APS overdose at Wakefield

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Take your head out of the sand, friend. Opioid overdose is a problem. The fact that it's in our schools is scary. We need to normalize narcan as a life saver, like we do with CPR. You seem to want to pretend it's not in our schools. It is and making narcan available seems like a good idea. If you wait for the paramedics, precious minutes go by and the brain continues to lose oxygen.

You’re telling a teacher who has been posting all over this thread about how we are facing this every single day in schools to “take her head out of the sand.” Please. Narcan is normalized. We do NOT need to be making teenagers and kids individually responsible for saving the lives of their peers with it as just a matter of attending school. You would be singing a very, very different tune the time YOUR kid was traumatized by having to do this or worse, not being able to in the moment and facing guilt because of it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Do you all realize Narcan is in all the Arlington public libraries at this point? It's right next to the AED/defib machines. I don't find that depressing. It just seems smart. I would have thought it would have been in schools already in the same fashion.

So you're saying because it might make a kid feel bad in some way down the road, it shouldn't be there at all? Let's remove the AED machines too then. Wouldn't want to screw it up if someone has a heart attack.

That is not what I said. I said ADULTS in schools have narcan, as they should. It should NOT just be posted around the school for kids to access with the message that they need to administer it to their peers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the PP, there is nothing more schools can do or that I think should be on schools to handle this. We are doing absolutely everything we can including obtaining narcan ourselves, as I did this weekend, and bringing it to school to have on hand if it’s needed. We are sitting outside the bathrooms check student passes so we know a) who is in which bathroom and b) for how long.

Your question is well intentioned but honestly a bit frustrating for me to read because why do you think it’s on us as TEACHERS to do more to address narcotic abuse? Do you not think already that having to watch kids for signs of respiratory distress or dilated pupils while also trying to teach is too much? I was helping a teacher locate one of her students in the hall last week because he hadn’t returned to class and she strongly suspected he was on something and was panicked. We routinely see ambulances pull up right outside our classroom windows to wheel out a kid having an emergency. I am talking weekly. One day recently, it happened twice in 30 minutes. Thank god both lived. I heard my AP panicked and yelling at the locked single stall restroom the other day for a kid to come out because when he didn’t answer she feared he was in distress or dead. It is our daily fear we will find a child dead in a bathroom, we have to teach around that, and you’re asking me what more do I want schools to do??

I want SOCIETY to do something. I want this country to not be such a depressing hellscape that teenagers don’t feel this desperate need for escapism at any cost. I want parents educating themselves on this, checking their kids’ rooms and bags, enforcing boundaries and structure. I want better for these children but it is not on schools to somehow manage this crisis.

Is this really what's going on? Or teens experiment with drugs as they've always done and now the risks are astronomically higher than they've ever been?

This country has more than it's fair share of problems but calling it a depressing hellscape seems a bit hyperbolic, particularly given how much of the world's population lives.

I've really started to believe the lack of accountability and expectations for these kids is also part of the problem. Time to face reality. Caught even once in the bathroom doing this? Suspended. Next time? Expelled. Get some undercover police officers in the schools to figure out who is dealing and bringing it in. And then bye. One strike and you're out. And just generally zero tolerance for kids who regularly show up in a way where they are not there to participate in learning. Clear and swift progressive discipline and then expel them.

Kids need boundaries and they need to know there are boundaries that will be enforced.

You may think it is hyperbole but it’s important you realize that that IS the mindset of most teenagers. They don’t see a very bright future. They see unaffordable college or college followed by a job with stagnant wages that will never allow them to buy a house . They see climate change. They see a future where they are guaranteed to have fewer opportunities for success than any generation before them. Yes experimentation is normal but there is a generational ennui and disaffection, compounded by of course the last 3 years of seeing every institution fail, that has profoundly altered their worldview. You ignore this or deny it at the risk of completely minimizing a huge driver of their behaviors and choices.

Most teenagers? I have two and don't see this as accurate. I don't think a whole lot of teenagers are actively thinking about how they won't be able to buy their first house or climate change down the road. Maybe they should be. But that's not how the teen brain works.

Teens very much live in the present. Social media is a big problem for many of them. Potential isolation from real-world interactions due to too much screen time, severely compounded by how our schools handled covid which broke the already tenuous thread many of them had to real-life relationships which then had to be rebuilt but many were not. Kids of a certain group, huge pressure to get into college.

I don't disagree with you that we need to look at more systemic issues, but the level of all consuming gloom and hysteria you're referencing isn't helping you make a case. Every institution failed? You don't want to see what life is like if every institution in our lives has legitimately failed.

Respectfully, your sample is 2. Your two. Their friends are probably a lot like them. I teach hundreds every year and interact with hundreds more day to day. I am face to face all day long in ways wonderful and terrible with teenagers and what they’re dealing with. The patterns and trends are much easier for someone in my position to discern. Again, you don’t have to like this or even agree but your experience is simply not comparable to mine in this area.

And in your interactions with them, they all talk to you about how they worry they won't be able to buy a home, stagnant wages, the planet is heating up, and all the institutions have failed? If they are this thoughtful and profound then I actually have hope for the next generation. I probably sound snarky but I am serious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Take your head out of the sand, friend. Opioid overdose is a problem. The fact that it's in our schools is scary. We need to normalize narcan as a life saver, like we do with CPR. You seem to want to pretend it's not in our schools. It is and making narcan available seems like a good idea. If you wait for the paramedics, precious minutes go by and the brain continues to lose oxygen.

You’re telling a teacher who has been posting all over this thread about how we are facing this every single day in schools to “take her head out of the sand.” Please. Narcan is normalized. We do NOT need to be making teenagers and kids individually responsible for saving the lives of their peers with it as just a matter of attending school. You would be singing a very, very different tune the time YOUR kid was traumatized by having to do this or worse, not being able to in the moment and facing guilt because of it.

ARe you speaking for yourself or as the teacher?

I never said kids should be ultimately responsible for administering the narcan but we do need to put it out, available, for all to know where to find it. The person describes some of us as contributing to the 'hellscape' - that's her term. I don't think the US is a hellscape but we are in an opioid crisis. We need to respond. As one poster said, it's in the public library. Put it in the schools with the AED and fire extinguisher? What is the problem with this?
I speak to my kid, in rational terms, about drugs. And my kids have also had CPR and AED training since middle school. I believe some courses are now adding narcan adminstration to the training.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Do you all realize Narcan is in all the Arlington public libraries at this point? It's right next to the AED/defib machines. I don't find that depressing. It just seems smart. I would have thought it would have been in schools already in the same fashion.

So you're saying because it might make a kid feel bad in some way down the road, it shouldn't be there at all? Let's remove the AED machines too then. Wouldn't want to screw it up if someone has a heart attack.

That is not what I said. I said ADULTS in schools have narcan, as they should. It should NOT just be posted around the school for kids to access with the message that they need to administer it to their peers.

So how this works in real life is the equipment is put in easy reach for anyone to access and training is offered to anyone who wants it and easy instructions are put on the box. There is no message anyone needs to adminster it to anyone. The hope is if the situation arises, someone will step up and administer it. If you feel deeply uncomfortable your child might ever be put in this position, I think it's appropriate to tell them to never use it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the PP, there is nothing more schools can do or that I think should be on schools to handle this. We are doing absolutely everything we can including obtaining narcan ourselves, as I did this weekend, and bringing it to school to have on hand if it’s needed. We are sitting outside the bathrooms check student passes so we know a) who is in which bathroom and b) for how long.

Your question is well intentioned but honestly a bit frustrating for me to read because why do you think it’s on us as TEACHERS to do more to address narcotic abuse? Do you not think already that having to watch kids for signs of respiratory distress or dilated pupils while also trying to teach is too much? I was helping a teacher locate one of her students in the hall last week because he hadn’t returned to class and she strongly suspected he was on something and was panicked. We routinely see ambulances pull up right outside our classroom windows to wheel out a kid having an emergency. I am talking weekly. One day recently, it happened twice in 30 minutes. Thank god both lived. I heard my AP panicked and yelling at the locked single stall restroom the other day for a kid to come out because when he didn’t answer she feared he was in distress or dead. It is our daily fear we will find a child dead in a bathroom, we have to teach around that, and you’re asking me what more do I want schools to do??

I want SOCIETY to do something. I want this country to not be such a depressing hellscape that teenagers don’t feel this desperate need for escapism at any cost. I want parents educating themselves on this, checking their kids’ rooms and bags, enforcing boundaries and structure. I want better for these children but it is not on schools to somehow manage this crisis.

Is this really what's going on? Or teens experiment with drugs as they've always done and now the risks are astronomically higher than they've ever been?

This country has more than it's fair share of problems but calling it a depressing hellscape seems a bit hyperbolic, particularly given how much of the world's population lives.

I've really started to believe the lack of accountability and expectations for these kids is also part of the problem. Time to face reality. Caught even once in the bathroom doing this? Suspended. Next time? Expelled. Get some undercover police officers in the schools to figure out who is dealing and bringing it in. And then bye. One strike and you're out. And just generally zero tolerance for kids who regularly show up in a way where they are not there to participate in learning. Clear and swift progressive discipline and then expel them.

Kids need boundaries and they need to know there are boundaries that will be enforced.

You may think it is hyperbole but it’s important you realize that that IS the mindset of most teenagers. They don’t see a very bright future. They see unaffordable college or college followed by a job with stagnant wages that will never allow them to buy a house . They see climate change. They see a future where they are guaranteed to have fewer opportunities for success than any generation before them. Yes experimentation is normal but there is a generational ennui and disaffection, compounded by of course the last 3 years of seeing every institution fail, that has profoundly altered their worldview. You ignore this or deny it at the risk of completely minimizing a huge driver of their behaviors and choices.

Most teenagers? I have two and don't see this as accurate. I don't think a whole lot of teenagers are actively thinking about how they won't be able to buy their first house or climate change down the road. Maybe they should be. But that's not how the teen brain works.

Teens very much live in the present. Social media is a big problem for many of them. Potential isolation from real-world interactions due to too much screen time, severely compounded by how our schools handled covid which broke the already tenuous thread many of them had to real-life relationships which then had to be rebuilt but many were not. Kids of a certain group, huge pressure to get into college.

I don't disagree with you that we need to look at more systemic issues, but the level of all consuming gloom and hysteria you're referencing isn't helping you make a case. Every institution failed? You don't want to see what life is like if every institution in our lives has legitimately failed.

Respectfully, your sample is 2. Your two. Their friends are probably a lot like them. I teach hundreds every year and interact with hundreds more day to day. I am face to face all day long in ways wonderful and terrible with teenagers and what they’re dealing with. The patterns and trends are much easier for someone in my position to discern. Again, you don’t have to like this or even agree but your experience is simply not comparable to mine in this area.

And in your interactions with them, they all talk to you about how they worry they won't be able to buy a home, stagnant wages, the planet is heating up, and all the institutions have failed? If they are this thoughtful and profound then I actually have hope for the next generation. I probably sound snarky but I am serious.

Some kids are great. It’s just the millions of brainwashed idiots who are breeding that we have to worry about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Do you all realize Narcan is in all the Arlington public libraries at this point? It's right next to the AED/defib machines. I don't find that depressing. It just seems smart. I would have thought it would have been in schools already in the same fashion.

So you're saying because it might make a kid feel bad in some way down the road, it shouldn't be there at all? Let's remove the AED machines too then. Wouldn't want to screw it up if someone has a heart attack.

That is not what I said. I said ADULTS in schools have narcan, as they should. It should NOT just be posted around the school for kids to access with the message that they need to administer it to their peers.

So how this works in real life is the equipment is put in easy reach for anyone to access and training is offered to anyone who wants it and easy instructions are put on the box. There is no message anyone needs to adminster it to anyone. The hope is if the situation arises, someone will step up and administer it. If you feel deeply uncomfortable your child might ever be put in this position, I think it's appropriate to tell them to never use it.

Again, I AM A TEACHER . This is not about my child, who, by the way, knows what Narcan is and how to use it since I’ve taught her. It’s about what kind of terrible environment are we just accepting kids in a crucial stage of childhood development should just tolerate rather than talk about societal fixes for this. But sure, make the kids mini field nurses and pretend that fixes it, way better idea. This is very much like when people suggest “just give teachers guns” instead of being willing to grapple with and legislate around the myriad issues causing mass school shootings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Do you all realize Narcan is in all the Arlington public libraries at this point? It's right next to the AED/defib machines. I don't find that depressing. It just seems smart. I would have thought it would have been in schools already in the same fashion.

So you're saying because it might make a kid feel bad in some way down the road, it shouldn't be there at all? Let's remove the AED machines too then. Wouldn't want to screw it up if someone has a heart attack.

That is not what I said. I said ADULTS in schools have narcan, as they should. It should NOT just be posted around the school for kids to access with the message that they need to administer it to their peers.

So how this works in real life is the equipment is put in easy reach for anyone to access and training is offered to anyone who wants it and easy instructions are put on the box. There is no message anyone needs to adminster it to anyone. The hope is if the situation arises, someone will step up and administer it. If you feel deeply uncomfortable your child might ever be put in this position, I think it's appropriate to tell them to never use it.

Again, I AM A TEACHER . This is not about my child, who, by the way, knows what Narcan is and how to use it since I’ve taught her. It’s about what kind of terrible environment are we just accepting kids in a crucial stage of childhood development should just tolerate rather than talk about societal fixes for this. But sure, make the kids mini field nurses and pretend that fixes it, way better idea. This is very much like when people suggest “just give teachers guns” instead of being willing to grapple with and legislate around the myriad issues causing mass school shootings.

Isn't CPR a requirement to be a teacher in VA? Add narcan administration to the CPR requirement.

You are really mixing things up though when you say those of us asking for narcan in the schools say teachers could carry guns - big BIG difference. I am anti-gun.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the PP, there is nothing more schools can do or that I think should be on schools to handle this. We are doing absolutely everything we can including obtaining narcan ourselves, as I did this weekend, and bringing it to school to have on hand if it’s needed. We are sitting outside the bathrooms check student passes so we know a) who is in which bathroom and b) for how long.

Your question is well intentioned but honestly a bit frustrating for me to read because why do you think it’s on us as TEACHERS to do more to address narcotic abuse? Do you not think already that having to watch kids for signs of respiratory distress or dilated pupils while also trying to teach is too much? I was helping a teacher locate one of her students in the hall last week because he hadn’t returned to class and she strongly suspected he was on something and was panicked. We routinely see ambulances pull up right outside our classroom windows to wheel out a kid having an emergency. I am talking weekly. One day recently, it happened twice in 30 minutes. Thank god both lived. I heard my AP panicked and yelling at the locked single stall restroom the other day for a kid to come out because when he didn’t answer she feared he was in distress or dead. It is our daily fear we will find a child dead in a bathroom, we have to teach around that, and you’re asking me what more do I want schools to do??

I want SOCIETY to do something. I want this country to not be such a depressing hellscape that teenagers don’t feel this desperate need for escapism at any cost. I want parents educating themselves on this, checking their kids’ rooms and bags, enforcing boundaries and structure. I want better for these children but it is not on schools to somehow manage this crisis.

Is this really what's going on? Or teens experiment with drugs as they've always done and now the risks are astronomically higher than they've ever been?

This country has more than it's fair share of problems but calling it a depressing hellscape seems a bit hyperbolic, particularly given how much of the world's population lives.

I've really started to believe the lack of accountability and expectations for these kids is also part of the problem. Time to face reality. Caught even once in the bathroom doing this? Suspended. Next time? Expelled. Get some undercover police officers in the schools to figure out who is dealing and bringing it in. And then bye. One strike and you're out. And just generally zero tolerance for kids who regularly show up in a way where they are not there to participate in learning. Clear and swift progressive discipline and then expel them.

Kids need boundaries and they need to know there are boundaries that will be enforced.

You may think it is hyperbole but it’s important you realize that that IS the mindset of most teenagers. They don’t see a very bright future. They see unaffordable college or college followed by a job with stagnant wages that will never allow them to buy a house . They see climate change. They see a future where they are guaranteed to have fewer opportunities for success than any generation before them. Yes experimentation is normal but there is a generational ennui and disaffection, compounded by of course the last 3 years of seeing every institution fail, that has profoundly altered their worldview. You ignore this or deny it at the risk of completely minimizing a huge driver of their behaviors and choices.

Most teenagers? I have two and don't see this as accurate. I don't think a whole lot of teenagers are actively thinking about how they won't be able to buy their first house or climate change down the road. Maybe they should be. But that's not how the teen brain works.

Teens very much live in the present. Social media is a big problem for many of them. Potential isolation from real-world interactions due to too much screen time, severely compounded by how our schools handled covid which broke the already tenuous thread many of them had to real-life relationships which then had to be rebuilt but many were not. Kids of a certain group, huge pressure to get into college.

I don't disagree with you that we need to look at more systemic issues, but the level of all consuming gloom and hysteria you're referencing isn't helping you make a case. Every institution failed? You don't want to see what life is like if every institution in our lives has legitimately failed.

Respectfully, your sample is 2. Your two. Their friends are probably a lot like them. I teach hundreds every year and interact with hundreds more day to day. I am face to face all day long in ways wonderful and terrible with teenagers and what they’re dealing with. The patterns and trends are much easier for someone in my position to discern. Again, you don’t have to like this or even agree but your experience is simply not comparable to mine in this area.

And in your interactions with them, they all talk to you about how they worry they won't be able to buy a home, stagnant wages, the planet is heating up, and all the institutions have failed? If they are this thoughtful and profound then I actually have hope for the next generation. I probably sound snarky but I am serious.

They talk about all that and even more. They’re not idiots, they see how things are. You think they look at all this and see their parents debating whether stuff like eggs or the preferred brand of bread is affordable anymore and don’t notice it seems pretty bad? Their outlook is overall bleak - about adults, about systems, about anything truly getting better. Obviously this isn’t all. Some are pretty blissfully ignorant or still have that kind of optimism you really only have at 15. But on the whole, Gen Z and Alpha are (rightfully) quite cynical and lack real expectations they’re headed for a future where you work hard and just have a nice life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Do you all realize Narcan is in all the Arlington public libraries at this point? It's right next to the AED/defib machines. I don't find that depressing. It just seems smart. I would have thought it would have been in schools already in the same fashion.

So you're saying because it might make a kid feel bad in some way down the road, it shouldn't be there at all? Let's remove the AED machines too then. Wouldn't want to screw it up if someone has a heart attack.

That is not what I said. I said ADULTS in schools have narcan, as they should. It should NOT just be posted around the school for kids to access with the message that they need to administer it to their peers.

So how this works in real life is the equipment is put in easy reach for anyone to access and training is offered to anyone who wants it and easy instructions are put on the box. There is no message anyone needs to adminster it to anyone. The hope is if the situation arises, someone will step up and administer it. If you feel deeply uncomfortable your child might ever be put in this position, I think it's appropriate to tell them to never use it.

Again, I AM A TEACHER . This is not about my child, who, by the way, knows what Narcan is and how to use it since I’ve taught her. It’s about what kind of terrible environment are we just accepting kids in a crucial stage of childhood development should just tolerate rather than talk about societal fixes for this. But sure, make the kids mini field nurses and pretend that fixes it, way better idea. This is very much like when people suggest “just give teachers guns” instead of being willing to grapple with and legislate around the myriad issues causing mass school shootings.

You're not going to legislate your way around this anytime soon. I work IN A LIBRARY where we have narcan and we were all offered training. Some staff felt as you do. So they didn't attend the training. When the time comes they won't step in and use the Narcan. Fine no problem. Someone probably will. It's incredibly easy to administer. It's way easier than an epi-pen for example. You can do no harm to a person by administering it. The situation is of course not even remotely analogous to giving teachers guns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Do you all realize Narcan is in all the Arlington public libraries at this point? It's right next to the AED/defib machines. I don't find that depressing. It just seems smart. I would have thought it would have been in schools already in the same fashion.

So you're saying because it might make a kid feel bad in some way down the road, it shouldn't be there at all? Let's remove the AED machines too then. Wouldn't want to screw it up if someone has a heart attack.

That is not what I said. I said ADULTS in schools have narcan, as they should. It should NOT just be posted around the school for kids to access with the message that they need to administer it to their peers.

So how this works in real life is the equipment is put in easy reach for anyone to access and training is offered to anyone who wants it and easy instructions are put on the box. There is no message anyone needs to adminster it to anyone. The hope is if the situation arises, someone will step up and administer it. If you feel deeply uncomfortable your child might ever be put in this position, I think it's appropriate to tell them to never use it.

Again, I AM A TEACHER . This is not about my child, who, by the way, knows what Narcan is and how to use it since I’ve taught her. It’s about what kind of terrible environment are we just accepting kids in a crucial stage of childhood development should just tolerate rather than talk about societal fixes for this. But sure, make the kids mini field nurses and pretend that fixes it, way better idea. This is very much like when people suggest “just give teachers guns” instead of being willing to grapple with and legislate around the myriad issues causing mass school shootings.

Isn't CPR a requirement to be a teacher in VA? Add narcan administration to the CPR requirement.

You are really mixing things up though when you say those of us asking for narcan in the schools say teachers could carry guns - big BIG difference. I am anti-gun.

It’s in the same vein. It’s refusing to look at the bigger picture and just foisting some ridiculous “solution” on schools that shouldn’t be saddled with endlessly reacting to crisis. And yes narcan training will be required but it’s not like it’s rocket science. Lean their head back, jam the nozzle in their nose and spray, and pray they don’t die before EMS can get there. Two teachers in my school had to begin what became five rounds of chest compressions with Narcan administration two weeks ago when a kid OD’d in their class at our school. He blessedly survived but this is real trauma for the teachers AND the kids who saw, even though we are trained.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the PP, there is nothing more schools can do or that I think should be on schools to handle this. We are doing absolutely everything we can including obtaining narcan ourselves, as I did this weekend, and bringing it to school to have on hand if it’s needed. We are sitting outside the bathrooms check student passes so we know a) who is in which bathroom and b) for how long.

Your question is well intentioned but honestly a bit frustrating for me to read because why do you think it’s on us as TEACHERS to do more to address narcotic abuse? Do you not think already that having to watch kids for signs of respiratory distress or dilated pupils while also trying to teach is too much? I was helping a teacher locate one of her students in the hall last week because he hadn’t returned to class and she strongly suspected he was on something and was panicked. We routinely see ambulances pull up right outside our classroom windows to wheel out a kid having an emergency. I am talking weekly. One day recently, it happened twice in 30 minutes. Thank god both lived. I heard my AP panicked and yelling at the locked single stall restroom the other day for a kid to come out because when he didn’t answer she feared he was in distress or dead. It is our daily fear we will find a child dead in a bathroom, we have to teach around that, and you’re asking me what more do I want schools to do??

I want SOCIETY to do something. I want this country to not be such a depressing hellscape that teenagers don’t feel this desperate need for escapism at any cost. I want parents educating themselves on this, checking their kids’ rooms and bags, enforcing boundaries and structure. I want better for these children but it is not on schools to somehow manage this crisis.

My question was not “what more can teachers do.” It was what more can the schools do. What can the schools do to support teachers? What more can the schools do so that it doesn’t all fall on teachers to make sure they have their own Narcan in case something happens

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^I agree with most of your points except giving narcan to every student. Narcan expires. But how about it be put in a lockbox (near the fire extinguishers or AED machines) where everyone knows where to access it? Make it easy-access?

They can give it to every student and I would assume some students would throw it away and yes it would expire so yeah put it in the hallways and put it in the bathrooms

The fact that multiple people think this is a good idea is proof of our country is the hellscape they’re using drugs to escape from. Depressing as hell. Let me know it works the first time a teenage CHILD freezes and doesn’t get or forgets how to use the Narcan, or it isn’t there, or they panic and do it wrong or the kid is too far gone and dies anyway. Now a teenagers gets to feel like it’s their fault a peer died. None of this is ok. This is SCHOOL, not Kensington Rd in Philadelphia, god

Do you all realize Narcan is in all the Arlington public libraries at this point? It's right next to the AED/defib machines. I don't find that depressing. It just seems smart. I would have thought it would have been in schools already in the same fashion.

So you're saying because it might make a kid feel bad in some way down the road, it shouldn't be there at all? Let's remove the AED machines too then. Wouldn't want to screw it up if someone has a heart attack.

That is not what I said. I said ADULTS in schools have narcan, as they should. It should NOT just be posted around the school for kids to access with the message that they need to administer it to their peers.

So how this works in real life is the equipment is put in easy reach for anyone to access and training is offered to anyone who wants it and easy instructions are put on the box. There is no message anyone needs to adminster it to anyone. The hope is if the situation arises, someone will step up and administer it. If you feel deeply uncomfortable your child might ever be put in this position, I think it's appropriate to tell them to never use it.

Again, I AM A TEACHER . This is not about my child, who, by the way, knows what Narcan is and how to use it since I’ve taught her. It’s about what kind of terrible environment are we just accepting kids in a crucial stage of childhood development should just tolerate rather than talk about societal fixes for this. But sure, make the kids mini field nurses and pretend that fixes it, way better idea. This is very much like when people suggest “just give teachers guns” instead of being willing to grapple with and legislate around the myriad issues causing mass school shootings.

Isn't CPR a requirement to be a teacher in VA? Add narcan administration to the CPR requirement.

You are really mixing things up though when you say those of us asking for narcan in the schools say teachers could carry guns - big BIG difference. I am anti-gun.

It’s in the same vein. It’s refusing to look at the bigger picture and just foisting some ridiculous “solution” on schools that shouldn’t be saddled with endlessly reacting to crisis. And yes narcan training will be required but it’s not like it’s rocket science. Lean their head back, jam the nozzle in their nose and spray, and pray they don’t die before EMS can get there. Two teachers in my school had to begin what became five rounds of chest compressions with Narcan administration two weeks ago when a kid OD’d in their class at our school. He blessedly survived but this is real trauma for the teachers AND the kids who saw, even though we are trained.

I work in healthcare and even us providers who provide CPR (I've only had to do it three times in my career) have to debrief after giving CPR; it is traumatizing. Thank god those teachers knew CPR. I sincerely hope they had an opportunity to speak to someone. But, it is so important to have this training and narcan availability. Every american should be trained in CPR and now, narcan administration.

[Anonymous]

And I don’t see how they can do more. But tbh, for my own sake, I need to bow out of this thread. I have two boxes of Narcan in my work bag to take to school tomorrow. Will have bathroom duty again tomorrow to monitor who and how long kids are in a locked stall before I have to worry. And it’ll be every day from here to June. I am perhaps too emotionally close to this to be a value add in this convo any longer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To the PP, there is nothing more schools can do or that I think should be on schools to handle this. We are doing absolutely everything we can including obtaining narcan ourselves, as I did this weekend, and bringing it to school to have on hand if it’s needed. We are sitting outside the bathrooms check student passes so we know a) who is in which bathroom and b) for how long.

Your question is well intentioned but honestly a bit frustrating for me to read because why do you think it’s on us as TEACHERS to do more to address narcotic abuse? Do you not think already that having to watch kids for signs of respiratory distress or dilated pupils while also trying to teach is too much? I was helping a teacher locate one of her students in the hall last week because he hadn’t returned to class and she strongly suspected he was on something and was panicked. We routinely see ambulances pull up right outside our classroom windows to wheel out a kid having an emergency. I am talking weekly. One day recently, it happened twice in 30 minutes. Thank god both lived. I heard my AP panicked and yelling at the locked single stall restroom the other day for a kid to come out because when he didn’t answer she feared he was in distress or dead. It is our daily fear we will find a child dead in a bathroom, we have to teach around that, and you’re asking me what more do I want schools to do??

I want SOCIETY to do something. I want this country to not be such a depressing hellscape that teenagers don’t feel this desperate need for escapism at any cost. I want parents educating themselves on this, checking their kids’ rooms and bags, enforcing boundaries and structure. I want better for these children but it is not on schools to somehow manage this crisis.

Is this really what's going on? Or teens experiment with drugs as they've always done and now the risks are astronomically higher than they've ever been?

This country has more than it's fair share of problems but calling it a depressing hellscape seems a bit hyperbolic, particularly given how much of the world's population lives.

I've really started to believe the lack of accountability and expectations for these kids is also part of the problem. Time to face reality. Caught even once in the bathroom doing this? Suspended. Next time? Expelled. Get some undercover police officers in the schools to figure out who is dealing and bringing it in. And then bye. One strike and you're out. And just generally zero tolerance for kids who regularly show up in a way where they are not there to participate in learning. Clear and swift progressive discipline and then expel them.

Kids need boundaries and they need to know there are boundaries that will be enforced.

You may think it is hyperbole but it’s important you realize that that IS the mindset of most teenagers. They don’t see a very bright future. They see unaffordable college or college followed by a job with stagnant wages that will never allow them to buy a house . They see climate change. They see a future where they are guaranteed to have fewer opportunities for success than any generation before them. Yes experimentation is normal but there is a generational ennui and disaffection, compounded by of course the last 3 years of seeing every institution fail, that has profoundly altered their worldview. You ignore this or deny it at the risk of completely minimizing a huge driver of their behaviors and choices.

Most teenagers? I have two and don't see this as accurate. I don't think a whole lot of teenagers are actively thinking about how they won't be able to buy their first house or climate change down the road. Maybe they should be. But that's not how the teen brain works.

Teens very much live in the present. Social media is a big problem for many of them. Potential isolation from real-world interactions due to too much screen time, severely compounded by how our schools handled covid which broke the already tenuous thread many of them had to real-life relationships which then had to be rebuilt but many were not. Kids of a certain group, huge pressure to get into college.

I don't disagree with you that we need to look at more systemic issues, but the level of all consuming gloom and hysteria you're referencing isn't helping you make a case. Every institution failed? You don't want to see what life is like if every institution in our lives has legitimately failed.

Respectfully, your sample is 2. Your two. Their friends are probably a lot like them. I teach hundreds every year and interact with hundreds more day to day. I am face to face all day long in ways wonderful and terrible with teenagers and what they’re dealing with. The patterns and trends are much easier for someone in my position to discern. Again, you don’t have to like this or even agree but your experience is simply not comparable to mine in this area.

And in your interactions with them, they all talk to you about how they worry they won't be able to buy a home, stagnant wages, the planet is heating up, and all the institutions have failed? If they are this thoughtful and profound then I actually have hope for the next generation. I probably sound snarky but I am serious.

Some kids are great. It’s just the millions of brainwashed idiots who are breeding that we have to worry about.

I don't debate some kids are great. The prefrontal cortex is not fully formed and they don't have impulse control. They seek pleasure and don't think about consequences. I don't think they are idiots or brainwashed. I think they live in the moment and don't always do a great job of connecting the dots and for this generation, the repercussions for making mistakes are a lot higher.

But if many of them are big systems thinkers and future thinking too that is great for all of us.