VBAC attempt experience

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My best friend tried a VBAC after a scheduled C section for a breech baby. She had some really fanciful notions about vaginal childbirth being some kind of empowering and beautiful experience she has missed out on and felt like she has failed in her first for having a section and was hell bent on trying for a vaginal birth. Some of her friends had had vaginal births tried to disavow her of these unrealistic expectations and to explain to her how painful and difficult the experience was but she wouldn’t hear it. She ended up having a long and painful labor and then a traumatic emergency C section which she said was far worse than the scheduled one. I think the only benefit she has now is that she can still run easily with no leaking or pelvic floor issues. But even after all that she still seems to think she missed out on something from not having a vaginal birth.

Screw you.

Why? If mom and baby are healthy and no one died or was permanently injured, WTF does it matter if baby came out of your belly instead of your lady bits? Plenty of vaginal births are horrific and injurious but the VBAC community refuses to hear that.

I think the issue is that people like you discount other people's preferences if you don't share them. Many woman want to experience labor and vaginal childbirth. People like you are always offended by and dismissive of the reasons they want to do that. My reason was that I believe that childbirth is an experience that is uniquely female and I wanted to experience what billions of women before me experienced. I did find that birth was an empowering and beautiful experience, which was obviously largely a function of both of my births going smoothly and everyone coming through them healthy and happy. I would certainly feel differently if that wasn't the case, but before my first baby was born (10 years ago), I would have felt disappointment at not having had that experience. I know that women like you like to discount the mother's experience of birth as selfish and trivial, but not everyone feels that way. I don't think that my desire to experience vaginal childbirth is selfish, particularly since I absolutely would not trade "experience vaginal childbirth" for the health of my child. My sister recently had an emergency c-section with her first baby, and she plans to try for a VBAC next time. I know that she feels like she missed out on the experience that I and our mother had in having babies vaginally, even though she also feels grateful that her baby was healthy.

There are also complications to c-sections which the "VBAC moms are selfish" community refuses to hear.

So what about all the moms who think childbirth is going to be an amazing and beautiful experience and end up with horrible injuries like prolapse or 4th degree tears? And all the C section moms who only hear beautiful empowering stories of vaginal birth and then who feel like they missed out on something, not recognizing they may have dodged a massive bullet? The ever-present narrative around C sections being bad and vaginal births being empowering and amazing is reductive, binary, and inaccurate. It makes anyone who didn’t have the perfect vaginal birth feel like total sh*t and people like you who got lucky yet don’t realize it intolerably arrogant.

Lol! Talk about reductive, binary and inaccurate. You don't speak for everyone that didn't have a "perfect vaginal birth". It sounds like you'd be better served by working on your self esteem issues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. Turns out that there is not a lot of hard data to inform decisions. From what I have found only 50% of attemps work and not much info on the the ones that worked led to issues for mom or baby, or if the ones that went to a c section after labor attempt had a higher chance of problems compared to scheduled second c sections. I could care less about which method to use from an experience perspective just want one that has the highest chance of better outcomes (and lower risk of really bad outcomes).

50%?! Lol, no.

"In fact, NICHD research shows that among appropriate candidates, about 75% of VBAC attempts are successful." - NIH

"Yet, it’s estimated that 60–80 percent of appropriate candidates who attempt VBAC will be successful." -ACOG

"Most published series examining women attempting TOLAC have demonstrated a vaginal delivery rate of 60–80%" - ACOG

ACOG also says uterine rupture is .5-.9%

In order of safety it's
1. VBAC
2. repeat C
3. failed VBAC

First 60 to 80% appropriate candidates may mean lower success overall since some people trying may not be appropriate.

Second, 60 to 80% is a huge range.

Third if vbac fails you move to to the least safe category which make any vbac riskier. You need to know how much safer 1 is compares to 3 to mae a real decision.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My best friend tried a VBAC after a scheduled C section for a breech baby. She had some really fanciful notions about vaginal childbirth being some kind of empowering and beautiful experience she has missed out on and felt like she has failed in her first for having a section and was hell bent on trying for a vaginal birth. Some of her friends had had vaginal births tried to disavow her of these unrealistic expectations and to explain to her how painful and difficult the experience was but she wouldn’t hear it. She ended up having a long and painful labor and then a traumatic emergency C section which she said was far worse than the scheduled one. I think the only benefit she has now is that she can still run easily with no leaking or pelvic floor issues. But even after all that she still seems to think she missed out on something from not having a vaginal birth.

Screw you.

Why? If mom and baby are healthy and no one died or was permanently injured, WTF does it matter if baby came out of your belly instead of your lady bits? Plenty of vaginal births are horrific and injurious but the VBAC community refuses to hear that.

I think the issue is that people like you discount other people's preferences if you don't share them. Many woman want to experience labor and vaginal childbirth. People like you are always offended by and dismissive of the reasons they want to do that. My reason was that I believe that childbirth is an experience that is uniquely female and I wanted to experience what billions of women before me experienced. I did find that birth was an empowering and beautiful experience, which was obviously largely a function of both of my births going smoothly and everyone coming through them healthy and happy. I would certainly feel differently if that wasn't the case, but before my first baby was born (10 years ago), I would have felt disappointment at not having had that experience. I know that women like you like to discount the mother's experience of birth as selfish and trivial, but not everyone feels that way. I don't think that my desire to experience vaginal childbirth is selfish, particularly since I absolutely would not trade "experience vaginal childbirth" for the health of my child. My sister recently had an emergency c-section with her first baby, and she plans to try for a VBAC next time. I know that she feels like she missed out on the experience that I and our mother had in having babies vaginally, even though she also feels grateful that her baby was healthy.

There are also complications to c-sections which the "VBAC moms are selfish" community refuses to hear.

So what about all the moms who think childbirth is going to be an amazing and beautiful experience and end up with horrible injuries like prolapse or 4th degree tears? And all the C section moms who only hear beautiful empowering stories of vaginal birth and then who feel like they missed out on something, not recognizing they may have dodged a massive bullet? The ever-present narrative around C sections being bad and vaginal births being empowering and amazing is reductive, binary, and inaccurate. It makes anyone who didn’t have the perfect vaginal birth feel like total sh*t and people like you who got lucky yet don’t realize it intolerably arrogant.

You know, not everything is about you. I can feel good about my experience and understand why someone would want to have that experience without putting your experience down. You can't do that. It's like someone having a good experience makes your experience worse somehow. I have never understood it.

Neither of my births was "perfect." I completely recognize that luck plays a role. I also do not believe that the way a birth goes is 100% due to luck because that seems quite reductive to me. Are you suggesting that there is nothing anyone can ever do to have a vaginal birth without complications? I think there are plenty of things women can do - for example, have good prenatal care and establish a good relationship with a high quality healthcare provider that is based on trust and respect. That is something you can do. I also think that understanding the mechanics of labor and delivery as well as complications can help with having a good experience. Obviously neither of those things is a magic solution, but when things were complicated during my second child's birth, the relationship I had with my OB and my knowledge of what was going on based on knowing a lot about labor and delivery changed the way that I felt about it.

I don't think that there is any kind of ever-present narrative for birth. For example, I didn't get an epidural with my first child. The majority of my friends questioned that decision. "Why would you do that to yourself?" they asked, as though I was doing something dangerous and stupid. Why did they care? Why is it impossible for you to accept that some people actually do that an empowering amazing birth? It's like you think that's a lie or something that they should not feel good about. I'm not sorry that I don't feel appropriately apologetic for having a good experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My best friend tried a VBAC after a scheduled C section for a breech baby. She had some really fanciful notions about vaginal childbirth being some kind of empowering and beautiful experience she has missed out on and felt like she has failed in her first for having a section and was hell bent on trying for a vaginal birth. Some of her friends had had vaginal births tried to disavow her of these unrealistic expectations and to explain to her how painful and difficult the experience was but she wouldn’t hear it. She ended up having a long and painful labor and then a traumatic emergency C section which she said was far worse than the scheduled one. I think the only benefit she has now is that she can still run easily with no leaking or pelvic floor issues. But even after all that she still seems to think she missed out on something from not having a vaginal birth.

You don’t sound like you respect your “best friend” very much. Also the pelvic floor issues are usually caused by pregnancy, not birth, but feel free to continue being misinformed AND judgmental!

Actually research shows most pelvic floor problems are caused by vaginal birth, with forceps increasing the risk. Pregnancy can cause some but it is actually the process of birth which causes most damage. PP you are just wrong.

DP, but the pelvic floor PT I saw said that pregnancy causes much of the damage, and vaginal birth only increases the risk if it's instrumental (forceps or vacuum) or with 3rd/4th degree tear. So, sure, it can increase risk, but it's not as unequivocal as many people claim.

Your PT is an idiot who is not up to date on any scientific evidence. I would love to see her tell that to someone with a fistula or anal sphincter tear that the cause was her pregnancy and not her delivery. You are promoting misinformation with zero backing. Please stop.

“Pelvic floor disorders are common conditions and are responsible for significant financial and emotional burden to patients and the healthcare system. Current literature suggests a strong association between vaginal delivery and both stress urinary incontinence and prolapse. Observational studies have identified certain obstetrical exposures, which appear to be more traumatic to the pelvic floor, particularly forceps delivery, prolonged second stage of labor and sphincter lacerations.”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3877300/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My best friend tried a VBAC after a scheduled C section for a breech baby. She had some really fanciful notions about vaginal childbirth being some kind of empowering and beautiful experience she has missed out on and felt like she has failed in her first for having a section and was hell bent on trying for a vaginal birth. Some of her friends had had vaginal births tried to disavow her of these unrealistic expectations and to explain to her how painful and difficult the experience was but she wouldn’t hear it. She ended up having a long and painful labor and then a traumatic emergency C section which she said was far worse than the scheduled one. I think the only benefit she has now is that she can still run easily with no leaking or pelvic floor issues. But even after all that she still seems to think she missed out on something from not having a vaginal birth.

Screw you.

Why? If mom and baby are healthy and no one died or was permanently injured, WTF does it matter if baby came out of your belly instead of your lady bits? Plenty of vaginal births are horrific and injurious but the VBAC community refuses to hear that.

Are you really this uninformed? I knew even before I was ever pregnant that these kinds of thoughts and feelings are common to the C-section experience!

Let me drop this little fact on you: Feelings of loss, missing out, doing something wrong, failing, and not fulfilling "your job as a woman" ARE SO COMMON AND UNIVERSAL POST-C-SECTION THAT IT IS LITERALLY PART OF THE VIDEO THEY MAKE YOU WATCH WHEN YOU LEAVE THE HOSPITAL. It is literally part of any book about C-sections or birth experience. It's a totally normal, common, natural, nearly universal experience that doctors and scientists study it.

I note you have no response to the bolded. Hmm, wonder why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tried it. It didn’t work. After hours of labor I had a small uterine rupture/window but the end result was baby and I were both Ok even though it was scary. I think people who try at home are crazy.
I actually don’t regret trying. So many people told me how amazing Labor was and how I needed to experience it. Got that out of my system. No thanks! Went on to have four more c sections.

I'm sorry but you've had 6 c sections?

I don't know if this is not believable or just really irresponsible on your doctor and your part.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Best thing to do. Listen to your doctor. It is a personal choice. Having a healthy baby and mom are the point. Neither is better for everyone.

That's just not true. I've had different doctors tell me different things. It felt like the one practice had an agenda ($$$$$$)

[Anonymous]

I had a successful VBAC at Georgetown. I was supposed to deliver at Sibley, but their maternity unit was full. It was a really long labor and I think I would have been told to call it quits if I was at Sibley. At Georgetown they seemed to treat it as a learning experience for the med student residents, so they let me push and push. The recovery was MUCH easier than with my c-section delivery, but I did tear. And go figure, baby #2's head was a lot larger than baby #1's head. So now I have the c-section scar and the leakiness. Best of both worlds

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tried it. It didn’t work. After hours of labor I had a small uterine rupture/window but the end result was baby and I were both Ok even though it was scary. I think people who try at home are crazy.
I actually don’t regret trying. So many people told me how amazing Labor was and how I needed to experience it. Got that out of my system. No thanks! Went on to have four more c sections.

I'm sorry but you've had 6 c sections?

Yep. No issues with any except the VBAC attempt on pregnancy #2.
You can all save the drama with telling me how irresponsible it is. I had great medical care and we took each section one at a time, checking when they stitched me up how my scar and uterus looked. Was cleared to have another one if I wanted (I don’t).

[Anonymous]

The reason I always hear for choosing a scheduled C is the desire for a controlled experience. I think that is a big motivation especially if you had a stressful first labor. I guess if your first was a scheduled C and you liked the controlled atmosphere then maybe you should go with that again? however if you are able to embrace the chaos and view the labor process a valuable birthing experience then I don’t think you will regret choosing VBAC. Not to say all the risks of either mode are equal but if you truly don’t know what to decide..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The reason I always hear for choosing a scheduled C is the desire for a controlled experience. I think that is a big motivation especially if you had a stressful first labor. I guess if your first was a scheduled C and you liked the controlled atmosphere then maybe you should go with that again? however if you are able to embrace the chaos and view the labor process a valuable birthing experience then I don’t think you will regret choosing VBAC. Not to say all the risks of either mode are equal but if you truly don’t know what to decide..

Yes, I think women, especially around here, like the scheduled aspect of the surgery because they can plan ahead with work etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The reason I always hear for choosing a scheduled C is the desire for a controlled experience. I think that is a big motivation especially if you had a stressful first labor. I guess if your first was a scheduled C and you liked the controlled atmosphere then maybe you should go with that again? however if you are able to embrace the chaos and view the labor process a valuable birthing experience then I don’t think you will regret choosing VBAC. Not to say all the risks of either mode are equal but if you truly don’t know what to decide..

Yes, I think women, especially around here, like the scheduled aspect of the surgery because they can plan ahead with work etc.

What about the women who attempt and don’t get it? Then have the trauma of another emergency C and then all the disappointment to boot, plus having to recover from two modes of delivery.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The reason I always hear for choosing a scheduled C is the desire for a controlled experience. I think that is a big motivation especially if you had a stressful first labor. I guess if your first was a scheduled C and you liked the controlled atmosphere then maybe you should go with that again? however if you are able to embrace the chaos and view the labor process a valuable birthing experience then I don’t think you will regret choosing VBAC. Not to say all the risks of either mode are equal but if you truly don’t know what to decide..

Yes, I think women, especially around here, like the scheduled aspect of the surgery because they can plan ahead with work etc.

What about the women who attempt and don’t get it? Then have the trauma of another emergency C and then all the disappointment to boot, plus having to recover from two modes of delivery.

I am going for a VBAC in a few months. I know I will regret if I don't try, if it ends in another C then so be it, but I'll know that I did everything I could at least.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The reason I always hear for choosing a scheduled C is the desire for a controlled experience. I think that is a big motivation especially if you had a stressful first labor. I guess if your first was a scheduled C and you liked the controlled atmosphere then maybe you should go with that again? however if you are able to embrace the chaos and view the labor process a valuable birthing experience then I don’t think you will regret choosing VBAC. Not to say all the risks of either mode are equal but if you truly don’t know what to decide..

Yes, I think women, especially around here, like the scheduled aspect of the surgery because they can plan ahead with work etc.

What about the women who attempt and don’t get it? Then have the trauma of another emergency C and then all the disappointment to boot, plus having to recover from two modes of delivery.

Not all emergency C’s are traumatic, it’s not like you only get one if you rupture. It can happen for all the same reasons FTMs get them which are usually not imminent.

A lot of women have disappointment after their child’s birth. The women I’ve talked to who were disappointed also did not regret trying for the VBAC. You so the best you can with the info you have at the time going into it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tried it. It didn’t work. After hours of labor I had a small uterine rupture/window but the end result was baby and I were both Ok even though it was scary. I think people who try at home are crazy.
I actually don’t regret trying. So many people told me how amazing Labor was and how I needed to experience it. Got that out of my system. No thanks! Went on to have four more c sections.

I'm sorry but you've had 6 c sections?

Yep. No issues with any except the VBAC attempt on pregnancy #2.
You can all save the drama with telling me how irresponsible it is. I had great medical care and we took each section one at a time, checking when they stitched me up how my scar and uterus looked. Was cleared to have another one if I wanted (I don’t).

Octomom