“Affirming” church not doing it for us

[Anonymous]

You might also want to check Little River UCC in Annandale

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are in a different area but really enjoy our Methodist church. I grew up Presbyterian and even in the 90s it was very political. Our Methodist church is open and affirming but sticks more to religious topics and has a congregation with varying political beliefs (though I doubt any maga types). Our prior church was the same, so I wonder if Methodist churches generally might be a fit.

I’ve never understood the point of looking for churches that are a “fit.” You’re not trying on skirts.

OP pray that God leads you to a church that is Biblically based, one that will welcome you with open arms as they do all of us as sinners, and have as their mission pointing people to the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Everything else will fall into place.

Yeah, you aren't "trying on skirts." But you are joining a community. So there is even more reason, than with trying on clothing, to get a good "fit."

Disagree. “Community” is your neighborhood or country club. A church should be where you find, serve and hear the word of God, above all.

What do you think finding, serving, and hearing the word of God looks like? You don't do it in a vacuum.

That’s correct. But to require that all of the people in this community look and think like you, so that you are always “comfortable” with the “fit” is the opposite of Christian thought.

OP isn't asking for everyone to look and think like them. They're asking for a place where they can be themselves and be accepted and find spiritual fulfillment. If you have to hide part of yourself to fit in somewhere, that community is not for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are in a different area but really enjoy our Methodist church. I grew up Presbyterian and even in the 90s it was very political. Our Methodist church is open and affirming but sticks more to religious topics and has a congregation with varying political beliefs (though I doubt any maga types). Our prior church was the same, so I wonder if Methodist churches generally might be a fit.

I’ve never understood the point of looking for churches that are a “fit.” You’re not trying on skirts.

OP pray that God leads you to a church that is Biblically based, one that will welcome you with open arms as they do all of us as sinners, and have as their mission pointing people to the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Everything else will fall into place.

Yeah, you aren't "trying on skirts." But you are joining a community. So there is even more reason, than with trying on clothing, to get a good "fit."

Disagree. “Community” is your neighborhood or country club. A church should be where you find, serve and hear the word of God, above all.

What do you think finding, serving, and hearing the word of God looks like? You don't do it in a vacuum.

That’s correct. But to require that all of the people in this community look and think like you, so that you are always “comfortable” with the “fit” is the opposite of Christian thought.

No one is saying that. DH and I always say we wish we were Catholic, since there is such great community infrastructure, our siblings and best friends are all Catholic, etc. But we just don't believe in Catholicism. We also don't believe the bible is literal and inerrant. So that leaves us with mainline denominations, which for us means about 15 churches within a 20 minute drive. At that point, it makes sense to look for a good fit- do they have good children's programming? Are there a lot of families? Are they more/less liturgical? Is it an environment that helps you feel closer to God? (We tried one church that had hard rock music and strobe lights and was not for us)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's an open secret that a majority of the College of Cardinals are gay and non-celibate. But what the Catholic church is trying to do (that the Episcopal church is not) is to actually maintain some continuity in this Christian religion. And Scripture and Tradition (i.e., the Magisterium) clearly and consistently put forward that homosexual acts are sinful.

So if you want to be affirmed for your sex acts, you'll have to go Episcopal or Unitarian or something and join the grievance fest. But if you want to be affirmed for your image as a child of God in communion with all the saints and angels, give the Catholics a chance.

OP here. It’s not that I specifically want affirmation of sex acts. Are all heterosexual sex acts automatically good?? There are millions of ways to sin. I don’t know that every single thing we do or thought we have needs to be affirmed.

One major issue I am having trouble accepting in “affirming” denominations is with the adoption of religious ideas such as the idea that there are more than 2 sexes, that a male body can be inhabited by a “female” brain, and other unscientific religious beliefs that are not supported by objective science or by scripture. I have personally known children and adults harmed by these things and I am appalled that some denominations are moving so far away from scripture and adopting ideas that mirror the current progressive ideologies.
Compassion isn’t new, and compassion is real, but compassion shouldn’t be dependent on buying into a worldly ideology.

[Anonymous]

Whoa OP, I was going to say you shouldn't write off entire denominations after visiting one church, the community and emphasis of Episcopalians (or any other) can vary hugely from one congregation to the next so you might find a better fit.

But I see above that you want a church that's accepting of gay but not trans people? Good luck with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Whoa OP, I was going to say you shouldn't write off entire denominations after visiting one church, the community and emphasis of Episcopalians (or any other) can vary hugely from one congregation to the next so you might find a better fit.

But I see above that you want a church that's accepting of gay but not trans people? Good luck with that.

That’s reductive and not at all what I’m saying.
It’s not about being “accepting”. It’s about adopting specific beliefs not tied to scripture. Scripture does not support the existence of a more than 2 sexes, and it also doesn’t support same sex marriage. That doesn’t mean we cannot be compassionate and welcoming to people who experience same sex attraction or do not conform to male or female stereotypes in some way. I don’t have all the answers, but there needs to be some room for people to exist and be welcomed in community without simply adopting the exact current progressive ideologies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are a gay couple, not married but living together and committed to each other.
Our church is LGBTQ and everything else affirming and more and more, it is just a grievance fest, pretty much like No Kings in church format. And it is dying.

I was back home this last weekend and attended Catholic mass with my aunt at her somewhat progressive parish. It was a such a breath of fresh air. Not my first time in a Catholic Church by a long shot, nor for my partner. But I don’t know if we can really exist in that church. We tried Episcopal but that wasn’t it either.

Any ideas? In NoVa.

UU, of course.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoa OP, I was going to say you shouldn't write off entire denominations after visiting one church, the community and emphasis of Episcopalians (or any other) can vary hugely from one congregation to the next so you might find a better fit.

But I see above that you want a church that's accepting of gay but not trans people? Good luck with that.

That’s reductive and not at all what I’m saying.
It’s not about being “accepting”. It’s about adopting specific beliefs not tied to scripture. Scripture does not support the existence of a more than 2 sexes, and it also doesn’t support same sex marriage. That doesn’t mean we cannot be compassionate and welcoming to people who experience same sex attraction or do not conform to male or female stereotypes in some way. I don’t have all the answers, but there needs to be some room for people to exist and be welcomed in community without simply adopting the exact current progressive ideologies.

I guess I'd ask what about the Catholic Church makes you feel like you can't exist there in precisely this way, then?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoa OP, I was going to say you shouldn't write off entire denominations after visiting one church, the community and emphasis of Episcopalians (or any other) can vary hugely from one congregation to the next so you might find a better fit.

But I see above that you want a church that's accepting of gay but not trans people? Good luck with that.

That’s reductive and not at all what I’m saying.
It’s not about being “accepting”. It’s about adopting specific beliefs not tied to scripture. Scripture does not support the existence of a more than 2 sexes, and it also doesn’t support same sex marriage. That doesn’t mean we cannot be compassionate and welcoming to people who experience same sex attraction or do not conform to male or female stereotypes in some way. I don’t have all the answers, but there needs to be some room for people to exist and be welcomed in community without simply adopting the exact current progressive ideologies.

I guess I'd ask what about the Catholic Church makes you feel like you can't exist there in precisely this way, then?

It doesn’t, necessarily. My aunt who is divorced, has friends in her congregation who are gay. It’s more the uncertainty of knowing how to fit in. I have visited multiple Catholic churches in NoVa and they are definitely not all the same.
Most if not all of the gay Catholics we know were raised Catholic. I don’t know any gay people who converted to Catholicism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are a gay couple, not married but living together and committed to each other.
Our church is LGBTQ and everything else affirming and more and more, it is just a grievance fest, pretty much like No Kings in church format. And it is dying.

I was back home this last weekend and attended Catholic mass with my aunt at her somewhat progressive parish. It was a such a breath of fresh air. Not my first time in a Catholic Church by a long shot, nor for my partner. But I don’t know if we can really exist in that church. We tried Episcopal but that wasn’t it either.

Any ideas? In NoVa.

UU, of course.

Ha. NO

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's an open secret that a majority of the College of Cardinals are gay and non-celibate. But what the Catholic church is trying to do (that the Episcopal church is not) is to actually maintain some continuity in this Christian religion. And Scripture and Tradition (i.e., the Magisterium) clearly and consistently put forward that homosexual acts are sinful.

So if you want to be affirmed for your sex acts, you'll have to go Episcopal or Unitarian or something and join the grievance fest. But if you want to be affirmed for your image as a child of God in communion with all the saints and angels, give the Catholics a chance.

No. It isn't.

And scripture does not "clearly and consistently" put forth any such thing (although tradition does, but that is such BS that it is a huge part of why we have protestantism).

Yes, it is an open secret. I worked for the Catholic Church. The head of our diocese was an old Queen. I had worked previously in the entertainment business. I know an old Queen when I see one. Forcing someone to be celibate is just not human and has lead to the very uptight, secretive clerical culture we have which is like something like you'd hear about in a pre-Stonewall documentary. Not all priests are gay but many of them are.

[Anonymous]

Try some United Methodist churches. One we attended was way over the top political, decorating the sanctuary for pride month, every sermon political more than biblical. But the church we currently attend actually focuses on the Bible and serving God while welcoming everyone without needing to talk about political ideology all the time (or really much at all).

[Anonymous]

OP, I think you're asking an important question and bringing up issues you are uniquely suited to call out. My friends who are looking for what you are looking for speak highly of United Methodist congregations, particularly one in Annadale, I think, I can get the exact name if you want it.
As another resource, I have been really blessed to watch some recent interviews with Dr. David Bennett who might not have the same convictions as yourself, but who is using his studies and life experience to speak specifically to more conservative congregations who need to get over thinking there's something inherently righteous about heterosexuality. I'm believing you will find a great church community as God leads you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I think you're asking an important question and bringing up issues you are uniquely suited to call out. My friends who are looking for what you are looking for speak highly of United Methodist congregations, particularly one in Annadale, I think, I can get the exact name if you want it.
As another resource, I have been really blessed to watch some recent interviews with Dr. David Bennett who might not have the same convictions as yourself, but who is using his studies and life experience to speak specifically to more conservative congregations who need to get over thinking there's something inherently righteous about heterosexuality. I'm believing you will find a great church community as God leads you.

Fundamentalist born-again Christians (the only kind of Christian entering heaven) are not saying heterosexuality is righteous (it is just God’s natural order) but that the Bible says clearly that adultery, fornication, and homosexuality are unrighteous behavior per 1 Corinthians 6:9

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

You are deceived if you think/feel/believe that homosexuality is righteous behavior in line with God’s natural order. There is no compromise on this matter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whoa OP, I was going to say you shouldn't write off entire denominations after visiting one church, the community and emphasis of Episcopalians (or any other) can vary hugely from one congregation to the next so you might find a better fit.

But I see above that you want a church that's accepting of gay but not trans people? Good luck with that.

That’s reductive and not at all what I’m saying.
It’s not about being “accepting”. It’s about adopting specific beliefs not tied to scripture. Scripture does not support the existence of a more than 2 sexes, and it also doesn’t support same sex marriage. That doesn’t mean we cannot be compassionate and welcoming to people who experience same sex attraction or do not conform to male or female stereotypes in some way. I don’t have all the answers, but there needs to be some room for people to exist and be welcomed in community without simply adopting the exact current progressive ideologies.

Scripture is also very clear that sex between unmarried heterosexual people is wrong.