Regret prepping for cogat now . . .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard of one case of prepping 5 years ago. The parent was called to the school. I didn't prep because I believe it sends the wrong message to my child, but now I hear about it regularly and just shake my head. I think other parents assume that I prep because I'm Asian, but I truly hope that the school knows that my kid was not prepped.

The parent was called to the school? That sounds crazy. FCPS chooses to base a significant decision affecting the quality of our children's education on tests that can be easily gamed and they called the parent in? There are a lot of people prepping. I didn't prep DC1 and had no idea about prepping at that point. DC1 got into AAP, but I later found out there is extensive prepping, and not just Asian moms. I haven't decided what to do with DC2 yet, but would not mind getting called in to have the you prepped your kid conversation since I don't think that FCPS is handling the whole situation very well--plus while DC2 is very smart, I think private is a better fit than AAP so there will be no consequences if I do prep DC2 and get called in. I would, however, get satisfaction out of telling the person who calls me in about how ridiculous the selection process based on easily gamed tests is. FCPS needs to follow the trend seen in NY of not using these tests because the results have become invalid due to extensive prepping. To the people who think there are one or two people prepping, have you seen the links to the various prep centers posted on this forum? Why do you think these businesses exist, for the one or two people?

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Prepping is what they changed the test to the FAT!

Well, the official reason is that the test needed to be more accessible to students who don't speak English. If that's true, it's utter garbage. Speaking and reading English are basic markers of success in this country; the same holds for countries in which other languages predominate. Speaking and reading English well are skills we should be emphasizing, not excluding.

[Anonymous]

Good point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Prepping is what they changed the test to the FAT!

Well, the official reason is that the test needed to be more accessible to students who don't speak English. If that's true, it's utter garbage. Speaking and reading English are basic markers of success in this country; the same holds for countries in which other languages predominate. Speaking and reading English well are skills we should be emphasizing, not excluding.

Really? The AART at my DC's school said explicitly in a parents meeting that they asked the publisher to write a custom test because too many kids had seen copies of the old CogAT in prep materials.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Prepping is what they changed the test to the FAT!

Well, the official reason is that the test needed to be more accessible to students who don't speak English. If that's true, it's utter garbage. Speaking and reading English are basic markers of success in this country; the same holds for countries in which other languages predominate. Speaking and reading English well are skills we should be emphasizing, not excluding.

Really? The AART at my DC's school said explicitly in a parents meeting that they asked the publisher to write a custom test because too many kids had seen copies of the old CogAT in prep materials.

Here's a link to a FCPS document that includes an explanation of why the test was changed last year:

http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/pdfs/FAQre2012CustomizedCogAT.pdf

See fourth paragraph, first sentence:

"FCPS staff members chose to administer the custom form of the CogAT this year after it came to our attention that some students, in previous years, had prepared for the CogAT using the exact form of the CogAT being administered in FCPS."

[Anonymous]

Then it's a shame they don't retest the past couple of years of students who didn't have to take the FxAT and who have increased AAP numbers exponentially.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Then it's a shame they don't retest the past couple of years of students who didn't have to take the FxAT and who have increased AAP numbers exponentially.

Right, because we all know the best use of the precious amount of classroom time is administering a standardized test.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Then it's a shame they don't retest the past couple of years of students who didn't have to take the FxAT and who have increased AAP numbers exponentially.

It would really suck to have to explain to a parent/child that the straight A (4) kid is being removed from AAP because of the FxAT score.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

There is the kid who complains about being forced to do Kumon for math (mom let him drop it this year), and the handful of kids who go to Chinese school every week, but no giant test prep machine.

To be fair, my mom-friends at the dance studio, tell me that part of the time their kids spend at Korean or Russian or Chinese school on the weekends is spent on what are essentially test prep type lessons. They miss or come late to rehearsals because they spend a number of hours at their cultural school on the weekends. I used to think that they were learning their heritage language at that time, but I've been told by the parents and the kids that a lot of the time is math and TJ prep.

How old are these kids? I 've never heard or seen this - and I've taught at one school and sent my kids to another, and I have friends in half a dozen Chinese language schools in MD/DC/VS, and this is completely news to me. For TJ preps, maybe, but 2/3rd grade AAP tests? Unheard of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There is the kid who complains about being forced to do Kumon for math (mom let him drop it this year), and the handful of kids who go to Chinese school every week, but no giant test prep machine.

To be fair, my mom-friends at the dance studio, tell me that part of the time their kids spend at Korean or Russian or Chinese school on the weekends is spent on what are essentially test prep type lessons. They miss or come late to rehearsals because they spend a number of hours at their cultural school on the weekends. I used to think that they were learning their heritage language at that time, but I've been told by the parents and the kids that a lot of the time is math and TJ prep.

How old are these kids? I 've never heard or seen this - and I've taught at one school and sent my kids to another, and I have friends in half a dozen Chinese language schools in MD/DC/VS, and this is completely news to me. For TJ preps, maybe, but 2/3rd grade AAP tests? Unheard of.

Sorry, no, I didn't mean AAP prep, but TJ prep and extra math. The kids I've known are mid elementary and middle school age, but have been going to the school for years. The parents say they want the kids to take math classes that are ahead of their grade level so the classes at regular school are a review of what they've already learned. I got the impression from conversation that the math started at an early age, but that could be wrong. Are you saying that the younger kids are only taking the language of their culture and no academic subjects at Saturday school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

There is the kid who complains about being forced to do Kumon for math (mom let him drop it this year), and the handful of kids who go to Chinese school every week, but no giant test prep machine.

To be fair, my mom-friends at the dance studio, tell me that part of the time their kids spend at Korean or Russian or Chinese school on the weekends is spent on what are essentially test prep type lessons. They miss or come late to rehearsals because they spend a number of hours at their cultural school on the weekends. I used to think that they were learning their heritage language at that time, but I've been told by the parents and the kids that a lot of the time is math and TJ prep.

How old are these kids? I 've never heard or seen this - and I've taught at one school and sent my kids to another, and I have friends in half a dozen Chinese language schools in MD/DC/VS, and this is completely news to me. For TJ preps, maybe, but 2/3rd grade AAP tests? Unheard of.

Sorry, no, I didn't mean AAP prep, but TJ prep and extra math. The kids I've known are mid elementary and middle school age, but have been going to the school for years. The parents say they want the kids to take math classes that are ahead of their grade level so the classes at regular school are a review of what they've already learned. I got the impression from conversation that the math started at an early age, but that could be wrong. Are you saying that the younger kids are only taking the language of their culture and no academic subjects at Saturday school?

Yes, nothing but Chinese, at least from pre-k to 4th grade classes. There are non-Chinese enrichment classes afterwards - tennis, martial arts, dance, badminton, etc.

I'm pretty sure it's the same thing for older kids too. I mean we talk about Chinese schools a LOT among friends but this is the first time I've heard about some do more than languages.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

To be fair, my mom-friends at the dance studio, tell me that part of the time their kids spend at Korean or Russian or Chinese school on the weekends is spent on what are essentially test prep type lessons. They miss or come late to rehearsals because they spend a number of hours at their cultural school on the weekends. I used to think that they were learning their heritage language at that time, but I've been told by the parents and the kids that a lot of the time is math and TJ prep.

How old are these kids? I 've never heard or seen this - and I've taught at one school and sent my kids to another, and I have friends in half a dozen Chinese language schools in MD/DC/VS, and this is completely news to me. For TJ preps, maybe, but 2/3rd grade AAP tests? Unheard of.

Sorry, no, I didn't mean AAP prep, but TJ prep and extra math. The kids I've known are mid elementary and middle school age, but have been going to the school for years. The parents say they want the kids to take math classes that are ahead of their grade level so the classes at regular school are a review of what they've already learned. I got the impression from conversation that the math started at an early age, but that could be wrong. Are you saying that the younger kids are only taking the language of their culture and no academic subjects at Saturday school?

Yes, nothing but Chinese, at least from pre-k to 4th grade classes. There are non-Chinese enrichment classes afterwards - tennis, martial arts, dance, badminton, etc.

I'm pretty sure it's the same thing for older kids too. I mean we talk about Chinese schools a LOT among friends but this is the first time I've heard about some do more than languages.

The Chinese School we go to has Chinese language, math and activity classes like mentioned above. However, the math classes are more like "catch-up" rather than "get-ahead". And definitely no prepping for NNAT/CogAt/FxAt/TJ and whatsoever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Then it's a shame they don't retest the past couple of years of students who didn't have to take the FxAT and who have increased AAP numbers exponentially.

It would really suck to have to explain to a parent/child that the straight A (4) kid is being removed from AAP because of the FxAT score.

Ultimately, they need to decide who this program is for. If it's for the "truly gifted" (which clearly it is not), then administer more rigorous, comprehensive tests and admit that very small number of kids. I would see a lot of value in this--with the right guidance, these are the kids who can accomplish really great things that will benefit us all.

If it's for kids who are somewhat smarter than average but mostly very highly motivated, then tailor the admissions process to them. Grades and teacher impressions (K, first, and second--not just the second grade teacher who has known you for all of a few months) would account for most of the admissions. Again, I have no problem with that. Sadly, Fairfax County schools are starting to cater to the lowest common denominator just to get the damn SOL scores up. So a kid who wants to learn and is willing to work hard should have a place where he or she is rewarded. Hard work is also key to accomplishing great things.

Right now, I think the program presents itself as "school for geniuses" but mostly admits the hard workers (and maybe test preppers--but I know nothing about that side). If it were more honest in its criteria, I think a lot of sniping among parents would go away.

[Anonymous]

It might vary by culture and by individual child. There are a number of different cultures that offer weekend schools in this area. I got the impression that a lot of math was involved from the kids talking to other kids. Also, one parent specifically said that his child was taking more advanced math at the cultural school than at regular school.

Maybe some of the cultural programs offer different class choices than others?

[Anonymous]

The Chinese School we go to has Chinese language, math and activity classes like mentioned above. However, the math classes are more like "catch-up" rather than "get-ahead". And definitely no prepping for NNAT/CogAt/FxAt/TJ and whatsoever.

Which one is this?