Creative Minds - Unified Lottery?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Look up "paper bag test"


So the little girl isn't black enough for you? Good to know."

My son is half black and half white. The girl looks like my son. The little girl is beautiful and perfect as she is.

My point is that the vast majority of children in the DC Public School system are black children. In planning a school here, even in the sitting around in the living room with the web designer stage, I would hope that people would be aware of the environment and history and some of the discrimination dark skinned black people still face in this world and this city. I would hope they would aim to reflect the beauty of every kind of child.

[Anonymous]

CM might be spending their money on educational materials versus updating a perfectly functional website.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They couldn't find a stock photo with even one black child who would not have passed the paper bag test back in the day? That is even worse.

What worries me is that you judge a school based on the website that they probably designed when it was 3 people sitting around in a living room vs the actual statistics that show it is the 2nd most racially diverse school in DC.

But sure, judge things on what they look like, not what they are.

NP: They've been open for a few years now, they have very savvy people running the school, and they KNOW how important marketing is. At this point I would assume any photos they have up on their main webpage are exactly the photos they want them to be. It is NOT crazy to notice things like that, and frankly, if you go visit the school, there are definitely brown and black kids, but not as many as most of the popular charters have. It does make you wonder about their admissions, frankly...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:CM might be spending their money on educational materials versus updating a perfectly functional website.

Riiiight, because they aren't up to date technologically enough to take pics of their actual kids or updated pics and upload them to their website. The cost of doing that is, erm, daunting for CM. Yeah, that must be it!

[Anonymous]

Look, what is the point of questioning their marketing, I seriously doubt it is a subversive and strategic decision. Do people think AA families will go to the website, see the picture, ignore good scores and move on to lower performing school? Probably they will still apply.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look, what is the point of questioning their marketing, I seriously doubt it is a subversive and strategic decision. Do people think AA families will go to the website, see the picture, ignore good scores and move on to lower performing school? Probably they will still apply.

As an AA parent who only moved to DC 2 school years' ago, I can definitely say that as I researched DC schools from many states away, the images on the websites had an impact. It didn't make us not apply to a school that was really highly rated, but it raised a red flag that stayed a red flag as I finally got to meet school staff at Expos and go to open houses.

Interestingly... those red flags often played out to real impressions when I visited. One school I read enough glowing things that I pretty much pushed the doubts out of my mind... until I went to an open house. A combination of the school's principal, the way the school answered a lot of questions about their curriculum and culture, and the way I was treated as I walked classroom to classroom... it all made me reflect back on the impression I had looking at their website and thought "Yeah, figures!" I had a similar experience with a 2nd school as well, and have met other parents who had the exact same experiences.

So in the end we did not apply, although that wasn't solely based on their marketing obviously. It was based on all the things a family should consider: what the school feels like, whether we think it would be a good match for our kid(s), and how we feel treated by the staff (which is obviously the best indicator you can get in advance of how your kid will be treated). But frankly, marketing gave a good indication of what that school prioritized, and I didn't feel like our family was the type of family the school wanted to serve, honestly. I'm sure all the people who want a less diverse, quality, free school option are thrilled that maybe people are turned off and don't apply... and we know they're out there, because they've spoken up on DCUM many times with the "Which public schools are mostly white?" type of threads.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look, what is the point of questioning their marketing, I seriously doubt it is a subversive and strategic decision. Do people think AA families will go to the website, see the picture, ignore good scores and move on to lower performing school? Probably they will still apply.

As an AA parent who only moved to DC 2 school years' ago, I can definitely say that as I researched DC schools from many states away, the images on the websites had an impact. It didn't make us not apply to a school that was really highly rated, but it raised a red flag that stayed a red flag as I finally got to meet school staff at Expos and go to open houses.

Interestingly... those red flags often played out to real impressions when I visited. One school I read enough glowing things that I pretty much pushed the doubts out of my mind... until I went to an open house. A combination of the school's principal, the way the school answered a lot of questions about their curriculum and culture, and the way I was treated as I walked classroom to classroom... it all made me reflect back on the impression I had looking at their website and thought "Yeah, figures!" I had a similar experience with a 2nd school as well, and have met other parents who had the exact same experiences.

So in the end we did not apply, although that wasn't solely based on their marketing obviously. It was based on all the things a family should consider: what the school feels like, whether we think it would be a good match for our kid(s), and how we feel treated by the staff (which is obviously the best indicator you can get in advance of how your kid will be treated). But frankly, marketing gave a good indication of what that school prioritized, and I didn't feel like our family was the type of family the school wanted to serve, honestly. I'm sure all the people who want a less diverse, quality, free school option are thrilled that maybe people are turned off and don't apply... and we know they're out there, because they've spoken up on DCUM many times with the "Which public schools are mostly white?" type of threads.

This is sad. I'm sorry that was your experience.

[Anonymous]

I'm also sad that was your experience - and honestly, a bit baffled that anything about the school would've made you feel that way. I'm an African American parent at CM and the reality is that the school is actually extraordinarily diverse. Indeed, it's comparable to many of the other similar, highly sought after charters (e.g., Inspired Teaching).

What I can say, based on personal experience, is that you absolutely cannot judge the diversity of the school based on who you see attending the open houses (or the parent events, for that matter). Furthermore, the family association president last year was an African American parent, and one of the co-chairs of the family association this year is African-American. I've volunteered at the open houses and led tours for prospective parents. I've honestly never felt a "vibe" that would make AA parents feel unwelcome and I'm pretty certain the principal would be deeply troubled that you would feel that this school was not welcoming to children from all backgrounds. It's one thing to say that you didn't think the school was a good fit for your child because of your child and your family's needs/values -- but it's really another to claim that this is because the school doesn't welcome AA kids.

You are, of course, more than entitled to your feelings...but I just wanted to say that, as a parent of an AA child at CM, I have never felt my child wasn't welcomed and loved at that school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm also sad that was your experience - and honestly, a bit baffled that anything about the school would've made you feel that way. I'm an African American parent at CM and the reality is that the school is actually extraordinarily diverse. Indeed, it's comparable to many of the other similar, highly sought after charters (e.g., Inspired Teaching).

What I can say, based on personal experience, is that you absolutely cannot judge the diversity of the school based on who you see attending the open houses (or the parent events, for that matter). Furthermore, the family association president last year was an African American parent, and one of the co-chairs of the family association this year is African-American. I've volunteered at the open houses and led tours for prospective parents. I've honestly never felt a "vibe" that would make AA parents feel unwelcome and I'm pretty certain the principal would be deeply troubled that you would feel that this school was not welcoming to children from all backgrounds. It's one thing to say that you didn't think the school was a good fit for your child because of your child and your family's needs/values -- but it's really another to claim that this is because the school doesn't welcome AA kids.

You are, of course, more than entitled to your feelings...but I just wanted to say that, as a parent of an AA child at CM, I have never felt my child wasn't welcomed and loved at that school.

I'm the parent you're responding to, and I really do appreciate you writing all that. Please note that I didn't generalize about all families, I just wrote what MY experience was and what it felt like for MY family. I also didn't say CM isn't diverse, I'm just agreeing with a PP that marketing does plant a seed of impression.

Since it sounds like you have had a great experience there, and there are other AA families who not only feel welcome but are even in some leadership roles (like Family Association President), maybe you should mention to the school's leadership that it might be worth looking at updating the images on the website? That's how this whole conversation started. And I would reiterate that I've met other AA parents who also checked out CM and chose not to apply, or applied but didn't feel good about their visit. Wish I could be more specific about their experiences but it's just worth noting that it's not just my experience. ANd I don't think any of us were going just on who else was in the room looking at the school. I met some uptight, overly-competitive parents at many open houses, including one fo the schools I fell in love with the most, but that didn't confuse me with the school itself because the school staff and environment was great and so welcoming.

I'm sincerely glad you're having a good experience there, and even though we didn't apply, I'm always happy to know that all families (but yes, I'm particularly sensitive to how things are for AA families) are welcome there and that AA families are having a great experience. You can't have too many families happy with their schools!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm also sad that was your experience - and honestly, a bit baffled that anything about the school would've made you feel that way. I'm an African American parent at CM and the reality is that the school is actually extraordinarily diverse. Indeed, it's comparable to many of the other similar, highly sought after charters (e.g., Inspired Teaching).

What I can say, based on personal experience, is that you absolutely cannot judge the diversity of the school based on who you see attending the open houses (or the parent events, for that matter). Furthermore, the family association president last year was an African American parent, and one of the co-chairs of the family association this year is African-American. I've volunteered at the open houses and led tours for prospective parents. I've honestly never felt a "vibe" that would make AA parents feel unwelcome and I'm pretty certain the principal would be deeply troubled that you would feel that this school was not welcoming to children from all backgrounds. It's one thing to say that you didn't think the school was a good fit for your child because of your child and your family's needs/values -- but it's really another to claim that this is because the school doesn't welcome AA kids.

You are, of course, more than entitled to your feelings...but I just wanted to say that, as a parent of an AA child at CM, I have never felt my child wasn't welcomed and loved at that school.

I'm the parent you're responding to, and I really do appreciate you writing all that. Please note that I didn't generalize about all families, I just wrote what MY experience was and what it felt like for MY family. I also didn't say CM isn't diverse, I'm just agreeing with a PP that marketing does plant a seed of impression.

Since it sounds like you have had a great experience there, and there are other AA families who not only feel welcome but are even in some leadership roles (like Family Association President), maybe you should mention to the school's leadership that it might be worth looking at updating the images on the website? That's how this whole conversation started. And I would reiterate that I've met other AA parents who also checked out CM and chose not to apply, or applied but didn't feel good about their visit. Wish I could be more specific about their experiences but it's just worth noting that it's not just my experience. ANd I don't think any of us were going just on who else was in the room looking at the school. I met some uptight, overly-competitive parents at many open houses, including one fo the schools I fell in love with the most, but that didn't confuse me with the school itself because the school staff and environment was great and so welcoming.

I'm sincerely glad you're having a good experience there, and even though we didn't apply, I'm always happy to know that all families (but yes, I'm particularly sensitive to how things are for AA families) are welcome there and that AA families are having a great experience. You can't have too many families happy with their schools!

Same poster, another thought re: diversity: I haven't looked at the numbers for SY12-13, but I am interested in how CM's diversity (specifically AA) compares to similarly popular charters. Even though you say CM is "extraordinarily diverse", I will say that from my very UNscientific experience (on the playgrounds of Columbia Heights and 16th St NW), I haven't met any AA CM students, yet I've met many Caucausian CM students (and one Latino student). Now that you've said CM is extraordinarily diverse, I'm going to check that out. Not because we will apply, because we still are not, but this raises my curiosity and makes me realize that going into this lottery season, I haven't looked at last year's data to see how the schools compare on this issue. I would never make a definitive statement about CM's diversity or comparable lack of it based on my little playground data, but you saying it's extraordinarily diverse I guess does surprise me and triggers a look, not just at CM but at all the schools we've considered in the last couple of years.

[Anonymous]

I curious about what the PP is talking about, the school not wanting their "type" of family. What type of family is that? Just by looking at the demographics I can't tell. 34% AA. Good size low SES. Don't get it, can you explain?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm also sad that was your experience - and honestly, a bit baffled that anything about the school would've made you feel that way. I'm an African American parent at CM and the reality is that the school is actually extraordinarily diverse. Indeed, it's comparable to many of the other similar, highly sought after charters (e.g., Inspired Teaching).

What I can say, based on personal experience, is that you absolutely cannot judge the diversity of the school based on who you see attending the open houses (or the parent events, for that matter). Furthermore, the family association president last year was an African American parent, and one of the co-chairs of the family association this year is African-American. I've volunteered at the open houses and led tours for prospective parents. I've honestly never felt a "vibe" that would make AA parents feel unwelcome and I'm pretty certain the principal would be deeply troubled that you would feel that this school was not welcoming to children from all backgrounds. It's one thing to say that you didn't think the school was a good fit for your child because of your child and your family's needs/values -- but it's really another to claim that this is because the school doesn't welcome AA kids.

You are, of course, more than entitled to your feelings...but I just wanted to say that, as a parent of an AA child at CM, I have never felt my child wasn't welcomed and loved at that school.

I'm the parent you're responding to, and I really do appreciate you writing all that. Please note that I didn't generalize about all families, I just wrote what MY experience was and what it felt like for MY family. I also didn't say CM isn't diverse, I'm just agreeing with a PP that marketing does plant a seed of impression.

Since it sounds like you have had a great experience there, and there are other AA families who not only feel welcome but are even in some leadership roles (like Family Association President), maybe you should mention to the school's leadership that it might be worth looking at updating the images on the website? That's how this whole conversation started. And I would reiterate that I've met other AA parents who also checked out CM and chose not to apply, or applied but didn't feel good about their visit. Wish I could be more specific about their experiences but it's just worth noting that it's not just my experience. ANd I don't think any of us were going just on who else was in the room looking at the school. I met some uptight, overly-competitive parents at many open houses, including one fo the schools I fell in love with the most, but that didn't confuse me with the school itself because the school staff and environment was great and so welcoming.

I'm sincerely glad you're having a good experience there, and even though we didn't apply, I'm always happy to know that all families (but yes, I'm particularly sensitive to how things are for AA families) are welcome there and that AA families are having a great experience. You can't have too many families happy with their schools!

I share some of your experiences. I'm curious to know which school you fell in love with. Are you there now?

[Anonymous]

I see everyone remarking in the "great scores" and great rating, but I'm not sure what measures they're referring to. I don't see any scores as this school is too new.

[Anonymous]

AA parent here too but not the previous poster. I had the same reaction to CMs website as I did to Lafayette's website. CM should change the images to be reflective of their student body. IT's site looks real and warm.

[Anonymous]

AA CM parent again. I will actually raise the website issue with the principal.

I admit that I personally really liked that the website had children of various ethnicities - that may be because I probably value the idea of a school that values diversity more broadly and the international perspective, than the specific racial demographics in DC. But I can also see how another parent might interpret things differently. I know that the website doesn't currently use pictures of CM students - those are the pics from the original website that was up before the school opened. I assume they had to pay to use each of the pics (thus why there are only a handful) and tried to select a really diverse group (kinda reminds me of Benetton ad). It might be time to consider changing that.

I know this might be hard to do, but I'm wondering if you can give examples of the types of things a school does that makes you feel welcome or unwelcome and that you think are tied to race/ethnicity. I'm not necessarily thinking about just CM, but at all the schools. No need to name schools b/c I don't want this to turn into an attack on various schools. Just trying to get more details to pass along so folks can critically think about these concerns.