Do unmotivated kids get into HGC?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thanks, appreciate that perspective! It's just that you hear so much about how competitive the selection process to these programs is, and how only the highest test scores, great overall school record and great teacher recommendations etc. will get a kid into such a program, and then you see a kid in that very program who has trouble keeping up as well as behavior issues, and you wonder!!
The kids are very much expected to work well together in groups and are graded on this, and according to my DC, others have to slow down and even risk poor grades when they have to work with him because this child just can't or won't keep up. And I already asked my child if this kid is better in other subjects (other than math) and DC said this is how he is, all day! Again, I do appreciate your perspective, and do understand that being inclusive is necessary in regular schools. But for a specialized merit-based program?? It is difficult for me to understand how a kid who clearly can't keep up with his peers academically or behaviorally belongs in that program! What about the other kids in the class who have to suffer because of it?
And if the child is performing poorly because of circumstances outside the school, MCPS still needs to figure out how to provide this child what he needs instead of letting him struggle in a competitive program and make others struggle with him!

This is very discouraging to hear. I wonder how he ended up in this program.

[Anonymous]

Behavior is one thing, very behind in academic is whole other thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks, appreciate that perspective! It's just that you hear so much about how competitive the selection process to these programs is, and how only the highest test scores, great overall school record and great teacher recommendations etc. will get a kid into such a program, and then you see a kid in that very program who has trouble keeping up as well as behavior issues, and you wonder!!
The kids are very much expected to work well together in groups and are graded on this, and according to my DC, others have to slow down and even risk poor grades when they have to work with him because this child just can't or won't keep up. And I already asked my child if this kid is better in other subjects (other than math) and DC said this is how he is, all day! Again, I do appreciate your perspective, and do understand that being inclusive is necessary in regular schools. But for a specialized merit-based program?? It is difficult for me to understand how a kid who clearly can't keep up with his peers academically or behaviorally belongs in that program! What about the other kids in the class who have to suffer because of it?
And if the child is performing poorly because of circumstances outside the school, MCPS still needs to figure out how to provide this child what he needs instead of letting him struggle in a competitive program and make others struggle with him!

This is very discouraging to hear. I wonder how he ended up in this program.

There were apparently some last-minute additions to the program my child is in but they were not "diversity" additions despite what PP above might want to believe. They were very much political additions based on people with power either in the county or in the school system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Behavior is one thing, very behind in academic is whole other thing.

Very behind on academics -- based on what PP said PP's son said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Behavior is one thing, very behind in academic is whole other thing.

Very behind on academics -- based on what PP said PP's son said.

Right. We are taking the word of a 9 year old on the gifts of another 9 year old, who may or may not be in a totally new school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Behavior is one thing, very behind in academic is whole other thing.

Very behind on academics -- based on what PP said PP's son said.

Right. We are taking the word of a 9 year old on the gifts of another 9 year old, who may or may not be in a totally new school.

Kids know more than you think. When my son was in preK, all his friend would bring words for him to read and some asked him for time because the only clock on the wall is analog. I think by second/third grade, kids have pretty accurate opinion on where their classmates are academically.

[Anonymous]

"It's also not the Center for Well-Behaved Neurotypical Children, or (despite what some people might think) the Center for Children Whose Parents Don't Mind Being All Up In Things That Are None Of Their Darn Business."

What goes on in my child's classroom IS ABSOLUTELY my business! That is one way I support my child in his educational success. Those parents who don't make it their business are the ones who cry foul about their children not getting enough opportunities to succeed!

[Anonymous]

"There were apparently some last-minute additions to the program my child is in but they were not "diversity" additions despite what PP above might want to believe. They were very much political additions based on people with power either in the county or in the school system."

That's terrible! But it would explain the admission of the seemingly unqualified child. Thanks! And FYI I don't WANT to believe anything. I am just trying to understand how something like this could happen and until your perspective, "diversity" was the only possible explanation I could come up with.

[Anonymous]

Kids, like adults, make assumptions all the time and kids, like adults, can often be wrong. Your child has absolutely no idea of the other child is qualified to be in the program. It's possible that other child has sky high test scores and IQ but is bored out of his mind because the HGC work is too easy.

A lot of kids think my kid is stupid but they would be shocked to see his test scores and his grades when he actually completes an assignment.

I think that if the district wants to change the HGCs into CESes where one of the qualifications is if kids are well behaved I wouldn't necessarily object but that isn't how it is now. Despite the name change, it's still to give highly gifted kids a chance at a deeper curriculum. It works for most kids but might not work for all of them. It doesn't mean they shouldn't have been admitted.

[Anonymous]

"This was a wonderfully intelligent and thoughtful response to a pretty obnoxious post. Thank you."

I agree that it was an intelligent and thoughtful response. But my post was not meant to be obnoxious. I was simply stating the facts as I observed them and questioning the mcps selection process or at least trying to understand it, in the least! I am entitled to have and express my opinion and ask my questions based on my observations and experiences. So sorry, not sorry for my post but sorry you find it obnoxious!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

"It's also not the Center for Well-Behaved Neurotypical Children, or (despite what some people might think) the Center for Children Whose Parents Don't Mind Being All Up In Things That Are None Of Their Darn Business."

What goes on in my child's classroom IS ABSOLUTELY my business! That is one way I support my child in his educational success. Those parents who don't make it their business are the ones who cry foul about their children not getting enough opportunities to succeed!

Why other students are there, and what their various capabilities and needs are, is not your business, though.

[Anonymous]

"Why other students are there, and what their various capabilities and needs are, is not your business, though"

It certainly is, because DC has to worry about poor grades when DC must work in a group with this kid who can't or won't keep up or cooperate with the rest of the group! And because my kid has had to be at the receiving end of this child's verbal and physical outbursts! In my understanding, Magnet programs are supposed to stimulate and encourage gifted kids by positive interactions with their peer group, not frustrate and discourage them by having to deal with kids who have academic and behavior issues!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
"Why other students are there, and what their various capabilities and needs are, is not your business, though"

It certainly is, because DC has to worry about poor grades when DC must work in a group with this kid who can't or won't keep up or cooperate with the rest of the group! And because my kid has had to be at the receiving end of this child's verbal and physical outbursts! In my understanding, Magnet programs are supposed to stimulate and encourage gifted kids by positive interactions with their peer group, not frustrate and discourage them by having to deal with kids who have academic and behavior issues!

You can take this question up with the teacher, then. "Why must my gifted child work in a group with this child who can't or won't keep up or cooperate with the rest of the group?!" Come back and tell us how that went.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a kid who started in an HGC program this year. DC tells me there are some very disruptive kids in the program - don't follow rules, talk and disturb others during class, etc. It so happens that they are mostly, but not all, AA. There is also one child who is just plain slow and "spacey". I have no personal experience with the "disruptive" kids, but I did spend some time with the "spacey" kid during open house when the teacher happened to pair him with my DC and me for a group math activity. I was shocked by how painfully slow this kid was at solving very simple math problems that my kid (and several others) solved in no time at all! He needed one on one help from the teacher just to participate, and still could not stay focused enough to complete the activity! He happens to be Latino. This kid has also been acting up a lot lately, resorting to making rude comments and even hitting! I was rather disturbed by my experience at the open house, and now finding out about the behavior issues, I have serious doubts/questions about the selection process and criteria used by MCPS for HGCs this year. I would never have imagined that such a slow, unfocused and behaviorally challenged kid would ever be part of my DC's peer group in a magnet program! Something just doesn't jive here!! My search for answers brought me to this forum, and thought I would share my personal experience.

Not every gifted kid is going to be a perfectly behaved angel. I see parents make that assumption time and again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
"Why other students are there, and what their various capabilities and needs are, is not your business, though"

It certainly is, because DC has to worry about poor grades when DC must work in a group with this kid who can't or won't keep up or cooperate with the rest of the group! And because my kid has had to be at the receiving end of this child's verbal and physical outbursts! In my understanding, Magnet programs are supposed to stimulate and encourage gifted kids by positive interactions with their peer group, not frustrate and discourage them by having to deal with kids who have academic and behavior issues!

That is a personal issue for you to take up with the teacher if it's come to that, but has nothing to do with the fitness of the other student, just the group dynamic with your child. And, news flash, some gifted students are abominable people, just like some non-gifted are.