How can we make DC streets bicycle and pedestrian-only?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that when commute times are less with public transportation, people will choose public transportation. When commute times are less with cars, people will use cars.

Eh, that depends on the time difference. My commute to work into DC is 25 minutes by car. If I could make that commute in 10 minutes by transit, I'd still take my car because I don't have to share my car with other people, some of whom may be drunk and/or potentially dangerous.

Places like New York and Tokyo are outliers, because transit is so much faster than driving. For most people, potentially shaving a few minutes off of a commute isn't worth it because of the negatives of public transit.

If you prefer a longer commute, that's your choice. However, public policy does not have to enable your choice.

Ditto for bikes? Weird to me how much money the city spends building an entire separate infrastructure for a small number of people who refuse to take the subway or the bus.

It is amazing that, in a city with a poverty rate that rivals West Virginia's, a small number of white guys from Ward 3 can get the city to spend billions of dollars to subsidize their hobby. Take the subway! Take the bus! Walk! You have plenty of other options!

You sure it’s just white guys from Ward 3? Because its not. https://www.washingtoninformer.com/ward-8-cyclists-critical-of-how-d-c-officials-have-tackled-transportation-issues/

Anecdotes are great, but it is really almost all white people.
https://www.mwcog.org/file.aspx?D=HcOqbzivuFayTfyAlhvUJhe72nkkosOrz2TZl%2bOlFXE%3d&A=3b5jlNJv7k8i9DmLKmqJ5c9bgLZ451b3R0E2zs1pReQ%3d

Because the only trips anybody makes, ever, anywhere, is the trip to and from work. That's all anybody ever does. From home, to work, then back home to stay until the next trip to work. Right? Nobody ever goes anywhere else.

Or, alternatively, most of the trips people make are not the commute to work, but those don't get counted.

-person who uses their bike for most trips, but not for the commute to work

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that when commute times are less with public transportation, people will choose public transportation. When commute times are less with cars, people will use cars.

Eh, that depends on the time difference. My commute to work into DC is 25 minutes by car. If I could make that commute in 10 minutes by transit, I'd still take my car because I don't have to share my car with other people, some of whom may be drunk and/or potentially dangerous.

Places like New York and Tokyo are outliers, because transit is so much faster than driving. For most people, potentially shaving a few minutes off of a commute isn't worth it because of the negatives of public transit.

If you prefer a longer commute, that's your choice. However, public policy does not have to enable your choice.

Ditto for bikes? Weird to me how much money the city spends building an entire separate infrastructure for a small number of people who refuse to take the subway or the bus.

It is amazing that, in a city with a poverty rate that rivals West Virginia's, a small number of white guys from Ward 3 can get the city to spend billions of dollars to subsidize their hobby. Take the subway! Take the bus! Walk! You have plenty of other options!

You sure it’s just white guys from Ward 3? Because its not. https://www.washingtoninformer.com/ward-8-cyclists-critical-of-how-d-c-officials-have-tackled-transportation-issues/

Anecdotes are great, but it is really almost all white people.
https://www.mwcog.org/file.aspx?D=HcOqbzivuFayTfyAlhvUJhe72nkkosOrz2TZl%2bOlFXE%3d&A=3b5jlNJv7k8i9DmLKmqJ5c9bgLZ451b3R0E2zs1pReQ%3d

Because the only trips anybody makes, ever, anywhere, is the trip to and from work. That's all anybody ever does. From home, to work, then back home to stay until the next trip to work. Right? Nobody ever goes anywhere else.

Or, alternatively, most of the trips people make are not the commute to work, but those don't get counted.

-person who uses their bike for most trips, but not for the commute to work

You clearly love to use Black folk for your propaganda but are obviously completely disconnected to how most Black folk live their lives in DC:

What are these “other trips”. Grocery shopping? How many grocery stores are in Wards 7 and 8?

Absolutely embarrassing and frankly racist. You need to stop talking about Black folk when you clearly have no clue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that when commute times are less with public transportation, people will choose public transportation. When commute times are less with cars, people will use cars.

Eh, that depends on the time difference. My commute to work into DC is 25 minutes by car. If I could make that commute in 10 minutes by transit, I'd still take my car because I don't have to share my car with other people, some of whom may be drunk and/or potentially dangerous.

Places like New York and Tokyo are outliers, because transit is so much faster than driving. For most people, potentially shaving a few minutes off of a commute isn't worth it because of the negatives of public transit.

If you prefer a longer commute, that's your choice. However, public policy does not have to enable your choice.

Ditto for bikes? Weird to me how much money the city spends building an entire separate infrastructure for a small number of people who refuse to take the subway or the bus.

It is amazing that, in a city with a poverty rate that rivals West Virginia's, a small number of white guys from Ward 3 can get the city to spend billions of dollars to subsidize their hobby. Take the subway! Take the bus! Walk! You have plenty of other options!

You sure it’s just white guys from Ward 3? Because its not. https://www.washingtoninformer.com/ward-8-cyclists-critical-of-how-d-c-officials-have-tackled-transportation-issues/

Anecdotes are great, but it is really almost all white people.
https://www.mwcog.org/file.aspx?D=HcOqbzivuFayTfyAlhvUJhe72nkkosOrz2TZl%2bOlFXE%3d&A=3b5jlNJv7k8i9DmLKmqJ5c9bgLZ451b3R0E2zs1pReQ%3d

Because the only trips anybody makes, ever, anywhere, is the trip to and from work. That's all anybody ever does. From home, to work, then back home to stay until the next trip to work. Right? Nobody ever goes anywhere else.

Or, alternatively, most of the trips people make are not the commute to work, but those don't get counted.

-person who uses their bike for most trips, but not for the commute to work

You clearly love to use Black folk for your propaganda but are obviously completely disconnected to how most Black folk live their lives in DC:

What are these “other trips”. Grocery shopping? How many grocery stores are in Wards 7 and 8?

Absolutely embarrassing and frankly racist. You need to stop talking about Black folk when you clearly have no clue.

You're not seriously saying that the only time Black people in DC go anywhere is to and from work, are you?

And how do you explain the Black people in DC who were killed by drivers while riding a bike?

[Anonymous]

From reading this thread the challenge seems to be that OP is alone in their quest to achieve this bicycle and pedestrian utopia.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that when commute times are less with public transportation, people will choose public transportation. When commute times are less with cars, people will use cars.

Eh, that depends on the time difference. My commute to work into DC is 25 minutes by car. If I could make that commute in 10 minutes by transit, I'd still take my car because I don't have to share my car with other people, some of whom may be drunk and/or potentially dangerous.

Places like New York and Tokyo are outliers, because transit is so much faster than driving. For most people, potentially shaving a few minutes off of a commute isn't worth it because of the negatives of public transit.

If you prefer a longer commute, that's your choice. However, public policy does not have to enable your choice.

Ditto for bikes? Weird to me how much money the city spends building an entire separate infrastructure for a small number of people who refuse to take the subway or the bus.

It is amazing that, in a city with a poverty rate that rivals West Virginia's, a small number of white guys from Ward 3 can get the city to spend billions of dollars to subsidize their hobby. Take the subway! Take the bus! Walk! You have plenty of other options!

You sure it’s just white guys from Ward 3? Because its not. https://www.washingtoninformer.com/ward-8-cyclists-critical-of-how-d-c-officials-have-tackled-transportation-issues/

Anecdotes are great, but it is really almost all white people.
https://www.mwcog.org/file.aspx?D=HcOqbzivuFayTfyAlhvUJhe72nkkosOrz2TZl%2bOlFXE%3d&A=3b5jlNJv7k8i9DmLKmqJ5c9bgLZ451b3R0E2zs1pReQ%3d

You don't think a lack of infrastructure that makes an activity safe in areas that are primarily concentrated within certain racial/ethnic backgrounds would be correlated with those racial/ethnic backgrounds performing that activity less than others where that isn't the case?

What is this word salad?

I guess anything more nuanced or complicated than A causes B ius just too much for your tiny little brain.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that when commute times are less with public transportation, people will choose public transportation. When commute times are less with cars, people will use cars.

Eh, that depends on the time difference. My commute to work into DC is 25 minutes by car. If I could make that commute in 10 minutes by transit, I'd still take my car because I don't have to share my car with other people, some of whom may be drunk and/or potentially dangerous.

Places like New York and Tokyo are outliers, because transit is so much faster than driving. For most people, potentially shaving a few minutes off of a commute isn't worth it because of the negatives of public transit.

If you prefer a longer commute, that's your choice. However, public policy does not have to enable your choice.

Ditto for bikes? Weird to me how much money the city spends building an entire separate infrastructure for a small number of people who refuse to take the subway or the bus.

It is amazing that, in a city with a poverty rate that rivals West Virginia's, a small number of white guys from Ward 3 can get the city to spend billions of dollars to subsidize their hobby. Take the subway! Take the bus! Walk! You have plenty of other options!

You sure it’s just white guys from Ward 3? Because its not. https://www.washingtoninformer.com/ward-8-cyclists-critical-of-how-d-c-officials-have-tackled-transportation-issues/

Anecdotes are great, but it is really almost all white people.
https://www.mwcog.org/file.aspx?D=HcOqbzivuFayTfyAlhvUJhe72nkkosOrz2TZl%2bOlFXE%3d&A=3b5jlNJv7k8i9DmLKmqJ5c9bgLZ451b3R0E2zs1pReQ%3d

Because the only trips anybody makes, ever, anywhere, is the trip to and from work. That's all anybody ever does. From home, to work, then back home to stay until the next trip to work. Right? Nobody ever goes anywhere else.

Or, alternatively, most of the trips people make are not the commute to work, but those don't get counted.

-person who uses their bike for most trips, but not for the commute to work

You clearly love to use Black folk for your propaganda but are obviously completely disconnected to how most Black folk live their lives in DC:

What are these “other trips”. Grocery shopping? How many grocery stores are in Wards 7 and 8?

Absolutely embarrassing and frankly racist. You need to stop talking about Black folk when you clearly have no clue.

So now you are celebrating food deserts in addition to the fact that city planners paved over the lower wards in the 60's and 70's to enable easier transportation for the white people in the suburbs?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:For one, our metro system is inadequate, there aren't enough stations.

I live and work in DC, but with an elementary kid in school, it would take me (checks google maps)... 25 min to get my kid to school that's a 10-15 min drive away, then another (checks google maps) 45-55 min to get myself to work that's a 25-30 min drive normally.

This is living in NE, with kids in school in NE, with my work also in NE.

No thanks.

You do realize you're literally driving at bike speed? Probably slower depending on where in NE.

The reason it takes you so long is because of traffic and lights (aka too many cars).

Now imagine your trips if DC had half as many cars.

DP. This is the real answer. It’s not banning all cars, it’s banning any non-DC plates. Or making them pay huge tolls to drive in the city. Anything that reduces MD and VA plates would be fine by me!

Cyclists are almost entirely white. Drivers are disproportionately black and brown (because they're less likely to be able to afford to live close to where they work)

All these cockamamie schemes to help cyclists and punish drivers boil down to privileging white people and hurting black and brown people.

You're wrong about this, it's been demonstrated to you multiple times that you're wrong about this, and yet here you still are, repeating yourself wrongly about this.

Sounds like you are unfamiliar with both cyclists and our suburbs.

Nope, that's you. You're just wrong about this.

I guess the fact that most of the cyclists who have died in traffic/related fatalities in the city in the past year have been either older black guys or white women means they just have such terrible luck because "those people" aren't riding bikes, its just middle-aged white guys who are?

Uh, DC averages one cyclist death per year.

Drivers killed 4 bicyclists in Montgomery County last year: a teenage boy bicycling on an obstructed sidewalk, a white woman bicycling in a bike lane (the driver was convicted of causing her death), another teenage boy walking his bike across the road after getting off a bus (hit and run driver), and a Hispanic man walking his bike across the road. All four were bicycling for transportation.

The bicyclist most recently killed in Prince George's County was a middle-aged black man bicycling for recreation/exercise (drunk driver).

The bicyclist most recently killed in Montgomery County was a young black man bicycling back from the store (racing drivers).

This thread is about DC. Not what happens in other states.

I mean, sure, if you want to take the position that the people who bicycle in DC are somehow completely different from the people who bicycle in Montgomery County or Prince George's County...

I honestly have no idea what you’re arguing about anymore. It’s just arguing for the sake of arguing at this point because if you’re not making up your own facts you’re changing the subject when someone points out you’re wrong. Then you delete the posts. LOL!

How many bicycle fatalities does DC average in a year?

You're going to have to decide if your argument is "There aren't enough dead bicyclists in DC to make bicycle infrastructure in DC worthwhile" - in which case you should tell us how many dead bicyclists there would need to be, in your opinion.

Or if your argument is "Bicyclists in DC are white men" - in which case you should explain why most of the dead bicyclists are not white men.

This is exactly what I’m talking about. Redirect and then argue about something else. LOL.

Let me help you. There has been 1 bicycle fatality so far in 2023 and going back to 2017, which is furthest back that DC provides easy access to data, there have been 15. So an average of 2.14 per year.

Also, according to the League of American Cyclists, who analyzed 2017 NHTA survey data, less than 20% of bicycle trips in the United States were by people of color, ie all person who are not non-Hispanic white.
https://data.bikeleague.org/show-your-data/national-data/demographics-of-active-transportation/

How many dead bicyclists is enough for you?

Why are most of the dead bicyclists not white men?

DP but this all seems like a better arguement for why urban biking should be limited, not expanded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that when commute times are less with public transportation, people will choose public transportation. When commute times are less with cars, people will use cars.

Eh, that depends on the time difference. My commute to work into DC is 25 minutes by car. If I could make that commute in 10 minutes by transit, I'd still take my car because I don't have to share my car with other people, some of whom may be drunk and/or potentially dangerous.

Places like New York and Tokyo are outliers, because transit is so much faster than driving. For most people, potentially shaving a few minutes off of a commute isn't worth it because of the negatives of public transit.

If you prefer a longer commute, that's your choice. However, public policy does not have to enable your choice.

Ditto for bikes? Weird to me how much money the city spends building an entire separate infrastructure for a small number of people who refuse to take the subway or the bus.

It is amazing that, in a city with a poverty rate that rivals West Virginia's, a small number of white guys from Ward 3 can get the city to spend billions of dollars to subsidize their hobby. Take the subway! Take the bus! Walk! You have plenty of other options!

You sure it’s just white guys from Ward 3? Because its not. https://www.washingtoninformer.com/ward-8-cyclists-critical-of-how-d-c-officials-have-tackled-transportation-issues/

Anecdotes are great, but it is really almost all white people.
https://www.mwcog.org/file.aspx?D=HcOqbzivuFayTfyAlhvUJhe72nkkosOrz2TZl%2bOlFXE%3d&A=3b5jlNJv7k8i9DmLKmqJ5c9bgLZ451b3R0E2zs1pReQ%3d

Because the only trips anybody makes, ever, anywhere, is the trip to and from work. That's all anybody ever does. From home, to work, then back home to stay until the next trip to work. Right? Nobody ever goes anywhere else.

Or, alternatively, most of the trips people make are not the commute to work, but those don't get counted.

-person who uses their bike for most trips, but not for the commute to work

You clearly love to use Black folk for your propaganda but are obviously completely disconnected to how most Black folk live their lives in DC:

What are these “other trips”. Grocery shopping? How many grocery stores are in Wards 7 and 8?

Absolutely embarrassing and frankly racist. You need to stop talking about Black folk when you clearly have no clue.

You're not seriously saying that the only time Black people in DC go anywhere is to and from work, are you?

And how do you explain the Black people in DC who were killed by drivers while riding a bike?

If you’re going to keep talking about dead Black people, at least have the decency to say their names.

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:From reading this thread the challenge seems to be that OP is alone in their quest to achieve this bicycle and pedestrian utopia.

I am hardly alone!

Besides, it’s not our numbers that count. It is our lobbying power.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From reading this thread the challenge seems to be that OP is alone in their quest to achieve this bicycle and pedestrian utopia.

I am hardly alone!

Besides, it’s not our numbers that count. It is our lobbying power.

When OP and DDOT are using taxpayer funds to pay outside advocacy groups to lobby for their own agenda, yes, it enhances lobbying power.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From reading this thread the challenge seems to be that OP is alone in their quest to achieve this bicycle and pedestrian utopia.

I am hardly alone!

Besides, it’s not our numbers that count. It is our lobbying power.

When OP and DDOT are using taxpayer funds to pay outside advocacy groups to lobby for their own agenda, yes, it enhances lobbying power.

Socks are for wearing on your feet, not for making sock puppets out of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From reading this thread the challenge seems to be that OP is alone in their quest to achieve this bicycle and pedestrian utopia.

I am hardly alone!

Besides, it’s not our numbers that count. It is our lobbying power.

When OP and DDOT are using taxpayer funds to pay outside advocacy groups to lobby for their own agenda, yes, it enhances lobbying power.

I donate $20 to WABA for every post I see here about a Bike Lobby.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From reading this thread the challenge seems to be that OP is alone in their quest to achieve this bicycle and pedestrian utopia.

I am hardly alone!

Besides, it’s not our numbers that count. It is our lobbying power.

When OP and DDOT are using taxpayer funds to pay outside advocacy groups to lobby for their own agenda, yes, it enhances lobbying power.

I donate $20 to WABA for every post I see here about a Bike Lobby.

I actually went and got a Bike Lobby shirt, and I wear it, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The bottom line is that when commute times are less with public transportation, people will choose public transportation. When commute times are less with cars, people will use cars.

Eh, that depends on the time difference. My commute to work into DC is 25 minutes by car. If I could make that commute in 10 minutes by transit, I'd still take my car because I don't have to share my car with other people, some of whom may be drunk and/or potentially dangerous.

Places like New York and Tokyo are outliers, because transit is so much faster than driving. For most people, potentially shaving a few minutes off of a commute isn't worth it because of the negatives of public transit.

If you prefer a longer commute, that's your choice. However, public policy does not have to enable your choice.

Ditto for bikes? Weird to me how much money the city spends building an entire separate infrastructure for a small number of people who refuse to take the subway or the bus.

It is amazing that, in a city with a poverty rate that rivals West Virginia's, a small number of white guys from Ward 3 can get the city to spend billions of dollars to subsidize their hobby. Take the subway! Take the bus! Walk! You have plenty of other options!

You sure it’s just white guys from Ward 3? Because its not. https://www.washingtoninformer.com/ward-8-cyclists-critical-of-how-d-c-officials-have-tackled-transportation-issues/

Anecdotes are great, but it is really almost all white people.
https://www.mwcog.org/file.aspx?D=HcOqbzivuFayTfyAlhvUJhe72nkkosOrz2TZl%2bOlFXE%3d&A=3b5jlNJv7k8i9DmLKmqJ5c9bgLZ451b3R0E2zs1pReQ%3d

Because the only trips anybody makes, ever, anywhere, is the trip to and from work. That's all anybody ever does. From home, to work, then back home to stay until the next trip to work. Right? Nobody ever goes anywhere else.

Or, alternatively, most of the trips people make are not the commute to work, but those don't get counted.

-person who uses their bike for most trips, but not for the commute to work

You clearly love to use Black folk for your propaganda but are obviously completely disconnected to how most Black folk live their lives in DC:

What are these “other trips”. Grocery shopping? How many grocery stores are in Wards 7 and 8?

Absolutely embarrassing and frankly racist. You need to stop talking about Black folk when you clearly have no clue.

You do know that there are Black people who live outside of Wards 7 and 8, right? Talk about racist...