Are more rich kids doing ROTC at college?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

FYI... there is no Marine ROTC -- only Army, Air Force and Navy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

FYI... there is no Marine ROTC -- only Army, Air Force and Navy.

No there is.

As a college student and Marine-Option Midshipman in the NROTC Program, your journey to a successful future will also lead to a life of purpose and advancement Marine Corps Officers are known for. For the right few, the Marine Corps offers the opportunity to pursue this noble path while earning a degree on a college campus. In fact, as a Marine-Option Midshipman, the NROTC Program will only enhance college life. But this is not merely an education; it is a screening process to find the few who have what it takes to lead Marines

http://www.marines.com/becoming-a-marine/commissioning-programs/four-year-colleges/nrotc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

FYI... there is no Marine ROTC -- only Army, Air Force and Navy.

Hmm. Could it have been under the Navy ROTC then? I do recall the scarlet and gold flag, different uniforms, etc. But if I am wrong, I do apologize.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

FYI... there is no Marine ROTC -- only Army, Air Force and Navy.

Hmm. Could it have been under the Navy ROTC then? I do recall the scarlet and gold flag, different uniforms, etc. But if I am wrong, I do apologize.

Oh, I see the person above me gave the answer. Thanks. I thought there was a Marines program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

FYI... there is no Marine ROTC -- only Army, Air Force and Navy.

No there is.

As a college student and Marine-Option Midshipman in the NROTC Program, your journey to a successful future will also lead to a life of purpose and advancement Marine Corps Officers are known for. For the right few, the Marine Corps offers the opportunity to pursue this noble path while earning a degree on a college campus. In fact, as a Marine-Option Midshipman, the NROTC Program will only enhance college life. But this is not merely an education; it is a screening process to find the few who have what it takes to lead Marines

http://www.marines.com/becoming-a-marine/commissioning-programs/four-year-colleges/nrotc

Ok -- Marine Option is available in a NROTC program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

FYI... there is no Marine ROTC -- only Army, Air Force and Navy.

No there is.

As a college student and Marine-Option Midshipman in the NROTC Program, your journey to a successful future will also lead to a life of purpose and advancement Marine Corps Officers are known for. For the right few, the Marine Corps offers the opportunity to pursue this noble path while earning a degree on a college campus. In fact, as a Marine-Option Midshipman, the NROTC Program will only enhance college life. But this is not merely an education; it is a screening process to find the few who have what it takes to lead Marines

http://www.marines.com/becoming-a-marine/commissioning-programs/four-year-colleges/nrotc

Ok -- Marine Option is available in a NROTC program.

NROTC = Naval ROTC, which includes both Navy and Marine Corp. You can designate Marine-option as part of that, and you'll get a slightly different experience.

-an NROTC grad

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

Norte dame is a crazy Christian school. The military has a huge religious bent to it - it doesn't take much reasoning to see why there's a bit overlap.

After college, I looked at Ocs. I was turned off when I was asked what my religion was by a recruiter.

I was never asked this at CIA. The military, within the natsec sphere, is poisoned with Christian fundy typeS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

Norte dame is a crazy Christian school. The military has a huge religious bent to it - it doesn't take much reasoning to see why there's a bit overlap.

After college, I looked at Ocs. I was turned off when I was asked what my religion was by a recruiter.

I was never asked this at CIA. The military, within the natsec sphere, is poisoned with Christian fundy typeS.

You seem misinformed. Notre Dame is a Catholic school and while there are many religious kids there and certainly a Catholic ethos to the school there are plenty of colleges that are much more religious or Christian-leaning.

And although Catholic was the first Christian religion, the faith is certainly not Christian in the unquestioning, too-often Bible-spouting, "my way or the highway" judgmental way that people think of when they think of "Christian" in the U.S. So nice try, but you're wrong here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

Notre Dame, and I'm assuming various others, have an ROTC College Program you can join after 30 credit hours. But you don't get the ROTC scholarship. Are these kids compensated at all for 3 years of effort?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went through Army ROTC at Princeton in the 80s when the program there was very large (over 100 cadets).

Most cadets at Princeton received 4 years of full tuition scholarship and $100 per month stipend.

I chose Princeton/ROTC over West Point. ROTC scholarship or West Point were the only non-state school options available to me given my family's financial situation.

Most of the ROTC cadets were (like me) from middle or UMC families. Very few were what I would call "rich". Many came from families with a tradition of military service, and/or from families that were trying to send several kids through college.

ROTC enrollment at expensive/elite private colleges declined in the 90s when full tuition scholarships were replaced with capped dollar scholarships that would not cover full tuition costs at expensive private colleges. Full-tuition ROTC scholarships were revived several years ago, and ROTC enrollment has grown again on elite private college campuses.

ROTC was/is not for everyone, but I am very fortunate that it was a route available to me.

But now elite colleges already offer absurdly generous financial aid packages. So, why would a middle class kid need to do ROTC?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

Notre Dame, and I'm assuming various others, have an ROTC College Program you can join after 30 credit hours. But you don't get the ROTC scholarship. Are these kids compensated at all for 3 years of effort?

I'm assuming that they are "compensated" (assuming they complete the ROTC curriculum and requirements), with a commission as an officer and either an active or reserve duty job after graduation. Whether an active or reserve position as I recall depended on many factors including individual merit, branch/specialty, and specific needs of the service at time of commissioning.

[Anonymous]

But now elite colleges already offer absurdly generous financial aid packages. So, why would a middle class kid need to do ROTC?

This is difficult for some to understand, but some people feel a calling to serve their country. Many people do ROTC because they want to give back to their country by serving as a military officer. They don't need to do it, they want to do it out of a sense of service. They choose to protect and defend our country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

Norte dame is a crazy Christian school. The military has a huge religious bent to it - it doesn't take much reasoning to see why there's a bit overlap.

After college, I looked at Ocs. I was turned off when I was asked what my religion was by a recruiter.

I was never asked this at CIA. The military, within the natsec sphere, is poisoned with Christian fundy typeS.

You seem misinformed. Notre Dame is a Catholic school and while there are many religious kids there and certainly a Catholic ethos to the school there are plenty of colleges that are much more religious or Christian-leaning.

And although Catholic was the first Christian religion, the faith is certainly not Christian in the unquestioning, too-often Bible-spouting, "my way or the highway" judgmental way that people think of when they think of "Christian" in the U.S. So nice try, but you're wrong here.

Norte dame is the most religiously fundementalist school in the top 35.

Remember the whole brouhaha over O coming to speak there.

It is filled with crazies. It's telling your response to support its secularity is to compare it to Liberty or a school like that

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went through Army ROTC at Princeton in the 80s when the program there was very large (over 100 cadets).

Most cadets at Princeton received 4 years of full tuition scholarship and $100 per month stipend.

I chose Princeton/ROTC over West Point. ROTC scholarship or West Point were the only non-state school options available to me given my family's financial situation.

Most of the ROTC cadets were (like me) from middle or UMC families. Very few were what I would call "rich". Many came from families with a tradition of military service, and/or from families that were trying to send several kids through college.

ROTC enrollment at expensive/elite private colleges declined in the 90s when full tuition scholarships were replaced with capped dollar scholarships that would not cover full tuition costs at expensive private colleges. Full-tuition ROTC scholarships were revived several years ago, and ROTC enrollment has grown again on elite private college campuses.

ROTC was/is not for everyone, but I am very fortunate that it was a route available to me.

But now elite colleges already offer absurdly generous financial aid packages. So, why would a middle class kid need to do ROTC?

"Middle class" is a very broad category. If you are lower middle class I would agree that financial aid nowadays would likely cover much/most of your need for an elite college.

But if you are middle class or slightly above middle class, Financial Aid might not cover nearly as much of college costs as a full tuition ROTC scholarship would.

I believe my own parents could have theoretically found a way to send me to Princeton without ROTC scholarship, but that would have badly affected our family's quality of life, depleted my parents savings and home equity, and limited the college options available for my four younger siblings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Notre Dame has had a long history of having all four military branches on campus. We have ROTC for Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines. I believe I have heard it said that we also have one of the highest, if not the highest, percentages of students doing ROTC.

Why? I am not entirely sure, but I think it may have something to do with what Princeton Army ROTC grad said up above:

many families from middle or UMC families
high tuition
from families with a tradition of military service
from families trying to send a lot of children to college

I think the Catholic angle, patriotism angle helped too. Above the doors to Sacred Heart, the basilica on campus, it says, "God, Country, and Notre Dame," the message being that we are here on Earth to serve all three, in this order.

Norte dame is a crazy Christian school. The military has a huge religious bent to it - it doesn't take much reasoning to see why there's a bit overlap.

After college, I looked at Ocs. I was turned off when I was asked what my religion was by a recruiter.

I was never asked this at CIA. The military, within the natsec sphere, is poisoned with Christian fundy typeS.

You seem misinformed. Notre Dame is a Catholic school and while there are many religious kids there and certainly a Catholic ethos to the school there are plenty of colleges that are much more religious or Christian-leaning.

And although Catholic was the first Christian religion, the faith is certainly not Christian in the unquestioning, too-often Bible-spouting, "my way or the highway" judgmental way that people think of when they think of "Christian" in the U.S. So nice try, but you're wrong here.

Norte dame is the most religiously fundementalist school in the top 35.

Remember the whole brouhaha over O coming to speak there.

It is filled with crazies. It's telling your response to support its secularity is to compare it to Liberty or a school like that

PP, you're the crazy one. NP here who is agnostic and graduated from ND. I loved every minute of it and never felt like anyone was out to proselytize me. In fact, my openness about my lack of religious upbringing and my doubts about any form of God was seen as a positive thing in some cases. It could never be compared to Liberty or Bob Jones U. On the other hand, it's not quiet about it's religion either. It's a wonderful place and the huge ROTC population really benefits the undergrad population overall.