Let’s Talk APS High Schools: 4th one or no?

[Anonymous]

If the County is going to get rid of swim requirements for all high schools then cool, no need to build one at the CC site. At this point I'm probably in favor of that. But if swimming is a requirement then that site needs a pool. If not then every student at every other high school needs to forced to sit in silence without the ability to do homework or be taught for an hour every swimming day too so that they lose an equivalent amount of education time to the CC kids who are stuck sitting on buses. Otherwise you are saying the kids who go to the CC don't deserve the same amount of instruction as everyone else.

As for the previous discussion about building up at an existing school one of the issues with doing that or with making the career center choice is with available slots for extra curriculars. When each school is 3000 - 4000 or more students that is alot of competition for a limited amount of slots in a band, or on a sports team or choir or school. Every student in APS high schools will be negatively impacted by fewer chances to do extra-curriculars. This was one of WL's big objections to expanding at the Education Center building or whatever its called. A 4th school balances opportunities among an enormous student population.

And as far as demographics - that last redistricting moved people from WL to Wakefield who were located along the east pike, in a historically black neighborhood, and were more diverse and of a lower socio-economic grouping. So if we are going to demand that the CC and Wakefield play nice and try to equally balance diversity amongst themselves, then WL, the school that just got whiter and richer, needs to participate in that too instead of name calling the one neighborhood not going all NIMBY at the thought of a new school. I don't even know what you do about Yorktown's diversity? Move IB there?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If the County is going to get rid of swim requirements for all high schools then cool, no need to build one at the CC site. At this point I'm probably in favor of that. But if swimming is a requirement then that site needs a pool. If not then every student at every other high school needs to forced to sit in silence without the ability to do homework or be taught for an hour every swimming day too so that they lose an equivalent amount of education time to the CC kids who are stuck sitting on buses. Otherwise you are saying the kids who go to the CC don't deserve the same amount of instruction as everyone else.

As for the previous discussion about building up at an existing school one of the issues with doing that or with making the career center choice is with available slots for extra curriculars. When each school is 3000 - 4000 or more students that is alot of competition for a limited amount of slots in a band, or on a sports team or choir or school. Every student in APS high schools will be negatively impacted by fewer chances to do extra-curriculars. This was one of WL's big objections to expanding at the Education Center building or whatever its called. A 4th school balances opportunities among an enormous student population.

And as far as demographics - that last redistricting moved people from WL to Wakefield who were located along the east pike, in a historically black neighborhood, and were more diverse and of a lower socio-economic grouping. So if we are going to demand that the CC and Wakefield play nice and try to equally balance diversity amongst themselves, then WL, the school that just got whiter and richer, needs to participate in that too instead of name calling the one neighborhood not going all NIMBY at the thought of a new school. I don't even know what you do about Yorktown's diversity? Move IB there?

It is not possible to balance Yorktown or W-L without some crazy boundaries, especially after the CC HS opens and a lot of South Arlington except for the SW gets pulled out of Wakefield. Wakefield then will have to be filled with SW, which currently goes to W-L and provides a good chunk of their diversity. At the very least, the CC boundary cannot take all of SE Arlington. Nauck has to stay at Wakefield to keep a contiguous boundary so that Crystal City and Pentagon City remain zoned Wakefield. That would allow balance between the two South Arlington HS.

[Anonymous]

There needs to be balance among all High Schooks because we are one county.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There needs to be balance among all High Schooks because we are one county.

Then start building some CAFs N of Lee Hwy and stop building them in SW Arlington.

But anyway, your answer seems to be that you can't do that, so instead we should just leave Wakefield behind? Sounds like a familiar argument. Green shirts are the new Orange Shirts.

Show me a map that does what you want or see yourself out of this conversation.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I think a lot of parents, including myself, would be pushing harder for the CC site and solutions to the athletics concern if we had confidence that the farms rate at Wakefield would not shoot up even higher than it did in the last boundary change. Recall that the planning units along the western Pike area were added to Wakefield at the last minute. I, and many others, feel that the same type of switcharoo would happen here. And, wealthy areas at Arlington Ridge and Aurora Highlands would fight hard to exit the Wakefield zone.

Personally, I would support a high school at the Kenmore site over CC. I drive Carlin Springs everyday (because I live here) and totally understand the traffic mess - but that needs to be fixed and a new school would force the two counties to fix it. A site at Kenmore has the space and can draw easily from North Arlington to balance the demographics. I know that is somehow off the table, but that doesn't change my mind about it.

The Arlington Heights neighborhood - and any others lobbying for a 4th HS at the Cc site should commit to a plan that equalizes the farms rate between that school and Wakefield. True colors would be on display.

Yes! This. If you look at the proposed map, the walk zones and the areas that aren't grayed out suggest a balanced student body in terms of income and ethnicity, at around 20-30%, if I'm getting the numbers right when looking at the density map at the same time. Wakefield will still have Pentagon/Crystal City and Shirlington to keep it from being too lower income, but I don't think the numbers work out better for them.

I actually think they could, it really depends. TJ is not fairing well after the last boundary redraw with free lunch nearly the same as Kenmore (high!). So I think that both Wakefield, and the new CC high school have reasons to want to balance diversity between them, and perhaps it would be possible to draw it down to 33% for both. Wouldn't that be ideal and preferable to the status quo?

But why not equalize the FRL numbers across all schools?? Why is it just south of 50?

Because it's politically impossible and the schools already exist. My equalize argument was about heading off perceived or real attempts by Arlington heights to capture a "better" high school for itself that everyone else pays for.

Like everyone else does not pay for others insisting upon keeping their "better" schools?!?!?!

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This whole amenities thing - I think the school should have what is reasonable, but I think the academics should come first.

This location will be equidistant between W-L and Wakefield, which both have pools, or even use a neighborhood.

Says the person of no risk of being zoned to the lesser than school. Oh, and what neighborhood pool are the kids supposed to use? The fancy north arlington ones built to keep black kids out?

Ehhm, there is no neighborhood pool there.
And the "equiDISTANT" pools will already be used by the 2500 kids at EACH site!!

There are several pools, they just aren't owned by APS. They are owned by apartment buildings. It could be possible to rent one for the school as an alternative. It'd be cheaper, though not ideal.

1. How many apartment buildings around there have indoor pools?
2. Even if that were so, they are likely not of comparable facilities as in the three high schools.

[Anonymous]

All of this just tells me everything should be on the table. Every school needs to share the burden in taking in the future swell of students. We could just double the facilities and extracurriculars, multiple bands and teams for each sport. Why can't Wakefield have 2 pools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All of this just tells me everything should be on the table. Every school needs to share the burden in taking in the future swell of students. We could just double the facilities and extracurriculars, multiple bands and teams for each sport. Why can't Wakefield have 2 pools?

Have you ever been to Arlington County? Ever visited one of its high school? Double facilities? That’s cute.

[Anonymous]

I just dont get the obsession with swimming pools. Grounds for a track or flat outdoor space? Yes, absolutely. But many many great high schools across the US do not have swimming pools. I can't shake the feeling that people are advocating for these not because they care about student needs, but rather because they just want another local pool to swim at.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just dont get the obsession with swimming pools. Grounds for a track or flat outdoor space? Yes, absolutely. But many many great high schools across the US do not have swimming pools. I can't shake the feeling that people are advocating for these not because they care about student needs, but rather because they just want another local pool to swim at.

The issue is that Arlington curriculum requires swimming instruction. So, if a pool is not on-site it becomes difficult to offer that since it takes more than one class period to get a bunch of kids over to another pool location, change, have class, change, come back.

I do wonder how HB is handling that? Or do they just have some waiver to not provide swimming instruction?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just dont get the obsession with swimming pools. Grounds for a track or flat outdoor space? Yes, absolutely. But many many great high schools across the US do not have swimming pools. I can't shake the feeling that people are advocating for these not because they care about student needs, but rather because they just want another local pool to swim at.

The issue is that Arlington curriculum requires swimming instruction. So, if a pool is not on-site it becomes difficult to offer that since it takes more than one class period to get a bunch of kids over to another pool location, change, have class, change, come back.

I do wonder how HB is handling that? Or do they just have some waiver to not provide swimming instruction?

Swim classes are required in high school or do they simply have to pass a swim test? Seems kinda late to be addressing it in HS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just dont get the obsession with swimming pools. Grounds for a track or flat outdoor space? Yes, absolutely. But many many great high schools across the US do not have swimming pools. I can't shake the feeling that people are advocating for these not because they care about student needs, but rather because they just want another local pool to swim at.

You are wrong. Swimming *saves lives*. It is the only sport that is also a survival skill.
If anything there should be more swimming, more instruction in swimming, and more water safety, lifeguard classes etc.
Arlington has made a commitment to teaching this valuable skill to every kid, and that is commendable.
We need to keep supporting that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just dont get the obsession with swimming pools. Grounds for a track or flat outdoor space? Yes, absolutely. But many many great high schools across the US do not have swimming pools. I can't shake the feeling that people are advocating for these not because they care about student needs, but rather because they just want another local pool to swim at.

You are wrong. Swimming *saves lives*. It is the only sport that is also a survival skill.
If anything there should be more swimming, more instruction in swimming, and more water safety, lifeguard classes etc.
Arlington has made a commitment to teaching this valuable skill to every kid, and that is commendable.
We need to keep supporting that.

I agree 100% with the swimming curriculum. I think it's extremely important and value APS commitment to it. Also wanted to point out, for those saying high school is too late, that the swimming curriculum starts in elementary school when they evaluate the kids in (I think) 3rd grade and start teaching the ones who don't know how to swim. We have moved in and out of the area so can't remember what other grades/ages they do it but it's a tremendous resource to be able to include the swim unit again in high school PE when they have the access to the pool.

Also Arlington is not like Fairfax which houses public pools in rec centers - in Arlington public pools are almost exclusively in the high schools (plus one at Upton Hill) so they are a community resource for fitness and recreation. If there aren't enough high schools to meet the demand then there also aren't enough pools to meet the demand. Anyone who has ever wanted to sign kids up for swim lessons or wanted to swim laps knows what I'm talking about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just dont get the obsession with swimming pools. Grounds for a track or flat outdoor space? Yes, absolutely. But many many great high schools across the US do not have swimming pools. I can't shake the feeling that people are advocating for these not because they care about student needs, but rather because they just want another local pool to swim at.

You are wrong. Swimming *saves lives*. It is the only sport that is also a survival skill.
If anything there should be more swimming, more instruction in swimming, and more water safety, lifeguard classes etc.
Arlington has made a commitment to teaching this valuable skill to every kid, and that is commendable.
We need to keep supporting that.

I agree 100% with the swimming curriculum. I think it's extremely important and value APS commitment to it. Also wanted to point out, for those saying high school is too late, that the swimming curriculum starts in elementary school when they evaluate the kids in (I think) 3rd grade and start teaching the ones who don't know how to swim. We have moved in and out of the area so can't remember what other grades/ages they do it but it's a tremendous resource to be able to include the swim unit again in high school PE when they have the access to the pool.

Also Arlington is not like Fairfax which houses public pools in rec centers - in Arlington public pools are almost exclusively in the high schools (plus one at Upton Hill) so they are a community resource for fitness and recreation. If there aren't enough high schools to meet the demand then there also aren't enough pools to meet the demand. Anyone who has ever wanted to sign kids up for swim lessons or wanted to swim laps knows what I'm talking about.

So are they going to stop Long Bridge then? Where will the $$ come from?

[Anonymous]

Are we really getting this bogged down over a swimming pool? Really? Since when is that integral to a high school education? The other 3 high schools all have beautiful, relatively new pools. And the County is about to spend anywhere from $65-70 million on Long Bridge Park. In an era where every dollar spent needs to be weighed against future needs and property tax hikes, not sure we should be fighting for a pool.

I'm far more concerned with balancing the economic diversity at any new CC high school with Wakefield and to some extent, W-L. (Yorktown is a lost cause.) Let's worry about that, and providing a good curriculum that'll challenge students.