GSA or OPM rules -- Min Office Space for a GS-15?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're renovating to go wall-less. The units that already got the renovation have their office directors out in the open, without offices, like everybody else.

Good. I'm sick of managers not being part of the team and not listening enough to their people. Our managers sit in their own "manager hallway."

What does bad management have to do with office space? You think they will magically become better listeners if they move into a cubicle?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you have a collective bargaining agreement or Administrative Policy Circular in your agency, it may contain such terms. It varies based on the agency.

Do collective bargaining units apply to GS-15's (usually managers)? In our agency they apply to GS-13's and below and Engineers are excluded. We also had an unwritten 'rule' that you would get your own office as a 13 (small offices - no cubes) but that went out the door when they started consolidating space. Now, you go where there is space. Period.

CBAs do not apply to management. But 15s can be covered by CBAs if they are in the unit. If they are non managerial 15s. Rare, however.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're renovating to go wall-less. The units that already got the renovation have their office directors out in the open, without offices, like everybody else.

Good. I'm sick of managers not being part of the team and not listening enough to their people. Our managers sit in their own "manager hallway."

What does bad management have to do with office space? You think they will magically become better listeners if they move into a cubicle?

Honestly, I don't think anything will "magically" happen. But is some logic behind the idea that putting managers closer to their reports, both in terms of physical location and in term of "prestige" will make them better able to understand and empower them. Some of the most well-regarded managers in my agency voluntarily elected to take a cube when office space became an issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're renovating to go wall-less. The units that already got the renovation have their office directors out in the open, without offices, like everybody else.

Good. I'm sick of managers not being part of the team and not listening enough to their people. Our managers sit in their own "manager hallway."

What does bad management have to do with office space? You think they will magically become better listeners if they move into a cubicle?

Honestly, I don't think anything will "magically" happen. But is some logic behind the idea that putting managers closer to their reports, both in terms of physical location and in term of "prestige" will make them better able to understand and empower them. Some of the most well-regarded managers in my agency voluntarily elected to take a cube when office space became an issue.

A decision they probably regret every single hour. As a long time fed once told me: Always take the biggest office available.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know if this is what OP was referring to, but our agency is moving to a new building, and there is some sort of GSA rule requiring attorney offices to be smaller than they previously could be. But it isn't by grade. Personally, I don't care about the size of the office, except that if it is going to be smaller, we need some alternative space to store bankers boxes of litigation documents.

DOJ? There was some noise that attorneys would be in cubes at 1-4 Con, and people protested because of confidentiality issues. So our offices are going to be smaller. Which again, fine, but I agree that they have to figure out what to do with the massive amounts of documents we deal with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know if this is what OP was referring to, but our agency is moving to a new building, and there is some sort of GSA rule requiring attorney offices to be smaller than they previously could be. But it isn't by grade. Personally, I don't care about the size of the office, except that if it is going to be smaller, we need some alternative space to store bankers boxes of litigation documents.

DOJ? There was some noise that attorneys would be in cubes at 1-4 Con, and people protested because of confidentiality issues. So our offices are going to be smaller. Which again, fine, but I agree that they have to figure out what to do with the massive amounts of documents we deal with.

Hold up. DOJ is moving to constitution square?

There are many lawyers working in cubes there now. In my view, the confidentiality argument doesn't really hold water. Do you currently leave documents in war rooms? On your desk in an unlocked office? No real difference with a cube....

[Anonymous]

It was 125 sq ft or so at the agency I used to work for, per union rules. They used to count ceiling tiles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We're renovating to go wall-less. The units that already got the renovation have their office directors out in the open, without offices, like everybody else.

Good. I'm sick of managers not being part of the team and not listening enough to their people. Our managers sit in their own "manager hallway."

What does bad management have to do with office space? You think they will magically become better listeners if they move into a cubicle?

Honestly, I don't think anything will "magically" happen. But is some logic behind the idea that putting managers closer to their reports, both in terms of physical location and in term of "prestige" will make them better able to understand and empower them. Some of the most well-regarded managers in my agency voluntarily elected to take a cube when office space became an issue.

A decision they probably regret every single hour. As a long time fed once told me: Always take the biggest office available.

Another federal manager here. It's that kind of thinking that breeds grievances, incivility, and hostility. And frankly, in this day and age, when one walks through a federal agency and sees people who work at home 2-4 days a week in the biggest offices, it's simply bizarre.

Yes, enjoy your "big" office. I guess it's compensating for something else.

[Anonymous]

When our program office moved into a new building, there were minimum requirements for all anticipated GS-15 offices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't know if this is what OP was referring to, but our agency is moving to a new building, and there is some sort of GSA rule requiring attorney offices to be smaller than they previously could be. But it isn't by grade. Personally, I don't care about the size of the office, except that if it is going to be smaller, we need some alternative space to store bankers boxes of litigation documents.

DOJ? There was some noise that attorneys would be in cubes at 1-4 Con, and people protested because of confidentiality issues. So our offices are going to be smaller. Which again, fine, but I agree that they have to figure out what to do with the massive amounts of documents we deal with.

Back up the paper on a server? Better yet, dont print it in the first place to only store it in a box 😀

[Anonymous]

There are definitely space requirements for 15s. I think it is OPM that has the dimensions. My agency knows them well and I have seen people with tape measures and others have used it to not return to office.

[Anonymous]

I'm a 14 and I have my own spacious office in my current position.

Suck it strivers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are definitely space requirements for 15s. I think it is OPM that has the dimensions. My agency knows them well and I have seen people with tape measures and others have used it to not return to office.

You are silly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are definitely space requirements for 15s. I think it is OPM that has the dimensions. My agency knows them well and I have seen people with tape measures and others have used it to not return to office.

Ages ago, yes. 41 CFR 101-17.3. A non-sup GS15 was allocated 150sqft of space but this was flexible. However this hasn’t been revisited since the 70’s and the modern work environment doesn’t look much like that anymore.
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CFR-2000-title41-vol2/pdf/CFR-2000-title41-vol2-part101-id363-subpart101-id433.pdf