Is the Charleston church shooting making anyone doubt their Faith?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. The way they show forgiveness is amazing and inspiring. It's an example of God's love.

People always like to credit "god" with the good, and never the bad. If the HUMAN forgiveness is an "example of God's love," why isn't the shooting an example of God's hatred and bloodlust?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. The way they show forgiveness is amazing and inspiring. It's an example of God's love.

People always like to credit "god" with the good, and never the bad. If the HUMAN forgiveness is an "example of God's love," why isn't the shooting an example of God's hatred and bloodlust?

Because God is good and God is love. God shows himself in good things and is supporting these people during this awful time. They are filled with faith and are leaning on God, and he is giving them strength.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. The way they show forgiveness is amazing and inspiring. It's an example of God's love.

People always like to credit "god" with the good, and never the bad. If the HUMAN forgiveness is an "example of God's love," why isn't the shooting an example of God's hatred and bloodlust?

Because God is good and God is love. God shows himself in good things and is supporting these people during this awful time. They are filled with faith and are leaning on God, and he is giving them strength.

+1

God, by definition, is good. Hatred, bloodlust, etc is the opposite of God.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If Dylann Roof had killed people in a mall, for example, on a mass shooting spree, only those who believed in God would go to a place called heaven?

Only they would be "saved?"

The unbaptized toddler would go to hell for sinning, right?

Baptism has nothing to do with it. It is merely a symbol of the rebirth to following Christ.

And as to your other questions, only God knows. But yes, in this sense, the fact that those people in Charleston were killed in a church is irrelevant to the final destiny of their souls.

Baptism is not symbolic in the Catholic Church; it's a sacrament cleansing you of original sin. Those not baptized may enter heaven through martyrdom, however.

Saying that doesn't make it a fact.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm so glad you posted this question.

I am a Christian, live in DC and spend the summer in Charleston. So I am here now and what I have witnessed this week has made me not doubt my faith, but actually inspired and made it stronger. What I have seen here this week is nothing short of the work of the Holy Spirit here on earth.

Satan himself -- in the body of DR -- walked into that church on Wednesday night. He confronted the risen Christ, and once again tried to attack it as he has done for 2,000 years. But was the result? Healing, love and forgiveness, even from those most personally affected by the tragedy. The city is in more pain than you can believe but there is also evidence here of the power of the risen Lord to conquer it all. DR is finished. His evil is exposed and has been put in his place. Others will try again -- Satan will not be fully conquered until Christ comes again -- but I can assure you, in this instance, he did not win.

Amen!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If Dylann Roof had killed people in a mall, for example, on a mass shooting spree, only those who believed in God would go to a place called heaven?

Only they would be "saved?"

The unbaptized toddler would go to hell for sinning, right?

Baptism has nothing to do with it. It is merely a symbol of the rebirth to following Christ.

And as to your other questions, only God knows. But yes, in this sense, the fact that those people in Charleston were killed in a church is irrelevant to the final destiny of their souls.

Baptism is not symbolic in the Catholic Church; it's a sacrament cleansing you of original sin. Those not baptized may enter heaven through martyrdom, however.

Saying that doesn't make it a fact.

never said it was

In fact, I'm a former Catholic. I just threw that out there to show how these silly religious rules restrict us. Catholics believe that we're born with original sin, which "dates back to" Adam and Eve and the fall from grace. It dates back to a myth. That's what I find so fascinating - that we're blamed for some character's "flaw" even though the church has come to accept evolution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not at all. The response of the Charleston community has renewed my faith. They are demonstrating what Christian love is all about.
There has been no violence or protests by the people of Charleston. They are showing love, forgiveness, and grace.
We could all learn from them.

That church service was as close to witnessing a resurrection as many of us will get in our lifetimes. There is something awe-inspiring about it that words can't quite capture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From my personal perspective, an atheist, I lost someone very close to me in a sudden way. Other people were spared, but she truly embodied a selfless, loving person. Anyway you could say what God would do this? But when people around you and yourself want to find comfort in the idea that she is in a better place or why someone was taken from you in a violent way, you don't ask that question. There is no point in continuing other people's pain by questioning what helps us all cope with the finality of death.

PP, what you have to understand is that God did not "do this" to your sweet friend/ relative. Accidents, deaths, tragedy happen to all of us at some point. I don't know the circumstances, but I am sorry that this happened to you and to someone in your life. Why were others spared? We do not know. It could be something as simple as luck. I do understand that when we here on earth are faced with death of loved ones, we view it as that person is taken from us. And they often are, as those people in the church were on Wednesday night. But I also know this -- they are now somewhere else that is their final home. And we can look forward to the day -- which, in the big scheme of things is truly "the blink of an eye" -- when we will be with them again.

What you have to understand is that atheists don't believe in god so are completely aware that god didn't do this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm so glad you posted this question.

I am a Christian, live in DC and spend the summer in Charleston. So I am here now and what I have witnessed this week has made me not doubt my faith, but actually inspired and made it stronger. What I have seen here this week is nothing short of the work of the Holy Spirit here on earth.

Satan himself -- in the body of DR -- walked into that church on Wednesday night. He confronted the risen Christ, and once again tried to attack it as he has done for 2,000 years. But what was the result? Healing, love and forgiveness, even from those most personally affected by the tragedy. The city is in more pain than you can believe but there is also evidence here of the power of the risen Lord to conquer it all. DR is finished. His evil is exposed and has been put in his place. Others will try again -- Satan will not be fully conquered until Christ comes again -- but I can assure you, in this instance, he did not win.

Don't forget that fear and pain and murder were also results. Also children deprived of their fathers or mothers. I am happy to see people come together to help the living in this time of great pain, and hope the time comes when this compassion isn't automatically couched in the language of satan and god.

You are absolutely right. This is a pain and void these victim family members will endure for the rest of their lives. Fortunately, they do have the knowledge that they will be together with their loved ones again one day.

Why does this tone of language bother you? All of the victims are devout Christians. Especially if this language is comfort to their relatives, why shouldn't it continue?

I'm all for comfort, especially in the time of trauma. I hope that people don't ultimately believe all the stories they are telling themselves right now to deal with the pain.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. The way they show forgiveness is amazing and inspiring. It's an example of God's love.

People always like to credit "god" with the good, and never the bad. If the HUMAN forgiveness is an "example of God's love," why isn't the shooting an example of God's hatred and bloodlust?

Because God is good and God is love. God shows himself in good things and is supporting these people during this awful time. They are filled with faith and are leaning on God, and he is giving them strength.

In other words, people are kidding themselves. God is clearly not all powerful and worthy of adoration if he can't stop evil -- or watches it happen -- and then takes credit for the human goodness afterwards.

They have a good reason for the self-deception -- they are in terrible distress and are grasping for some kind of comfort. And the whole society encourages belief in magic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm so glad you posted this question.

I am a Christian, live in DC and spend the summer in Charleston. So I am here now and what I have witnessed this week has made me not doubt my faith, but actually inspired and made it stronger. What I have seen here this week is nothing short of the work of the Holy Spirit here on earth.

Satan himself -- in the body of DR -- walked into that church on Wednesday night. He confronted the risen Christ, and once again tried to attack it as he has done for 2,000 years. But what was the result? Healing, love and forgiveness, even from those most personally affected by the tragedy. The city is in more pain than you can believe but there is also evidence here of the power of the risen Lord to conquer it all. DR is finished. His evil is exposed and has been put in his place. Others will try again -- Satan will not be fully conquered until Christ comes again -- but I can assure you, in this instance, he did not win.

Don't forget that fear and pain and murder were also results. Also children deprived of their fathers or mothers. I am happy to see people come together to help the living in this time of great pain, and hope the time comes when this compassion isn't automatically couched in the language of satan and god.

You are absolutely right. This is a pain and void these victim family members will endure for the rest of their lives. Fortunately, they do have the knowledge that they will be together with their loved ones again one day.

Why does this tone of language bother you? All of the victims are devout Christians. Especially if this language is comfort to their relatives, why shouldn't it continue?

I'm all for comfort, especially in the time of trauma. I hope that people don't ultimately believe all the stories they are telling themselves right now to deal with the pain.

Truly, how dare you. Your statements are the very definition of cruelty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not at all. The response of the Charleston community has renewed my faith. They are demonstrating what Christian love is all about.
There has been no violence or protests by the people of Charleston. They are showing love, forgiveness, and grace.
We could all learn from them.

That church service was as close to witnessing a resurrection as many of us will get in our lifetimes. There is something awe-inspiring about it that words can't quite capture.

Was the sacrifice of nine lives taken violently a worthy price for this resurrection?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. The way they show forgiveness is amazing and inspiring. It's an example of God's love.

People always like to credit "god" with the good, and never the bad. If the HUMAN forgiveness is an "example of God's love," why isn't the shooting an example of God's hatred and bloodlust?

Because God is good and God is love. God shows himself in good things and is supporting these people during this awful time. They are filled with faith and are leaning on God, and he is giving them strength.

In other words, people are kidding themselves. God is clearly not all powerful and worthy of adoration if he can't stop evil -- or watches it happen -- and then takes credit for the human goodness afterwards.

They have a good reason for the self-deception -- they are in terrible distress and are grasping for some kind of comfort. And the whole society encourages belief in magic.

Ok, so what's it to you? Let them believe. The original question was if the shooting in Charleston had weakened anyone's faith. The answers so far seem to be a resounding "no!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. The way they show forgiveness is amazing and inspiring. It's an example of God's love.

People always like to credit "god" with the good, and never the bad. If the HUMAN forgiveness is an "example of God's love," why isn't the shooting an example of God's hatred and bloodlust?

Because God is good and God is love. God shows himself in good things and is supporting these people during this awful time. They are filled with faith and are leaning on God, and he is giving them strength.

In other words, people are kidding themselves. God is clearly not all powerful and worthy of adoration if he can't stop evil -- or watches it happen -- and then takes credit for the human goodness afterwards.

They have a good reason for the self-deception -- they are in terrible distress and are grasping for some kind of comfort. And the whole society encourages belief in magic.

Ok, so what's it to you? Let them believe. The original question was if the shooting in Charleston had weakened anyone's faith. The answers so far seem to be a resounding "no!"

What's with you -- do you truly feel some dissent on a message board is going to interfere with a person of true faith? God is mighty, Some people say he proved it with the outpouring of faith after the killings and that he was powerless to prevent the murders. Somehow, this thinking provides comfort to many people. but not all and they are entitled to express their feelings too.

[Anonymous]

"Expressing their feelings" is great, but why denigrate people? Why say it's" self-deception" and belief in "magic?" In other words 1. Why criticize people? 2. How does that affect you? If you believe they are self-deceived and believe in crazy, old myths, so what? Move along. Again, the answer seems to be that no, the shootings in Charleston have not diminished people's faith. Does that require debate?