Narcissistic Personality Disorder - Any Experience?

[Anonymous]

DSM-IV-TR 301.81The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders fourth edition, DSM IV-TR, a widely used manual for diagnosing mental disorders, defines narcissistic personality disorder (in Axis II Cluster B) as:[1]

A pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:
1.Has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
2.Is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
3.Believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)
4.Requires excessive admiration
5.Has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
6.Is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
7.Lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others
8.Is often envious of others or believes others are envious of him or her
9.Shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes
10.Often mild to moderate paranoia, that others are out to do him in.
11.Predominant "name dropper" boasting or suggestion association with people or affiliations of importance.
It is also a requirement of DSM-IV that a diagnosis of any specific personality disorder also satisfies a set of general personality disorder criteria.

[Anonymous]

OP here. You all are scaring the heck out of me. In reading all these stories, and looking back at MIL's behavior over the past 16 years that I have known her, she definitely has some degree of NPD. Her deceased (2nd) husband had probably one of the worst cases ever. I can not believe I finally have a "name" to use for her behavior (and deceased step-FIL). My only doubts revolve around DH's upbringing. I have never heard him say she was overly critical of him but maybe she did over-praise him when she paid attention. I know she often treated him as a substiute spouse, you can actually see it in her extended family photos. She left him with her aunt and uncle for a few years (even though his Dad would have been happy to have him). I dont know that she was all that involved in his life even when he did live with her. I am still trying to figure that part out so as to understand how it affected him growing up. He always says he was the last kid picked up at every event. She told him he was a great athlete but never super smart (not true). When he was young and ateenager, her boyfriends spent the night and he knew. Anyway, I want to somehow get him to figure out that this disorder describes his mom's behavior but it has to be subtle and so he kind of figure it out himself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm so sorry for you and your family, OP. My father was narcissistic. He abused us all horrifically and bullied anyone he thought would take it - unless they had something he want and then he was Mr. Charming. His position as a physician really let him feed his disorder. Anyone who criticised him or called him on his behavior was shunned/dropped. Our lives were hell and as soon as I could, I left home. One I left and made it clear I wasn't taking his shit any more, he pretty much left me alone. Until he died, I severely limited contact with him and only spoke/saw my mom when he wasn't around. If I had had children while he was alive, I would never have let him see them - not just because of my fears he would abuse them but also because he would use my children as pawns to hurt my mother. If he knew something mattered to you, he would use that get to you. He would have had my mom do shit like rip up all pictures of the kids, rip up any drawings they made for her, that sort of thing. I know he'd do it because that's the sort of thing he did while I was growing up. He did it because he could.

It took me a long time and a lot of therapy to get to a good place. It's not easy and if your DH hasn't really examined this part of his life, well, it's going to be very difficult for you both to make some of the hard decisions you need to make and establish boundaries. I'm sorry I don't have anything more positive or uplifting to offer......

I am married to your "father" can't wait to get out.....

[Anonymous]

OP I relate so much. It's like we have the same MIL. We set major boundaries and while DH agrees she has NPD, he is still caught up in the cycle of abuse and i can't force him out of it. She will go on the verbal attack out of nowhere and it's like a tornado hits, but he seems addicted to the calm and the charm that comes after. She morphs into the mother he wanted...briefly....until she goes off on her next abusive tirade...which you cannot predict because something major could be just fine with her and then something tiny sets her off.

We limit her contact with out kids and we keep it brief and supervised. Any violations of boundaries and we leave. We don't let her stay with us. We have gone long periods of time without contact.

On the one hand my husband knows he saved himself a small fortune in marital therapy by setting boundaries with her, on the other hand he needs her in his life and I could never insist he cut off, that has to come from him. My siblings in law have spent a small fortune in marital and individual therapy all to find out what we already knew...the woman has NPD and without boundaries she can destroy marriages and make people miserable.

That all said...the woman should get an academy award for acting because when she puts on her sweet act she fools many people, though those close to her know her inner ugly.

[Anonymous]

I'm so sorry, OP. I'm one of the PPs and I know what you're going through. Your DH really does need some counseling to help him with this. It's hard to break out of the emotional patterns of our childhood (the parental bonds really can exert an unhealthy pull at times) and it sounds like he could use some gentle and understanding help. It's not easy and at times it's very painful but it is really better than being subjected to the rollercoaster his mother can put him on. It would be useful for you to start it together, perhaps initiating it as a marital issue (which it is). The counselor could hear from you what you're seeing, how it impacts you and your fears for your kids. If you get the right counselor and it goes well, your DH could then work with her individually for a while. I can't tell you how much easier it is having a counselor to discuss this with and having a rational voice to provide objective guidance and strategies - the strategies! That's really been the best. We all need strategies rather than just reacting emotionally. Good luck and please post back with updates.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all this helpful advice. I'm not the OP, but a daughter of a NM.
One question for those who have limited to no contact...How do you maintain relationships with those family members who live with/work with your parent? In my case my elderly grandparents, father and sibling live either with my mother or in the same very small town, and while I want to limit contact with her, what happens is I end up seeing everyone else less. All of my relationships have suffered...

[Anonymous]

Thought this was relevant:

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-legacy-distorted-love/201105/the-narcissistic-family-portrait

[Anonymous]

I was going to write something similar to 16:59 .... For those worried about what they will feel when the parent dies, the first feeling is freedom and relief. I cried more for the fact that I was first crying out of happiness then grief. I felt like such a phony at the funeral.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for all this helpful advice. I'm not the OP, but a daughter of a NM.
One question for those who have limited to no contact...How do you maintain relationships with those family members who live with/work with your parent? In my case my elderly grandparents, father and sibling live either with my mother or in the same very small town, and while I want to limit contact with her, what happens is I end up seeing everyone else less. All of my relationships have suffered...

frequent pp here who has dealt with this. we would just visit and not tell my dad. stay with someone else. Fortunately he doesn't live WITH anyone, just in the same town as my mother and brother. When there was no contact I would just try to park someone else's car behind mine and hope he didn't drive by (and see my out of state plates), and when limited contact I would just say I'm going to be in town from X to Y and I can either see you for lunch or dinner on Y. Of course this is much easier if you can make your family members understand that the limited contact is what's best for you and their respect is expected (interference will not be tolerated). Otherwise, if you have well-meaning family that doesn't respect your wishes, dear ol' mom or dad will likely show up where you're staying!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thought this was relevant:

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-legacy-distorted-love/201105/the-narcissistic-family-portrait

Good timing. Thanks for posting.

[Anonymous]

Wow - I'm the one who asked how people feel when their narcissistic parent dies. I can't imagine feeling good about it - I assumed my feelings would become even more complex. Food for thought . . . .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow - I'm the one who asked how people feel when their narcissistic parent dies. I can't imagine feeling good about it - I assumed my feelings would become even more complex. Food for thought . . . .

I'm the PP who wrote about her father's death as the best thing that ever happened to her. I want to clarify that I don't feel "good" about it. I know that may be difficult to understand that it's the best thing that ever happened to me but I don't feel "good" about it. You're right that it's complex. A better way to look at it perhaps is as if it were a malignant cancer. Sure, the experience of cancer may have some positives - like learning empathy for others struggling with issues, appreciation of the positive things in your life, realizing what's really important in life, etc. But, that doesn't happen in the beginning. It takes some time, including some grief. When if your cancer is cured, I don't think anyone would say they felt "good" that their cancer was cured. It was an awful experience, I took what was of value of the experience but I'm glad that it's over. I'm mourn for the father I never had, the brutality that was inflicted up on me and those I loved and am glad that through counseling I have been able to find peace with the experience. I don't feel "good" about his death but it freed me. Does that at least make some sense?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thought this was relevant:

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-legacy-distorted-love/201105/the-narcissistic-family-portrait

Good timing. Thanks for posting.

Wow. That sure is a good article. Thanks for posting.