Anyone following this Candice Miller/Mama & Tata nightmare?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

You don’t get any life insurance if it’s suicide.

Again, that's not true. It's a matter of state law, which dictates the terms of life insurance contracts issued in the state. New York is two years. So, if the policy has been in effect more than 2 years, she collects.

I'm sure the insurance company will litigate this. He died with $15-50 million in debt and referenced his $15 million in life insurance policies in the note...

[Anonymous]

I didn’t know who this person was until reading this thread. Wow… what a mess. This story gives off Ruth Madoff vibes. I guess it’s possible that she didn’t know of their dire financial straits, but tbh it beggars belief that she had no clue. I feel sorry for their girls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It would be weird imo if life insurance DIDNT cover suicide. It’s for the survivors, not the deceased.

But then it would incentivize people to kill themselves for the payout. They used to let people take out an insurance policy on any one. And that led to people's murders and they changed that. Bad public policy

Well, if you accept that mental illness is real illness, you have to cover deaths resulting from an illness. That’s the rationale for suicide coverage after 2 year exclusion.

An actuary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He's a coward of the worse kind. Suicide doesn't hurt the person dead it punishes the living. His young daughters will spend the rest of their lives mentally wounded. His wife will spend years trying to did out of this mess and will have to witness the mental anguish of her children. Life will be dark and unhappy for quite some time. As a man he should have owned up to his mistakes. Taken whatever punishment was coming his way and.......started over. That's the beauty of living in this country- you can reinvent yourself as many times as you want. He destroyed his entire family and his death solved nothing. He's a coward.

His death will actually help his daughters. He would have ruined their life. He was a bad person. Now they have a chance to become decent human beings without his toxicity.
He did what was needed. He is not coward.

Nope. He did probably have demons and there’s a history of mental health issues on his side of the family, but her family is awful. Completely vapid social climbers bordering on narcissists. Candace, her mom, sister, aunt, etc are all social climbers and use friends, kids, etc as props to get ahead. Those girls don’t stand a chance stuck with just her family now.

Do you know them? Please dish! Dying to know what Candice was like when she was younger.

Our circles overlapped when I lived in ny but I didn’t personally know her. We live in dc now

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I can't remember where i read it, but when this store broke,there was a someone who was quoted as saying that, relationships in these circles are very transactional.And it really hit on what i've long observed about the dynamics of relationships amongst this type of crowd.

Poverty is humiliating,isolating and detrimental to one's overall health.But,as a poor person, if you're lucky enough to have someone who cares for you then you know it's as authentic,genuine and sincere as it gets. The fact that this Brandon Miller guy didn't or thought he couldn't talk about the true state of their finances with his so-called wife is just so.....damning and revelatory of the kind of superficial relationships these people entertain.

I don’t think that’s it at all. When you’re in finance in ny, there are wild swings all the time. Look at some of the most successful real estate funds, and most have had moments when they’ve been underwater. Many of the successful managers are former athletes, across the board they’re either very cocky or on the spectrum. They always think there’s the next big thing and they usually have to double down to get there. I’ve seen some wild rides. Obviously they don’t usually end like this, but if every manager gave up when he was down, a lot of funds would fold. This one is more complicated w/ being the second generation, but look how he went after a bigger project when he was in debt. That’s what they do. It just generally doesn’t carry over into extremes in personal spending.
Nothing about their lifestyle was equal to the size of their fund, even if it had been successful. She was spending as if he were a manager at tiger or citadel, not some run of the mill 2nd tier RE fund.

Couple of things

-why didn't or couldn't he tell the wife their lifestyle wasn't sustainable in the short,medium or long term?

- The description of the NY real estate industry doesn't apply to him—he was never even a medium player, not even close.He was at the very bottom of the pole as far as NY real estate is concerned.

- Nothing has described this guy as being in finance. It's been said over and over again that he was in real estate .

Well he was in RE finance in that he was playing the game of trying to buy and sell things w/o actually developing. Look at what he developed and it was minuscule. Look at what was developed post his dads death, and the fund did practically nothing tangible but did do a few plays on property so that’s why I’d consider it finance not pure development.

You dont know what real estate finance is. I suggest you look up again what he was really into.Better yet, read the NYT article.

Thanks. I actually work in it. Moved from ny to dc and still work in it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think an interesting and cautionary aspect of this sad story is that they started off as a somewhat normal wealthy young couple, but with the introduction of social media into the world and their lives, the focus and trajectory of their lives seemed to shift. Their lifestyle and the need for it to be extravagant and ostentatious eclipsed everything else especially the health and happiness of their family.

Before social media:

This is the American way of life. Capitalism and the ability to accumulate wealth that is much greater than other peoples, combined with social media, create people like this.

Back when the US had a much more equal distribution of wealth, and before social media, people like this would just be your average neighborhood social climber, not an obnoxious presence lording their wealth over the commoners.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You don’t get any life insurance if it’s suicide.

Again, that's not true. It's a matter of state law, which dictates the terms of life insurance contracts issued in the state. New York is two years. So, if the policy has been in effect more than 2 years, she collects.

I'm sure the insurance company will litigate this. He died with $15-50 million in debt and referenced his $15 million in life insurance policies in the note...

They won’t. There is no fraud here—he’s actually dead. It’s been two years plus since he bought the policy. He surely didn’t buy with the intent to off himself.

It’s frightening how many of you are nattering about no insurance for suicide—none of you have life insurance or you can’t read the policies?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You don’t get any life insurance if it’s suicide.

Again, that's not true. It's a matter of state law, which dictates the terms of life insurance contracts issued in the state. New York is two years. So, if the policy has been in effect more than 2 years, she collects.

I'm sure the insurance company will litigate this. He died with $15-50 million in debt and referenced his $15 million in life insurance policies in the note...

Eh. Anyone who actually goes through with unaliving themselves is clearly mentally ill. That's not fraud.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

You don’t get any life insurance if it’s suicide.

Again, that's not true. It's a matter of state law, which dictates the terms of life insurance contracts issued in the state. New York is two years. So, if the policy has been in effect more than 2 years, she collects.

I'm sure the insurance company will litigate this. He died with $15-50 million in debt and referenced his $15 million in life insurance policies in the note...

Eh. Anyone who actually goes through with unaliving themselves is clearly mentally ill. That's not fraud.

I wish he got help. So sad for the kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How she not know they were living in a complete house of cards? Wouldn’t their fancy Manhattan rental and borrowed furniture have tipped her off?

I know people in her social circle. She knew.

But WHEN did she know? Only in May 2024 when the friend told her?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How she not know they were living in a complete house of cards? Wouldn’t their fancy Manhattan rental and borrowed furniture have tipped her off?

I know people in her social circle. She knew.

But WHEN did she know? Only in May 2024 when the friend told her?

She knew when they had to sell their condo and couldn’t even afford furniture for their rental as well as when the boat was repossessed and when they started getting foreclosure notices in water mill

[Anonymous]

Could someone familiar with life insurance law chime in. If the family receives the life insurance money, won’t creditors insist the money go towards Mr. Miller’s debts?

[Anonymous]

She’s a very unattractive woman. Can’t imagine the degrees of delusion it took for her to hold herself out on social media as someone with an enviable lifestyle.

[Anonymous]

Is her Insta archived somewhere?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Could someone familiar with life insurance law chime in. If the family receives the life insurance money, won’t creditors insist the money go towards Mr. Miller’s debts?

No. Life insurance claims pass outside the estate and go directly to the beneficiary and creditors have no claim. She will get to keep. LI is meant to replace income.