What is really behind the surge in applications to top colleges?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone is reading DCUM and is stressed. I think DCUM is secretly funded by the Russians to undermine our society.

or funded by the Indian gov to promote emmigration of crazy parents fom India to the US

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Harvard reported 3000 more applications than last year including a 14.9% jump in Asian-American and 18.7% jump in African-American applications.

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/2/14/applications-numbers-2018/

Also, with so many more applications, you'd think yield rates (#matriculating/#accepted) would go down (if Johnny is applying to 12 schools when 10 years ago he would have applied to 6) but yield rates are going up at most of the Ivies.

Elite college yields are increasing because students and parents are more and more prestige-driven and want their investment to have higher chances of paying off big time. The decision many middle class families make is the following: should I squeeze my finances a little bit more to cover the part of the tuition not covered by need-based aid at an ivy/elite or should I send my kid to the lower-tier private or state college where they ll have full-ride or almost full-ride merit aid? if the extra cost is not exorbitant many such families increasingly choose the first option because they view the elite school as the less risky bet for their child's future success.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My two Asian cousins from Cali put in close to thirty applications each.

I understand. I want my kids to apply to no more then 9 schools but then statistics reveal that as Asians, we have to apply to more schools.

That's because you Asians created your own applications arms race. Haven't you noticed that the elite schools are only taking two kids per high school? And then every top kid in the school is submitting 20-30 applications to those top schools? What the heck do you think is going to happen?

My white kid, strong academics and test scores but meh grades, and meh extracurriculars is 5 for 5 on apps to highly ranked competitive schools, both public and private. 4 were good/stretch fits and 1 safety. Only waiting to hear from one reach school. Start being realistic about the process instead of applying to all reach schools.

What is your point? If my Asian kid has strong academics and perfect test scores and top grades and is class officer; why would my child not apply to the top schools. If a student's stats fits the stats for top schools, why not apply? That's not the problem. The problem is Asians are < 6% of the US population, but are the highest percent that apply to colleges. The stats always state that Asians representation at universities are way above their population, but we are also the highest percent who are college bound.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harvard reported 3000 more applications than last year including a 14.9% jump in Asian-American and 18.7% jump in African-American applications.

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/2/14/applications-numbers-2018/

Also, with so many more applications, you'd think yield rates (#matriculating/#accepted) would go down (if Johnny is applying to 12 schools when 10 years ago he would have applied to 6) but yield rates are going up at most of the Ivies.

Because fewer students are getting into multiple colleges. I'd guess that no more than 200 students get into more than 1 among HYPSM each year.

Yields are also going up or stable at the non-Ivy top universities like NU/Rice/Hopkins, state flagships, and the top LACs.

It is more than 200, I would guess around 800-900 or so. Here is why:

There are about ~700 kids each year who turn down a Princeton acceptance.
One can safely assume that at least 70% of these non-enrolling admits (~490) turn down P for HYSM. It could very well be more than 70%. The 70% number is a conservative estimate in line with the Stanford senate minutes leaked online a few years ago which showed that 75% of Stanford non-enrolling students matriculated at HYPM for the class of 2014.
http://mathacle.blogspot.com/2012/01/stanford-or-harvardyaleprincetonmit-or.html

The situation is similar for Yale :~700 kids turn down a Yale acceptance, and it is again reasonable to assume that at least 70% do so in order to attend HSMP.

So far you have at least 490 names on the Princeton non-enrolling, HYSM-enrolling pool and another 490 names on the Yale non-enrolling, HPSM-enrolling pool. So at the very least you got 490 students with more than one HYPSM choice.

Of course the total number is more than 490. This is because a) the rate above could be higher than 70% , b) the two pools above cannot overlap 100%; (100% overlap would mean that there are no people who turn down Y and enroll at P and vice versa) and c) you also have to account for:
1. the H/S/M enrollees who were H-S, H-M, M-S or H-S-M cross-admits, but had neither a Y nor a P choice (either didn't apply or they applied and did not get accepted)
2. the students who got into H and/or S and/or M but chose to enroll at Y or P instead
3. the cases of HYPSM cross-admits who ended up enrolling at a non-HYPSM school. This is not a big number but it is also not zero (choosing Columbia to be in NYC, Penn for Wharton/dual degree, Caltech or major merit-aid at state honors programs are the most common cases I have come across where one would make a non-HYPSM choice over one or more HYPSM choices)

Adding up all these additional cases could easily bring the total up to 800-900 students, considering that there are ~ 350 admitted names every year that turn down each of H, S, MIT.

Hmm nice analysis. I wonder how many of these students are not hooked or prodigies. Probably not too many.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My two Asian cousins from Cali put in close to thirty applications each.

My three white cousins put in close to forty applications each.

My one white kid put in 3 applications. He got accepted at two, just waiting to hear back from the last (reach school.) Still, 2 out of 3 isn't bad.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My two Asian cousins from Cali put in close to thirty applications each.

I understand. I want my kids to apply to no more then 9 schools but then statistics reveal that as Asians, we have to apply to more schools.

That's because you Asians created your own applications arms race. Haven't you noticed that the elite schools are only taking two kids per high school? And then every top kid in the school is submitting 20-30 applications to those top schools? What the heck do you think is going to happen?

My white kid, strong academics and test scores but meh grades, and meh extracurriculars is 5 for 5 on apps to highly ranked competitive schools, both public and private. 4 were good/stretch fits and 1 safety. Only waiting to hear from one reach school. Start being realistic about the process instead of applying to all reach schools.

What is your point? If my Asian kid has strong academics and perfect test scores and top grades and is class officer; why would my child not apply to the top schools. If a student's stats fits the stats for top schools, why not apply? That's not the problem. The problem is Asians are < 6% of the US population, but are the highest percent that apply to colleges. The stats always state that Asians representation at universities are way above their population, but we are also the highest percent who are college bound.

Applying to top schools isn't the issue. But applying to 20+ of them is, especially when all the other Asian kids at your high school are doing the same thing. If 20 elite schools get 100 applications from Asian kids from the same high school, but only admit 2 kids per school, what do you think is going to happen? A handful of those kids are going to be admitted to many of the schools, and many of the kids won't be admitted at all. If instead those 100 kids applied to only 3 or 4 of those elite schools (and not all HYPS) then there would be less competition from other kids in their high school and each student would stand out more in the application pool. But, whatever. Apply to as many schools as you want. But then don't whine about low yield rates for Asians.

[Anonymous]

Fear. Fear is what is driving it.

[Anonymous]

It's called the college admissions industrial complex.

[Anonymous]

Stand out. If you’re a borderline Ivy Asian or Jewish kid from the northeast do something outside the box like become a prize winning banjo player. Or serve in the military first then do college later.

[Anonymous]

When UVA wins the men’s national basketball championship this year, applications are going to SURGE even more. Wouldn’t want to be applying in the next two years.

[Anonymous]

As many people have pointed out, it's getting really easy to add applications on the Common App and, because of that, many students throw a bunch of extra schools on there to see if they'll be admitted. Schools help fuel this by eliminating the application fee and taking out the extra essay. All this does is help the school appear to be more selective and feed into their need to climb the USNWR charts. It's really sad that people are slaves to this because there are many schools that can help your child be successful if they are bright and motivated.

My child applied ED and went to a top 25 school that was a great fit and where she had been in touch with admissions several times. She is now loving the college and having a great experience. Many of her friends who sent in 20 applications to the top USNWR schools and picked the "best" one to which they were admitted aren't as happy. Everyone needs to decide how best to support their child in the process but I think it's better to be thoughtful and targeted. Not everyone can apply ED due to the need to compare merit aid, I get this, but you can be more thoughtful and targeted with how you approach the search with your child and help them identify great schools that they have a good chance of being admitted. Try for one or two top schools and really try to connect with the local admissions rep and make sure your child isn't just choosing them because of the rank - have them really articulate what programs and opportunities at these schools really speak to them.

Or just send in 40 applications like someone's cousin did. YMMV

[Anonymous]

My white kid, strong academics and test scores but meh grades, and meh extracurriculars is 5 for 5 on apps to highly ranked competitive schools, both public and private. 4 were good/stretch fits and 1 safety. Only waiting to hear from one reach school.

Which "highly ranked competitive schools" like white kids with meh grades/ECs and high test scores? Asking for a friend.

When UVA wins the men’s national basketball championship this year, applications are going to SURGE even more. Wouldn’t want to be applying in the next two years.

Are the kids who are choosing a school based on the performance of its basketball team really going to be competitive applicants for UVA?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only reasons apps are up is because it is so easy to apply to colleges and click off what you want.

I wish they were hand written and mailed. Cut out a lot of crap admissions just to see if they get in.

Yeah, it's so easy. Just click a button. Watch your kid navigate the Common App before you talk about how easy it is to apply to college. There's no fast way to fill it out unless you're being sloppy about it.

I had one child that already did. It was extremely easy. Not sure why your child thinks it is so hard

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My two Asian cousins from Cali put in close to thirty applications each.

I understand. I want my kids to apply to no more then 9 schools but then statistics reveal that as Asians, we have to apply to more schools.

That's because you Asians created your own applications arms race. Haven't you noticed that the elite schools are only taking two kids per high school? And then every top kid in the school is submitting 20-30 applications to those top schools? What the heck do you think is going to happen?

My white kid, strong academics and test scores but meh grades, and meh extracurriculars is 5 for 5 on apps to highly ranked competitive schools, both public and private. 4 were good/stretch fits and 1 safety. Only waiting to hear from one reach school. Start being realistic about the process instead of applying to all reach schools.

Lol....I’m fairly certain meh grades and ECs won’t get a kid into a highly competitive school.

[Anonymous]

increase in population looking to attend college
increase from overseas
increase in the average number of colleges students apply


My family has done our part in trying to lower the last one:
DC1: Applied to 4
DC2: Apllied to 6
Nephew 1: Applied to 4