explain the NC law to me - why are we so obsessed with bathrooms?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of you are so naïve, I'm not sure how you make it through the day.

Yes I was thinking the same thing. They think this is abot bathrooms.

No we don't. We think it is about small minded reactionary bigots trying to find any way to legally register their disgust for LGBTQ citizens in a post marriage equality America. And we are not wrong.

I guess I was confused. I agree with you. That's why it's not about bathrooms. It's about finding a way to take a way to make trans people "illegal". Not bathrooms.

You don't think some women are uncomfortable sharing a public restroom with a man dressed as a woman (who is obviously a man)? You are kidding yourself. That would make me uncomfortable. Of course, if I can't tell it's a man, then I can't tell.

Why are you uncomfortable? Really. Are you afraid of trans people?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I thought conservatives hated intrusive big government regulation.

This is clearly the worst form of intrusive big government regulation.

Yet more hypocrisy from the right.

It is baffling to me how you come to this conclusion.
The law is simply allowing each establishment to determine when and if to allow people to use a bathroom/locker room based on their chosen gender.
It is taking government out of the equation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of you are so naïve, I'm not sure how you make it through the day.

Yes I was thinking the same thing. They think this is abot bathrooms.

No we don't. We think it is about small minded reactionary bigots trying to find any way to legally register their disgust for LGBTQ citizens in a post marriage equality America. And we are not wrong.

I guess I was confused. I agree with you. That's why it's not about bathrooms. It's about finding a way to take a way to make trans people "illegal". Not bathrooms.

You don't think some women are uncomfortable sharing a public restroom with a man dressed as a woman (who is obviously a man)? You are kidding yourself. That would make me uncomfortable. Of course, if I can't tell it's a man, then I can't tell.

Why are you uncomfortable? Really. Are you afraid of trans people?

Let the bullying begin. Case rested

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, this isn't about bathrooms or trying to protect anyone.

It's about legislating hatred against a minority of people.

People are small-minded. People in South, particularly, are small-minded.

This may quality as Trumpian, both for the stupidity and the lack of self-awareness

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought conservatives hated intrusive big government regulation.

This is clearly the worst form of intrusive big government regulation.

Yet more hypocrisy from the right.

It is baffling to me how you come to this conclusion.
The law is simply allowing each establishment to determine when and if to allow people to use a bathroom/locker room based on their chosen gender.
It is taking government out of the equation.

Your understanding of the NC law is incorrect. It does not allow establishments any flexibility to determine anything. The one and only determination it allows is what bathroom people can go to strictly based on what is on that person's birth certificate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is probably one of the best articles around regarding transgenderism. Did you know 70-80% of teens who think they are the wrong sex lose those feelings? This is according to John's Hopkins University studies, mind you. And yet there are laws being passed allowing for gender reassignment surgeries on 15 year olds without parental consent? Madness!

http://thefederalist.com/2015/10/26/indulging-transgender-fantasies-makes-them-worse/

Reading comprehension fail. The Federalist article states "70 percent to 80 percent of those kids will spontaneously lose those feelings, according to Paul McHugh, the former chief of psychiatry at Johns Hopkins University", and the words "Paul McHugh" link to a CNS News article that states "Dr. McHugh further noted studies from Vanderbilt University and London’s Portman Clinic of children who had expressed transgender feelings but for whom, over time, 70%-80% 'spontaneously lost those feelings.'"

Children, not specifically teens, and not Johns Hopkins studies. Also, no full citations to said studies provided, so no way to authenticate them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought conservatives hated intrusive big government regulation.

This is clearly the worst form of intrusive big government regulation.

Yet more hypocrisy from the right.

It is baffling to me how you come to this conclusion.
The law is simply allowing each establishment to determine when and if to allow people to use a bathroom/locker room based on their chosen gender.
It is taking government out of the equation.

But HOW and WHEN are people supposed to be allowed to determine when and if to allow the public to use the restroom? It is insane. What about an older woman who looks a little mannish - what kind of proof (since this is America and we aren't required to carry identification here) is some asshole clerk going to require when he suspects great aunt gertrude isn't actually a woman? Talk about invasion of privacy. I can see some asshole getting pushy with someone who is a woman (or man) and then being arrested for assault, and sued the hell to oblivion.

How is this even a thing?? How does the law imagine citizens enforcing this? It makes no sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of you are so naïve, I'm not sure how you make it through the day.

Yes I was thinking the same thing. They think this is abot bathrooms.

No we don't. We think it is about small minded reactionary bigots trying to find any way to legally register their disgust for LGBTQ citizens in a post marriage equality America. And we are not wrong.

I guess I was confused. I agree with you. That's why it's not about bathrooms. It's about finding a way to take a way to make trans people "illegal". Not bathrooms.

You don't think some women are uncomfortable sharing a public restroom with a man dressed as a woman (who is obviously a man)? You are kidding yourself. That would make me uncomfortable. Of course, if I can't tell it's a man, then I can't tell.

Why are you uncomfortable? Really. Are you afraid of trans people?

Let the bullying begin. Case rested

Hon, being questioned about your stance is not bullying, and if your stance is so sensitive that it can't handle being questioned, perhaps it's not so solid to begin with.

This, fyi, is bullying: http://www.thetaskforce.org/study-high-rates-of-bullying-suicide-attempts-among-transgender-and-gender-non-conforming-people/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, what happens when a trans woman (with male genitalia) enters a mens' bathroom dressed as woman? How will police ensure compliance? Are all people at the risk of an on-the-spot strip search?

Homeland Security will develop an app to scan, analyze and classify genitalia.

There's also ways know if they were born locally or stay here illegally.

And this is a win for small government?

I also don't get it, OP. Neither the enforcement nor why it is needed. Someone who looks like a woman (but has male genitalia) goes into a women's bathroom. If they're there to pee, they go into a stall and no one is the wiser. If they are there to harass or assault women, they'd do that regardless of whether they were dressed as a woman. Ditto the men's room. And a trans man is far likely to be threatened in the men's room rather than be a threat. I really don't understand why this is taking up so much time and attention. I am a woman and I do not care if a trans woman wants to use the women's bathroom. If h/she feels like a woman and wants to pee in a stall where I don't see her anyway, why do I care?

You're right, I don't understand it either. Know why? Because it's not about bathrooms at all - it's about pushing an agenda, based on what do-gooders believe is 'non-hate', when in reality, it's causing more attention and more problems as a result. The solution is simply to continue to put third bathrooms in, non-gender family bathrooms so to speak. This solves a lot of additional problems, such as when my 5 year old son insisted on going into the men's room at Jersey Turnpike rest stops and I could not go in with him. This completely eliminates the awkwardness and safety issues for trans-gender individuals as well.

Now - wait for the outrage at my statements from people here and you'll see what I mean about forcing an agenda over safety for all parties.

He's a five year old. Who is in charge here? In public my 6 year old
son goes with me, his mother, to use the restroom. Be a parent, be in charge, take responsibility. We don't need laws for that. YOU just need common sense and better ways to spend your mental energy.

He did go with me but it made things more difficult than it needed to be on a large car trip. What if the kid is 8? 10? Does the risk go down, allowing a child in the bathroom like that? I don't think so. And taking them in the women's room at 10 is a completely new ball game. A family bathroom solves that issue

To the bolded point, no, it doesn't. Women's bathrooms have stalls for privacy. My son can't see you and you can't see him. But at 10, seriously, stop hovering and let the damn kid use the bathroom. Cut the cord already.

If this were really about the urgent need for family bathrooms, then this would have been an issue for a very, very, very long time and we wouldn't be talking about forcing people to use the bathroom of the sex on their birth certificate. We would be having a different conversation entirely. You are being disingenuous at best and a lying liar at worst if you really think this is true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I thought conservatives hated intrusive big government regulation.

This is clearly the worst form of intrusive big government regulation.

Yet more hypocrisy from the right.

Amen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yeah, what happens when a trans woman (with male genitalia) enters a mens' bathroom dressed as woman? How will police ensure compliance? Are all people at the risk of an on-the-spot strip search?

Homeland Security will develop an app to scan, analyze and classify genitalia.

There's also ways know if they were born locally or stay here illegally.

And this is a win for small government?

I also don't get it, OP. Neither the enforcement nor why it is needed. Someone who looks like a woman (but has male genitalia) goes into a women's bathroom. If they're there to pee, they go into a stall and no one is the wiser. If they are there to harass or assault women, they'd do that regardless of whether they were dressed as a woman. Ditto the men's room. And a trans man is far likely to be threatened in the men's room rather than be a threat. I really don't understand why this is taking up so much time and attention. I am a woman and I do not care if a trans woman wants to use the women's bathroom. If h/she feels like a woman and wants to pee in a stall where I don't see her anyway, why do I care?

You're right, I don't understand it either. Know why? Because it's not about bathrooms at all - it's about pushing an agenda, based on what do-gooders believe is 'non-hate', when in reality, it's causing more attention and more problems as a result. The solution is simply to continue to put third bathrooms in, non-gender family bathrooms so to speak. This solves a lot of additional problems, such as when my 5 year old son insisted on going into the men's room at Jersey Turnpike rest stops and I could not go in with him. This completely eliminates the awkwardness and safety issues for trans-gender individuals as well.

Now - wait for the outrage at my statements from people here and you'll see what I mean about forcing an agenda over safety for all parties.

He's a five year old. Who is in charge here? In public my 6 year old
son goes with me, his mother, to use the restroom. Be a parent, be in charge, take responsibility. We don't need laws for that. YOU just need common sense and better ways to spend your mental energy.

He did go with me but it made things more difficult than it needed to be on a large car trip. What if the kid is 8? 10? Does the risk go down, allowing a child in the bathroom like that? I don't think so. And taking them in the women's room at 10 is a completely new ball game. A family bathroom solves that issue

To the bolded point, no, it doesn't. Women's bathrooms have stalls for privacy. My son can't see you and you can't see him. But at 10, seriously, stop hovering and let the damn kid use the bathroom. Cut the cord already.

If this were really about the urgent need for family bathrooms, then this would have been an issue for a very, very, very long time and we wouldn't be talking about forcing people to use the bathroom of the sex on their birth certificate. We would be having a different conversation entirely. You are being disingenuous at best and a lying liar at worst if you really think this is true.

I am so sick of only kids using women's bathrooms. It makes the line even longer. Why can't your dh's ever take the kids? I personally would just like unisex bathrooms.

[Anonymous]

It's a bathroom, in the women everyone has a stall and in the men if they poop they have a stall. I don't think a transman can use the urinal unless they've completed the re assignment and have a penis.

So what exactly is the problem? I don't pee in the middle of the floor in the open area. I go into a stall, shut it, do my business and then go on my way.i don't care what anyone else in there is doing unless they are in my stall peeing on me. I don't think trans people are perverts looking to get their kicks, or pedophiles with a bathroom fetish looking to watch little girls or boys pee. What are you afraid of? You are uncomfortable being around a trans person in the bathroom? Grow up, pee and leave. It's a public bathroom. Geesh

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's a bathroom, in the women everyone has a stall and in the men if they poop they have a stall. I don't think a transman can use the urinal unless they've completed the re assignment and have a penis.

So what exactly is the problem? I don't pee in the middle of the floor in the open area. I go into a stall, shut it, do my business and then go on my way.i don't care what anyone else in there is doing unless they are in my stall peeing on me. I don't think trans people are perverts looking to get their kicks, or pedophiles with a bathroom fetish looking to watch little girls or boys pee. What are you afraid of? You are uncomfortable being around a trans person in the bathroom? Grow up, pee and leave. It's a public bathroom. Geesh

The problem, for those you who are too short-sighted to recognize it, is -- who are you to say that a man "looks like a woman" or a woman "looks like a man?" You think that just because a man is "dressed like a woman," that makes it OK for him to enter the woman's restroom? What, exactly, qualifies as "dressed like/ looks like" a woman? Who are you to determine that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a bathroom, in the women everyone has a stall and in the men if they poop they have a stall. I don't think a transman can use the urinal unless they've completed the re assignment and have a penis.

So what exactly is the problem? I don't pee in the middle of the floor in the open area. I go into a stall, shut it, do my business and then go on my way.i don't care what anyone else in there is doing unless they are in my stall peeing on me. I don't think trans people are perverts looking to get their kicks, or pedophiles with a bathroom fetish looking to watch little girls or boys pee. What are you afraid of? You are uncomfortable being around a trans person in the bathroom? Grow up, pee and leave. It's a public bathroom. Geesh

The problem, for those you who are too short-sighted to recognize it, is -- who are you to say that a man "looks like a woman" or a woman "looks like a man?" You think that just because a man is "dressed like a woman," that makes it OK for him to enter the woman's restroom? What, exactly, qualifies as "dressed like/ looks like" a woman? Who are you to determine that?

And I'm going to ask again. Why are you uncomfortable with this? Trans people are not scary. They are human beings who have needs and truly just want to live their lives in the way that feels most comfortable. Also, do you see how your point is a slippery slope? "Excuse me. You don't look enough like a woman to be using the women's restroom. Please show me your papers proving you're a woman"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a bathroom, in the women everyone has a stall and in the men if they poop they have a stall. I don't think a transman can use the urinal unless they've completed the re assignment and have a penis.

So what exactly is the problem? I don't pee in the middle of the floor in the open area. I go into a stall, shut it, do my business and then go on my way.i don't care what anyone else in there is doing unless they are in my stall peeing on me. I don't think trans people are perverts looking to get their kicks, or pedophiles with a bathroom fetish looking to watch little girls or boys pee. What are you afraid of? You are uncomfortable being around a trans person in the bathroom? Grow up, pee and leave. It's a public bathroom. Geesh

The problem, for those you who are too short-sighted to recognize it, is -- who are you to say that a man "looks like a woman" or a woman "looks like a man?" You think that just because a man is "dressed like a woman," that makes it OK for him to enter the woman's restroom? What, exactly, qualifies as "dressed like/ looks like" a woman? Who are you to determine that?

I am PP you quoted. Why don't you answer the first question yourself without the insult. Who are you to say who looks like a man or who looks like a woman? I think the law and the freak out are ridiculous. No, I don't think men or women are faking to be trans and then using opposite gender bathrooms while dressed as trans just to watch me or you or my kids pee or poop. I mean what do you think the trans people are doing in there besides going to the bathroom? Is there such a large population of perverted trans public bathroom people to make this a big issue? OMG, they're coming, hide, it's a transgender person with a full bladder.