Would you tell your IVF conceived child that the other embryos were discarded?

[Anonymous]

If you told any of your siblings that you discarded the embryos, or even told a close friend, they will probably tell your child eventually.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was an IVF baby and that question honestly has never crossed my mind. If and when I am in that situation myself though, I morally could not make the decision to discard embryos.

They are YOUR embryos. You can do whatever with them.

[Anonymous]

I would if it came up but I don't think we will bring it up ourselves. I don't consider it a big deal. It's not like they were actual siblings - just potential siblings.

[Anonymous]

We have three embryos on ice that I know we are going to have to discard. We have three kids already and are just done with procreation. But you know, even with every rational thought on the side of discarding, and even with being 100% prochoice, atheist and whatnot, it's still not an easy decision. not at all. It's pretty damn hard to deny their humanity after you already know that in our case, they are genetically normal, two girls and one boy, and their sibling who got picked out has just gone to bed.

Of course if my child ever asked, I'd tell him they were discarded and to be damn happy he was the one who got picked, because it could have just as easily been the one on the left or the one on the right.

I'm going to discard. What I'm saying is that it's not an easy thing and it's not a "no big deal."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We have three embryos on ice that I know we are going to have to discard. We have three kids already and are just done with procreation. But you know, even with every rational thought on the side of discarding, and even with being 100% prochoice, atheist and whatnot, it's still not an easy decision. not at all. It's pretty damn hard to deny their humanity after you already know that in our case, they are genetically normal, two girls and one boy, and their sibling who got picked out has just gone to bed.

Of course if my child ever asked, I'd tell him they were discarded and to be damn happy he was the one who got picked, because it could have just as easily been the one on the left or the one on the right.

I'm going to discard. What I'm saying is that it's not an easy thing and it's not a "no big deal."

Thank you for saying this. I’m in the same situation and I can’t help but think that it’s simply luck of the draw that we have the two kids we have now. I am also 100% pro-choice, but I have to say it does bother me looking at my kids and knowing they could just have easily have been discarded as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So many embryos don’t make it so many don’t survive the freeze and thaw process. So many don’t implant. They are not children.

That’s a reason to view ART with skepticism, not to deny the humanity of these tiny humans.

NP here. Speaking as someone who did 5 rounds of IVF, biology does not intend all embryos to become babies. The process is VERY inefficient and even in young, healthy couples, a high percentage of eggs that fertilize and develop enough to become embryos are genetically abnormal and unable to continue development. The rate is around 50% for women under 30 and goes down after that. And even genetically normal embryos only successfully implant and become continued pregnancies 70% of the time, at the very most. They are not only NOT humans, it is IMPOSSIBLE for them to become humans because they are not genetically complete. That's how human reproduction works, and it's a reality that hits you hard when you do IVF.

+1000
We had so many that didn’t make it. More than 20. If you want to call those tiny humans just think of all the wasted sperm from various ways men make sperm and all the wasted eggs women discard each month. Throw in there the wasted babies that MC despite all efforts. So many tiny “humans” unborn.

[Anonymous]

OP -- I understand your question. Deciding what to do with the embryos was one of the most difficult decisions I've had to make. We paid to freeze them for years. Finally, we decided to donate them to research. My DD knows she's a child of IVF. She's only 12, so she hasn't asked a lot of questions yet, although she knows that there were two embryos put in and only one (her) implanted. I think that was a little weird for her to realize she could have been a twin. I'm sure she'll ask this question or it will come up at some point and we will have to explain. This is hard for me because, unlike some on this board, I do feel like this has moral implications. I felt that in deciding to use IVF in the first place too. I hope that the embryos we donated led to some important scientific knowledge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would if it came up but I don't think we will bring it up ourselves. I don't consider it a big deal. It's not like they were actual siblings - just potential siblings.

And I say this because we went through several failed IVF/FET cycles before getting our first BFP.

An embryo is a CHANCE at a child. Not really a child. It has to implant and continue to grow to realize the potential. None of that is a given for any embryo - via ART or not.

We donated our remaining embryos to science.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you have a child that was conceived through IVF, have you or could you see yourself at some point (maybe late teens or later) see yourself sharing with them that the other embryos were discarded? I don't mean coming right out and saying it of course, but if you just happened to be discussing the topic of IVF, do you think you would reveal that information?

This is a ridiculous problem to make up and have. Not all or even many embryos make it. It’s a long process. The DCs don’t need to know, or get into the particulars unless they are adults and having an infertility problem themselves; ie doing IVF. Don’t make up problems to have : there are plenty of problems that will come along without making one up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP -- I understand your question. Deciding what to do with the embryos was one of the most difficult decisions I've had to make. We paid to freeze them for years. Finally, we decided to donate them to research. My DD knows she's a child of IVF. She's only 12, so she hasn't asked a lot of questions yet, although she knows that there were two embryos put in and only one (her) implanted. I think that was a little weird for her to realize she could have been a twin. I'm sure she'll ask this question or it will come up at some point and we will have to explain. This is hard for me because, unlike some on this board, I do feel like this has moral implications. I felt that in deciding to use IVF in the first place too. I hope that the embryos we donated led to some important scientific knowledge.

You felt like you needed to shift this burden into your child? What a great mom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have three embryos on ice that I know we are going to have to discard. We have three kids already and are just done with procreation. But you know, even with every rational thought on the side of discarding, and even with being 100% prochoice, atheist and whatnot, it's still not an easy decision. not at all. It's pretty damn hard to deny their humanity after you already know that in our case, they are genetically normal, two girls and one boy, and their sibling who got picked out has just gone to bed.

Of course if my child ever asked, I'd tell him they were discarded and to be damn happy he was the one who got picked, because it could have just as easily been the one on the left or the one on the right.

I'm going to discard. What I'm saying is that it's not an easy thing and it's not a "no big deal."

Thank you for saying this. I’m in the same situation and I can’t help but think that it’s simply luck of the draw that we have the two kids we have now. I am also 100% pro-choice, but I have to say it does bother me looking at my kids and knowing they could just have easily have been discarded as well.

For me, these points are what proved difficult. I'm pro-choice, and I have zero judgment for what people do or don't do with their embryos. I also agree with PP's that IVF makes painfully clear how inefficient human reproduction is, and also makes clear that embryos simply are not children; at best (AT BEST) they are potential children. Most are potential failed transfers, honestly.

Nonetheless, once I had embryos take and become children, I viewed the leftover embryo (we only have one left) in a totally different light. We had tried to PGS test that embryo, but the lab screwed up the sample and we got no results. So we don't know if that one remaining embryo even has a snowball's chance in hell of making it, but we didn't know if DC1 had a chance either, and here he is, and he's the light of our lives. For us personally, it has been a struggle to figure out what we want to do with that last embryo. Others may not feel the same way. (Especially in a world of PGS, whether an embryo is a potential child or not is a lot more clear earlier on, which might make it easier or harder, depending on how many normal embryos you get).

As for telling your kid, why don't you just try age-appropriate honesty? "Here's how IVF works. Here's why many couples need it. Here's why it's such a great thing, but there are many things that make it hard, and you've asked about one of the things that was hard for us. Here's how we thought about it. If you're ever faced with going through IVF, you might face a similar question. How would you think about it?" Why is this fundamentally different than any other difficult issue you should help your child think through, at an age-appropriate time?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was an IVF baby and that question honestly has never crossed my mind. If and when I am in that situation myself though, I morally could not make the decision to discard embryos.

They are YOUR embryos. You can do whatever with them.

Just because one can discard doesn’t mean it feels morally right to do so. The only way I could go through IVF is by making the commitment that I would use or donate to another person/couple any resulting euploid embryos. I’m pro choice so no issue with others doing what is right for them, but discarding a pgs tested euploid embryo is not something I could do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you have a child that was conceived through IVF, have you or could you see yourself at some point (maybe late teens or later) see yourself sharing with them that the other embryos were discarded? I don't mean coming right out and saying it of course, but if you just happened to be discussing the topic of IVF, do you think you would reveal that information?

This is a ridiculous problem to make up and have. Not all or even many embryos make it. It’s a long process. The DCs don’t need to know, or get into the particulars unless they are adults and having an infertility problem themselves; ie doing IVF. Don’t make up problems to have : there are plenty of problems that will come along without making one up.

It’s really not ridiculous though. This is something DW and I have discussed for years. We will have some left and it’s painful to think of destroying them for all of the reasons listed here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So many embryos don’t make it so many don’t survive the freeze and thaw process. So many don’t implant. They are not children.

That’s a reason to view ART with skepticism, not to deny the humanity of these tiny humans.

NP here. Speaking as someone who did 5 rounds of IVF, biology does not intend all embryos to become babies. The process is VERY inefficient and even in young, healthy couples, a high percentage of eggs that fertilize and develop enough to become embryos are genetically abnormal and unable to continue development. The rate is around 50% for women under 30 and goes down after that. And even genetically normal embryos only successfully implant and become continued pregnancies 70% of the time, at the very most. They are not only NOT humans, it is IMPOSSIBLE for them to become humans because they are not genetically complete. That's how human reproduction works, and it's a reality that hits you hard when you do IVF.

+1000
We had so many that didn’t make it. More than 20. If you want to call those tiny humans just think of all the wasted sperm from various ways men make sperm and all the wasted eggs women discard each month. Throw in there the wasted babies that MC despite all efforts. So many tiny “humans” unborn.

Sperm and eggs only have half of a genome. Very different than an embryo.