What is the reason for the veterinary back up?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I left work today and I do not want to go back. It is not just this area. It is the entire profession. We are being abused. I don't want to do it anymore. I am only 50 years old. I need a job for the next twenty years that will not kill me before I kill myself.

Are you a vet or a tech?
What do you see as the main contributor of abuse, employer or clients? What is something that you might be struggling with now? Would a change in practices help?

Can you work for a lab, food company, or FDA?

Who will end up being veterinarians? What will have to happen to fix the industry?

I am a vet. And I am tired. Underappreciated. Underpaid. Abused by clients. Being squeezed by management. I cannot do it anymore.

We are not letting clients in yet as we decide on best policies going forward. Clients are complaining left and right. I have staff quitting. Don't have enought help. Management wants me to see more appointments with less help and less time. Awesome. I got three calls today for emergencies from patients of other practices. They have a primary care doctor. But they don't have space so they want me to fit them in. I. Am. Done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's a tough profession under the best of circumstances, with high stress and high suicide rates, and now everything is just exponentially worse. All the precautions that they have to take, curbside checkin and whatnot, are all adding to their burden. Appointments take longer, so they can see fewer patients, and that whole thing just snowballs. IF any of the staff gets sick, or quits, it just sets off a chain reaction that's difficult to recover from.

As a client I really like the curbside check-ins and found the process faster. I would think it’s easier to do their job without the owner hovering. My dog also stays more relaxed waiting in the car than in the waiting room, which is better for the vet and techs too. If I could pay through the app it would be even faster.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I left work today and I do not want to go back. It is not just this area. It is the entire profession. We are being abused. I don't want to do it anymore. I am only 50 years old. I need a job for the next twenty years that will not kill me before I kill myself.

Are you a vet or a tech?
What do you see as the main contributor of abuse, employer or clients? What is something that you might be struggling with now? Would a change in practices help?

Can you work for a lab, food company, or FDA?

Who will end up being veterinarians? What will have to happen to fix the industry?

I am a vet. And I am tired. Underappreciated. Underpaid. Abused by clients. Being squeezed by management. I cannot do it anymore.

We are not letting clients in yet as we decide on best policies going forward. Clients are complaining left and right. I have staff quitting. Don't have enought help. Management wants me to see more appointments with less help and less time. Awesome. I got three calls today for emergencies from patients of other practices. They have a primary care doctor. But they don't have space so they want me to fit them in. I. Am. Done.

Do you find that most of your clientele are appreciative but the smaller subset of awful seems exponentially worse. And by management, do you mean this practice is corporate and not privately owned, or privately owned by a vet who might be unreasonable? I wonder which is better now, to keep private business, which does come with its own headaches, or work for a company. I am not even sure which is best from a client standpoint.

I straddle the time period of the neighborhood veterinary practice, owned by one person, almost always male, to now, a corporate owned entity with young women vets coming and going, but, of course now with state of the art technology, referrals to specialists, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I left work today and I do not want to go back. It is not just this area. It is the entire profession. We are being abused. I don't want to do it anymore. I am only 50 years old. I need a job for the next twenty years that will not kill me before I kill myself.

Are you a vet or a tech?
What do you see as the main contributor of abuse, employer or clients? What is something that you might be struggling with now? Would a change in practices help?

Can you work for a lab, food company, or FDA?

Who will end up being veterinarians? What will have to happen to fix the industry?

I am a vet. And I am tired. Underappreciated. Underpaid. Abused by clients. Being squeezed by management. I cannot do it anymore.

We are not letting clients in yet as we decide on best policies going forward. Clients are complaining left and right. I have staff quitting. Don't have enought help. Management wants me to see more appointments with less help and less time. Awesome. I got three calls today for emergencies from patients of other practices. They have a primary care doctor. But they don't have space so they want me to fit them in. I. Am. Done.

Just want to add, there are probably so many of your patients who will be crushed and really they have no idea all this is going on in practices. Don't know you, but I wish I could give you a hug. I wish there was a pathway of reconstruction to work on these problems. We need veterinarians.
Thanks for your hard work.

[Anonymous]

Vets and techs on here - thank you for everything you do! I have had many senior dogs over the years so I've spent A LOT of time at both my regular vet and emergency clinics. In fact, I just had to take one of my dogs to the emergency vet this past weekend and the two doctors that worked with him were SO incredibly kind and capable. It is heartbreaking to read some of your stories. I hope that I have adequately expressed my gratitude during all of my visits but I am certainly going to have that top of mind from now on. Hugs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So, another question-
Do corporate take overs help or hinder? What do they help in a practice, and what go they hurt? I can see how an individual practice could drown in expenses, and maybe the business model needs this corporate investment.

I'm comparing it to optometry, which used to all be private practices until Pearl Vision and all the subsequent others arrived on the scene and changed everything starting in the late 70s. Optical services really changed, as well.

Back to veterinary- One issue is insurance. It was a rarity to buy it, with very limited options until the past 5 or 6 years. I managed 6 dogs without. Now I would only recommend getting a pet with insurance as a requirement. People don't understand what it costs to treat pets these days. It's not unusual to have MRIs, laser treatments, physical therapy, specialized surgeries, oncology treatment, etc.

If I've forgotten up to now, thanks so much to all the veterinary staff, doctors and techs alike. Of course you are important to pets, but it's really people you are treating. Many apologies for any abuse anyone has had to endure, I feel just awful to hear about it.

Vet owner here - corporate practices hurt the profession overall (again, looking at you Banfield/MM Mars). They offer massive signing bonuses and salaries - we CANNOT compete. They see almost exclusively routine appts such as vaccines and push any illness or emergencies to other clinics - why? Because, it takes time and those appts aren't as profitable. From a business model standpoint, great model. But from a general support the profession, not so great.

Our clinic does not have an issue with pet insurance as fees are paid by the client and reimbursed directly to the client. We don't get involved. It allows clients to support their pets and get them care.
I believe people don't see human medicine bills because most everyone has human health insurance and you pay $20 for a copay. They don't understand that we use the same MRI, meds and have the same education yet charge a tenth of what human medicine does. Also, the recent uptick in client crap is a function of people not being allowed in the buildings. It is much easier to complain when you don't look people in the eye - same way people feel open to complain on the internet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
This is so sad to hear - my tween daughter is thinking about being a vet. Although she wanted to work in theriogenology for zoos, to help conservation efforts. Is zoological veterinary medicine also impacted?

Please continue to encourage her. It truly is an amazing field. Zoo med is so difficult to break into but small animal vet med is great - although stressful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, another question-
Do corporate take overs help or hinder? What do they help in a practice, and what go they hurt? I can see how an individual practice could drown in expenses, and maybe the business model needs this corporate investment.

I'm comparing it to optometry, which used to all be private practices until Pearl Vision and all the subsequent others arrived on the scene and changed everything starting in the late 70s. Optical services really changed, as well.

Back to veterinary- One issue is insurance. It was a rarity to buy it, with very limited options until the past 5 or 6 years. I managed 6 dogs without. Now I would only recommend getting a pet with insurance as a requirement. People don't understand what it costs to treat pets these days. It's not unusual to have MRIs, laser treatments, physical therapy, specialized surgeries, oncology treatment, etc.

If I've forgotten up to now, thanks so much to all the veterinary staff, doctors and techs alike. Of course you are important to pets, but it's really people you are treating. Many apologies for any abuse anyone has had to endure, I feel just awful to hear about it.

Vet owner here - corporate practices hurt the profession overall (again, looking at you Banfield/MM Mars). They offer massive signing bonuses and salaries - we CANNOT compete. They see almost exclusively routine appts such as vaccines and push any illness or emergencies to other clinics - why? Because, it takes time and those appts aren't as profitable. From a business model standpoint, great model. But from a general support the profession, not so great.

Our clinic does not have an issue with pet insurance as fees are paid by the client and reimbursed directly to the client. We don't get involved. It allows clients to support their pets and get them care.
I believe people don't see human medicine bills because most everyone has human health insurance and you pay $20 for a copay. They don't understand that we use the same MRI, meds and have the same education yet charge a tenth of what human medicine does. Also, the recent uptick in client crap is a function of people not being allowed in the buildings. It is much easier to complain when you don't look people in the eye - same way people feel open to complain on the internet.

So, like the way Pearl Vision changed the Optometric and Optician private practices, corporate is taking over hampering how vets can compete and stay in business. And that's not unlike what happened to a lot of small businesses, particularly with online shopping, although unrelated. I totally get it, and feel for you, but I am guessing this is the way veterinary services will end of going.
And I know the doctors and practices have nothing to do with insurance, but I meant that owners just need to realize they really need to get it...having a pet is expensive. They have to understand that vets need to charge what is costs.

So, what the future looks like is probably the fact that most practices will be under various corporate umbrellas, the companies will combine and partner with insurance companies and veterinarians will be contractors or employees of such. I think these are the transition years before we see the last of individual practices, and yes, it's sad, but it may be way it has to go considering the larger breadth of services and technology needed as opposed to animal care 20 years ago. Also, women are dominating the DVM population and they want more flexibility.

I think dentistry, dermatology, PT, mental health are also going through industry changes, but insurance has always covered these entities.
Thanks for all your hard work. Veterinarians really should be cherished and definitely paid more. I will be sure to express my gratitude to our practice whenever possible, which, BTW, is owned by Banfield, I think. In the end, it's the specific vet that matters to me more than who owns the practice, but our vet left practicing all together this year ( wasn't older, just left) and the one other seasoned vet is older and will eventually leave. The rest have been a steady turnover of young vets for the last decade. That is what concerns me.

[Anonymous]

There's a false assumption that veterinary care should be cheaper and more convenient than medical care because the patients aren't people. I admit that I had sticker shock when I first got a dog. But, I realize that the education level needed is an extremely high bar, the equipment, staff, patience, etc. all similar or higher level than my own doctor's office. I hope the vets on here are able to get more help and healthcare for themselves. Thanks for all that you do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There's a false assumption that veterinary care should be cheaper and more convenient than medical care because the patients aren't people. I admit that I had sticker shock when I first got a dog. But, I realize that the education level needed is an extremely high bar, the equipment, staff, patience, etc. all similar or higher level than my own doctor's office. I hope the vets on here are able to get more help and healthcare for themselves. Thanks for all that you do.

Agree!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, another question-
Do corporate take overs help or hinder? What do they help in a practice, and what go they hurt? I can see how an individual practice could drown in expenses, and maybe the business model needs this corporate investment.

I'm comparing it to optometry, which used to all be private practices until Pearl Vision and all the subsequent others arrived on the scene and changed everything starting in the late 70s. Optical services really changed, as well.

Back to veterinary- One issue is insurance. It was a rarity to buy it, with very limited options until the past 5 or 6 years. I managed 6 dogs without. Now I would only recommend getting a pet with insurance as a requirement. People don't understand what it costs to treat pets these days. It's not unusual to have MRIs, laser treatments, physical therapy, specialized surgeries, oncology treatment, etc.

If I've forgotten up to now, thanks so much to all the veterinary staff, doctors and techs alike. Of course you are important to pets, but it's really people you are treating. Many apologies for any abuse anyone has had to endure, I feel just awful to hear about it.

Vet owner here - corporate practices hurt the profession overall (again, looking at you Banfield/MM Mars). They offer massive signing bonuses and salaries - we CANNOT compete. They see almost exclusively routine appts such as vaccines and push any illness or emergencies to other clinics - why? Because, it takes time and those appts aren't as profitable. From a business model standpoint, great model. But from a general support the profession, not so great.

Our clinic does not have an issue with pet insurance as fees are paid by the client and reimbursed directly to the client. We don't get involved. It allows clients to support their pets and get them care.
I believe people don't see human medicine bills because most everyone has human health insurance and you pay $20 for a copay. They don't understand that we use the same MRI, meds and have the same education yet charge a tenth of what human medicine does. Also, the recent uptick in client crap is a function of people not being allowed in the buildings. It is much easier to complain when you don't look people in the eye - same way people feel open to complain on the internet.

So, like the way Pearl Vision changed the Optometric and Optician private practices, corporate is taking over hampering how vets can compete and stay in business. And that's not unlike what happened to a lot of small businesses, particularly with online shopping, although unrelated. I totally get it, and feel for you, but I am guessing this is the way veterinary services will end of going.
And I know the doctors and practices have nothing to do with insurance, but I meant that owners just need to realize they really need to get it...having a pet is expensive. They have to understand that vets need to charge what is costs.

So, what the future looks like is probably the fact that most practices will be under various corporate umbrellas, the companies will combine and partner with insurance companies and veterinarians will be contractors or employees of such. I think these are the transition years before we see the last of individual practices, and yes, it's sad, but it may be way it has to go considering the larger breadth of services and technology needed as opposed to animal care 20 years ago. Also, women are dominating the DVM population and they want more flexibility.

I think dentistry, dermatology, PT, mental health are also going through industry changes, but insurance has always covered these entities.
Thanks for all your hard work. Veterinarians really should be cherished and definitely paid more. I will be sure to express my gratitude to our practice whenever possible, which, BTW, is owned by Banfield, I think. In the end, it's the specific vet that matters to me more than who owns the practice, but our vet left practicing all together this year ( wasn't older, just left) and the one other seasoned vet is older and will eventually leave. The rest have been a steady turnover of young vets for the last decade. That is what concerns me.

Thank you. Fun fact, Banfield is actually owned by M&M mars. It was a private company until about 10 years ago and then Mars came in and purchased the practice. Significant changes since then.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, another question-
Do corporate take overs help or hinder? What do they help in a practice, and what go they hurt? I can see how an individual practice could drown in expenses, and maybe the business model needs this corporate investment.

I'm comparing it to optometry, which used to all be private practices until Pearl Vision and all the subsequent others arrived on the scene and changed everything starting in the late 70s. Optical services really changed, as well.

Back to veterinary- One issue is insurance. It was a rarity to buy it, with very limited options until the past 5 or 6 years. I managed 6 dogs without. Now I would only recommend getting a pet with insurance as a requirement. People don't understand what it costs to treat pets these days. It's not unusual to have MRIs, laser treatments, physical therapy, specialized surgeries, oncology treatment, etc.

If I've forgotten up to now, thanks so much to all the veterinary staff, doctors and techs alike. Of course you are important to pets, but it's really people you are treating. Many apologies for any abuse anyone has had to endure, I feel just awful to hear about it.

Vet owner here - corporate practices hurt the profession overall (again, looking at you Banfield/MM Mars). They offer massive signing bonuses and salaries - we CANNOT compete. They see almost exclusively routine appts such as vaccines and push any illness or emergencies to other clinics - why? Because, it takes time and those appts aren't as profitable. From a business model standpoint, great model. But from a general support the profession, not so great.

Our clinic does not have an issue with pet insurance as fees are paid by the client and reimbursed directly to the client. We don't get involved. It allows clients to support their pets and get them care.
I believe people don't see human medicine bills because most everyone has human health insurance and you pay $20 for a copay. They don't understand that we use the same MRI, meds and have the same education yet charge a tenth of what human medicine does. Also, the recent uptick in client crap is a function of people not being allowed in the buildings. It is much easier to complain when you don't look people in the eye - same way people feel open to complain on the internet.

So, like the way Pearl Vision changed the Optometric and Optician private practices, corporate is taking over hampering how vets can compete and stay in business. And that's not unlike what happened to a lot of small businesses, particularly with online shopping, although unrelated. I totally get it, and feel for you, but I am guessing this is the way veterinary services will end of going.
And I know the doctors and practices have nothing to do with insurance, but I meant that owners just need to realize they really need to get it...having a pet is expensive. They have to understand that vets need to charge what is costs.

So, what the future looks like is probably the fact that most practices will be under various corporate umbrellas, the companies will combine and partner with insurance companies and veterinarians will be contractors or employees of such. I think these are the transition years before we see the last of individual practices, and yes, it's sad, but it may be way it has to go considering the larger breadth of services and technology needed as opposed to animal care 20 years ago. Also, women are dominating the DVM population and they want more flexibility.

I think dentistry, dermatology, PT, mental health are also going through industry changes, but insurance has always covered these entities.
Thanks for all your hard work. Veterinarians really should be cherished and definitely paid more. I will be sure to express my gratitude to our practice whenever possible, which, BTW, is owned by Banfield, I think. In the end, it's the specific vet that matters to me more than who owns the practice, but our vet left practicing all together this year ( wasn't older, just left) and the one other seasoned vet is older and will eventually leave. The rest have been a steady turnover of young vets for the last decade. That is what concerns me.

Thank you. Fun fact, Banfield is actually owned by M&M mars. It was a private company until about 10 years ago and then Mars came in and purchased the practice. Significant changes since then.

Very interesting. They also control a big chunk of the pet food market (40+%) in the U.S.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, another question-
Do corporate take overs help or hinder? What do they help in a practice, and what go they hurt? I can see how an individual practice could drown in expenses, and maybe the business model needs this corporate investment.

I'm comparing it to optometry, which used to all be private practices until Pearl Vision and all the subsequent others arrived on the scene and changed everything starting in the late 70s. Optical services really changed, as well.

Back to veterinary- One issue is insurance. It was a rarity to buy it, with very limited options until the past 5 or 6 years. I managed 6 dogs without. Now I would only recommend getting a pet with insurance as a requirement. People don't understand what it costs to treat pets these days. It's not unusual to have MRIs, laser treatments, physical therapy, specialized surgeries, oncology treatment, etc.

If I've forgotten up to now, thanks so much to all the veterinary staff, doctors and techs alike. Of course you are important to pets, but it's really people you are treating. Many apologies for any abuse anyone has had to endure, I feel just awful to hear about it.

Vet owner here - corporate practices hurt the profession overall (again, looking at you Banfield/MM Mars). They offer massive signing bonuses and salaries - we CANNOT compete. They see almost exclusively routine appts such as vaccines and push any illness or emergencies to other clinics - why? Because, it takes time and those appts aren't as profitable. From a business model standpoint, great model. But from a general support the profession, not so great.

Our clinic does not have an issue with pet insurance as fees are paid by the client and reimbursed directly to the client. We don't get involved. It allows clients to support their pets and get them care.
I believe people don't see human medicine bills because most everyone has human health insurance and you pay $20 for a copay. They don't understand that we use the same MRI, meds and have the same education yet charge a tenth of what human medicine does. Also, the recent uptick in client crap is a function of people not being allowed in the buildings. It is much easier to complain when you don't look people in the eye - same way people feel open to complain on the internet.

So, like the way Pearl Vision changed the Optometric and Optician private practices, corporate is taking over hampering how vets can compete and stay in business. And that's not unlike what happened to a lot of small businesses, particularly with online shopping, although unrelated. I totally get it, and feel for you, but I am guessing this is the way veterinary services will end of going.
And I know the doctors and practices have nothing to do with insurance, but I meant that owners just need to realize they really need to get it...having a pet is expensive. They have to understand that vets need to charge what is costs.

So, what the future looks like is probably the fact that most practices will be under various corporate umbrellas, the companies will combine and partner with insurance companies and veterinarians will be contractors or employees of such. I think these are the transition years before we see the last of individual practices, and yes, it's sad, but it may be way it has to go considering the larger breadth of services and technology needed as opposed to animal care 20 years ago. Also, women are dominating the DVM population and they want more flexibility.

I think dentistry, dermatology, PT, mental health are also going through industry changes, but insurance has always covered these entities.
Thanks for all your hard work. Veterinarians really should be cherished and definitely paid more. I will be sure to express my gratitude to our practice whenever possible, which, BTW, is owned by Banfield, I think. In the end, it's the specific vet that matters to me more than who owns the practice, but our vet left practicing all together this year ( wasn't older, just left) and the one other seasoned vet is older and will eventually leave. The rest have been a steady turnover of young vets for the last decade. That is what concerns me.

Thank you. Fun fact, Banfield is actually owned by M&M mars. It was a private company until about 10 years ago and then Mars came in and purchased the practice. Significant changes since then.

Very interesting. They also control a big chunk of the pet food market (40+%) in the U.S.

Yeah, the connection with food is interesting. One should always follow the $$ whenever fad diets or unfounded or misleading warnings come out. Several recently.

[Anonymous]

Our vet is absolutely amazing, but her office is overbooked and still not taking any new clients. There are 5 doctors in the practice, many nurses, and they've hired extra support staff and STILL can't keep up.

But - they do their best to call back when they say they will call. If they don't follow through, they are ok with a call-back reminder. I have 2 geriatric pets with chronic illnesses so things can get urgent quick. When I do get the vet on the phone, she is her amazing self but admits to being beyond exhausted. I mean, she's running a large practice, managing her family with kids at home, etc, etc. I get it: she is swamped. And it just has not yet let up for them. They are burnt out, but can't quit.

[Anonymous]

Vet here - it is comforting to read the supportive messages here. But then I open Nextdoor and see people comment on how vets charge too much, are in it for the money, etc.....please please please.....be kind to your vet's office. Buy them lunch. Bring bagels by on a Saturday morning...

The joy of practicing is going away for many. We need to bring it back....