South Arlington and North Arlington Schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't the issue boil down to the fact that Arlington schools are out of room and we keep hearing over and over again that there is no land left to build on? So why would you increase housing density anywhere in Arlington (north or south) until you have figured out how you are going to ensure enough school seats for the new families? I don't oppose AH, but I do think the Board is putting the cart before the horse if they pass that plan before figuring out what they are going to do about the school situation.

I agree with you, but I think that it comes down to how you want to allocate scarce resources. If you don't have school age kids, school issues just aren't at the forefront.

I serve on my little neighborhood association's board in north Arlington, and what I have heard from some older neighbors is that they favor affordable housing generally because they don't like how the character of Arlington has been changing. In their view, it used to be a more collegial, accessible, middle class place, and now it's becoming snobby and out of touch. They like their neighborhoods and they're sick of the ostentatious new builds. They would rather see zoning rules relaxed to permit multifamily dwellings than a neighborhood full of mc mansions. I can't even tell you how much I have heard about this. Even when they're talking to me (I live in a small old house we bought for less than 800k, but I'm fairly new to the neighborhood), there's this undercurrent of animosity against new residents, and an assumption that we're all living in $1.6 million new homes. They're older, they don't have kids in school, and they bought a long time ago, so they don't really mind if property values deflate a bit; they're still sitting pretty. There's also a sense that a ton of money has been spent on gold plated schools to serve the small slice of affluent young families who don't need it. They feel that school populations have peaked, and so it's stupid to keep building- they lived here in the 80's and early 00's when Arlington was closing schools. Anyway, to them, affordable housing is a worthy expenditure, and all these rich new people can either afford higher taxes or private schools on the off chance school overcrowding gets out of control.

Obviously this attitude is troubling to me, but those are the views I have heard expressed. For a lot of long time residents who have the time and inclination to get involved in Arlington planning and politics, schools are just not the number one priority.

This is really interesting to me, and I'm glad you posted this, because these are the EXACT same sentiments and phrases from elderly neighbors at my South Arlington neighborhood association! My neighborhood has a lot of elderly homeowners that would rather keep it quaint and low key.
Not realistic of course! Our well regarded neighborhood school has ever increasing enrollment- breaking a record now every year, since we've lived here.

Interesting- kind of makes you think that the real divide is not so much north vs. south, but generational. I live in north Arlington- not in country club hills or one of the traditionally affluent neighborhoods up there, but in one of the many neighborhoods formerly populated by modest colonials with smaller lot sizes.

To other PPs, I agree that it's hard not to have a visceral reaction to long time residents who complain that Arlington is now TOO nice, especially if (like me), you bought fairly recently. I'm not defending it, but I think it's worth looking at things from their perspective- they bought when Arlington wasn't nearly as ritzy, and quite a few of them put a lot of legwork to develop the community centers and parks that we all enjoy. So, for example, when the county was closing schools a few years back, it was residents who advocated for repurposing the land into senior centers or whatever. There's a lot of pride in a long tradition of civic engagement in Arlington. Hell, some of the really old timers in my neighborhood were actively involved in Arlington's efforts re limiting 66 to 2 lanes back in the 1970's. I think there's a sense that now that they worked hard to make Arlington into a desirable community, they are being pushed out. Sure, they are sitting on a more valuable property, but they don't want to leave, and that's why rhetoric like "just sell your house for a gazillion dollars" doesn't help. It's nice, but people in their 60's see themselves staying in their homes for many more years yet. And I think that the divide is exacerbated because a lot of new residents aren't around as much, and don't really have the time to get involved.

But whether you agree with them or not, I can't emphasize this enough- these are the people who are participating in the political and planning process. I had the opportunity to talk to someone from some county office about a neighborhood board thing, and he basically said that they have a ton of meetings, and the same 10 guys in their 50's from north Arlington show up at every single one. Virtually no one else. I think a lot of us with kids sometimes look at the school issues in a vacuum, and really focus on the school board and county board meetings where the big ticket items are discussed. But there are SO MANY meetings and planning sessions that take place every month, and so many competing priorities- ESPECIALLY re land use- and unfortunately people in the young families with kids category are just not particularly well represented. Understandably so- if you have a job and kids, evening meetings are a giant pain. But if you really want to make a difference with this stuff, I would suggest getting involved with your neighborhood association, vs a PTA or school based organization. Or even just talking to your neighbors. I have found that a lot of newer neighbors just aren't attuned to what is going on, and a lot of older neighbors just appreciate talking to someone who cares.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't the issue boil down to the fact that Arlington schools are out of room and we keep hearing over and over again that there is no land left to build on? So why would you increase housing density anywhere in Arlington (north or south) until you have figured out how you are going to ensure enough school seats for the new families? I don't oppose AH, but I do think the Board is putting the cart before the horse if they pass that plan before figuring out what they are going to do about the school situation.

I agree with you, but I think that it comes down to how you want to allocate scarce resources. If you don't have school age kids, school issues just aren't at the forefront.

I serve on my little neighborhood association's board in north Arlington, and what I have heard from some older neighbors is that they favor affordable housing generally because they don't like how the character of Arlington has been changing. In their view, it used to be a more collegial, accessible, middle class place, and now it's becoming snobby and out of touch. They like their neighborhoods and they're sick of the ostentatious new builds. They would rather see zoning rules relaxed to permit multifamily dwellings than a neighborhood full of mc mansions. I can't even tell you how much I have heard about this. Even when they're talking to me (I live in a small old house we bought for less than 800k, but I'm fairly new to the neighborhood), there's this undercurrent of animosity against new residents, and an assumption that we're all living in $1.6 million new homes. They're older, they don't have kids in school, and they bought a long time ago, so they don't really mind if property values deflate a bit; they're still sitting pretty. There's also a sense that a ton of money has been spent on gold plated schools to serve the small slice of affluent young families who don't need it. They feel that school populations have peaked, and so it's stupid to keep building- they lived here in the 80's and early 00's when Arlington was closing schools. Anyway, to them, affordable housing is a worthy expenditure, and all these rich new people can either afford higher taxes or private schools on the off chance school overcrowding gets out of control.

Obviously this attitude is troubling to me, but those are the views I have heard expressed. For a lot of long time residents who have the time and inclination to get involved in Arlington planning and politics, schools are just not the number one priority.

I've also heard concerns from older residents about affordability of Arlington for their own kids. They want their kids to be able to live here. Unfortunately, AH policies don't actually help their middle class kids. We have a few friends who grew up in our Ashton Heights neighborhood and now are raising their families here, but they are all in their 40s and benefitted by buying property before the prices took off.

I've heard this too. Maybe their precious millenial offspring should consider SOUTH ARLINGTON!!!! Oh, that's right... The schools aren't great. Maybe we should fix that!

Maybe their lazy ass kids should have worked harder. I grew up in Woodbridge. My husband and I studied hard, worked hard and bought a $1.4 million home in N. Arlington. I'm supposed to feel bad because some guy in Ashton Heights has his kids living in his basement because they can't afford to buy a home in Clarendon? Give me a fucking break.

The East Village used to be full of starving artists---try to buy there now. Neighborhoods change. They should be glad it's going thus direction and not into a ghetto (though they are trying to turn it that way with all of this affordable housing bullshit).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't the issue boil down to the fact that Arlington schools are out of room and we keep hearing over and over again that there is no land left to build on? So why would you increase housing density anywhere in Arlington (north or south) until you have figured out how you are going to ensure enough school seats for the new families? I don't oppose AH, but I do think the Board is putting the cart before the horse if they pass that plan before figuring out what they are going to do about the school situation.

I agree with you, but I think that it comes down to how you want to allocate scarce resources. If you don't have school age kids, school issues just aren't at the forefront.

I serve on my little neighborhood association's board in north Arlington, and what I have heard from some older neighbors is that they favor affordable housing generally because they don't like how the character of Arlington has been changing. In their view, it used to be a more collegial, accessible, middle class place, and now it's becoming snobby and out of touch. They like their neighborhoods and they're sick of the ostentatious new builds. They would rather see zoning rules relaxed to permit multifamily dwellings than a neighborhood full of mc mansions. I can't even tell you how much I have heard about this. Even when they're talking to me (I live in a small old house we bought for less than 800k, but I'm fairly new to the neighborhood), there's this undercurrent of animosity against new residents, and an assumption that we're all living in $1.6 million new homes. They're older, they don't have kids in school, and they bought a long time ago, so they don't really mind if property values deflate a bit; they're still sitting pretty. There's also a sense that a ton of money has been spent on gold plated schools to serve the small slice of affluent young families who don't need it. They feel that school populations have peaked, and so it's stupid to keep building- they lived here in the 80's and early 00's when Arlington was closing schools. Anyway, to them, affordable housing is a worthy expenditure, and all these rich new people can either afford higher taxes or private schools on the off chance school overcrowding gets out of control.

Obviously this attitude is troubling to me, but those are the views I have heard expressed. For a lot of long time residents who have the time and inclination to get involved in Arlington planning and politics, schools are just not the number one priority.

I've also heard concerns from older residents about affordability of Arlington for their own kids. They want their kids to be able to live here. Unfortunately, AH policies don't actually help their middle class kids. We have a few friends who grew up in our Ashton Heights neighborhood and now are raising their families here, but they are all in their 40s and benefitted by buying property before the prices took off.

I've heard this too. Maybe their precious millenial offspring should consider SOUTH ARLINGTON!!!! Oh, that's right... The schools aren't great. Maybe we should fix that!

Maybe their lazy ass kids should have worked harder. I grew up in Woodbridge. My husband and I studied hard, worked hard and bought a $1.4 million home in N. Arlington. I'm supposed to feel bad because some guy in Ashton Heights has his kids living in his basement because they can't afford to buy a home in Clarendon? Give me a fucking break.

The East Village used to be full of starving artists---try to buy there now. Neighborhoods change. They should be glad it's going thus direction and not into a ghetto (though they are trying to turn it that way with all of this affordable housing bullshit).

Wow...the mean streets of Woodbridge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't the issue boil down to the fact that Arlington schools are out of room and we keep hearing over and over again that there is no land left to build on? So why would you increase housing density anywhere in Arlington (north or south) until you have figured out how you are going to ensure enough school seats for the new families? I don't oppose AH, but I do think the Board is putting the cart before the horse if they pass that plan before figuring out what they are going to do about the school situation.

I agree with you, but I think that it comes down to how you want to allocate scarce resources. If you don't have school age kids, school issues just aren't at the forefront.

I serve on my little neighborhood association's board in north Arlington, and what I have heard from some older neighbors is that they favor affordable housing generally because they don't like how the character of Arlington has been changing. In their view, it used to be a more collegial, accessible, middle class place, and now it's becoming snobby and out of touch. They like their neighborhoods and they're sick of the ostentatious new builds. They would rather see zoning rules relaxed to permit multifamily dwellings than a neighborhood full of mc mansions. I can't even tell you how much I have heard about this. Even when they're talking to me (I live in a small old house we bought for less than 800k, but I'm fairly new to the neighborhood), there's this undercurrent of animosity against new residents, and an assumption that we're all living in $1.6 million new homes. They're older, they don't have kids in school, and they bought a long time ago, so they don't really mind if property values deflate a bit; they're still sitting pretty. There's also a sense that a ton of money has been spent on gold plated schools to serve the small slice of affluent young families who don't need it. They feel that school populations have peaked, and so it's stupid to keep building- they lived here in the 80's and early 00's when Arlington was closing schools. Anyway, to them, affordable housing is a worthy expenditure, and all these rich new people can either afford higher taxes or private schools on the off chance school overcrowding gets out of control.

Obviously this attitude is troubling to me, but those are the views I have heard expressed. For a lot of long time residents who have the time and inclination to get involved in Arlington planning and politics, schools are just not the number one priority.

This is really interesting to me, and I'm glad you posted this, because these are the EXACT same sentiments and phrases from elderly neighbors at my South Arlington neighborhood association! My neighborhood has a lot of elderly homeowners that would rather keep it quaint and low key.
Not realistic of course! Our well regarded neighborhood school has ever increasing enrollment- breaking a record now every year, since we've lived here.

And then they will gleeful sell their unrenovated 1000 sq ft south Arlington cottage, with a cracked foundation and water damage for 650k. This thread is making me want to throw stuff.

It is weird because those of us who have traveled widely and lived elsewhere but are here now (temporarily, thank goodness) have a hard time understanding what is so special about Arlington. Avoiding bad commutes? A few nice-ish parks that some old WASPs had the foresight to set up decades ago? It must be something, because everyone I meet elsewhere in nova wants in.

[Anonymous]

I live in S. Arlington and originally avoided CARD because I think I misunderstood what the County was trying to do and some of CARD's language made me feel uncomfortable. Totally regret it, and am voting for McMenamin and Dorsey.....

[Anonymous]

It is weird because those of us who have traveled widely and lived elsewhere but are here now (temporarily, thank goodness) have a hard time understanding what is so special about Arlington. Avoiding bad commutes? A few nice-ish parks that some old WASPs had the foresight to set up decades ago? It must be something, because everyone I meet elsewhere in nova wants in.

You could say that about DC in general. Not the most exciting city on earth but more expensive than many great European cities--Berlin and Amsterdam come to mind. I grew up overseas and find Arlington a comfortable and easy place to raise kids and commute to work. A good representation of an old American suburb, which for me, is preferable to the planned community look of so many newer communities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I live in S. Arlington and originally avoided CARD because I think I misunderstood what the County was trying to do and some of CARD's language made me feel uncomfortable. Totally regret it, and am voting for McMenamin and Dorsey.....

I saw that letter and its language caught me too, but I'm glad I did. Definitely going to vote in November!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live in S. Arlington and originally avoided CARD because I think I misunderstood what the County was trying to do and some of CARD's language made me feel uncomfortable. Totally regret it, and am voting for McMenamin and Dorsey.....

I saw that letter and its language caught me too, but I'm glad I did. Definitely going to vote in November!

+100
Spread the word.

I find my neighbors (love 'em) don't really pay attention to Board elections. However, have a few drinks and enlighten them and they are gung-ho and will go vote.

Encourage friends and neighbors to show up for this Election!!

[Anonymous]

Yes. Arlington is being driven now by long time residents in their 60/70ss who are unabashedly liberal and have nothing better to do but attend the endless stream meetings. Even if you do attend those meeting (and believe me, I have) the message sent by the old timers and the staff is that if you haven't been involved in the XX sector plan and the XX transportation plan that were drafted 10 years ago, your views on the XX housing plan or the XX school plan count for less. The Arlington Way is broken. There is virtually no way for busy residents aged 25-55 to work for a living and participate in all their "process,' which is not process, but just a way for staff to pretend to listen to residents and then do whatever they and the liberal idealist old timers (and the developers, don't forget them!) want. We need a new model for governing--and I don't mean the ridiculous "twitter town halls' that are just more propaganda from the County PR folks. Another vote for McMenamin and Dorsey. At least Dorsey has kids in this county and can relate. Katie Cristol. Ha.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes. Arlington is being driven now by long time residents in their 60/70ss who are unabashedly liberal and have nothing better to do but attend the endless stream meetings. Even if you do attend those meeting (and believe me, I have) the message sent by the old timers and the staff is that if you haven't been involved in the XX sector plan and the XX transportation plan that were drafted 10 years ago, your views on the XX housing plan or the XX school plan count for less. The Arlington Way is broken. There is virtually no way for busy residents aged 25-55 to work for a living and participate in all their "process,' which is not process, but just a way for staff to pretend to listen to residents and then do whatever they and the liberal idealist old timers (and the developers, don't forget them!) want. We need a new model for governing--and I don't mean the ridiculous "twitter town halls' that are just more propaganda from the County PR folks. Another vote for McMenamin and Dorsey. At least Dorsey has kids in this county and can relate. Katie Cristol. Ha.

I'm glad younger people are participating in some way. As a Millenial, I want my voice heard too. But we all work and don't have time to run for office. Whether you agree with Cristol or not, at least she is getting out there. The County Board needs to be much more balanced. Sometimes it seems as if there should be districts or seats apportioned along north and south, but that would acknowledge the divide that exists, and I don't know that it would help to do that. More of the South needs to vote!!!

[Anonymous]

Dorsey has kids in the schools? Good - he won't be inclined to ignore this stuff,

He's got my vote!!!

McMeniman always had it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes. Arlington is being driven now by long time residents in their 60/70ss who are unabashedly liberal and have nothing better to do but attend the endless stream meetings. Even if you do attend those meeting (and believe me, I have) the message sent by the old timers and the staff is that if you haven't been involved in the XX sector plan and the XX transportation plan that were drafted 10 years ago, your views on the XX housing plan or the XX school plan count for less. The Arlington Way is broken. There is virtually no way for busy residents aged 25-55 to work for a living and participate in all their "process,' which is not process, but just a way for staff to pretend to listen to residents and then do whatever they and the liberal idealist old timers (and the developers, don't forget them!) want. We need a new model for governing--and I don't mean the ridiculous "twitter town halls' that are just more propaganda from the County PR folks. Another vote for McMenamin and Dorsey. At least Dorsey has kids in this county and can relate. Katie Cristol. Ha.

I'm glad younger people are participating in some way. As a Millenial, I want my voice heard too. But we all work and don't have time to run for office. Whether you agree with Cristol or not, at least she is getting out there. The County Board needs to be much more balanced. Sometimes it seems as if there should be districts or seats apportioned along north and south, but that would acknowledge the divide that exists, and I don't know that it would help to do that. More of the South needs to vote!!!

I think it's great to have a younger person run, but I don't think Cristol is the right choice. She just doesn't get it yet. Maybe in a couple of years.

[Anonymous]

Yes. He has kids in elementary school. So he gets it. Katie Cristol is just Mary Hyne's protege. It's nice that 's she's under 60, but she does not understand the school situation in Arlington.Talk about out of touch. She's an educational consultant and Randolph school volunteer who claims the school is doing well. Has she even looked at their scores Spend a day in the at Randolph and then go to, say, Glebe or Long Branch or McKinley for a day. NOT the same. And look at SOLs. Oh--and please call me in 5 years and let me know if Katie Cristol is sending her kids to Randolph. Ha.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't the issue boil down to the fact that Arlington schools are out of room and we keep hearing over and over again that there is no land left to build on? So why would you increase housing density anywhere in Arlington (north or south) until you have figured out how you are going to ensure enough school seats for the new families? I don't oppose AH, but I do think the Board is putting the cart before the horse if they pass that plan before figuring out what they are going to do about the school situation.

I agree with you, but I think that it comes down to how you want to allocate scarce resources. If you don't have school age kids, school issues just aren't at the forefront.

I serve on my little neighborhood association's board in north Arlington, and what I have heard from some older neighbors is that they favor affordable housing generally because they don't like how the character of Arlington has been changing. In their view, it used to be a more collegial, accessible, middle class place, and now it's becoming snobby and out of touch. They like their neighborhoods and they're sick of the ostentatious new builds. They would rather see zoning rules relaxed to permit multifamily dwellings than a neighborhood full of mc mansions. I can't even tell you how much I have heard about this. Even when they're talking to me (I live in a small old house we bought for less than 800k, but I'm fairly new to the neighborhood), there's this undercurrent of animosity against new residents, and an assumption that we're all living in $1.6 million new homes. They're older, they don't have kids in school, and they bought a long time ago, so they don't really mind if property values deflate a bit; they're still sitting pretty. There's also a sense that a ton of money has been spent on gold plated schools to serve the small slice of affluent young families who don't need it. They feel that school populations have peaked, and so it's stupid to keep building- they lived here in the 80's and early 00's when Arlington was closing schools. Anyway, to them, affordable housing is a worthy expenditure, and all these rich new people can either afford higher taxes or private schools on the off chance school overcrowding gets out of control.

Obviously this attitude is troubling to me, but those are the views I have heard expressed. For a lot of long time residents who have the time and inclination to get involved in Arlington planning and politics, schools are just not the number one priority.

This is really interesting to me, and I'm glad you posted this, because these are the EXACT same sentiments and phrases from elderly neighbors at my South Arlington neighborhood association! My neighborhood has a lot of elderly homeowners that would rather keep it quaint and low key.
Not realistic of course! Our well regarded neighborhood school has ever increasing enrollment- breaking a record now every year, since we've lived here.

And then they will gleeful sell their unrenovated 1000 sq ft south Arlington cottage, with a cracked foundation and water damage for 650k. This thread is making me want to throw stuff.

It is weird because those of us who have traveled widely and lived elsewhere but are here now (temporarily, thank goodness) have a hard time understanding what is so special about Arlington. Avoiding bad commutes? A few nice-ish parks that some old WASPs had the foresight to set up decades ago? It must be something, because everyone I meet elsewhere in nova wants in.

People will say parks and walkability, but in the end - it's truly about commute. DC haS the worst traffic in the nation. We are closest to the district without having to live there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes. He has kids in elementary school. So he gets it. Katie Cristol is just Mary Hyne's protege. It's nice that 's she's under 60, but she does not understand the school situation in Arlington.Talk about out of touch. She's an educational consultant and Randolph school volunteer who claims the school is doing well. Has she even looked at their scores Spend a day in the at Randolph and then go to, say, Glebe or Long Branch or McKinley for a day. NOT the same. And look at SOLs. Oh--and please call me in 5 years and let me know if Katie Cristol is sending her kids to Randolph. Ha.

Wow. Head. In. The. Sand. To spend time in these schools and still not be willing to have an honest conversation about it?



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