Gaza War, Part 3

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

You mean like my Palestinian relatives who are "citizens" of that "dEmOCracY" and live in E. Jerusalem? It's PALESTINIAN, not "Arab." Israelis are the ones with the made-up identity. They even erased Arab Jews (including Palestinian Jews) and call all of them "Mizrahi" because that's how despicable Zionism is. A racist ideology from Europe which destroyed PALESTINE and made all PALESTINIAN and other ARAB Jews erase their own identity to please their Ashkenazi interlopers, and then have the audacity to claim the Arab culture and the food is now "iSrAeli."

Well, you've been lied to about the equality. They're given different IDs and even license plates look different so they know it's not Jews in the car. Which is why my family who've been there forever (we've done DNA tests, so we know we're comprised of every 'invader,' not to mention I've laughably had a couple of Israelis here in the US hit on me in Hebrew thinking I was Israeli), are denied the access to certain roads, but an (alleged) rapist like Brett Ratner fleeing US prosecution, can just show up and on day one, gets to use that road which gets you to where you need to be within a few minutes while it takes my 80yo grandfather an hour if he's lucky (with nasty checkpoints along the way), to get to his destination.

It is a virulently racist oppressive country and the fact is that the US media has done everything to deny it for decades because it's no longer up for debate: When you have the likes of David Brooks (whose own son served w/ the IDF), Bret Stephens (who writes articles titled "The Diseased Arab Mind" BEFORE he even got hired by the NYT) and countless others who are unrelenting in their Zionism, but considered "American, unbiased media," then you know why it's my family who gets vilified by people like them who get to control the narrative and conditioned Americans for generations into believing israel "hAS a rIghT tO dEFenD iTsElF" against my grandfather trying to just go to places he was free to do as a child before some Long Island/Russian-born, arrogant, violent 20yo bully got to tell him he couldn't.

Social media has exposed the glaring hypocrisy of MSM and that's why the younger generation isn't "brainwashed" into believing Israel was spreading joy and then some evil Palestinians showed up and ruined all of that "peace." They see the word "killed" reserved for Israelis and "died" for Palestinians. They see the media and the govt simply taking the lies of israel as gospel.

The absolute nerve of some of you in denial about the barbarism, RAPE, torture of Zionist Jews showing up from Europe and they brought terrorism themselves. My God, you have actual documentaries w/ old Zionist Jewish men laughing and bragging about their depravity. Israelis have never been made to feel ashamed or vilified for what they did to STEAL Palestine and being the very reason a Hamas even exists. The pro-Israeli side gets away w/ the most disgusting language (and PROJECTION) about my people along w/ disgusting behavior -- which I know first-hand.

The most accurate quote for Israel and its arrogant, hypocritical defenders: Offended by everything, ashamed of nothing.

What you should be ashamed of is your ilk invading Israel on October 7 and mass raping and murdering innocent people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Why give citizenship to people who have openly expressed hatred for you, express zero interest in learning about or being part of your society, and so on?

You unintentionally described the attitude toward the native, indigenous population of every Zionist who immigrated to the region since 1880 (to the present day). And yet the former were expected to just accept that immigration and their own forced displacement from the lands they and their immediate predecessors had lived on for centuries and centuries without objection and without resistance, so it seems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

You mean like my Palestinian relatives who are "citizens" of that "dEmOCracY" and live in E. Jerusalem? It's PALESTINIAN, not "Arab." Israelis are the ones with the made-up identity. They even erased Arab Jews (including Palestinian Jews) and call all of them "Mizrahi" because that's how despicable Zionism is. A racist ideology from Europe which destroyed PALESTINE and made all PALESTINIAN and other ARAB Jews erase their own identity to please their Ashkenazi interlopers, and then have the audacity to claim the Arab culture and the food is now "iSrAeli."

Well, you've been lied to about the equality. They're given different IDs and even license plates look different so they know it's not Jews in the car. Which is why my family who've been there forever (we've done DNA tests, so we know we're comprised of every 'invader,' not to mention I've laughably had a couple of Israelis here in the US hit on me in Hebrew thinking I was Israeli), are denied the access to certain roads, but an (alleged) rapist like Brett Ratner fleeing US prosecution, can just show up and on day one, gets to use that road which gets you to where you need to be within a few minutes while it takes my 80yo grandfather an hour if he's lucky (with nasty checkpoints along the way), to get to his destination.

It is a virulently racist oppressive country and the fact is that the US media has done everything to deny it for decades because it's no longer up for debate: When you have the likes of David Brooks (whose own son served w/ the IDF), Bret Stephens (who writes articles titled "The Diseased Arab Mind" BEFORE he even got hired by the NYT) and countless others who are unrelenting in their Zionism, but considered "American, unbiased media," then you know why it's my family who gets vilified by people like them who get to control the narrative and conditioned Americans for generations into believing israel "hAS a rIghT tO dEFenD iTsElF" against my grandfather trying to just go to places he was free to do as a child before some Long Island/Russian-born, arrogant, violent 20yo bully got to tell him he couldn't.

Social media has exposed the glaring hypocrisy of MSM and that's why the younger generation isn't "brainwashed" into believing Israel was spreading joy and then some evil Palestinians showed up and ruined all of that "peace." They see the word "killed" reserved for Israelis and "died" for Palestinians. They see the media and the govt simply taking the lies of israel as gospel.

The absolute nerve of some of you in denial about the barbarism, RAPE, torture of Zionist Jews showing up from Europe and they brought terrorism themselves. My God, you have actual documentaries w/ old Zionist Jewish men laughing and bragging about their depravity. Israelis have never been made to feel ashamed or vilified for what they did to STEAL Palestine and being the very reason a Hamas even exists. The pro-Israeli side gets away w/ the most disgusting language (and PROJECTION) about my people along w/ disgusting behavior -- which I know first-hand.

The most accurate quote for Israel and its arrogant, hypocritical defenders: Offended by everything, ashamed of nothing.

History and DNA disagree with most of your ranting. Ashkenazi Jews do in fact have strong DNA ties to the region and countless historical documents corroborate how Jews were chased out of their homeland of Judea and repeatedly persecuted and chased from country to country, ending up in Europe. But here you are denying all of that. Do you also deny that the holocaust happened?

And likewise, history also shows that many of the Muslim Palestinians do indeed descend from Arabs who came into the area with the spread of Islam. You also deny many other aspects of the history of Palestine. You act as if Israelis just showed up in 1947 and stole the land. That is not at all the case. It was a deal made by the UK, who controlled the land ever since WWI, when the Ottomans lost control of it. The previous rulers of Palestine fought a war, and lost. And this was followed by many others who tried attacking Israel and exterminating Jews throughout the 1940s, 1950s, 1960s and so on. Arabs attacked, Jews defended, Arabs lost. Over and over. Yet the whole basis for Arab dominance in the region was because of conquest in the first place. Legitimate for Arabs to do it, but not for anyone else?

You want to yammer about what's disgusting, what's arrogant, what's hypocritical yet you are completely oblivious to all that is disgusting, arrogant and hypocritical in what you yourself post.

LOL of course it's legitimate to obtain land by conquest but somehow Putin's a bad guy for annexing parts of Ukraine he conquered. Rules for thee but not for me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Why give citizenship to people who have openly expressed hatred for you, express zero interest in learning about or being part of your society, and so on?

You unintentionally described the attitude toward the native, indigenous population of every Zionist who immigrated to the region since 1880 (to the present day). And yet the former were expected to just accept that immigration and their own forced displacement from the lands they and their immediate predecessors had lived on for centuries and centuries without objection and without resistance, so it seems.

There was not country of Palestine, there was who citizenship of Palestine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Gazans cannot be Israeli because the option to obtain Israeli citizenship is not available to them.

Do you want me to go back and find that ignorant poster who wondered why Gazans cannot "peacefully integrate into the Israeli society like other Arabs"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:These protesters are going to get someone killed.

You make my words they are a month or less away from setting off bombs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Does any of what you just said matter? Israel and the Zionists supporting Israel's right to maintain a Jewish identity have made it abundantly clear that a non-Jewish population with equal rights (voting, by way of example) could never be allowed. Based on that fact, suggesting that non-Jewish citizens of Gaza or the West Bank could simply "opt in" to Israeli citizenship seems dishonest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Gazans cannot be Israeli because the option to obtain Israeli citizenship is not available to them.

Do you want me to go back and find that ignorant poster who wondered why Gazans cannot "peacefully integrate into the Israeli society like other Arabs"?

It was available to them in the past, but they spoiled it with long, ongoing violence. Many Palestinians themselves rejected Israeli citizenship because they reject Israel itself. Whereas, history and data shows that there are currently more than 2 million Palestinians whose families were accepted and now hold Israeli citizenship. And here you want to blame Israel for something Palestinians chose for themselves, just as how they chose to face a bombing campaign by raping, torturing, burning and murdering their way through Israel killing 1200.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Does any of what you just said matter? Israel and the Zionists supporting Israel's right to maintain a Jewish identity have made it abundantly clear that a non-Jewish population with equal rights (voting, by way of example) could never be allowed. Based on that fact, suggesting that non-Jewish citizens of Gaza or the West Bank could simply "opt in" to Israeli citizenship seems dishonest.

What's a lie is suggesting non-Jewish people cannot be Israeli citizens. That is patently false. There are MILLIONS of Israeli citizens with equal rights, who are Palestinian Arab Muslims, Christians and so on. And, Palestinians have in the past been given the option to opt in. They reject it, they throw it away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Gazans cannot be Israeli because the option to obtain Israeli citizenship is not available to them.

Do you want me to go back and find that ignorant poster who wondered why Gazans cannot "peacefully integrate into the Israeli society like other Arabs"?

It was available to them in the past, but they spoiled it with long, ongoing violence. Many Palestinians themselves rejected Israeli citizenship because they reject Israel itself. Whereas, history and data shows that there are currently more than 2 million Palestinians whose families were accepted and now hold Israeli citizenship. And here you want to blame Israel for something Palestinians chose for themselves, just as how they chose to face a bombing campaign by raping, torturing, burning and murdering their way through Israel killing 1200.

It depends on who you're talking about. It was available to Palestinians who managed to stay after villages were cleared by Israeli terrorists and later the IDF. It was never available to those chased out

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Gazans cannot be Israeli because the option to obtain Israeli citizenship is not available to them.

Do you want me to go back and find that ignorant poster who wondered why Gazans cannot "peacefully integrate into the Israeli society like other Arabs"?

It was available to them in the past, but they spoiled it with long, ongoing violence. Many Palestinians themselves rejected Israeli citizenship because they reject Israel itself. Whereas, history and data shows that there are currently more than 2 million Palestinians whose families were accepted and now hold Israeli citizenship. And here you want to blame Israel for something Palestinians chose for themselves, just as how they chose to face a bombing campaign by raping, torturing, burning and murdering their way through Israel killing 1200.

It was never available to Gazans. Stop lying.

And some nerve to assume the right to "accept" or "reject" people who have lived in the land before Israel was founded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Does any of what you just said matter? Israel and the Zionists supporting Israel's right to maintain a Jewish identity have made it abundantly clear that a non-Jewish population with equal rights (voting, by way of example) could never be allowed. Based on that fact, suggesting that non-Jewish citizens of Gaza or the West Bank could simply "opt in" to Israeli citizenship seems dishonest.

What's a lie is suggesting non-Jewish people cannot be Israeli citizens. That is patently false. There are MILLIONS of Israeli citizens with equal rights, who are Palestinian Arab Muslims, Christians and so on. And, Palestinians have in the past been given the option to opt in. They reject it, they throw it away.

Palestinians have never been given an option to "opt in", except the 1948 Arabs who managed to avoid expulsion, and a tiny group of East Jerusalemites who have to overcome tremendous hurdles to apply for citizenship.

Non-Jewish citizens of Israel do not have equal rights. Stop lying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Does any of what you just said matter? Israel and the Zionists supporting Israel's right to maintain a Jewish identity have made it abundantly clear that a non-Jewish population with equal rights (voting, by way of example) could never be allowed. Based on that fact, suggesting that non-Jewish citizens of Gaza or the West Bank could simply "opt in" to Israeli citizenship seems dishonest.

What's a lie is suggesting non-Jewish people cannot be Israeli citizens. That is patently false. There are MILLIONS of Israeli citizens with equal rights, who are Palestinian Arab Muslims, Christians and so on. And, Palestinians have in the past been given the option to opt in. They reject it, they throw it away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Look, there are almost 2 million Arabs living in Israel - about 20% of the country's population. And no one is proposing to throw them out. They are living there peacefully.

The Palestinians in Gaza WERE able to come and go when they had jobs in Israel or needed medical treatment, or all kinds of other things. But I don't know why you would think that it would ever make sense to fold Gaza into Israel. Who in the world would actually want that? You think the Palestinians who are angry to the point of rape and slaughter about Israel existing at all, want to live under Israeli rule?! You think this is a plan that should be proposed? "Hey, you keep saying 'from the river to the sea' and 'death to all Jews' - but wanna come join our country?"

I don't know why you think this is a gotcha.

Ah yes, the 2 million Arabs in Israel, the "1948 Arabs", the 20% of the total Arab population in 1948 that escaped deportation, Jewish militias or super-ardent Zionists who thought we no needo no Arabs in Eretz Israel, that ain't what good lord promised!

I'll leave the discussion of "nobody wants to throw them out" (guess what! some do!) or "they are completely equal to Israeli Jews!" (guess what! they aren't!) for another day. Better people than me have days jobs that focus exclusively on cataloguing that type of inequality. But a few facts for the readers:

"In the aftermath of the 1947–49 Palestine war, of the estimated 950,000 Arabs that lived in the territory that became Israel before the war, over 80% fled or were expelled and 20%, some 156,000, remained.[31] Arab citizens of Israel today are largely composed of the people who remained and their descendants. Others include some from the Gaza Strip and the West Bank who procured Israeli citizenship under family-unification provisions made significantly more stringent in the aftermath of the Second Intifada.[32]

While most Arabs remaining in Israel were granted citizenship, they were subject to martial law in the early years of the state.[33][34] Zionism had given little serious thought as to how to integrate Arabs, and according to Ian Lustick subsequent policies were 'implemented by a rigorous regime of military rule that dominated what remained of the Arab population in territory ruled by Israel, enabling the state to expropriate most Arab-owned land, severely limit its access to investment capital and employment opportunity, and eliminate virtually all opportunities to use citizenship as a vehicle for gaining political influence'.[35] Travel permits, curfews, administrative detentions, and expulsions were part of life until 1966.

I want to remind you that this discussion was brought on by the post lamenting "why can't Gazans integrate peacefully into Israeli society like other Arabs who live in Israel!" The "gotcha" part is that in fact, this integration, i.e. citizenship, has never, ever, ever been made available to ANY ARAB OUTSIDE OF "1948 ARABS, that is, the 20% that escaped deportation in 1948. Never since then. Not once.

Don't talk about being able to "come and go". Libraries can be filled with stories by the people whose lives were derailed by random rejections at checkpoints, inordinately long wait times, lost opportunities to travel, do business, receive an education, perform or play sports at the global stage.

How about Arabs in East Jerusalem and the Golan who are able to apply for citizenship?

yes how about them?

Just 5 Percent of E. Jerusalem Palestinians Have Received Israeli Citizenship Since 1967
Since 1967, over 14,000 Palestinians living in East Jerusalem have had their residency status revoked, something that cannot be done to citizens
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-05-29/ty-article/why-so-few-palestinians-from-jerusalem-have-israeli-citizenship/00000181-0c46-d090-abe1-ed7fefc20000

The lack of Israeli citizenship has many implications. Without it, East Jerusalem Palestinians cannot vote in Israeli legislative elections or obtain an Israeli passport. To travel abroad they must apply for a temporary travel document (laissez passer). Some jobs are not open to non-citizens. Most importantly, their residency status can be revoked, unlike citizens. This has happened to over 14,000 Palestinians since 1967, mostly due to information showing that the center of their life was not in Jerusalem. With the loss of resident status, they lose their health insurance, livelihood and even the right to enter Jerusalem.

Over the years, the Interior Ministry has given various and sundry reasons for denying citizenship to Palestinians. This includes a family member owning land or having an electricity bill in the West Bank, or a failed short Hebrew test, or a small criminal file that was closed years ago. In one case, a person was denied because his wife, who is an Israeli citizen, published a post that mentioned the Nakba. Another person was denied because their social media profile photo showed a Palestinian flag, even though there was an Israeli flag alongside it. For many years, the ministry ignored a clause making the process easier by allowing for an expedited process for people under 21, denying applications made on the basis of this clause.

Just proves that your assertion that only those who remained after 1948 were able to get citizenship is wrong and your “has never ever been available” is also wrong.

Just proves that you have zero understanding of context surrounding the so-called "eligibility" of East Jerusalemites.

Just proves that you were caught in a lie and now trying to weasel out of it.

What? The poster said, "why can't Arabs from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israeli society, like other Arabs in Israel". Tell me. How can an Arab from Gaza peacefully integrate into the Israel society, i.e. move to Israel and obtain citizenship? I'll wait.

No the poster said that Arabs have never been offered Israeli citizenship since 1948 which is a lie. Citizens of Gaza do not want to be citizens of Israel. Why do you infantilize them with your white superiority complex and think that you know best? They want their own country they don’t want to be Israelis. You all keep yelling about colonization but then think that you can tell these Gazans what they should be doing. Again, they don’t want to be Israelis.

Does any of what you just said matter? Israel and the Zionists supporting Israel's right to maintain a Jewish identity have made it abundantly clear that a non-Jewish population with equal rights (voting, by way of example) could never be allowed. Based on that fact, suggesting that non-Jewish citizens of Gaza or the West Bank could simply "opt in" to Israeli citizenship seems dishonest.

What's a lie is suggesting non-Jewish people cannot be Israeli citizens. That is patently false. There are MILLIONS of Israeli citizens with equal rights, who are Palestinian Arab Muslims, Christians and so on. And, Palestinians have in the past been given the option to opt in. They reject it, they throw it away.

Palestinians have never been given an option to "opt in", except the 1948 Arabs who managed to avoid expulsion, and a tiny group of East Jerusalemites who have to overcome tremendous hurdles to apply for citizenship.

Non-Jewish citizens of Israel do not have equal rights. Stop lying.

What rights do non Jewish Israelis not have? Not being allowed to be buried at a Jewish cemetery? There are Arabs in the Knesset, Arab on the supreme court, Arab muslim ambassadors. Same voting and land owing rights, same access to universities and professions. Let’s talk Lebanon where Palestinians not allowed to own land or be doctors and lawyers .