Montessori is more strict?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The deal breaker for me is that pretend play is NOT allowed in Montessori. If your child picks up a string of beads and pretends they are a snake, they will be told that isn't allowed. Beads are for a specific purpose, perhaps counting or string but never for being snakes because that is not there intended purpose.

Blocks are just blocks to build and never a phone or walkie talkie or powerful crystal with powers.

You say this like it’s universal. Both my kids are in a Montessori school and they engage in tons of pretend play including at school. They don’t do it during the ‘work cycle’ but there is a lot of additional time in a Montessori schedule. And, a good Montessori school worships things like recess and free time — I’ve watched the kids at outside time and they run around like total maniacs/3 year olds.

‘Work’ isn’t just sweeping and stuff. For the little kids, it’s, like, playing with dinosaurs. Or dancing. Or yoga. Or washing their hands. Or arranging flowers. Or whatever. For my kindergartener, it’s more like typical school stuff. But a work cycle at our school is about 1/3 of the total day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think people are butting heads because there’s a distinction between the montessori purists and the Montessori inspired. Some of them are really cultish and you need to figure out how much flex they have. I suggested uphread questions about cursive and the work cycle as good proxies, but the play pretend question is also a good one.
I agree with PP that in a good Montessori classroom, there is a lot of collaboration, often between older/younger kids.

I agree with about half of this but my very cultish Montessori school values free time and play and imagination and all that kid stuff.

BTW, that ‘blocks’ thing that people are talking about isn’t blocks as you know it — it’s the first part of the Montessori math curriculum. And yeah, they are supposed to do a specific thing with them. However, there are other blocks that can be ‘played with’ in the most free form way. You can’t ‘play’ with pink tower or brown stairs blocks, but you can play with other blocks — just like kids at traditional school can’t ‘play’ randomly with, like, compasses or whatever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people are butting heads because there’s a distinction between the montessori purists and the Montessori inspired. Some of them are really cultish and you need to figure out how much flex they have. I suggested uphread questions about cursive and the work cycle as good proxies, but the play pretend question is also a good one.
I agree with PP that in a good Montessori classroom, there is a lot of collaboration, often between older/younger kids.

I agree with about half of this but my very cultish Montessori school values free time and play and imagination and all that kid stuff.

BTW, that ‘blocks’ thing that people are talking about isn’t blocks as you know it — it’s the first part of the Montessori math curriculum. And yeah, they are supposed to do a specific thing with them. However, there are other blocks that can be ‘played with’ in the most free form way. You can’t ‘play’ with pink tower or brown stairs blocks, but you can play with other blocks — just like kids at traditional school can’t ‘play’ randomly with, like, compasses or whatever.

I just don’t understand the benefit of it. Play based preschools teach all the same concepts, but without all that rigidity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The deal breaker for me is that pretend play is NOT allowed in Montessori. If your child picks up a string of beads and pretends they are a snake, they will be told that isn't allowed. Beads are for a specific purpose, perhaps counting or string but never for being snakes because that is not there intended purpose.

Blocks are just blocks to build and never a phone or walkie talkie or powerful crystal with powers.

You say this like it’s universal. Both my kids are in a Montessori school and they engage in tons of pretend play including at school. They don’t do it during the ‘work cycle’ but there is a lot of additional time in a Montessori schedule. And, a good Montessori school worships things like recess and free time — I’ve watched the kids at outside time and they run around like total maniacs/3 year olds.

‘Work’ isn’t just sweeping and stuff. For the little kids, it’s, like, playing with dinosaurs. Or dancing. Or yoga. Or washing their hands. Or arranging flowers. Or whatever. For my kindergartener, it’s more like typical school stuff. But a work cycle at our school is about 1/3 of the total day.

PP, and reading the original PP and I feel the need to amend my previous comment — some of the key montessori materials used in their math and language arts curriculum may look like toys, but they’re not and they’re not intended to be used like toys. Traditional school kids use certain materials for math, Montessori kids use other materials for math. So, yeah. The beads aren’t a snake. The beads can’t be a snake — the beads are part of the math program. There is a ton of other stuff in the classroom that can be used for imaginary play, but some materials are off limits for that.

If that bothers you as a parent, it is 100% not the kind of program for you. But my 2 year old is in a Montessori school and she pretended a hot dog was a phone today, and my older kid plays make believe all day long.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people are butting heads because there’s a distinction between the montessori purists and the Montessori inspired. Some of them are really cultish and you need to figure out how much flex they have. I suggested uphread questions about cursive and the work cycle as good proxies, but the play pretend question is also a good one.
I agree with PP that in a good Montessori classroom, there is a lot of collaboration, often between older/younger kids.

I agree with about half of this but my very cultish Montessori school values free time and play and imagination and all that kid stuff.

BTW, that ‘blocks’ thing that people are talking about isn’t blocks as you know it — it’s the first part of the Montessori math curriculum. And yeah, they are supposed to do a specific thing with them. However, there are other blocks that can be ‘played with’ in the most free form way. You can’t ‘play’ with pink tower or brown stairs blocks, but you can play with other blocks — just like kids at traditional school can’t ‘play’ randomly with, like, compasses or whatever.

I just don’t understand the benefit of it. Play based preschools teach all the same concepts, but without all that rigidity.

It doesn’t feel rigid to me, and play based has its own curriculum too. (Draw the picture of how you’ll play with this doll, then go do it, then write about it, etc etc etc). Curricula by design have structure. Montessori is just one approach.

The benefit of any program is what it is. I don’t know whether Montessori is ‘the best’ (I assume no? But I wouldn’t even know how to measure that) but the particular school my kids go to is amazing and it’s Montessori and I watch my 5 year old doing all sorts of cool things. He’s probably be fine anywhere, but he and we all love his school. From reading this thread, there are a lot of misconceptions based on some of the terminology and I just feel like addressing those.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people are butting heads because there’s a distinction between the montessori purists and the Montessori inspired. Some of them are really cultish and you need to figure out how much flex they have. I suggested uphread questions about cursive and the work cycle as good proxies, but the play pretend question is also a good one.
I agree with PP that in a good Montessori classroom, there is a lot of collaboration, often between older/younger kids.

I agree with about half of this but my very cultish Montessori school values free time and play and imagination and all that kid stuff.

BTW, that ‘blocks’ thing that people are talking about isn’t blocks as you know it — it’s the first part of the Montessori math curriculum. And yeah, they are supposed to do a specific thing with them. However, there are other blocks that can be ‘played with’ in the most free form way. You can’t ‘play’ with pink tower or brown stairs blocks, but you can play with other blocks — just like kids at traditional school can’t ‘play’ randomly with, like, compasses or whatever.

I just don’t understand the benefit of it. Play based preschools teach all the same concepts, but without all that rigidity.

It doesn’t feel rigid to me, and play based has its own curriculum too. (Draw the picture of how you’ll play with this doll, then go do it, then write about it, etc etc etc). Curricula by design have structure. Montessori is just one approach.

The benefit of any program is what it is. I don’t know whether Montessori is ‘the best’ (I assume no? But I wouldn’t even know how to measure that) but the particular school my kids go to is amazing and it’s Montessori and I watch my 5 year old doing all sorts of cool things. He’s probably be fine anywhere, but he and we all love his school. From reading this thread, there are a lot of misconceptions based on some of the terminology and I just feel like addressing those.

It’s not the terminology. Read some of the posts on here. They sound cultish. “School is for work, not goofing around.” Does that sound like a normal thing to say about a preschool?

[Anonymous]

We went to see a Montessori classroom to see if it would be a good fit for our 3-year old. When we left the school, we both looked at each other like, "what the heck was this all about!". Kids were like zombies walking from one "work station" to another. Only one girl cracked a smile during the 30 minute visit. She was playing tea time, and this was the only station that resembled what I call play.
We don't have a crazy kid who is loud, runs around or even engages in imaginative play, but Montessori is still not for him. We we wondering how he would survive doing the stations 3 hours a day.
We did co-op and then Reggio prk4. DC speaks 3 languages, knows his math facts, reads and writes, and can type faster than a court recorder. He knows his countries and knows history more than he needs at his age. I don't credit Reggio or co-op for that. I just didn't want schooling to get in the way, and Montessori seemed the worst fit.
I know only one child who I thought would fit into Montessori, but his mom was so against the idea when I mentioned it. She clearly had made up her mind way before I knew about Montessori.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We went to see a Montessori classroom to see if it would be a good fit for our 3-year old. When we left the school, we both looked at each other like, "what the heck was this all about!". Kids were like zombies walking from one "work station" to another. Only one girl cracked a smile during the 30 minute visit. She was playing tea time, and this was the only station that resembled what I call play.
We don't have a crazy kid who is loud, runs around or even engages in imaginative play, but Montessori is still not for him. We we wondering how he would survive doing the stations 3 hours a day.
We did co-op and then Reggio prk4. DC speaks 3 languages, knows his math facts, reads and writes, and can type faster than a court recorder. He knows his countries and knows history more than he needs at his age. I don't credit Reggio or co-op for that. I just didn't want schooling to get in the way, and Montessori seemed the worst fit.
I know only one child who I thought would fit into Montessori, but his mom was so against the idea when I mentioned it. She clearly had made up her mind way before I knew about Montessori.

Yeah, when we visited a Montessori school, we thought it was awful too. I remember one kid came up to us to show us something she made and the parent who was showing us around shooed her away, saying “go do your work.”

It was just so weird and seemingly just not joyful.

[Anonymous]

I think the moral of the story is in general Montessori is not an approach for everyone and it highly depends on the school. Some schools may be “purists” and therefore a bit more “strict” while other Montessori schools are a bit more relaxed. It could be the difference of AMI vs AMS.

[Anonymous]

It doesn’t feel rigid to me, and play based has its own curriculum too. (Draw the picture of how you’ll play with this doll, then go do it, then write about it, etc etc etc). Curricula by design have structure. Montessori is just one approach.




The above is not true about play based preschools. Play based is the whole point. There are goals for children’s learning but they are achieved through PLAY, not by rote learning and being told that there is only one way to do something correctly. That is not appropriate for this age group.

For the person who mentioned that there is only one way to use a compass in a class, that is also not true in a play based school. Materials are presented so that children can explore them and come up with their own ideas on usage. There is plenty of time in later years to use a compass for its “real” purpose.

[Anonymous]

Well, it sounds like it's a good fit for some people and not others. Personally, my own DD and all of my nieces and nephews did Montessori, many through Elementary. All are now thriving at their traditional high schools (one at Walls, another at RMIB) and two headed to top colleges, one top of her Wilson class. All loved their time in Montessori and remember it as the best education years they had with collaborative, joyful classrooms, plenty of learning, and lots of freedom to do their own thing.

So, if it's not for you, then fine, but no need to tear it down for those it works well for. There is plenty of time in the day for all sorts of activities, some structured and some less structured and some totally not structured.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, it sounds like it's a good fit for some people and not others. Personally, my own DD and all of my nieces and nephews did Montessori, many through Elementary. All are now thriving at their traditional high schools (one at Walls, another at RMIB) and two headed to top colleges, one top of her Wilson class. All loved their time in Montessori and remember it as the best education years they had with collaborative, joyful classrooms, plenty of learning, and lots of freedom to do their own thing.

So, if it's not for you, then fine, but no need to tear it down for those it works well for. There is plenty of time in the day for all sorts of activities, some structured and some less structured and some totally not structured.

100%.

[Anonymous]

Can some one describe what a child does when arranging flowers? Are they directing to arrange by color/height/or variety? How long does a preschooler focus on this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It doesn’t feel rigid to me, and play based has its own curriculum too. (Draw the picture of how you’ll play with this doll, then go do it, then write about it, etc etc etc). Curricula by design have structure. Montessori is just one approach.




The above is not true about play based preschools. Play based is the whole point. There are goals for children’s learning but they are achieved through PLAY, not by rote learning and being told that there is only one way to do something correctly. That is not appropriate for this age group.

For the person who mentioned that there is only one way to use a compass in a class, that is also not true in a play based school. Materials are presented so that children can explore them and come up with their own ideas on usage. There is plenty of time in later years to use a compass for its “real” purpose.

Play based preschool in DCPS absolutely has structure and methods like I describe — maybe not at the school your kids went to but certainly at some of them.

But my point is that most schools and preschools have both formal curricula and free-er play time. To say ‘hey, why can’t you use these math materials for toys?’ Applied elsewhere would be akin to saying something like ‘why can’t you make 2+2=5? You’re mean dictators!’ Not everything can be used however kids want it to be used in the context of school. I suppose if you want your kid to be able to stick crayons up their nose or do whatever they want with most materials, Montessori would absolutely be too strict. But having limitations on materials isn’t unique to montessori by any means.

When I think of strict, I think of punishment for violating rules. I suppose structures and schedules themselves are a kind of strictness — in which case, sure, Montessori is more strict than other kinds of programs. But my 5 year old has been in Montessori his whole life and has been ‘punished’ exactly once, for biting another kid. Otherwise, the ‘punishments’ for bad behavior are more like natural consequences and they’re mostly enforced by other kids. I was at the birthday circle time once and one kid was goofing off and delaying the start and the other kids were like ‘kid! We’re waiting for you! Come sit down!’ And he did. I’ve seen kids pulled aside during outside time if they’re violent, but it’s more like a cooling off period. My kid has missed snack on occasion because he was too slow cleaning up his work and by the time he was done snack time was over. None of that feels strict to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We went to see a Montessori classroom to see if it would be a good fit for our 3-year old. When we left the school, we both looked at each other like, "what the heck was this all about!". Kids were like zombies walking from one "work station" to another. Only one girl cracked a smile during the 30 minute visit. She was playing tea time, and this was the only station that resembled what I call play.
We don't have a crazy kid who is loud, runs around or even engages in imaginative play, but Montessori is still not for him. We we wondering how he would survive doing the stations 3 hours a day.
We did co-op and then Reggio prk4. DC speaks 3 languages, knows his math facts, reads and writes, and can type faster than a court recorder. He knows his countries and knows history more than he needs at his age. I don't credit Reggio or co-op for that. I just didn't want schooling to get in the way, and Montessori seemed the worst fit.
I know only one child who I thought would fit into Montessori, but his mom was so against the idea when I mentioned it. She clearly had made up her mind way before I knew about Montessori.

I wouldn’t send my kid to a school where kids seemed like zombies. But the Montessori work cycle is typically quieter and the kids tend to be pretty focused. If that horrifies you, it’s definitely not for you. I think it’s cool to see my kid so ‘into’ his activities, especially now that he’s older and he can so clearly see how he’s progressing.