High staff turnover at daycare/preschool

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some amount of turnover happens and is to be expected. These are low paying jobs and life happens and some people aren’t great employees. I’m going to say in the range of 10-15% during the school year. Or maybe 1-3 people on a 20 person staff and maybe 5-7 people on a 50 person staff.

Then, there is some amount of turnover that suggests problems of some sort. Before I’d switch daycares, I’d also look at how the center is handling it.

I don’t know where you work but there is no job and I mean no career that has 50 employees where they only lose 5-7 people a year. Doesn’t exist. Especially in a stressful trade like preschool or teaching. Wake up and stop spewing fake stats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some amount of turnover happens and is to be expected. These are low paying jobs and life happens and some people aren’t great employees. I’m going to say in the range of 10-15% during the school year. Or maybe 1-3 people on a 20 person staff and maybe 5-7 people on a 50 person staff.

Then, there is some amount of turnover that suggests problems of some sort. Before I’d switch daycares, I’d also look at how the center is handling it.

I don’t know where you work but there is no job and I mean no career that has 50 employees where they only lose 5-7 people a year. Doesn’t exist. Especially in a stressful trade like preschool or teaching. Wake up and stop spewing fake stats.

Clearly you don't work in government. People in my organization do. not. leave.

[Anonymous]

somewhere between 15-20 people on staff at DC’s daycare. No one has left since we started in September.

[Anonymous]

Well, there are some daycares (not-for-profits, mostly) that believe in providing a living wage and benefits to their employees. Let's be clear, it's still not high pay, but it's certainly not minimum wage. There are daycares in the general area (e.g., Wonders in Bethesda) that offer tuition remission for teachers' children, health care subsidies, and raises for additional certifications. I believe Wonders' turnover at their core operation in Bethesda is much lower, maybe 15-20%. Keep in mind that a 20% turnover means that people work there for an average of 5 years. This means for every person who comes in for just one year and realizes it's not their thing or doesn't work out, there is a teacher with 10 years of experience.

This is generally NOT true of the for-profits places like Bright Horizons, who basically abuse a lot of their employees by keeping them part-time and/or cutting their hours when kids call in sick. You're going to get high turnover in that kind of environment and hence why the average turnover across all daycares is something like 40%

[Anonymous]

Keep in mind that OSSE is raising the education requirements for teachers and assistants. The requirements for assistants went into effect in December 2019 -minimum requirement is a CDA. You can apply for a temporary waiver for an assistant who is currently taking CDA classes, but otherwise they will not be able to remain employed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, there are some daycares (not-for-profits, mostly) that believe in providing a living wage and benefits to their employees. Let's be clear, it's still not high pay, but it's certainly not minimum wage. There are daycares in the general area (e.g., Wonders in Bethesda) that offer tuition remission for teachers' children, health care subsidies, and raises for additional certifications. I believe Wonders' turnover at their core operation in Bethesda is much lower, maybe 15-20%. Keep in mind that a 20% turnover means that people work there for an average of 5 years. This means for every person who comes in for just one year and realizes it's not their thing or doesn't work out, there is a teacher with 10 years of experience.

This is generally NOT true of the for-profits places like Bright Horizons, who basically abuse a lot of their employees by keeping them part-time and/or cutting their hours when kids call in sick. You're going to get high turnover in that kind of environment and hence why the average turnover across all daycares is something like 40%

I think you have to look at each daycare individually. I visited one Goddard School where they have teachers that have been there for 20 years. At a different Goddard School, I asked about turnover and got a speech about how there is turnover at all daycares. Goddard has a franchise model so it does depend on the owner of the specific facility. We're currently a for-profit daycare, but it's a local business with just a few locations, and is very well-run, with low turnover.

When I was visiting daycares while pregnant I felt completely ill-equipped to decide what the best place would be for my baby. The main thing I ended up looking at was, do the teachers look happy? And it's worked out well so far.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, there are some daycares (not-for-profits, mostly) that believe in providing a living wage and benefits to their employees. Let's be clear, it's still not high pay, but it's certainly not minimum wage. There are daycares in the general area (e.g., Wonders in Bethesda) that offer tuition remission for teachers' children, health care subsidies, and raises for additional certifications. I believe Wonders' turnover at their core operation in Bethesda is much lower, maybe 15-20%. Keep in mind that a 20% turnover means that people work there for an average of 5 years. This means for every person who comes in for just one year and realizes it's not their thing or doesn't work out, there is a teacher with 10 years of experience.

This is generally NOT true of the for-profits places like Bright Horizons, who basically abuse a lot of their employees by keeping them part-time and/or cutting their hours when kids call in sick. You're going to get high turnover in that kind of environment and hence why the average turnover across all daycares is something like 40%

I think you have to look at each daycare individually. I visited one Goddard School where they have teachers that have been there for 20 years. At a different Goddard School, I asked about turnover and got a speech about how there is turnover at all daycares. Goddard has a franchise model so it does depend on the owner of the specific facility. We're currently a for-profit daycare, but it's a local business with just a few locations, and is very well-run, with low turnover.

When I was visiting daycares while pregnant I felt completely ill-equipped to decide what the best place would be for my baby. The main thing I ended up looking at was, do the teachers look happy? And it's worked out well so far.

You're right, I'm generalizing from the Bright Horizons model. There are good for-profit daycares and bad non-profit daycares, in terms of how they treat staff

[Anonymous]

At our preschool/daycare, there is very low turnover. I think it's because they are paid "well" compared to others in the same field.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, there are some daycares (not-for-profits, mostly) that believe in providing a living wage and benefits to their employees. Let's be clear, it's still not high pay, but it's certainly not minimum wage. There are daycares in the general area (e.g., Wonders in Bethesda) that offer tuition remission for teachers' children, health care subsidies, and raises for additional certifications. I believe Wonders' turnover at their core operation in Bethesda is much lower, maybe 15-20%. Keep in mind that a 20% turnover means that people work there for an average of 5 years. This means for every person who comes in for just one year and realizes it's not their thing or doesn't work out, there is a teacher with 10 years of experience.

This is generally NOT true of the for-profits places like Bright Horizons, who basically abuse a lot of their employees by keeping them part-time and/or cutting their hours when kids call in sick. You're going to get high turnover in that kind of environment and hence why the average turnover across all daycares is something like 40%

I’d Wonders a not for profit? If so, is it in name only? (Many hospitals aren’t non-profit for tax reasons, but operate very much like any other business.) we are at a daycare with Wonders like benefits and turnover, and it is family owned (unlike BH, for example) but I am still pretty sure it operates as a for profit business.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, there are some daycares (not-for-profits, mostly) that believe in providing a living wage and benefits to their employees. Let's be clear, it's still not high pay, but it's certainly not minimum wage. There are daycares in the general area (e.g., Wonders in Bethesda) that offer tuition remission for teachers' children, health care subsidies, and raises for additional certifications. I believe Wonders' turnover at their core operation in Bethesda is much lower, maybe 15-20%. Keep in mind that a 20% turnover means that people work there for an average of 5 years. This means for every person who comes in for just one year and realizes it's not their thing or doesn't work out, there is a teacher with 10 years of experience.

This is generally NOT true of the for-profits places like Bright Horizons, who basically abuse a lot of their employees by keeping them part-time and/or cutting their hours when kids call in sick. You're going to get high turnover in that kind of environment and hence why the average turnover across all daycares is something like 40%

I’d Wonders a not for profit? If so, is it in name only? (Many hospitals aren’t non-profit for tax reasons, but operate very much like any other business.) we are at a daycare with Wonders like benefits and turnover, and it is family owned (unlike BH, for example) but I am still pretty sure it operates as a for profit business.

I'm not sure what you mean by "in name only?" Are you suggesting that there are organizations that call themselves not for profits that are actually for profits? Because that is illegal. Family owned is just like any other for-profit business that is expected to deliver returns to the owners. Just, in the case of the family owned business, it's the family getting the returns. In a not for profit, any income is reinvested into the business and does not get paid out to owners.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, there are some daycares (not-for-profits, mostly) that believe in providing a living wage and benefits to their employees. Let's be clear, it's still not high pay, but it's certainly not minimum wage. There are daycares in the general area (e.g., Wonders in Bethesda) that offer tuition remission for teachers' children, health care subsidies, and raises for additional certifications. I believe Wonders' turnover at their core operation in Bethesda is much lower, maybe 15-20%. Keep in mind that a 20% turnover means that people work there for an average of 5 years. This means for every person who comes in for just one year and realizes it's not their thing or doesn't work out, there is a teacher with 10 years of experience.

This is generally NOT true of the for-profits places like Bright Horizons, who basically abuse a lot of their employees by keeping them part-time and/or cutting their hours when kids call in sick. You're going to get high turnover in that kind of environment and hence why the average turnover across all daycares is something like 40%

I’d Wonders a not for profit? If so, is it in name only? (Many hospitals aren’t non-profit for tax reasons, but operate very much like any other business.) we are at a daycare with Wonders like benefits and turnover, and it is family owned (unlike BH, for example) but I am still pretty sure it operates as a for profit business.

I'm not sure what you mean by "in name only?" Are you suggesting that there are organizations that call themselves not for profits that are actually for profits? Because that is illegal. Family owned is just like any other for-profit business that is expected to deliver returns to the owners. Just, in the case of the family owned business, it's the family getting the returns. In a not for profit, any income is reinvested into the business and does not get paid out to owners.

DP. True but I think many people think of nonprofits as being charities that receive grants and fundraise to provide services to clients. However, many nonprofits, like hospitals and universities, provide services in exchange for fees (that are often quite high) much like a business. A nonprofit daycare is a bit like that as well. Nothing wrong with that at all, though the waters get a bit muddied when a nonprofit like a university or a hospital is paying its administrators huge salaries. I doubt that's the case at Wonders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, there are some daycares (not-for-profits, mostly) that believe in providing a living wage and benefits to their employees. Let's be clear, it's still not high pay, but it's certainly not minimum wage. There are daycares in the general area (e.g., Wonders in Bethesda) that offer tuition remission for teachers' children, health care subsidies, and raises for additional certifications. I believe Wonders' turnover at their core operation in Bethesda is much lower, maybe 15-20%. Keep in mind that a 20% turnover means that people work there for an average of 5 years. This means for every person who comes in for just one year and realizes it's not their thing or doesn't work out, there is a teacher with 10 years of experience.

This is generally NOT true of the for-profits places like Bright Horizons, who basically abuse a lot of their employees by keeping them part-time and/or cutting their hours when kids call in sick. You're going to get high turnover in that kind of environment and hence why the average turnover across all daycares is something like 40%

I’d Wonders a not for profit? If so, is it in name only? (Many hospitals aren’t non-profit for tax reasons, but operate very much like any other business.) we are at a daycare with Wonders like benefits and turnover, and it is family owned (unlike BH, for example) but I am still pretty sure it operates as a for profit business.

I'm not sure what you mean by "in name only?" Are you suggesting that there are organizations that call themselves not for profits that are actually for profits? Because that is illegal. Family owned is just like any other for-profit business that is expected to deliver returns to the owners. Just, in the case of the family owned business, it's the family getting the returns. In a not for profit, any income is reinvested into the business and does not get paid out to owners.

DP. True but I think many people think of nonprofits as being charities that receive grants and fundraise to provide services to clients. However, many nonprofits, like hospitals and universities, provide services in exchange for fees (that are often quite high) much like a business. A nonprofit daycare is a bit like that as well. Nothing wrong with that at all, though the waters get a bit muddied when a nonprofit like a university or a hospital is paying its administrators huge salaries. I doubt that's the case at Wonders.

That’s precisely what I meant. And I am sure that Wonders’s salaries are nowhere near the salaries of hospital or university executives. But that still doesn’t mean it functions as a non-profit in the traditional sense and what would be “profits” could still go to leadership, even if a lower level than at hospitals/universities.

Wonders tuition is comparable to other centers as are its programs, so I am not sure how it being a non-profit conveys any benefit other than a talking point.

This isn’t to knock Wonders. We liked it when we looked at it and friends who used it have been happy. It is simply a discussion of their tax status.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I'm def browsing other options, but our kid seems to be happy there and that's why I'm hesitating. I just worry that something is wrong with the administrative oversight. I should add that in October their director left abruptly so there is also an interim director since then. High turnover worries me, but it also worries me that they don't communicate it well. I come one day and see new faces, so I ask questions and find out that X person doesn't work there anymore. I want to give them a credit that it might be due to a lack of stable leadership but also how difficult it's to draft an email to all parents and inform them about staffing changes...Are other daycares/preschools better about communicating?

That’s a lie! She didn’t leave abruptly. The school advised she was going into a different field, which was confirmed with her Facebook. She was there for months after the initial email went out advising all parents of her leaving and she stayed to train the interim director. Also the interim director has been there for years as a teacher and manager. Stop being a dramatic person. It’s not the school’s fault in this situation. Tell the truth and stop leaning the information in the negative.

Did OP even name her center? If not, how could you know if this was a lie.

OP here. Yeah, this person who accuses me of being dishonest doesn’t seem to know my center. Our situation was completely different. Director acknowledged in her resignation email that she was leaving abruptly and this was not previously communicated. Guess our center isn’t the only one with this problem but please don’t call me a liar or dramatic person in the future. Thanks ?

Trinity?

[Anonymous]

Preschool teacher here. I work at a part-time half-day preschool based in a church. We have very low turnover: in the past 3 years, we have had 6 of 22 staff leave. 3 retirements (after 20-30 year tenures at our school), one move away, one changed to a new field, one stayed home with kids. Our pay is better than a typical day care center's pay.

Also, I think that preschools run by church/temple tend to retain staff longer because many of the staff are committed to a higher mission and/or are part of a church community. It is more than just a job for many staff at this kind of school. I think that is a hidden benefit of a religiously-affiliated school, even if you are not at all interested in the religion part.

OP, that sounds like too much turnover, and too little communication. It may indeed be that during their transition in leadership, they are not handling everything so smoothly. That would give me some concern.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PPs who say that their centers have very low turnover, can you please please post names of these centers? We've been at two centers. Both have had very bad turnover, and it has been dealt with terribly by management. I'd really love to know the names of better options in DC.

+1000 would love to know what centers have low turnover

Over the last 3 years we've had kids at Children in the Shoe BCC, none of the teachers in either the infant or toddler rooms they were in left. I'd guess 15-20% turnover? I don't know what they pay relative to other centers in the area, but I've noticed that they don't send people home even when it's not needed to maintain ratios. I've done pickups where there are 3-4 teachers with the same number of kids in a combined room.