Excellent podcast from Politico from youngkin strategists on how they won — must read/listen

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

Was the title the exact question asked: How good of a job are local schools doing in balancing health and safety with other priorities?

That question asks how they are doing now. It doesn't ask how they did last year. If you asked me that exact question, I too would say somewhat good. However, I am still pissed at the Dems for last year, which was not good at all.

Direct quote from the article: “Most parents are OK with how their schools handled the pandemic."

But what were the exact questions asked? Are those published somewhere?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

DP. Maybe you shouldn't be trying to understand a local election with national data. A governor is not a president or even a senator. It's a local issue. Parents in this area are pissed about how local Democratic school boards handled education during the pandemic. Terry McAuliffe didn't appear to understand that, or be bothered to figure it out. He doubled down on his sentiment that parents shouldn't have a say, after they were required to oversee their kids schooling for well over a year. That matters. The man shot himself in the foot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

DP. Maybe you shouldn't be trying to understand a local election with national data. A governor is not a president or even a senator. It's a local issue. Parents in this area are pissed about how local Democratic school boards handled education during the pandemic. Terry McAuliffe didn't appear to understand that, or be bothered to figure it out. He doubled down on his sentiment that parents shouldn't have a say, after they were required to oversee their kids schooling for well over a year. That matters. The man shot himself in the foot.

And so did a seemingly intelligent electorate who chose to vote with spite

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

DP. Maybe you shouldn't be trying to understand a local election with national data. A governor is not a president or even a senator. It's a local issue. Parents in this area are pissed about how local Democratic school boards handled education during the pandemic. Terry McAuliffe didn't appear to understand that, or be bothered to figure it out. He doubled down on his sentiment that parents shouldn't have a say, after they were required to oversee their kids schooling for well over a year. That matters. The man shot himself in the foot.

And so did a seemingly intelligent electorate who chose to vote with spite

We'll see. I'm hopeful that he'll end up being a practical leader along the lines of Gov. Hogan in MD. Maybe he will, maybe not. I'll stay hopeful until proven wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

DP. Maybe you shouldn't be trying to understand a local election with national data. A governor is not a president or even a senator. It's a local issue. Parents in this area are pissed about how local Democratic school boards handled education during the pandemic. Terry McAuliffe didn't appear to understand that, or be bothered to figure it out. He doubled down on his sentiment that parents shouldn't have a say, after they were required to oversee their kids schooling for well over a year. That matters. The man shot himself in the foot.

And so did a seemingly intelligent electorate who chose to vote with spite

We'll see. I'm hopeful that he'll end up being a practical leader along the lines of Gov. Hogan in MD. Maybe he will, maybe not. I'll stay hopeful until proven wrong.

Good luck! I’m not from VA but found the whole thing fascinating from a poli sci perspective and eventually just sad.

At least he’ll be able to say during his four years there was no CRT in k-12 schools*

*this has always been true

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's pretty easy.

Youngkin played the aw-shucks southern gentlemen while the right wing echo chamber pounded CRT and other BS through its media outlets and social media promotion.

This. A mom at soccer practice was gushing on how excited she was that Youngkin won so that he would save LCPS.

I usually ignore political talk but I couldn't help myself. I asked her if she'd researched what Youngkin had pledged to do for education. Spoiler alert: she hadn't. She had just gone by the talking hot points and was a bit crestfallen when I send her information on the scope of what the Governor can actually change re: education.

The governor has a hige role in education in Virg8nia through appointments to the Virginia dept of education.

Plus of all of the 6 candidates, Winsome Sears was the most qualified on the issue of education.

Too bad she hates women.

Or maybe she likes women enough to believe they are mature and can control their bodies rather than leaving it to the whims of nature.

How has that ever worked out in the history of mankind?

In the 21st Century women who can't control their bodies and let men impregnate them willy-nilly are stuck in the stone ages. Women who can control their bodies and conception are doing quite well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

DP. Maybe you shouldn't be trying to understand a local election with national data. A governor is not a president or even a senator. It's a local issue. Parents in this area are pissed about how local Democratic school boards handled education during the pandemic. Terry McAuliffe didn't appear to understand that, or be bothered to figure it out. He doubled down on his sentiment that parents shouldn't have a say, after they were required to oversee their kids schooling for well over a year. That matters. The man shot himself in the foot.

Also wouldn't the majority of other schools nationwide have actually been *open* far more that VA schools (43 states apparently)--so the parents would be responding to the opposite scenario in terms of closures. I seriously do not see how a national poll is relevant at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

DP. Maybe you shouldn't be trying to understand a local election with national data. A governor is not a president or even a senator. It's a local issue. Parents in this area are pissed about how local Democratic school boards handled education during the pandemic. Terry McAuliffe didn't appear to understand that, or be bothered to figure it out. He doubled down on his sentiment that parents shouldn't have a say, after they were required to oversee their kids schooling for well over a year. That matters. The man shot himself in the foot.

And so did a seemingly intelligent electorate who chose to vote with spite

We'll see. I'm hopeful that he'll end up being a practical leader along the lines of Gov. Hogan in MD. Maybe he will, maybe not. I'll stay hopeful until proven wrong.

Is Hogan a pro-life nutter propagating the big lie?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“ The fairfax county health dept approved of the hybrid plan in summer 2020. There is no excuse not to have to done it.”

Did you listen to any of the FCPS Sb meetings where Dr Gloria spoke? Her non-answers undermined going back in my view. Every time I heard her talk it made me more skeptical.

By the way - I also think this is a crystal clear example of what is wrong with the Ds & why I think their racist dog whistle thing is a bunch of baloney & why the Ds are in actuality no better. Why were we not listening to the head of the dept. of health - that is the expert. Why did the school board not trust her as an expert - because she’s a woman? Because she’s not white? I know she goes by Dr. Gloria but I think that’s because no one can pronounce her last name and I think that is unacceptable.

And another thing - anyone who says CRT is not being taught in school full stop - doesn’t know enough about history to be in charge of making history curriculum anyway!!! Everything is biased, even the news. And that is the starting point to be able to actually be able to teach history.

Because she was hired by the county for a role that had nothing to do with advising on infectious diseases in a pandemic.

She now heads the health dept. which has everything to do with advising on infectious diseases in a pandemic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some nuances I'm not seeing reflected here - as the working parent of a young child, I definitely was told that by wanting in-person school, I "just wanted free daycare"...but usually that sentiment was expressed by people of conservative political persuasions who probably thought women should be SAHMs anyway ("if you can't/don't want to take care of your own kids you shouldn't have had them!"). From teachers/teacher advocacy groups, I mostly heard a lot of "not [reopening] until it's safe", which seemed to be unclear at best and a constantly moving goalpost at worst. I was incensed by teachers who took full advantage of priority vaccination and then still refused to return to in-person teaching.

All that said...the majority of APS and FCPS parents chose remote learning in the fall of 2020 (not sure about other counties). You can split hairs and say it's because the proposed in-person offerings weren't workable (staggered starts, alternate days), but looking back 15 months ago, we didn't know what we do now, and most people erred on the side of keeping kids home.

The "OpenFCPS" crowd was an uneasy alliance of Covid deniers, parents who wanted/needed their kids out of the house, and people with serious concerns about their children's educational needs being met (or not)...while they were loud, they were never able to formulate a cogent "Plan B" that included CDC-compliant risk mitigation measures.

I can understand being mad at local school boards, at teachers, at teachers unions. Some of the stuff that was done (remote school from within school facilities, for a fee?!) was the antithesis of equity. And the fact that working parents got the rawest deal of the pandemic has been broadly documented. All fair points.

But to go from there to...voting in the party that opposes paid family and medical leave, dispenses with public health mitigation measures like masks and vaccinations, and siphons off public school money to private schools and corporate-helmed charters (while simultaneously decreasing overall incoming tax revenue) seems to me to be textbook cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. I won't go so far as to say flipping one's vote to Youngkin was racist, but I absolutely believe that the people who did so en masse (college-educated white women) acted in an effort to preserve their own privilege in shaping public schools to best serve their own interests. Just because Youngkin was smart enough to largely keep his mouth shut during the campaign doesn't mean he's not the policy equivalent of Trump et al.

So your point is, that it’s a white college-educated woman’s responsibility to shut up, pay taxes, and not expect a thing for them?

Wait...what?! That's quite a leap. If high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools are your goal, don't you think it's a bit short-sighted to think you'll get that from the party that consistently denigrates public health measures and either directly or indirectly defunds public education? Seems rather like expecting Rs to do something about gun control because Democrats moved too slowly on the issue for your taste...

given that Democrats literally closed schools for 1.5 years, you don’t have much credibility. That’s the whole problem.

I think 2 thing are worth noting: 1) what PP said. D's did not offer "high-quality, safe, continuously open public schools." So it's not like there's a home with the D's any longer for that.
2) people who are mad often vote against a thing more than for a thing. I know we all want to be rational and reasonable and stuff, but when D's didn't prioritize education , and on top of that told parents (moms, mostly) to just shut up and accept it, that made some people mad. Thus is the nature of politics.

To point 1, I said that's the goal, right? And there are logical and illogical ways to try and achieve that goal.
To point 2, you're totally right about the "voting against things" part. It's really pathetic. But how were [predominately D-led] public school administrations supposed to 'prioritize education' when teachers wouldn't return to work and many of the parents who wanted in-person school wouldn't agree to mitigation measures? What magic solution do these 'switch' voters believe was available 15 months ago?

oh yeah, somehow public schools were completely unable to open in the *exact same cities* where private and Catholic schools remained open. You need to be a little more introspective here. It was a political failure.

You really don't read, or think critically, do you? TEACHERS REFUSED TO COME BACK. FACILITIES COULDN'T BE ARRANGED TO SUPPORT DISTANCING REQUIREMENTS. THERE WAS NO VACCINE IN AUGUST 2020. Comparing private schools (with one or two facilities, potentially losing a handful of teachers) to school systems with hundreds of facilities and thousands of teachers is completely asinine.

I don't understand why you're trying to make this argument anymore. The voters have spoken - they think it's bullsh*t. You can relitigate all you want, but people believe what they believe. So I suggest that Democrats take it to heart.

This is all a DCUM echo chamber talking point. Here is some polling data to add facts to the conversation

https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-covid-schools-c758ac4f-f1de-4016-b683-babf8d4fdbaa.html

"Asked how schools in their community had done in terms of balancing health and safety with other priorities since the start of the pandemic, 71% of U.S. adults — and 75% of parents — said schools had done a good job as opposed to a poor job.

That's about the same response as when respondents were asked how good a job individuals in their communities had done (72%), slightly higher than the good rating local governments got (68%) and better than their governor (63%).
Local businesses got the highest share of "good" ratings on balancing those interests (80%)."


"What they're saying: "A lot of the energy, criticism that’s been happening, it’s not coming from a large chunk of the population," said Ipsos senior vice president Chris Jackson. "It's very much a tail-wagging-the-dog scenario.""

So please stop with the schools were closed and made parents mad and thats why dems lost rhetoric. Youngkin dogwhistled a bunch of uneducated white women (non - college women was the biggest shift) and that was that. Enjoy your four years with DeSantis in the vest

It's amusing that you are citing a NATIONAL poll. It's just generally not helpful when trying to describe local trends.

Considering Youngkin voters are citing an extreme incident as a reason for voting and ignoring a half century of anti women, anti family leave, anti abortion, anti schools, maybe you shouldn’t be educating people on trends

DP. Maybe you shouldn't be trying to understand a local election with national data. A governor is not a president or even a senator. It's a local issue. Parents in this area are pissed about how local Democratic school boards handled education during the pandemic. Terry McAuliffe didn't appear to understand that, or be bothered to figure it out. He doubled down on his sentiment that parents shouldn't have a say, after they were required to oversee their kids schooling for well over a year. That matters. The man shot himself in the foot.

Also wouldn't the majority of other schools nationwide have actually been *open* far more that VA schools (43 states apparently)--so the parents would be responding to the opposite scenario in terms of closures. I seriously do not see how a national poll is relevant at all.

Totally agree - a national poll has very little relevance here.

[Anonymous]

Plus it also includes non parents - I'm not sure how their feelings are relevant either.

[Anonymous]

Even pretending a national poll has relevance here (and I'm highly skeptical of the poll), the point remains that even if assuming most parents supported lengthy closures and were happy and fully on board with how things were and still are handled with the schools, the Democrat ones didn't support the policies enough to bother to vote for McAuliffe. This election was lost because his probable voters didn't go to the polls in sufficiently large numbers. Therefore, at some level, the lack of voter turnout had to do with disenchantment with Democrats on school issues. These aren't voters who would be willing to vote Republican, but they felt disconnected and disillusioned enough to not bother voting at all. If Biden's voters had returned to the polls, McAuliffe would have won. They didn't, and he lost.

[Anonymous]

Burbio needs to share more details about their "in-person index". Seems like they may not be comparing apples to apples.

Were they calculating based on the # of days? Hours?

According to this piece, Burbio is using a different baseline number of days/hours than VA uses. They are using 1170 hours.
https://www.the74million.org/article/one-fate-two-fates-red-states-blue-states-new-data-reveals-a-432-hour-in-person-learning-gap-produced-by-the-politics-of-pandemic-schooling/
Using Burbio’s data, The 74 calculated the average days and hours of in-person learning in each state based on a 180-day school year and a 6.5-hour school day.

Virginia's standard is 990 hours.
https://law.lis.virginia.gov/admincode/title8/agency20/chapter131/section150/
The standard school year shall be 180 instructional days or 990 instructional hours. The standard school day, including passing time for class changes and excluding breaks for meals, shall average a minimum of five and one-half instructional hours for students in grades 1 through 12 and a minimum of three hours for kindergarten

And what % of K classes in Virginia are still half-day? How did Burbio count those?


How did Burbio take this discrepancy into account when calculating their "in-person index"?