St. Andrews vs. Holton vs. BCC -- HELP!

[Anonymous]

Our DD has been admitted for ninth grade at St. Andrews and Holton. So now my DW and I are trying to help her decide among St. Andrews, Holton, and BCC (her public high school). I would be interested in hearing from anyone who has (or who has had) children at these schools, and especially from people who can offer a comparative perspective among these schools.

From my standpoint and from the standpoint of my DW, these are all good options. We'd be happy to have our DD choose any one of these three, and we want this to be her decision. My goal is to help her identify and balance all of the considerations that might be relevant to her decision. Our overarching objective is for her to choose the school where she is going to be happiest.

These are some of the comparative considerations that seem relevant to me at the moment, but I'd love to get reactions from people who have direct and current information:

Academics: All three schools are strong academically, and none of them will be easy. My impression is that St. Andrew's would be the "easiest" in terms of workload and expectations, Holton probably the hardest, and BCC would be as easy or as hard as she cares to make it (e.g. depending on whether she does full IB, etc.). Our DD is a hard worker, but it would be good for her to be an environment where she gets clear directions about what needs to get done and when it needs to be done. What are the stress levels like at each of these schools? What does the workload look like?

Social Life: Obviously, Holton is a girls' school, so the three schools are not directly comparable in that respect. We'd really like to hear from current parents about what the social life is like at Holton, since we've heard different things from different sources. Are the girls nice to each other? Are they accepting of differences and variety? What do the cliques look like? How important are Landon boys to their social life outside of school? Have parents of DDs felt that the all-girls environment is good, bad, or indifferent?

We're more familiar with the social life at St. Andrew's since we know kids who have gone there, but we'd still be interested in hearing from current and recent parents. My overall impression of St. Andrews is that it's friendly and cozy. But at the same time, it has always seemed rather preppy and jockey to me -- is that fair? Given its location, the social life there seems to revolve around Potomac, whereas we live in Friendship Heights (closer to Holton). Our DD is fairly "urban", so I'm a little concerned about St. Andrew's in that regard.

As for BCC, our biggest concern there is the "lost in the crowd" phenomenon. We'd love to hear from BCC parents about how their DDs/DSs have found their place in that environment.

Four Years from Now: We're not the kind of people who would urge our DD to attend a particular school because it's the best way to get into Princeton, but college placement is nonetheless a relevant consideration. It seems to me that BCC is a very difficult platform, given its size and the sheer number of bright, capable kids there -- you really need to stand out on the extras to get noticed. My impression is that St. Andrew's does a good job of finding the right fit for each of its students, and then working hard to get them into those schools. I have less of a feel for what college placement looks like coming out of Holton.

We would appreciate your thoughts on these and any other factors that you consider relevant. We especially welcome reactions from current or recent parents (or teachers) at these schools, and please indicate the nature of your connection to the school. Thanks.

[Anonymous]

Uh, what does your daughter want?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Uh, what does your daughter want?

Uh, she probably doesn't know so that's why he's asking?

[Anonymous]

She wants to be happy. She wants a school where the students are friendly and respectful to each other. She's always been a "gamma girl" -- moving among different crowds and trying to be on good terms with everyone. Academically, she is a fantastic writer, so opportunities for creative writing are important. She's also interested in issues affecting girls around the world (access to education, preventing child marriage and trafficking, etc.), and she's looking for opportunities for leadership in that area. She's recently started playing lacrosse, so I imagine that she'll want to play in a reasonably non-competitive, entry-level environment. Hope that helps.

[Anonymous]

I don't know much about St. Andrews or BCC, but the interest in women's issues on a global scale would make Holton a good fit for her I'd think. They have the Global Scholar program and the journeys abroad program (particularly Rwanda) would probably be really appealing to her. My DD isn't in Upper School yet, so I can only offer hearsay and tell you that the older girls we know all seem to have found a niche at Holton.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She wants to be happy. She wants a school where the students are friendly and respectful to each other. She's always been a "gamma girl" -- moving among different crowds and trying to be on good terms with everyone. Academically, she is a fantastic writer, so opportunities for creative writing are important. She's also interested in issues affecting girls around the world (access to education, preventing child marriage and trafficking, etc.), and she's looking for opportunities for leadership in that area. She's recently started playing lacrosse, so I imagine that she'll want to play in a reasonably non-competitive, entry-level environment. Hope that helps.

Sounds like a Holton girl to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know much about St. Andrews or BCC, but the interest in women's issues on a global scale would make Holton a good fit for her I'd think. They have the Global Scholar program and the journeys abroad program (particularly Rwanda) would probably be really appealing to her. My DD isn't in Upper School yet, so I can only offer hearsay and tell you that the older girls we know all seem to have found a niche at Holton.

Thanks, I'm aware of the Global Scholars program and that's a big plus for me. Holton seems like it's working hard to cultivate young women who will have an international outlook.

[Anonymous]

Academically would think you are choosing between Holton and BCC, St As is a pretty different setting academically than Holton or the top classes at BCC. Very different socially, and in our experience, the kids at BCC do really well in college admissions, and with the money you save on tuition, a private college counselor and lots of Prep Matters would still be a lot cheaper than Holton or St Andrew's. Our DDs went to BCC and through sports interacted with many kids from the other two schools, particularly Holton. I would be suspect your DDs in interests in women's issues around the world would be a bit unusual at St Andrews as well, although they do have some interesting students born outside the US for sure.

[Anonymous]

If she shadowed each school that's the best way to tell. My dd shadowed at Holton and NCS. I could tell by the smile on her face when I picked her up from Holton a few years ago that that was where she belonged.

[Anonymous]

Holton

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She wants to be happy. She wants a school where the students are friendly and respectful to each other. She's always been a "gamma girl" -- moving among different crowds and trying to be on good terms with everyone. Academically, she is a fantastic writer, so opportunities for creative writing are important. She's also interested in issues affecting girls around the world (access to education, preventing child marriage and trafficking, etc.), and she's looking for opportunities for leadership in that area. She's recently started playing lacrosse, so I imagine that she'll want to play in a reasonably non-competitive, entry-level environment. Hope that helps.

She will get more focus on her writing at either St. Andrews or Holton, given the small class sizes and emphasis on writing assignments. For the girls' issues, probably opportunities at all three places, but the most at Holton because of the all-girls' focus.

For the sports, Holton has the most competitive lacrosse program of all three places but I don't think she would have a problem making the JV team at any of the three places -- whether varsity is in the cards for her would depend on how fast she progresses. The smaller private schools will have more additional sports opportunity, for example, were she to go to Holton she could try to pick up field hockey (St. Andrews doesn't offer it), which is a good sport to "start late" in general because there are not many youth sports opportunities. There will also be some opportunities for no cut sports at BCC (cross country, say), but with more kids it can be harder to make varsity teams in sports with more limited rosters.

She sounds like a nice, talented kid who would do well at any of those schools. Congrats to her and good luck to your family as you make the choice.

[Anonymous]

Just a note that you have placed a lot of personal information on this board. St Andrews probably admits a dozen to two dozen girls to 9th, not all of whom live in bounds for BCC, and also have been admitted to Holton, and have your daughter's interests.

I would seriously consider asking Jeff to take down this thread, as by Friday morning's new parent / new student coffee at St A, many folks will otherwise have read it.

[Anonymous]

No one is going to care who this person is, believe me. And she either comes to St. A or she doesn't. People can be professional about this - seriously. I would go for Holton. You can always pull out to BCC if it isn't right. Holton is strong academically and works well with the students for college placement.

[Anonymous]

I'm one of the posters who every time I write something. .some one writes "Holton mom". Given what you have written-- I would say BCC. The workload at Holton is unforgiving. I would think the girls are nicer at BCC since there is much more economic diversity. And it would be much more fun.

[Anonymous]

I am a St. Andrew's parent. Obviously, you have to first decide on single sex vs. coed environment. Can’t help you there. In the meantime, a few responses to OP's questions follow:

1. Socially, it is hard to imagine any school where more of the student body is engaged and happy than St. Andrew's. Our very different kids have distinct, but inclusive groups of friends that seem to grow each year as new kids joined the school. There is a strong sense of school community, a strong sense of community within each class (grade), and the faculty really takes an interest in nurturing and developing each the student’s talents (art, music, athletics, etc.). St. Andrew’s seems to attract (or create) a sizeable group of just really nice kids.

2. Academics.
a. St. Andrews vs. BCC. My sense is that the basic classes generally will be more rigorous than standard “honors” classes at BCC (which, as a practical matter, have become the basic grade level classes for kids planning to attend most colleges from MCPS). I am in the BCC cluster and our neighbors’ kids attend BCC and I’ve toured BCC twice. My understanding is that the privates provide more attention to writing especially in 9th and 10th grade because of the larger BCC class sizes and heavy teaching load. Parents whose children transfer from MCPS have told us their kids have had to put in much more effort at St. Andrew’s. The full IB program at BCC is probably more rigorous than either St. Andrew’s or Holton generally, but some parents I know of kids who have done it complain that it consumed their child’s life, he/she had no time for ECs, and, in the end, at least one friend didn’t want child no. 2 to do the full IB program. St. Andrew’s now offers more differentiated course levels to accommodate different students (standard, accelerated/honors/AP classes). The kids with the most challenging courses get more work than those with lighter schedules, but you don’t have to lock into any one track across the board. And it sometimes seems like perhaps more work than it is b/c our kids are very involved in ECs at school and they all take electives.

b. St. Andrew’s or Holton. If you want single sex and have a girl that both thrives in a competitive atmosphere and loves the girl-power things, Holton probably can't be beat. Otherwise, it is a matter of the overall culture of each school and personal preferences as to what works best for a kid. There are a number of St. Andrew’s kids taking an AP class at Holton this year as part of the private school consortium in MoCo, and they do just as well in that class side by side with kids from Holton as they do in their own classes at St. Andrew’s. Both schools offer a great education.

3. The Four Years From Now Question.
Four years from now your child will be best prepared for college by attending whichever school will make her happiest, motivates her to want to learn/study, teaches her studies skills/tools to practice for college, etc. In that environment, she will do her best work and shine through in her pursuit of EC’s. The school that will do that may be different for different students. I was very impressed with the St. Andrew’s college counseling office . The counselor really got to know our DC, and was very helpful in advising and strategizing about college lists/visits, testing, course selection, summer activities, etc. St. Andrew’s does work hard to find good choices for each students depending on his/her interests, abilities, talents, preferences, etc. considering academic, social, geographic, athletic, financial, and other personal factors. At St. Andrew’s, not everyone thinks he/she is a future ivy league alum, and those kids still go on to earn degrees at good schools, still go to grad schools if they want to, get jobs etc. Part of a St. Andrew’s education is to learn to maximize your abilities whatever they are. That said, the St. Andrew’s students who are most academically oriented also do very well in that arena of the most selective schools. So far this year, there have been early admissions I know of to Univ of Chicago, Yale, Dartmouth, Georgetown, Conn. College.

I think there are cultural differences in the two schools. A certain type of kid will tend to thrive at Holton, and another may find it more anxiety provoking. Go back to each school again – more than once if necessary. Have your daughter go back. Ask for the names of families to talk to who have a child similar to yours. And FWIW I don’t think you posted anything here embarrassing or unnecessarily identifying to worry about. Good luck.