Deep Racism Problems at NCS and STA: Questions/Answers we can't get through admissions

[Anonymous]

A lot depends on specific attributes your child has. I have two kids. One child has dark skin, black hair, dark brown eyes and is quiet, very smart, and quite athletic. His teachers and other parents assume he is an average student who is on a scholarship. Even when he scores well on tests and class work some teachers are skeptical at times. Teachers will ask if he needs help or ask if someone did or helped him with homework.

My other son has lighter skin, green eyes, and brown hair with highlights from the sun. He has had a completely different experience from teachers and other parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot depends on specific attributes your child has. I have two kids. One child has dark skin, black hair, dark brown eyes and is quiet, very smart, and quite athletic. His teachers and other parents assume he is an average student who is on a scholarship. Even when he scores well on tests and class work some teachers are skeptical at times. Teachers will ask if he needs help or ask if someone did or helped him with homework.

My other son has lighter skin, green eyes, and brown hair with highlights from the sun. He has had a completely different experience from teachers and other parents.

While I understand your point, I wouldn't want my kid being part of a place where they pass through or not based on how "white" they look.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All of the local schools have the instagram accounts. The question is, what are they doing about it?

I know another "big 3" is taking it very seriously to address systemic problems within the institution and across the community.

It is very hard work, but if our country is to survive, critically important.

OP again: Which one? And what specifically are they doing? Thank you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:O.p. It is about power. White W.A.S.P. males have "lorded" over the U.S. since its inception. It used to be just being white alone was not good enough. My Jewish + Catholic relatives were shunned + excluded. The Jewish ones were killed in the Holocaust. Now U.M.C. whites can largely pass for W.A.S.P.S. If they look + act the part + as long as their names are not "too Jewish" or "too ethnic". So it stands to reason that since N.C.S. + STA are W.A.S.P. "Enclaves, i.e. Episcopalen, that they would be the most exclusive + want to retain white "waspy" power. Yes they will admit some "acceptable looking" people of color, but they will never truly fit in unless they come from famous +/or celebrity families.

Do you have firsthand knowledge of this at the schools? I'm not being oppositional. I'm asking because you're lumping a fair bit of things together here. The Episcopal church may have a waspy history, for instance, but it is extraordinarily diverse and progressive and has been for a very long time. That doesn't answer the questions about NCS/STA or vice versa.

[Anonymous]

If STA wants to be a kind and diverse place they need to stop preferentially admitting the children of VIPs and those who were born with a silver spoon in their mouth. It's ridiculous, really. They keep wringing their hands and speaking about diversity and kindness and inclusion and then year after year they admit the kids of CEOs and law partners and more recently---of Trump appointees--all from a select number of private schools.

They do so preferentially over equally qualified kids from public and equally qualified kids with parents who are pediatricians and journalists and government lawyers. And then they turn around and wonder, "gee whiz! Whey is our student body so elitist? Why are the boys so unkind?". "Maybe if we had one more diversity chapel we would solve this problem. Yes, let's have one more chapel. That will fix it!".
Giant eye roll.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op here: I might imagine that some of the other privates are better, but is that actually just my imagination? For instance, the history of GDS is certainly inspiring, but I was surprised to read accounts on their ig page that sound a lot like the ncs dei director’s resignation letter that a pp so helpfully posted. Indeed, both @blackatsidwell and @blackatgds contain deeply troubling posts as well. I couldn't even get through @blackatmaret. More than that, those IG feeds from gds and sidwell stopped adding contributions in August. I don’t know if that’s because issues are getting addressed, because there aren’t other stories to be told, because the schools channeled those voices to less public fora, or something else. I would love to read into that stop date positive things, but that seems a stretch.

Fundamentally, it is just so frustrating not to be able to feel like we really can look at "fit" for all the attributes that make up my dc (intellectually insatiable, relatively sporty, funny, friendly, empathetic, chatty , artistic, competitive, and again, interested in single sex). Is "fit" for the whole child just another luxury children of color dare to dream about? Is the only aspect of "fit" they get to consider which school is sufficiently less racist than another school? I'm being serious with these questions. It feels as if our family can't even consider any number of otherwise excellent schools, whose programs would seem to fit DC very well, because we can't and won't trade DC's psychological well-being--even for a truly top education.

Finally, to a pp who suggested we ask the school for current families to talk to: We have, and we will. However, there's school selection in those referrals. Beyond the school-selected referrals, we don't want to push. We are grateful to any family who wishes to speak, but we also know personally that many families in this situation are tired of always having to take on the burden of discussing these issues. In fact, and maybe I'm dreaming here, but we would like to hear from all types of families in these schools; this should be something everyone is taking on and caring about.

Thank you to those who have engaged with the thread topic, and I hope more people will contribute.

I don't think any of these schools are "structurally racist." There may be racist parents and kids at some of the schools like St Albans but few IMO and one finds such jerks almost everywhere in life. If the race composition of the class matters that much, check out DeMatha - 45% AA. Most St Albans folks would turn up their nose at DeMatha.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If STA wants to be a kind and diverse place they need to stop preferentially admitting the children of VIPs and those who were born with a silver spoon in their mouth. It's ridiculous, really. They keep wringing their hands and speaking about diversity and kindness and inclusion and then year after year they admit the kids of CEOs and law partners and more recently---of Trump appointees--all from a select number of private schools.

They do so preferentially over equally qualified kids from public and equally qualified kids with parents who are pediatricians and journalists and government lawyers. And then they turn around and wonder, "gee whiz! Whey is our student body so elitist? Why are the boys so unkind?". "Maybe if we had one more diversity chapel we would solve this problem. Yes, let's have one more chapel. That will fix it!".
Giant eye roll.

+10000.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dp: so no one is going to address this?

Address what? Chat rooms set up to complain about a school or students or parents?
Hopefully Op finds a good pity party school for her kids or whatever she’s looking for.

Maybe try that private school Obama went to with a bunch of Asian and Hawaiian and white kids. How was their BLM complaint blog? Better than the GDS one?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If STA wants to be a kind and diverse place they need to stop preferentially admitting the children of VIPs and those who were born with a silver spoon in their mouth. It's ridiculous, really. They keep wringing their hands and speaking about diversity and kindness and inclusion and then year after year they admit the kids of CEOs and law partners and more recently---of Trump appointees--all from a select number of private schools.

They do so preferentially over equally qualified kids from public and equally qualified kids with parents who are pediatricians and journalists and government lawyers. And then they turn around and wonder, "gee whiz! Whey is our student body so elitist? Why are the boys so unkind?". "Maybe if we had one more diversity chapel we would solve this problem. Yes, let's have one more chapel. That will fix it!".
Giant eye roll.

+1.

I'll add to this by saying that it was a real shock coming from Beauvoir. Beauvoir isn't perfect, but it is quite committed to diversity in admissions (and elsewhere). As one fellow family put it, "the only reason STA is diverse is because of Beauvoir." After fourth grade, admissions at STA is somehow influenced in no small part by the desire by a small set of white, highly conservative families to get their friends in. Not every admit, but a LOT.

I don't know *why* STA perpetuates this disconnect between admissions and all of its overtures to diversity and inclusion. I don't say that just because it makes their commitments to diversity ring pretty hollow and the achievement of their initiatives basically impossible. I say that because it doesn't even seem to add up in a "money talks" way. Some of the very biggest donors to the school aren't in that little group, and we've watched as candidates they've supported get rejected, so it isn't the case that it's this one little group keeping the school's capital campaign afloat. It's not. We've also seen STA reject plenty of diverse applicants who are not lacking in money and/or prestige. I'm not saying only prestigious or wealthy families should get in. I'm saying that EVEN IF that was what was going on, it makes very little sense why STA is still happy to reject wealthy, prestigious diverse applicants, many of whom are coming from elite privates too. It doesn't add up...unless, as we are starting to fear, STA is more interested in being a club for a few families than a school for the best and brightest of all types of boys.

Anyway, OP, admissions is one of the key things, if not the key thing, that has to change for STA to make good on any of its commitments to a more welcoming environment for all students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dp: so no one is going to address this?

Address what? Chat rooms set up to complain about a school or students or parents?
Hopefully Op finds a good pity party school for her kids or whatever she’s looking for.

Maybe try that private school Obama went to with a bunch of Asian and Hawaiian and white kids. How was their BLM complaint blog? Better than the GDS one?

OP: If this is someone in the STA/NCS community, this tells you a lot. I hope it's not, but who knows.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:O.p. It is about power. White W.A.S.P. males have "lorded" over the U.S. since its inception. It used to be just being white alone was not good enough. My Jewish + Catholic relatives were shunned + excluded. The Jewish ones were killed in the Holocaust. Now U.M.C. whites can largely pass for W.A.S.P.S. If they look + act the part + as long as their names are not "too Jewish" or "too ethnic". So it stands to reason that since N.C.S. + STA are W.A.S.P. "Enclaves, i.e. Episcopalen, that they would be the most exclusive + want to retain white "waspy" power. Yes they will admit some "acceptable looking" people of color, but they will never truly fit in unless they come from famous +/or celebrity families.

Do you have firsthand knowledge of this at the schools? I'm not being oppositional. I'm asking because you're lumping a fair bit of things together here. The Episcopal church may have a waspy history, for instance, but it is extraordinarily diverse and progressive and has been for a very long time. That doesn't answer the questions about NCS/STA or vice versa.

Yes I do, and I was not offering a "value judgment" but rather just presenting the situation to the O.P. Of course, the people in power will do many charitable deeds. It does not follow however that they want to give up their power + give "their children's seats" to someone else.just as people may have B.L.M. Signs in their exclusive neighborhoods + support the cause; it does not mean they want to "give up" their neighborhoods to people of color.

My white child went to one of these schools + passed as W.A.S.P. Because we are U.M.C. + child was a top athlete in 3 reply sports.

[Anonymous]

Meant "preppy" sports in p.p.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:O.p. It is about power. White W.A.S.P. males have "lorded" over the U.S. since its inception. It used to be just being white alone was not good enough. My Jewish + Catholic relatives were shunned + excluded. The Jewish ones were killed in the Holocaust. Now U.M.C. whites can largely pass for W.A.S.P.S. If they look + act the part + as long as their names are not "too Jewish" or "too ethnic". So it stands to reason that since N.C.S. + STA are W.A.S.P. "Enclaves, i.e. Episcopalen, that they would be the most exclusive + want to retain white "waspy" power. Yes they will admit some "acceptable looking" people of color, but they will never truly fit in unless they come from famous +/or celebrity families.

Do you have firsthand knowledge of this at the schools? I'm not being oppositional. I'm asking because you're lumping a fair bit of things together here. The Episcopal church may have a waspy history, for instance, but it is extraordinarily diverse and progressive and has been for a very long time. That doesn't answer the questions about NCS/STA or vice versa.

This is a very naive assessment of the Episcopal Church.

[Anonymous]

My daughter is a Latina student at NCS (a pretty small group, so I'm not going to get too specific). Her experience doesn't match those described in the Instagram accounts. I note that the same accounts exist for schools like SFS, GDS and Maret, all local publics. In reading through them all, I have (and she has, based on her own experiences) a tough time believing that all of the contributions are authentic and/or objective, though there is probably a grain of truth in at least some of them (as there probably is for all the local schools). The fact that anonymous contributions are accepted and posted makes it tough to tell what's real and what's trolling.

With respect to the commentary by the recently departed D&I director, it's puzzling that she came to all these conclusions during a 4 month period when everyone was remote (and during this time, my daughter had no exposure to her at all). Her commentary says "I knew that the Black power fist tattoo on my back could be shown under no circumstances." That seems pretty absurd based on what my daughter shows me on her group texts, as her and her group of friends are about as militantly pro-BLM as you'll find. Same with the faculty and administration, and the Cathedral staff/clergy. From what I have seen, the political culture at NCS, among the students and faculty at least, is very progressive, at least among a pretty large segment of the students.

The prior D&I director, who was excellent, left at the end of last year to take a HoS job. Her diversity day programs were excellent, and my daughter loved them. Separately, Rodney Glasgow (who was then MS head at St. Andrews, and is now HoS at SSFS) came to do a presentation either last year or the prior year, and my daughter couldn't stop raving about his discussion of the intersection of race and sexual orientation. Similarly, the Director of Admissions is very committed to these issues, and walks the walk. If you don't believe me, go find out for yourself.

At the parent level, I do find the culture fairly privileged, though I like the vast majority of parents. As a family with less money than a lot of other Close families, I do sometimes feel that there's an unconscious thoughtlessness about how we might, for example, not make small talk over the lavish vacations we'll be taking once Covid is over. However, the administration is very conscious about this, and bends over backwards to try to make sure students feel an environment based on equity.

Back to the recently departed D&I head... I wonder if her 2 years at her prior school, mixed with all the trauma of this past spring/summer, just soured her on doing this type of job. Too bad, because Toni Morrison is also one of my favorite authors, and I'd have loved to see what types of programs she might have put in place if she hadn't quit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My daughter is a Latina student at NCS (a pretty small group, so I'm not going to get too specific). Her experience doesn't match those described in the Instagram accounts. I note that the same accounts exist for schools like SFS, GDS and Maret, all local publics. In reading through them all, I have (and she has, based on her own experiences) a tough time believing that all of the contributions are authentic and/or objective, though there is probably a grain of truth in at least some of them (as there probably is for all the local schools). The fact that anonymous contributions are accepted and posted makes it tough to tell what's real and what's trolling.

With respect to the commentary by the recently departed D&I director, it's puzzling that she came to all these conclusions during a 4 month period when everyone was remote (and during this time, my daughter had no exposure to her at all). Her commentary says "I knew that the Black power fist tattoo on my back could be shown under no circumstances." That seems pretty absurd based on what my daughter shows me on her group texts, as her and her group of friends are about as militantly pro-BLM as you'll find. Same with the faculty and administration, and the Cathedral staff/clergy. From what I have seen, the political culture at NCS, among the students and faculty at least, is very progressive, at least among a pretty large segment of the students.

The prior D&I director, who was excellent, left at the end of last year to take a HoS job. Her diversity day programs were excellent, and my daughter loved them. Separately, Rodney Glasgow (who was then MS head at St. Andrews, and is now HoS at SSFS) came to do a presentation either last year or the prior year, and my daughter couldn't stop raving about his discussion of the intersection of race and sexual orientation. Similarly, the Director of Admissions is very committed to these issues, and walks the walk. If you don't believe me, go find out for yourself.

At the parent level, I do find the culture fairly privileged, though I like the vast majority of parents. As a family with less money than a lot of other Close families, I do sometimes feel that there's an unconscious thoughtlessness about how we might, for example, not make small talk over the lavish vacations we'll be taking once Covid is over. However, the administration is very conscious about this, and bends over backwards to try to make sure students feel an environment based on equity.

Back to the recently departed D&I head... I wonder if her 2 years at her prior school, mixed with all the trauma of this past spring/summer, just soured her on doing this type of job. Too bad, because Toni Morrison is also one of my favorite authors, and I'd have loved to see what types of programs she might have put in place if she hadn't quit.

You meant that gds and sfs are privates right? Assuming that was a typo.