On the chopping block: AAP Centers

[Anonymous]

Haha - yeah insurance didn't cover any of the testing. They cover the drugs, just not the eval. Several thousand bucks is not pocket change for most people.

[Anonymous]

I just wanted to pipe in and say that if you get a neuropsych exam done at Childrens or KKI, your insurance will probably cover a large portion of it. The con is you will have to wait a long time for an appointment and you won't get to choose your clinician.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just wanted to pipe in and say that if you get a neuropsych exam done at Childrens or KKI, your insurance will probably cover a large portion of it. The con is you will have to wait a long time for an appointment and you won't get to choose your clinician.

11:42 here -- we had DC's evaluation done at Children's (at the HALP clinic, located on Prosperity & Route 50) several years back. We learned (later) we probably should have had further testing done than was completed at Children's. Agree with the PP on the long wait -- ours was a 6th month wait, but this was several years ago.

[Anonymous]

Perhaps a S/O thread could be started to address these testing issues. This particular thread is supposed to be discussing centers being cut.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I personally am trying to figure out why schools with large numbers of aap students don't have the resources and peers that seem to be the whole argument for center placement.

I don't think centers need to be eliminated entirely, but lliv schools with a decent amount of kids per grade level don't need the center option.

AAP and GE parents have both supported this idea on this thread.

I think FCPS does too. And they are moving away from the Center option for baseschools with a lot of AAP children.

+1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wanted to pipe in and say that if you get a neuropsych exam done at Childrens or KKI, your insurance will probably cover a large portion of it. The con is you will have to wait a long time for an appointment and you won't get to choose your clinician.

11:42 here -- we had DC's evaluation done at Children's (at the HALP clinic, located on Prosperity & Route 50) several years back. We learned (later) we probably should have had further testing done than was completed at Children's. Agree with the PP on the long wait -- ours was a 6th month wait, but this was several years ago.

That's interesting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we all just agree that we hate having AAP Centers?

I can certainly agree with this. They create far too many issues, resentment, and divisiveness.

I can certainly disagree with this as my student does not have a peer group at the base school. (He was subjected to frequent bullying, among other things.)

so a child who just misses the cut off for eligibility in your school has to stay and get bullied? You bought your house around certain school boundaries. But your kid gets the option to leave. Hmmm

It sucks that a child just misses the cut off, but exactly. Her child qualified for a special program. Part of the reason he qualified for the program is a learning style that has statistically high likelihood of being 2e, which is a group of kids that has a very high likelihood of being bullied. And her child stayed in boundary (the AAP boundary) as the school boundary is defined in the FCPS Boundary locator. Google it and plug your address in there. It will spit out 2 boundaries: one AAP, one not. Both are real boundaries, depending on your child's program. And you don't ditch a program almost everyone agrees is needed at some level (whether that is top .5%, 1%, 2%, whatever) because a small number of kids are misidentified or just miss the cut off. And there are frequent complaints from Gen Ed that FCPS overidentifies kids, and should be less willing to take that borderline kid.



This is true. At any cutoff there will be those that just miss the cut off. Life is not fair and it is not equal. What is a parent going to do when their kid was never taught multiplication In school and is learning beyond multiplication. All the other kids learned all their factors years prior to 3rd grade and the teacher is flying through the math lessons because the kids already know it all or only need a couple minutes to pick it up. The parent will complain that the teacher does not teach the material in class, b/c their child goes home not knowing how to do their homework. Teachers give homework to review what goes on in class, the last thing a teacher will do is give a student homework on material they have never been taught in class.

Some posters with GE kids on this thread have made really good points that have changed the way I think about the Center school structure. I would note lunate centers, but I see where They can be unnecessary, or even counterproductive in some cases. But a few posters (or maybe even one vocal poster) is so mean and seem to have so little compassion for AAP kids, some of whose parents describe bullying, social isolation, a genuine academic inability to function in a Gen Ed setting and struggles with 2e. And also has so little of actual substance to say. That poster (because I'd like to think it's just one) hurts people raising valid issues by turning open minded AAP parents off. And yes, that person I would characterize as a troll. Because they are not on this board to discuss a real issue in our schools. They only want to belittle others (kids!), presumably to make themselves feel better.

I think a lot of the anger directed toward the entire AAP situation can be summed up in this way: AAP kids are given a choice of schools that GE kids are not. The GE child who is bullied at his/her base school is stuck there unless the family can fulfill one of the very specific criteria for transferring. The bullied AAP kid, on the other hand, is able to leave for a center school, with no hoops to jump through as the GE student must.

Another example is the family who moves into a "lesser" school boundary, but can send their AAP child to a better school simply because s/he gets into AAP. Meanwhile, the GE kids at this base school have no such option for leaving.

Can you and others possibly see the incredible inequities the families of GE children (not to mention these kids themselves) see every day? If the situations were reversed, and your child was stuck unhappily at one school, but a large group of his/her peers were able to opt for another school - you'd be furious and speaking up about it too. The system is clearly sending a message to our General Ed kids - they are second class citizens within FCPS.

It is not an inequity becasue every last child in the district is screened for entry into this program. Not once, but multiple times. Not limited to teacher recommendations or parent applications or school quotas as has been the case in the three other states we lived in. Every single child. If the parents don't agree with the results, they can provide their own testing or request rescreening. Every single student not accepted can reapply every single year. If you move in from out of state you are tested for the program, both with the cogat and the nnat. Even if you have tests from the other states, which might have qualified you for the GT program there but were too low to qualify in Fairfax County.

FCPS leaves not a single stone unturned to do their utmost to provide this service to every possibke kid who could qualify.

If that is not equitable than what is?

[Anonymous]

It sucks that a child just misses the cut off, but exactly. Her child qualified for a special program. Part of the reason he qualified for the program is a learning style that has statistically high likelihood of being 2e, which is a group of kids that has a very high likelihood of being bullied.

Maybe when it was GT--but not now. Get rid of the program as it stands.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It sucks that a child just misses the cut off, but exactly. Her child qualified for a special program. Part of the reason he qualified for the program is a learning style that has statistically high likelihood of being 2e, which is a group of kids that has a very high likelihood of being bullied.

Maybe when it was GT--but not now. Get rid of the program as it stands.

"During the course of the GTAC discussions this year, the question was raised about the name of the program itself. We know that the State of Virginia requires Fairfax County Public Schools to provide gifted services, but it does not designate the name of those services. Several choices were discussed and, while some members did not support a change, the majority of the Committee membership approved of a name change from Gifted and Talented Services to Advanced Academic Programs. It was felt by the Committee that this name change emphasizes efforts to put a label on the service being offered and recognizes the academic nature of the program."

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/105/104443.page#1020399

http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/pdfs/aapac/gtac/GTAC2006-07AnnualReport.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

It sucks that a child just misses the cut off, but exactly. Her child qualified for a special program. Part of the reason he qualified for the program is a learning style that has statistically high likelihood of being 2e, which is a group of kids that has a very high likelihood of being bullied.

Maybe when it was GT--but not now. Get rid of the program as it stands.

+1
It's simply disingenuous to claim that most of the kids in AAP have a "learning style that has statistically high(er) likelihood of being 2e, which is a group of kids that has a very high likelihood of being bullied". When the program was GT, this was probably true, for the most part. But no way are the mainstream kids who make up the bulk of today's AAP any different from their Gen Ed counterparts as far as having different "learning styles" or a greater propensity to be bullied. That is seriously grasping at any excuse to keep the status quo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It sucks that a child just misses the cut off, but exactly. Her child qualified for a special program. Part of the reason he qualified for the program is a learning style that has statistically high likelihood of being 2e, which is a group of kids that has a very high likelihood of being bullied.

Maybe when it was GT--but not now. Get rid of the program as it stands.

"During the course of the GTAC discussions this year, the question was raised about the name of the program itself. We know that the State of Virginia requires Fairfax County Public Schools to provide gifted services, but it does not designate the name of those services. Several choices were discussed and, while some members did not support a change, the majority of the Committee membership approved of a name change from Gifted and Talented Services to Advanced Academic Programs. It was felt by the Committee that this name change emphasizes efforts to put a label on the service being offered and recognizes the academic nature of the program."

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/105/104443.page#1020399

http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/pdfs/aapac/gtac/GTAC2006-07AnnualReport.pdf

Yes, we're all aware of why the name was changed, as you've posted this before. But not only did the name change, but the admission criteria was also significantly loosened so as to "cast a wider net". In doing so, the program has cast such a wide net that it is no longer a "gifted" program, by any stretch of the imagination.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Good. It's about time. It's a tremendous waste of money and resources.

"Base kid" is a common taunt at our center school.

The AAP students are so segregated and operate in their own rarefied air beginning as young as third grade.

Very much an "us v. them" mentality fueled by hyper-competitive parents.

Enough!

The ugly reality is that FCPS is back to ersatz segregation, with the "elites" getting preferential treatment and in some center schools, "base kids" are the minority.

Interesting to note that some of the FCPS center schools HAD to become centers to avoid permanent closure.

I haven't read through all of the pages of this post, but if you had a child that needed this program you wouldn't feel this way. My kid needs this program just like any other special needs child. If they do away with the centers I hope they have a plan in place for kids like mine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good. It's about time. It's a tremendous waste of money and resources.

"Base kid" is a common taunt at our center school.

The AAP students are so segregated and operate in their own rarefied air beginning as young as third grade.

Very much an "us v. them" mentality fueled by hyper-competitive parents.

Enough!

The ugly reality is that FCPS is back to ersatz segregation, with the "elites" getting preferential treatment and in some center schools, "base kids" are the minority.

Interesting to note that some of the FCPS center schools HAD to become centers to avoid permanent closure.

+1. Even if all the kids in AAP don't need the program, some certainly do.

I haven't read through all of the pages of this post, but if you had a child that needed this program you wouldn't feel this way. My kid needs this program just like any other special needs child. If they do away with the centers I hope they have a plan in place for kids like mine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good. It's about time. It's a tremendous waste of money and resources.

"Base kid" is a common taunt at our center school.

The AAP students are so segregated and operate in their own rarefied air beginning as young as third grade.

Very much an "us v. them" mentality fueled by hyper-competitive parents.

Enough!

The ugly reality is that FCPS is back to ersatz segregation, with the "elites" getting preferential treatment and in some center schools, "base kids" are the minority.

Interesting to note that some of the FCPS center schools HAD to become centers to avoid permanent closure.[/

+1. Even if all the kids in AAP don't need the program, some certainly do.

I haven't read through all of the pages of this post, but if you had a child that needed this program you wouldn't feel this way. My kid needs this program just like any other special needs child. If they do away with the centers I hope they have a plan in place for kids like mine.

The kids who need AAP didn't disappear just because more kids were admitted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Good. It's about time. It's a tremendous waste of money and resources.

"Base kid" is a common taunt at our center school.

The AAP students are so segregated and operate in their own rarefied air beginning as young as third grade.

Very much an "us v. them" mentality fueled by hyper-competitive parents.

Enough!

The ugly reality is that FCPS is back to ersatz segregation, with the "elites" getting preferential treatment and in some center schools, "base kids" are the minority.

Interesting to note that some of the FCPS center schools HAD to become centers to avoid permanent closure.

+1. Even if all the kids in AAP don't need the program, some certainly do.

I haven't read through all of the pages of this post, but if you had a child that needed this program you wouldn't feel this way. My kid needs this program just like any other special needs child. If they do away with the centers I hope they have a plan in place for kids like mine.

The kids who need AAP didn't disappear just because a larger number of kids were admitted