DD failing all her classes not sure what type of help to get

[Anonymous]

^ I thought teachers were lazy and useless. Oh is that just this year?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP - just to reassure you, you are not alone this year. I am a HS teacher and I have a lot of students with this problem, and my own 15 year old has been slowly sinking all year. I attribute a lot of it to the developmental age of young teens and the fact that they have been working alone all year, rather than surrounded by peers and being monitored by an adult other than their parents.

In normal times, if I gave an explanation of a task in class and then set kids loose to work on it, about 1/4 would have been paying attention and gotten started. Then slowly there would be a ripple across the room or within groups of "oh, we are doing something" and "what are we doing?" and "how do we do this?" until there are just a handful of students not working. Then the teacher is circulating and can prompt students with "why haven't you started yet?" and address individual problems. When everyone is working on a thing, it is easier for students to keep working on the thing (because clearly, now is the time to do the thing.) They get positive social feedback from doing the same thing as everyone, they can get support from peers if they need it, and they can support others (boosting their own self-confidence).

This year, that whole process is broken. Kids are left on their own to provide their own executive functioning and positive feedback system. They can't glance around at peers and get a clue about something they need help with. They definitely don't want to call attention to themselves by asking an actual question of the teacher. Sometimes they actually do know what is going on, but they are doubting themselves and don't get feedback that they are on the right track, so they stop. Some students may have fallen into a negative feedback loop - where efforts in earlier quarters didn't pay off with top grades, so they doubt themselves and second guess themselves and don't turn in work, which makes worse grades, which makes them freeze even more. Adult brains think it is a simple problem to solve (just do the thing), but smushy teen brains which are trying to figure out who they are and which don't have fully functioning prefrontal cortexes yet, just can't do it on their own.

I think that things will get better for everyone next year, in person. But I also think that this year has exposed some anxiety and ADD/ADHD issues for some students that they may have been able to work around in normal times, but now they need more support to get back on track.

Thank you for posting this!

[Anonymous]

Thank you for articulating it so well, 16:59! I have been trying to explain it as “visual cues” from other students in the class but your description is perfect. I wish my kid’s teacher understood and gave any bit of grace.

[Anonymous]

Yes my DD too. I also just started working back in healthcare after remote Covid work so it’s been hard. She pretty much waits til I get home and we go over missing assignments and play catch up on homework all weekend with her sitting next to me while I chill. Whatever it takes. But we are looking at Executive Function help next as we have two tutors since March that have been helpful.
Thank you teacher who posted

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP - just to reassure you, you are not alone this year. I am a HS teacher and I have a lot of students with this problem, and my own 15 year old has been slowly sinking all year. I attribute a lot of it to the developmental age of young teens and the fact that they have been working alone all year, rather than surrounded by peers and being monitored by an adult other than their parents.

In normal times, if I gave an explanation of a task in class and then set kids loose to work on it, about 1/4 would have been paying attention and gotten started. Then slowly there would be a ripple across the room or within groups of "oh, we are doing something" and "what are we doing?" and "how do we do this?" until there are just a handful of students not working. Then the teacher is circulating and can prompt students with "why haven't you started yet?" and address individual problems. When everyone is working on a thing, it is easier for students to keep working on the thing (because clearly, now is the time to do the thing.) They get positive social feedback from doing the same thing as everyone, they can get support from peers if they need it, and they can support others (boosting their own self-confidence).

This year, that whole process is broken. Kids are left on their own to provide their own executive functioning and positive feedback system. They can't glance around at peers and get a clue about something they need help with. They definitely don't want to call attention to themselves by asking an actual question of the teacher. Sometimes they actually do know what is going on, but they are doubting themselves and don't get feedback that they are on the right track, so they stop. Some students may have fallen into a negative feedback loop - where efforts in earlier quarters didn't pay off with top grades, so they doubt themselves and second guess themselves and don't turn in work, which makes worse grades, which makes them freeze even more. Adult brains think it is a simple problem to solve (just do the thing), but smushy teen brains which are trying to figure out who they are and which don't have fully functioning prefrontal cortexes yet, just can't do it on their own.

I think that things will get better for everyone next year, in person. But I also think that this year has exposed some anxiety and ADD/ADHD issues for some students that they may have been able to work around in normal times, but now they need more support to get back on track.

NP - thanks for this as we have similar issues with my sophomore. And thank you for being a high school teacher who has taken the time to learn about and understand the teenage brains. We need more high school teachers like you!

[Anonymous]

I’d spend the summer investigating a diagnosis and then getting an IEP. If you start now you may be able to have supports and services in place through the school before the next school year starts. If you need information on how, ask on the SN board.

[Anonymous]

Anxiety is a definite possibility.

My dd recently got a spot with a psychologist (the pediatrician is now referring and has a few on staff). The psycholgist says she has severe anxiety snd has just started tslking to dd about wsys to break up her assignments into manageable pieces. This year is in the tank, but I'm hoping next year dd can do better. As she is currently a junior, her college prospects are bad. But, I hope she can do well in the fall and that will be a last chance for a few 4-yr colleges. Otherwise, dd will do NOVA and see what happens. I learned this past year that I can hire all the tutors in the world, but until DD wants to engage with school, it isn't going to happen. She has to her her self right first.

[Anonymous]

*She has to GET her self right first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A tutor. You need to take charge. You need to make sure she gets to each class and participates and monitor the homework/due date and sit with her if necessary to get it done. She needs support. Also, try therapy in case its depression.

Do not wipe the slate clean and pretend nothing is happening.

But would a tutor help her with executive functioning issues? She doesn't need help learning the material. As for your other suggestions, we try to do this, and it leads to endless arguments. That's why I feel like I need to hire the monitoring of the work out. But who to hire it out to? I'm not sure what kind of professional to be looking for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Likely inattentive adhd exacerbated by remote learning. My dd has adhd, and it only become apparent when she started high school. We monitored her school work like a hawk, but she still couldn't get stuff turned in.
So that insurance covers it, bring her to pediatrician asap, tell dr.her symptoms and get referral to psychologist and/or therapist. Then get diagnosis from psychologist and probably meds, and get written order for school evaluation for IEP and/or 504 plan.
Do it immediately, because it only gets worse

What does a therapist do with a kid who has a diagnosis or adhd? Do they specifically work on study skills like a private coach would, but insurance picks up the tab?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. Executive function coaches cost over $100 an hour. We can’t afford that. Children’s told us 15-18 months before my kid can be seen. All other testers don’t take insurance. Only rich people deserve to be helped.

I am trying to help my kid with executive function type tips and strategies. It’s exhausting and demoralizing.

OP here. This is my issue as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. Executive function coaches cost over $100 an hour. We can’t afford that. Children’s told us 15-18 months before my kid can be seen. All other testers don’t take insurance. Only rich people deserve to be helped.

I am trying to help my kid with executive function type tips and strategies. It’s exhausting and demoralizing.

OP here. This is my issue as well.

As I mentioned above, there is help through the schools if you go through the IEP process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. Executive function coaches cost over $100 an hour. We can’t afford that. Children’s told us 15-18 months before my kid can be seen. All other testers don’t take insurance. Only rich people deserve to be helped.

I am trying to help my kid with executive function type tips and strategies. It’s exhausting and demoralizing.

OP here. This is my issue as well.

DP. A n umber of school systems have a 'tutor' list where the cost is closer to $50/hr. If nothing else, you could work with an organization like Huntington Learning Center where the cost is also in the $50 range. I get that even in the $50 range, it's a lot of money but, really, can you afford NOT to do it? We're talking life-skills here, not SAT prep to get into Harvard. Everyone needs to be able to identify what has been assigned to them, gather the materials needed, do the work and turn it in - on time. If there are other barriers impacting your DD's development/implementation of this skill, get them identified so she can learn how to appropriately compensate and advocate for herself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD age 14, currently has F’s in four of her five classes. She is very smart. It’s not an issue of comprehension, she just doesn’t do her assignments on time and gets very far behind. This has always been an issue, but her grades have never been this bad.
I want to get help for her someone who can work with her on time management skills, and overcoming procrastination, but who does this? She doesn’t need a tutor and this really doesn’t seem like the kind of thing a therapist does. Who if anyone provides the kind of help we are looking for?

Executive function tutor, combined with allowing them to talk to the teachers. Without your permission, they can only do so much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are in a similar situation. Up until this year my DD age 15, has been top of her class. She is smart and she is very capable, but this year has been bizarre. Efficiency is dismal. We have a messed up combination of what seems like procrastination/time management/day dreaming and perfectionism going on. For years I've been certain she has OCD, but it seemed very manageable. The pandemic has brought the OCD to a whole new level. The only way she has gotten stuff done this year is by sitting with her at the kitchen table, and reeling her back in when she starts checking out. Stuff that should take an hour, is taking 9- 10 hours to get it right by her standards. Crazy as I've never been involved in her getting work done before. Watching her work is concerning. Can one have both OCD and ADHD? Not sure what help to seek either, when anything she manages to get in is 90% or higher. Just we have a crap load of zeros too for the stuff she ran out of time on, 3/4 done but won't submit.

Neuropsych to get an IEP that will allow her to try to manage what happened this year.
Executive function tutor to help her learn to manage her time better.
The last piece is professionals to help with whatever the neuropsych finds. It may be OCD and ADHD, but it may not. Try to go in without preconceptions.