parents. Plenty of teachers are strict and control phones. Sounds like a you problem and you need to rethink what you do.
And that summer vacation money you have, we spend it on tutors to make up for the bad curriculum and teaching.
Sorry you po’, angry, and bitter. A vacation might help. Sorry your kids are not that bright. I’ve never had to pay for tutors for my kids. They work hard.
Mine are extremely bright. Good try. Yes, a vacation would be nice but we’d rather pay for activities and tutors. Calc bc and multivariable are hard, algebra is not.
Anonymous wrote:Stop blaming teachers. By HS, students know what they need to do, the just choose not to do it. They think sports is a priority, their phone, their friends, etc., not their school work.
What did we do before parentvue?
Parents need to take responsibility of their kids. Show teachers some respect, then students will learn to respect teachers.
Before ParentVUE we had textbooks and not a blizzard of mishmash handouts for every class.
We had handouts in the 80s. Xeroxed. I remember at the end of the year, throwing away folders of papers. Don't act like we didn't have handouts before. You gotta move into the new century. We all gotta keep up with technology.
It's not technology that is holding us back, it's parents who don't discipline their kids, kids who don't respect adults, too many phones during class time.
Parents taking kids on vacation during the school year and expecting the teacher to follow up with the kids individually. We didn't take a vacation during the school year. We focused on school.
Parent expectation is unreal.
Most of us discipline our kids, restrict and monitor phones and reach out to teachers to check on our kids and work together.
We haven’t had a vacation, even a weekend away in 8 years. Not even during the summer.
Textbooks are helpful. For history we have them and they are great. Math too but teachers choose not to use them.
As a teacher it’s on you to control your classroom and find ways to reach students. Stop blaming parents. Plenty of teachers are strict and control phones. Sounds like a you problem and you need to rethink what you do.
And that summer vacation money you have, we spend it on tutors to make up for the bad curriculum and teaching.
Not PP, but I am a parent and see the poor behavior of some kids. I’ve seen kids hiding their phone under their desk. Teachers know. They are not stupid. It’s an endless battle. They can’t keep fighting the fight. It’s exhausting. Burnout is real. They do rethink what they do and leave. That’s how classes end up with subs for the remainder of the year.
YouTube has tons of videos for all the AP classes. That how my kids got 4s and 5s. What school requires so much tutors?
Anonymous wrote:How about a rule where teachers and admin need to respond to parents within three days. We have teachers and admin who clearly read the messages and don’t respond. How about teachers needing to consistently post assignments online so parents know what’s going on. How about teachers grade within a week so kids know how they are doing? We have teachers who still have not graded or posted in a month. Not ok. Kids can only be successful if teachers also put in the effort.
Most teachers are putting in the effort. But that effort requires time. We’ve done this math multiple times but here it is again:
150 students x 5min an assignment =750mins / 60mins in an hour = 12.5 hours . Thats the total time to grade one assignment. If a teacher got one class period free per day let’s say 47mins x 5 days =235 mins /60 =3.9 hours. That’s how much time they had in their work week to potentially grade. There other 8.6 hours comes from their personal life.
Out of seven teachers, three are putting in effort. Getting a month behind on grading and not responding to parents is not ok.
Thank those three. They gave up their weekends and evenings for you.
The other four are giving you what they are paid for.
Some, yes, some no. It’s their job. Not ok to not grade. As of today still no grades posted for the past month.
I’m a DP, but I’m happy to repeat the math for you:
I have 150 students. A writing assignment can take 15 minutes to grade. That’s 37.5 hours of grading. I get approximately 3.5 hours a week of time to get my work done.
And that’s just one assignment. Just one. That doesn’t include emails I need to respond to, reports I have to update, plans I have to revise.
So literally half my job has to be done on my own time. Over 30 hours a week.
So… SHOULD this be my job?
How do you think your students will improve without written feedback? I get that it takes time, but isn’t this a huge part of learning and the job?
I am a middle school teacher. My students do not read the feedback. They look at their grade and come up to me and say 'why did I get a B/C?' I ask them about looking at the feedback and they say nope.
Out of curiosity, can the parents see the feedback? One thing I find frustrating is that as a parent I can rarely see the feedback. Otherwise I would go over it with my kid. “the teacher says you need a better into sentence. Can you think of a good into sentence for this paragraph?” Etc. I do think it’s hard for 11-13 year olds to look at written feedback and internalize it. I work with 25-30 hear olds and I am often told they want oral feedback, not just my written feedback on their work product. I get ghat teachers don’t have time to sit down with every kid but I feel like there is missed opposition for parents to partner with teachers in this effort.
I receive that feeeback in the work place too - don’t just send written comments. Make appointments to sit and go through the document to explain the reasons for high and low level changes. Personally I didn’t post it earlier because it’s clear the teachers posting here don’t care about such things or don’t want to spend the time.
I’m one of the teachers posting here. I work about 70 hours a week, primarily because of my grading load. That’s what it takes to provide feedback in a timely manner. As I said earlier: I am the teacher you want. Being that teacher is burning me out.
Here’s what I do:
1. Give up my nights and weekends to grade
2. Give written feedback within two weeks. I can’t do earlier because, as I said, one assignment can take me almost 40 hours to grade.
3. Provide class time for students to read my comments. They must comment back AND provide revisions. This goes home for review and comes back to me within 2 days.
4. I review their revisions (another 10 hours of grading) returned within 3 days.
5. The process starts again with the next writing assignment. The portfolio builds.
This is what everybody here is asking for. It’s me doing the job as it should be done.
I’m not given ANY time to do this, so it comes from my family. No, that’s not okay. It’s why teachers start phoning it in. Our job should not be in direct competition with our health and our own lives.
I want to thank you for this but can you tell me if you share that feedback with parents? If not, is there a reason why? I genuinely want to help the teachers help my kids — I spent several hours a week myself on parentvue and canvass trying to figure out what I can see, but it’s actually very little. When I was a kid I have paper assignments and books and graded papers that my parents could review with me. I feel like part of the problem is that the current systems discourage parents from being involved in their kids education, which is probably to the detriment of both the kids and the teachers.
I teach advanced high school courses. I firmly believe students must be their own advocates, so I do not involve parents every step of the way. My students must be prepared for college coursework in 1-2 years, and parents will have no access to professors then.
I explain my writing tasks and the progression at the start of the year; this information is in all of my course documentation. Essays, which are hand written in class, are announced a week ahead of time in class and online. I include links to any prep materials. The essays, with comments, can go home for two days for reflection and revision. At that point, I want them back in the classroom so I can rescore and then they can be added to individual portfolios.
Parents have access to the calendar and prep materials. They can see the comments when the essays go home for revision.
But, by junior year, I do not directly involve parents. If a parent wants to meet with me, which occasionally happens, I absolutely welcome that and we can review the student’s work together. I’m available before or after school every day.
Kids sometimes have reasons why they will not approach teachers and someone still need support. As a parent if my kid needs me to step in I will. Handwriting essays is terrible.
Not only does your own writing need work, but you need to brush up on the latest neuroscience.
Your neuroscience is a bunch of bunk and I’m a good writer as are my kids as I have spent many hours working with them. I also taught them to type so they can write more quickly and edit easily. We review all assignments.
OK, maybe you are a good writer, except in social media posts... but you don't get to dismiss science that disproves your opinion with "it's bunk." Luckily, you aren't in charge.
Anonymous wrote:I'm a parent of a rising 9th grader. Before this change to grading I wanted my DC take as many AP's as possible even with their year round club sports and other extracurriculars, namely music. I justified this because in the old grading system A+B = A. Now I don't know if this strategy will work for DC. Given all their time commitments something will have to give.
Yes, your child will have to choose between school work and extracurriculars. That should be the case.
I hope that this new grading policy gets rid of at least some of the grade inflation that has made kids feel like to distinguish themselves in college admissions they have to take every AP class they can. It sounds exhausting and unsustainable. But when everyone gets an A in everything, taking lots of AP classes and doing well on the exams can show you are really a stand-out student.
Anonymous wrote:Stop blaming teachers. By HS, students know what they need to do, the just choose not to do it. They think sports is a priority, their phone, their friends, etc., not their school work.
What did we do before parentvue?
Parents need to take responsibility of their kids. Show teachers some respect, then students will learn to respect teachers.
Before ParentVUE we had textbooks and not a blizzard of mishmash handouts for every class.
We had handouts in the 80s. Xeroxed. I remember at the end of the year, throwing away folders of papers. Don't act like we didn't have handouts before. You gotta move into the new century. We all gotta keep up with technology.
It's not technology that is holding us back, it's parents who don't discipline their kids, kids who don't respect adults, too many phones during class time.
Parents taking kids on vacation during the school year and expecting the teacher to follow up with the kids individually. We didn't take a vacation during the school year. We focused on school.
Parent expectation is unreal.
Most of us discipline our kids, restrict and monitor phones and reach out to teachers to check on our kids and work together.
We haven’t had a vacation, even a weekend away in 8 years. Not even during the summer.
Textbooks are helpful. For history we have them and they are great. Math too but teachers choose not to use them.
As a teacher it’s on you to control your classroom and find ways to reach students. Stop blaming parents. Plenty of teachers are strict and control phones. Sounds like a you problem and you need to rethink what you do.
And that summer vacation money you have, we spend it on tutors to make up for the bad curriculum and teaching.
Not PP, but I am a parent and see the poor behavior of some kids. I’ve seen kids hiding their phone under their desk. Teachers know. They are not stupid. It’s an endless battle. They can’t keep fighting the fight. It’s exhausting. Burnout is real. They do rethink what they do and leave. That’s how classes end up with subs for the remainder of the year.
YouTube has tons of videos for all the AP classes. That how my kids got 4s and 5s. What school requires so much tutors?
So, your kids learned calc bc no issues with just videos? That’s great, it did not work for mine so we got a tutor.
Anonymous wrote:How about a rule where teachers and admin need to respond to parents within three days. We have teachers and admin who clearly read the messages and don’t respond. How about teachers needing to consistently post assignments online so parents know what’s going on. How about teachers grade within a week so kids know how they are doing? We have teachers who still have not graded or posted in a month. Not ok. Kids can only be successful if teachers also put in the effort.
Most teachers are putting in the effort. But that effort requires time. We’ve done this math multiple times but here it is again:
150 students x 5min an assignment =750mins / 60mins in an hour = 12.5 hours . Thats the total time to grade one assignment. If a teacher got one class period free per day let’s say 47mins x 5 days =235 mins /60 =3.9 hours. That’s how much time they had in their work week to potentially grade. There other 8.6 hours comes from their personal life.
Out of seven teachers, three are putting in effort. Getting a month behind on grading and not responding to parents is not ok.
Thank those three. They gave up their weekends and evenings for you.
The other four are giving you what they are paid for.
Some, yes, some no. It’s their job. Not ok to not grade. As of today still no grades posted for the past month.
I’m a DP, but I’m happy to repeat the math for you:
I have 150 students. A writing assignment can take 15 minutes to grade. That’s 37.5 hours of grading. I get approximately 3.5 hours a week of time to get my work done.
And that’s just one assignment. Just one. That doesn’t include emails I need to respond to, reports I have to update, plans I have to revise.
So literally half my job has to be done on my own time. Over 30 hours a week.
So… SHOULD this be my job?
How do you think your students will improve without written feedback? I get that it takes time, but isn’t this a huge part of learning and the job?
I am a middle school teacher. My students do not read the feedback. They look at their grade and come up to me and say 'why did I get a B/C?' I ask them about looking at the feedback and they say nope.
Out of curiosity, can the parents see the feedback? One thing I find frustrating is that as a parent I can rarely see the feedback. Otherwise I would go over it with my kid. “the teacher says you need a better into sentence. Can you think of a good into sentence for this paragraph?” Etc. I do think it’s hard for 11-13 year olds to look at written feedback and internalize it. I work with 25-30 hear olds and I am often told they want oral feedback, not just my written feedback on their work product. I get ghat teachers don’t have time to sit down with every kid but I feel like there is missed opposition for parents to partner with teachers in this effort.
I receive that feeeback in the work place too - don’t just send written comments. Make appointments to sit and go through the document to explain the reasons for high and low level changes. Personally I didn’t post it earlier because it’s clear the teachers posting here don’t care about such things or don’t want to spend the time.
I’m one of the teachers posting here. I work about 70 hours a week, primarily because of my grading load. That’s what it takes to provide feedback in a timely manner. As I said earlier: I am the teacher you want. Being that teacher is burning me out.
Here’s what I do:
1. Give up my nights and weekends to grade
2. Give written feedback within two weeks. I can’t do earlier because, as I said, one assignment can take me almost 40 hours to grade.
3. Provide class time for students to read my comments. They must comment back AND provide revisions. This goes home for review and comes back to me within 2 days.
4. I review their revisions (another 10 hours of grading) returned within 3 days.
5. The process starts again with the next writing assignment. The portfolio builds.
This is what everybody here is asking for. It’s me doing the job as it should be done.
I’m not given ANY time to do this, so it comes from my family. No, that’s not okay. It’s why teachers start phoning it in. Our job should not be in direct competition with our health and our own lives.
I want to thank you for this but can you tell me if you share that feedback with parents? If not, is there a reason why? I genuinely want to help the teachers help my kids — I spent several hours a week myself on parentvue and canvass trying to figure out what I can see, but it’s actually very little. When I was a kid I have paper assignments and books and graded papers that my parents could review with me. I feel like part of the problem is that the current systems discourage parents from being involved in their kids education, which is probably to the detriment of both the kids and the teachers.
I teach advanced high school courses. I firmly believe students must be their own advocates, so I do not involve parents every step of the way. My students must be prepared for college coursework in 1-2 years, and parents will have no access to professors then.
I explain my writing tasks and the progression at the start of the year; this information is in all of my course documentation. Essays, which are hand written in class, are announced a week ahead of time in class and online. I include links to any prep materials. The essays, with comments, can go home for two days for reflection and revision. At that point, I want them back in the classroom so I can rescore and then they can be added to individual portfolios.
Parents have access to the calendar and prep materials. They can see the comments when the essays go home for revision.
But, by junior year, I do not directly involve parents. If a parent wants to meet with me, which occasionally happens, I absolutely welcome that and we can review the student’s work together. I’m available before or after school every day.
Kids sometimes have reasons why they will not approach teachers and someone still need support. As a parent if my kid needs me to step in I will. Handwriting essays is terrible.
Not only does your own writing need work, but you need to brush up on the latest neuroscience.
Your neuroscience is a bunch of bunk and I’m a good writer as are my kids as I have spent many hours working with them. I also taught them to type so they can write more quickly and edit easily. We review all assignments.
OK, maybe you are a good writer, except in social media posts... but you don't get to dismiss science that disproves your opinion with "it's bunk." Luckily, you aren't in charge.
You aren’t giving evidence, just making a statement.
Anonymous wrote:I hope that this new grading policy gets rid of at least some of the grade inflation that has made kids feel like to distinguish themselves in college admissions they have to take every AP class they can. It sounds exhausting and unsustainable. But when everyone gets an A in everything, taking lots of AP classes and doing well on the exams can show you are really a stand-out student.
We aren’t seeing grade inflation and with some teachers it impossible to get an a.
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