LAST APS meeting on new high school and countywide rezoning (4/4, 7 pm Yorktown)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went on Thursday at Wakefield.

There is also a proposal that all incoming K and 5th students should be automatically entered into the option lotteries

Also with the East/West proposal Key will no longer be a neighborhood school. Everyone will have to lottery in to all option schools.

I went too and thought this was a very odd solution to the problem.

I assume the problem is that some parents may not be aware (for a variety of reasons) of all the available options so by putting everyone in the lottery everyone has an equal chance to get into a school they may or may not want to get into.
What if I wanted IB but my child got an immersion spot, or vice versa. What happens then? I see this a carrying a huge admin burden as you simply can't force a family to do immersion or IB if it not what they want for their kid and it seems like it will make it harder for those who do want an option school to get the option they choose.

So while I understand the problem this doesn't seem like the best solution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unfortunately tomorrow is my bday so I can't make the meeting. Just studied slide deck. Does this mean if you don't go to an immersion ES just your neighborhood ES which i guess is now a STEAM school and you were originally zoned for Williamsburg you would now go to Kenmore? How are thry going to handle all these applications!? APS couldn't even handle the stupid extended care sign up!

No. You would go to your neighborhood middle school but you would have the option to apply to a lottery to attend the STEAM school in your zone instead. And, there would be some immersion kids at your neighborhood middle school, same as how Gunston works right now.

This is incorrect. Under the proposal all neighborhood school are STEAM schools. You don't have to lottery in.

[Anonymous]

The "automatic lottery entry" thing concerns me. Part of the reason the countywide programs succeed is that they have devoted parents who really care about the programs. If you automatically enter families with no interest, some of them will get in and attend and then not engage or get as much out of it. They've already eased up the requirements by not requiring a tour or signatures on a form. (which makes it easier on busy parents.)

I'm on the PTA board at ATS and we're opposed to the idea for this reason. Part of what makes our school great is that we have engaged parents, but out of hundreds of families, you still see the same 20-30 people running everything because others don't volunteer. We worry that will get worse with automatic lottery entry; that you'll have even fewer parents who care enough to do more than the bare minimum.

[Anonymous]

Not surprised to hear this from an ATS parent. This is not about the parental experience or engagement. Choice programs should serve the entire community, not just those in the know enough to seek it out and enter the lottery. The super lottery is a great way of making the options concrete and encouraging families to learn about the opportunties and consider enrolling. Of course ATS parents oppose this. I bet HB parents oppose it too. It will require those countywide schools to do more to serve the entire county. Imagine that.

[Anonymous]

Families with "no interest" will not enroll in these programs.

[Anonymous]

I think it would be useful to have data on how much of a program's success is the program itself and how much is the community it serves. I think not requiring parents to sign their kids up for a lottery would help with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

MS
- Immersion: New program at Williamsburg for West, Gunston for East
- IB: New program at Swanson for West, Jefferson for East
- STEAM - New program at Kenmore for West, new program at Stratford for East

Um, nobody is fooled by the "West-East" thing. Why bother doing this? All this does is further lock in the North-South divide. At least right now, anyone who really wants immersion goes to Gunston, and anyone who really wants IB goes to Jefferson. All this will do is cause further segregation...as if it's not bad enough right now.

What? Splitting the county E/W locks in the N/S division? Nope. In terms of segregation, this is a better plan than what we have now. If you really want a program for your student, it might not be the most convenient thing for you, personally. But I guess we'll see who really wants the program, and who wanted it only when it was close by and convenient, and a way to escape gen pop at the neighborhood school. If you prioritize proximity, you have your neighborhood school (looking at you southside Claremont parents who don't want to have to go to Williamsburg for MS or Yorktown for HS, and don't give me some BS about the Spanish speaking population, whose interests you don't represent since your school hasn't been able to keep a 50-50 split as you, the middle class Anglos, have crowded them out). If the demand for this program isn't there at the secondary level, they won't grow the current program to the other schools. I guess we'll find out.

Agree that in terms of segregation that the E/W is better. I had heard that the E/W division is something that they are looking at for farther down the road though, like 2020+ (This was mentioned in the previous post about choice) is that still the case?

I am just wondering how it will work for DS since he is going into Claremont from Nauck in the fall (so zoned for Drew). The new E/W means he would go to Key (but I am assuming he would get to stay at Claremont rather than being forced to switch) but then I am confused on whether he would go to Gunston (what the key path is) or Williamsburg (what the Claremont path is). So will his MS/HS course be based on his address or his ES.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The "automatic lottery entry" thing concerns me. Part of the reason the countywide programs succeed is that they have devoted parents who really care about the programs. If you automatically enter families with no interest, some of them will get in and attend and then not engage or get as much out of it. They've already eased up the requirements by not requiring a tour or signatures on a form. (which makes it easier on busy parents.)

I'm on the PTA board at ATS and we're opposed to the idea for this reason. Part of what makes our school great is that we have engaged parents, but out of hundreds of families, you still see the same 20-30 people running everything because others don't volunteer. We worry that will get worse with automatic lottery entry; that you'll have even fewer parents who care enough to do more than the bare minimum.

Do you realize how classist and elitist this sounds? The educational opportunity is for the children, not the families. The fact that a family can't be active in the PTA shouldn't mean their kids can't attend. This isn't a private co-op, it's a public school. Clearly they'll have enough interest Into send their children which is what matters. In fact, if indeed active parents make for better schools, then won't those kids from less advantaged families and schools actually get more benefit from ATS than they would from their own school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unfortunately tomorrow is my bday so I can't make the meeting. Just studied slide deck. Does this mean if you don't go to an immersion ES just your neighborhood ES which i guess is now a STEAM school and you were originally zoned for Williamsburg you would now go to Kenmore? How are thry going to handle all these applications!? APS couldn't even handle the stupid extended care sign up!

No. You would go to your neighborhood middle school but you would have the option to apply to a lottery to attend the STEAM school in your zone instead. And, there would be some immersion kids at your neighborhood middle school, same as how Gunston works right now.

This is incorrect. Under the proposal all neighborhood school are STEAM schools. You don't have to lottery in.

All neighborhood elementary schools would be STEAM. PP is talking here about middle school -- each zone would have a "STEAM" option for middle school. I gather it would be like IB in that it's a whole-school program in a neighborhood school that can also accommodate some transfers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

MS
- Immersion: New program at Williamsburg for West, Gunston for East
- IB: New program at Swanson for West, Jefferson for East
- STEAM - New program at Kenmore for West, new program at Stratford for East

Um, nobody is fooled by the "West-East" thing. Why bother doing this? All this does is further lock in the North-South divide. At least right now, anyone who really wants immersion goes to Gunston, and anyone who really wants IB goes to Jefferson. All this will do is cause further segregation...as if it's not bad enough right now.

What? Splitting the county E/W locks in the N/S division? Nope. In terms of segregation, this is a better plan than what we have now. If you really want a program for your student, it might not be the most convenient thing for you, personally. But I guess we'll see who really wants the program, and who wanted it only when it was close by and convenient, and a way to escape gen pop at the neighborhood school. If you prioritize proximity, you have your neighborhood school (looking at you southside Claremont parents who don't want to have to go to Williamsburg for MS or Yorktown for HS, and don't give me some BS about the Spanish speaking population, whose interests you don't represent since your school hasn't been able to keep a 50-50 split as you, the middle class Anglos, have crowded them out). If the demand for this program isn't there at the secondary level, they won't grow the current program to the other schools. I guess we'll find out.

Agree that in terms of segregation that the E/W is better. I had heard that the E/W division is something that they are looking at for farther down the road though, like 2020+ (This was mentioned in the previous post about choice) is that still the case?

I am just wondering how it will work for DS since he is going into Claremont from Nauck in the fall (so zoned for Drew). The new E/W means he would go to Key (but I am assuming he would get to stay at Claremont rather than being forced to switch) but then I am confused on whether he would go to Gunston (what the key path is) or Williamsburg (what the Claremont path is). So will his MS/HS course be based on his address or his ES.

I believe what they said at the last meeting is that the E/W split is further down the road, though I think it will have to take some shape in the near term as they redo boundaries and build new schools. What staff was clear about was that any current students, plus any concurrently enrolled siblings, will be able to stay in their current schools and would not be forced to move the the E/W mirror school. I don't know what it means for MS, though. It's unclear how soon the second MS and HS locations would come online. You're probably looking at Gunston for MS, based on address, and because it's not clear how soon they'll have a second program up and running at the MS and HS levels.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

MS
- Immersion: New program at Williamsburg for West, Gunston for East
- IB: New program at Swanson for West, Jefferson for East
- STEAM - New program at Kenmore for West, new program at Stratford for East

Um, nobody is fooled by the "West-East" thing. Why bother doing this? All this does is further lock in the North-South divide. At least right now, anyone who really wants immersion goes to Gunston, and anyone who really wants IB goes to Jefferson. All this will do is cause further segregation...as if it's not bad enough right now.

What? Splitting the county E/W locks in the N/S division? Nope. In terms of segregation, this is a better plan than what we have now. If you really want a program for your student, it might not be the most convenient thing for you, personally. But I guess we'll see who really wants the program, and who wanted it only when it was close by and convenient, and a way to escape gen pop at the neighborhood school. If you prioritize proximity, you have your neighborhood school (looking at you southside Claremont parents who don't want to have to go to Williamsburg for MS or Yorktown for HS, and don't give me some BS about the Spanish speaking population, whose interests you don't represent since your school hasn't been able to keep a 50-50 split as you, the middle class Anglos, have crowded them out). If the demand for this program isn't there at the secondary level, they won't grow the current program to the other schools. I guess we'll find out.

Agree that in terms of segregation that the E/W is better. I had heard that the E/W division is something that they are looking at for farther down the road though, like 2020+ (This was mentioned in the previous post about choice) is that still the case?

I am just wondering how it will work for DS since he is going into Claremont from Nauck in the fall (so zoned for Drew). The new E/W means he would go to Key (but I am assuming he would get to stay at Claremont rather than being forced to switch) but then I am confused on whether he would go to Gunston (what the key path is) or Williamsburg (what the Claremont path is). So will his MS/HS course be based on his address or his ES.

I believe what they said at the last meeting is that the E/W split is further down the road, though I think it will have to take some shape in the near term as they redo boundaries and build new schools. What staff was clear about was that any current students, plus any concurrently enrolled siblings, will be able to stay in their current schools and would not be forced to move the the E/W mirror school. I don't know what it means for MS, though. It's unclear how soon the second MS and HS locations would come online. You're probably looking at Gunston for MS, based on address, and because it's not clear how soon they'll have a second program up and running at the MS and HS levels.

Thanks! That is kind of what I was thinking. I don't really care either way (Gunston or Williamsburg) but interesting nonetheless.
I appreciate that they would want to keep future concurrently enrolled siblings at the same school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not surprised to hear this from an ATS parent. This is not about the parental experience or engagement. Choice programs should serve the entire community, not just those in the know enough to seek it out and enter the lottery. The super lottery is a great way of making the options concrete and encouraging families to learn about the opportunties and consider enrolling. Of course ATS parents oppose this. I bet HB parents oppose it too. It will require those countywide schools to do more to serve the entire county. Imagine that.

Wow - that's incredibly condescending to families who you believe don't "know enough".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So glad we saw this sh** storm coming and moved to McLean. Can anyone honestly say they are happy with any of these options?

I'm happy with the ES and MS options. HS is still an issue, but not terrible. We will figure it out. The good news though is that we don't have to go through life as a smug tw@t. So there's that.

[Anonymous]

Wow - that's incredibly condescending to families who you believe don't "know enough".
--------------------------

Yes. There are plenty of families (military transplants, others transferred from out of state, recent immigrants) who don't know enough about the complex APS system to avail themselves of all the options. This could only come as a surprise to you if you live in a bubble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

MS
- Immersion: New program at Williamsburg for West, Gunston for East
- IB: New program at Swanson for West, Jefferson for East
- STEAM - New program at Kenmore for West, new program at Stratford for East

Um, nobody is fooled by the "West-East" thing. Why bother doing this? All this does is further lock in the North-South divide. At least right now, anyone who really wants immersion goes to Gunston, and anyone who really wants IB goes to Jefferson. All this will do is cause further segregation...as if it's not bad enough right now.

What? Splitting the county E/W locks in the N/S division? Nope. In terms of segregation, this is a better plan than what we have now. If you really want a program for your student, it might not be the most convenient thing for you, personally. But I guess we'll see who really wants the program, and who wanted it only when it was close by and convenient, and a way to escape gen pop at the neighborhood school. If you prioritize proximity, you have your neighborhood school (looking at you southside Claremont parents who don't want to have to go to Williamsburg for MS or Yorktown for HS, and don't give me some BS about the Spanish speaking population, whose interests you don't represent since your school hasn't been able to keep a 50-50 split as you, the middle class Anglos, have crowded them out). If the demand for this program isn't there at the secondary level, they won't grow the current program to the other schools. I guess we'll find out.

Agree that in terms of segregation that the E/W is better. I had heard that the E/W division is something that they are looking at for farther down the road though, like 2020+ (This was mentioned in the previous post about choice) is that still the case?

I am just wondering how it will work for DS since he is going into Claremont from Nauck in the fall (so zoned for Drew). The new E/W means he would go to Key (but I am assuming he would get to stay at Claremont rather than being forced to switch) but then I am confused on whether he would go to Gunston (what the key path is) or Williamsburg (what the Claremont path is). So will his MS/HS course be based on his address or his ES.

So one of the main things they said Thursday is don't worry about the dividing line. It was just illustrative to show parents what an east/west divide could look like. They said don't spend too much time worrying about which side of the line you are on.
Of course if you are extreme west or east it is easy to know but for the middle they aren't sure what the dividing line will look like.

I am of the understanding that students already enrolled can stay where they are but it would impact them for the next level (MS or HS) provide the zones are in place by the time he starts middles school.