Nottingham?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After having kids at Nottingham for almost 10 years we pulled our kids a couple of years ago and put them in private school. We had said for years that something was off with one of our kids only to be constantly assured the child was testing above grade level and fine: We finally had outside testing done and learned dyslexia was causing the problem. The year we pulled our kids, several other families did for the same reason. I was not appreciate the way the principal treated us when we pulled our kids. It seemed like she took it very personally that we were putting them in private rather doing what we thought would be best so our child could receive the needed services.

If this happened a couple of years ago, then it probably wasn’t under the current principal.

I'm the OP of the above post and it absolutely happened under the current principal. I know people had issues with the previous principal as well but our experience was with the current one. The conversation I had with her and the new assistant principal when we pulled our kids was extremely disappointing.

I posted earlier in this thread that I had a similar kind of experience at McKinley. I don't know if all APS schools are like this, but I too had the experience that if my child wasn't actually getting poor grades or acting out in class in ways that disturbed other students, the school felt like testing for learning disabilities or other issues was not warranted. Even where the school knew our child was experiencing anxiety, difficulty managing the work, hated school, etc. -- I guess they seemed to view that as not their problem, like maybe the anxiety was caused by the family and not a function of having problems with the schoolwork.

That is why I recommend to folks reading this to get your child tested privately if you have any worries or concerns that something isn't quite right, whatever school you are at. Do NOT trust your school to have your best interests at heart. We frankly misunderstood the relationship between our school and our child -- the school ultimately cares primarily about itself and its ability to manage all of the kids under its supervision. If your child "fits" and is passing the SOLs, the school may feel it has bigger problems. So get testing if there is ever a concern if you can afford it.

Yes, this is true. If the child's academics are not being impacted, they are not concerned with testing and IEPs. That means, a child who is "doing fine" academically with C's and B's but who could/should be getting A's and B's is not going to be considered "in need."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:if my child wasn't actually getting poor grades or acting out in class


Schools are required to identify students with disabilities but how are they supposed to identify students who are not displaying academic or behavioral issues? If there is no academic impact there is no need for IEP testing which is to provide access to the gen ed curriculum. If your student is performing to grade level expectations then they have adequate access.

504 is different because it's not an academic impact that is required so much as an activity of daily living so it's more broad but only offers accommodations.

It's the "grade level expectations" that's the problem. Our schools' focus should be on each student performing to the level they are capable of achieving, not just meeting an average standard. This is how so many kids fall through the cracks.

[Anonymous]

Same experience at Campbell. Our child was technically at "grade level" and that was good enough. No support of any kind offered. But she was struggling academically and we could see it. It seemed that the bar was very low for what was "good enough" and there was no desire from the school for her to do better than that.

[Anonymous]

Glebe was a struggle every step of the way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if my child wasn't actually getting poor grades or acting out in class


Schools are required to identify students with disabilities but how are they supposed to identify students who are not displaying academic or behavioral issues? If there is no academic impact there is no need for IEP testing which is to provide access to the gen ed curriculum. If your student is performing to grade level expectations then they have adequate access.

504 is different because it's not an academic impact that is required so much as an activity of daily living so it's more broad but only offers accommodations.

It's the "grade level expectations" that's the problem. Our schools' focus should be on each student performing to the level they are capable of achieving, not just meeting an average standard. This is how so many kids fall through the cracks.

But, unfortunately that is not the law. The law doesn’t say each child needs to achieve their highest potential.

[Anonymous]

I don't think parents are asking schools to get kids to achieve their highest potential (the horror!), but to help identify basic issues that may be impacting a kid's access to the curriculum. Like dyslexia. Or autism, even HFA. Or dysgraphia. Even if a kid is getting Bs and Cs, but is really struggling and having a hard time, seems like the schools should be trying to identify these issues. It still shocks me that my kid went through 5 years of elementary school with not a single child expert on staff at the elementary identifying them for some of these issues. It's not rocket science to identify some of these things, but I guess my child's grades were getting in the way of their view.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if my child wasn't actually getting poor grades or acting out in class


Schools are required to identify students with disabilities but how are they supposed to identify students who are not displaying academic or behavioral issues? If there is no academic impact there is no need for IEP testing which is to provide access to the gen ed curriculum. If your student is performing to grade level expectations then they have adequate access.

504 is different because it's not an academic impact that is required so much as an activity of daily living so it's more broad but only offers accommodations.

It's the "grade level expectations" that's the problem. Our schools' focus should be on each student performing to the level they are capable of achieving, not just meeting an average standard. This is how so many kids fall through the cracks.

But, unfortunately that is not the law. The law doesn’t say each child needs to achieve their highest potential.

The law also doesn't say that each child's needs can only be considered if they are not meeting grade expectation. it does not prohibit a school from giving other students the supports they need (and are probably already providing other students anyway)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:if my child wasn't actually getting poor grades or acting out in class


Schools are required to identify students with disabilities but how are they supposed to identify students who are not displaying academic or behavioral issues? If there is no academic impact there is no need for IEP testing which is to provide access to the gen ed curriculum. If your student is performing to grade level expectations then they have adequate access.

504 is different because it's not an academic impact that is required so much as an activity of daily living so it's more broad but only offers accommodations.

It's the "grade level expectations" that's the problem. Our schools' focus should be on each student performing to the level they are capable of achieving, not just meeting an average standard. This is how so many kids fall through the cracks.

But, unfortunately that is not the law. The law doesn’t say each child needs to achieve their highest potential.

The law also doesn't say that each child's needs can only be considered if they are not meeting grade expectation. it does not prohibit a school from giving other students the supports they need (and are probably already providing other students anyway)

Right, but if your expectation is that public school can do this and also provide the resources to get kids multiple grade levels below expectations and with very clear and obvious (and legally obligated) needs met, they will need a heck of a lot more money.

[Anonymous]

My expectation is that if I see my child struggling for 3 years and I continue to tell my child’s teachers that something is going on - that they take notice and stop telling me my child is meeting expectations. I shouldn’t have to pay for outside private testing and put my child in private school because Nottingham failed to help my child whom we ultimately found out has dyslexia. What if we had spent those 3 years actually providing my child with the needed help rather than now trying to catch up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After having kids at Nottingham for almost 10 years we pulled our kids a couple of years ago and put them in private school. We had said for years that something was off with one of our kids only to be constantly assured the child was testing above grade level and fine: We finally had outside testing done and learned dyslexia was causing the problem. The year we pulled our kids, several other families did for the same reason. I was not appreciate the way the principal treated us when we pulled our kids. It seemed like she took it very personally that we were putting them in private rather doing what we thought would be best so our child could receive the needed services.

If this happened a couple of years ago, then it probably wasn’t under the current principal.

I'm the OP of the above post and it absolutely happened under the current principal. I know people had issues with the previous principal as well but our experience was with the current one. The conversation I had with her and the new assistant principal when we pulled our kids was extremely disappointing.

This only her third year at Nottingham, so if you pulled your kids two or more years ago, at most you were only there a couple of months after she joined the school. She therefore cannot be responsible for "years" of you saying something was wrong before you pulled your kids.

I am in no way saying Nottingham is perfect (no school is), but APS and Nottingham have done a lot of work to address the issues that existed previously. It is a different environment now with different leadership, so this kind of feedback is only constructive if the timeline is clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After having kids at Nottingham for almost 10 years we pulled our kids a couple of years ago and put them in private school. We had said for years that something was off with one of our kids only to be constantly assured the child was testing above grade level and fine: We finally had outside testing done and learned dyslexia was causing the problem. The year we pulled our kids, several other families did for the same reason. I was not appreciate the way the principal treated us when we pulled our kids. It seemed like she took it very personally that we were putting them in private rather doing what we thought would be best so our child could receive the needed services.

If this happened a couple of years ago, then it probably wasn’t under the current principal.

I'm the OP of the above post and it absolutely happened under the current principal. I know people had issues with the previous principal as well but our experience was with the current one. The conversation I had with her and the new assistant principal when we pulled our kids was extremely disappointing.

This only her third year at Nottingham, so if you pulled your kids two or more years ago, at most you were only there a couple of months after she joined the school. She therefore cannot be responsible for "years" of you saying something was wrong before you pulled your kids.

If you read my posts you will see that I didn’t blame the current principal for years of problems. I have an issue when I raise it with my kids’ teachers and they continued to tell me my child was fine when my child was not. I found my conversations with the principal after we decided to pull my kids disappointing.
I am in no way saying Nottingham is perfect (no school is), but APS and Nottingham have done a lot of work to address the issues that existed previously. It is a different environment now with different leadership, so this kind of feedback is only constructive if the timeline is clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My expectation is that if I see my child struggling for 3 years and I continue to tell my child’s teachers that something is going on - that they take notice and stop telling me my child is meeting expectations. I shouldn’t have to pay for outside private testing and put my child in private school because Nottingham failed to help my child whom we ultimately found out has dyslexia. What if we had spent those 3 years actually providing my child with the needed help rather than now trying to catch up.

This kind of thing is not unique to Nottingham, or to APS. The reality for just about every school system is that special education needs exceed the special education funding provided to schools, so they basically are forced to ration special education resources. No decent educator honestly believes that "meets grade level expectations" is a deciding factor on whether a student has an education-related disability and thus whether they should be evaluated for services, but in practice is has to be because (1) students who aren't meeting grade level expectations typically have greater educational needs, and thus a greater need for the limited resources, and (2) testing to assess where a child could be performing and then measuring their actual performance against that is complex and very resource-intensive, beyond what schools generally can dedicate to it without severely compromising other areas.

So this is an issue everywhere. If your child is below grade level, it is fairly easy to make a case for testing. But if you child is meeting (and especially if they are exceeding) grade level expectations, it is very difficult to make a case that your child is not meeting their actual potential and that some sort of disability likely is preventing them from doing so, and thus to make a case for why the school should test. It sucks. It's an awful system. I know, because I've been there. But public schools didn't create the system, and they have a very limited ability to change it. If you want it to change, your advocacy needs to be directed at federal and state lawmakers, because they have the real power here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After having kids at Nottingham for almost 10 years we pulled our kids a couple of years ago and put them in private school. We had said for years that something was off with one of our kids only to be constantly assured the child was testing above grade level and fine: We finally had outside testing done and learned dyslexia was causing the problem. The year we pulled our kids, several other families did for the same reason. I was not appreciate the way the principal treated us when we pulled our kids. It seemed like she took it very personally that we were putting them in private rather doing what we thought would be best so our child could receive the needed services.

If this happened a couple of years ago, then it probably wasn’t under the current principal.

I'm the OP of the above post and it absolutely happened under the current principal. I know people had issues with the previous principal as well but our experience was with the current one. The conversation I had with her and the new assistant principal when we pulled our kids was extremely disappointing.

DP. What did you expect them to do, throw a parade because you were leaving?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My expectation is that if I see my child struggling for 3 years and I continue to tell my child’s teachers that something is going on - that they take notice and stop telling me my child is meeting expectations. I shouldn’t have to pay for outside private testing and put my child in private school because Nottingham failed to help my child whom we ultimately found out has dyslexia. What if we had spent those 3 years actually providing my child with the needed help rather than now trying to catch up.

This kind of thing is not unique to Nottingham, or to APS. The reality for just about every school system is that special education needs exceed the special education funding provided to schools, so they basically are forced to ration special education resources. No decent educator honestly believes that "meets grade level expectations" is a deciding factor on whether a student has an education-related disability and thus whether they should be evaluated for services, but in practice is has to be because (1) students who aren't meeting grade level expectations typically have greater educational needs, and thus a greater need for the limited resources, and (2) testing to assess where a child could be performing and then measuring their actual performance against that is complex and very resource-intensive, beyond what schools generally can dedicate to it without severely compromising other areas.

So this is an issue everywhere. If your child is below grade level, it is fairly easy to make a case for testing. But if you child is meeting (and especially if they are exceeding) grade level expectations, it is very difficult to make a case that your child is not meeting their actual potential and that some sort of disability likely is preventing them from doing so, and thus to make a case for why the school should test. It sucks. It's an awful system. I know, because I've been there. But public schools didn't create the system, and they have a very limited ability to change it. If you want it to change, your advocacy needs to be directed at federal and state lawmakers, because they have the real power here.

1,000,000

I have also come to this conclusion, as I suspect one of my kid’s inherited mild dyslexia from their father. But in both cases, it’s not severe enough to be flagged or addressed by public school, because despite checking the boxes, they always performed above grade level expectations. DH was helped by his own parent, who was a teacher, outside of school hours. And we will probably have to explore private testing and remediation for our child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My expectation is that if I see my child struggling for 3 years and I continue to tell my child’s teachers that something is going on - that they take notice and stop telling me my child is meeting expectations. I shouldn’t have to pay for outside private testing and put my child in private school because Nottingham failed to help my child whom we ultimately found out has dyslexia. What if we had spent those 3 years actually providing my child with the needed help rather than now trying to catch up.

This kind of thing is not unique to Nottingham, or to APS. The reality for just about every school system is that special education needs exceed the special education funding provided to schools, so they basically are forced to ration special education resources. No decent educator honestly believes that "meets grade level expectations" is a deciding factor on whether a student has an education-related disability and thus whether they should be evaluated for services, but in practice is has to be because (1) students who aren't meeting grade level expectations typically have greater educational needs, and thus a greater need for the limited resources, and (2) testing to assess where a child could be performing and then measuring their actual performance against that is complex and very resource-intensive, beyond what schools generally can dedicate to it without severely compromising other areas.

So this is an issue everywhere. If your child is below grade level, it is fairly easy to make a case for testing. But if you child is meeting (and especially if they are exceeding) grade level expectations, it is very difficult to make a case that your child is not meeting their actual potential and that some sort of disability likely is preventing them from doing so, and thus to make a case for why the school should test. It sucks. It's an awful system. I know, because I've been there. But public schools didn't create the system, and they have a very limited ability to change it. If you want it to change, your advocacy needs to be directed at federal and state lawmakers, because they have the real power here.

I'd buy that argument more at high needs schools like Carlin Springs, Barcroft, etc. But not at schools like Nottingham. Those schools do not have the high percentage of students with big special needs schools with high FRL and high% ELL have. They should absolutely be able to test more kids in the middle, especially when the parent is consistently expressing concerns. APS keeps telling us parents know their children best....until we ask APS for something. Then suddenly the teacher knows our kid better.