Why don't schools automatically reevaluate every year?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

Shy, quiet kids aren't dumb.... they are just shy

You have to know the basics before being able to go deeper. How do you assess how well a kid knows the basics ? Tests and grades !

I know plenty of people who know the basics, made good grades, but they can't have a deep, intellectual conversation about anything. They aren't creative. They aren't problem solvers. IDK I don't think your logic holds up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

Shy, quiet kids aren't dumb.... they are just shy

You have to know the basics before being able to go deeper. How do you assess how well a kid knows the basics ? Tests and grades !

I know plenty of people who know the basics, made good grades, but they can't have a deep, intellectual conversation about anything. They aren't creative. They aren't problem solvers. IDK I don't think your logic holds up.

I know plenty of parents who think their kid is more creative, a better problem solver, and deeper than other kids, when the reality is that their kid would be indistinguishable from everyone else. I understand that your kid doesn't have the scores or grades to suggest that she belongs in AAP, and you're desperate to believe that your kid has some special something to justify her inclusion. Maybe she does. Maybe she doesn't. There are a lot of kids in AAP who don't. There are also a lot of gen ed kids who would be indistinguishable from your child or any other child in AAP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

Shy, quiet kids aren't dumb.... they are just shy

Huh? What does being shy have to do with it? One 5th grader can carry on an abstract convo about a book, the other 5th grader isn't there yet. One is in AAP, the other one isn't. Teachers, btw, are pretty good at zeroing in on the ones who are deeper thinkers. Someone also said the ability for a school to differentiate this varies in FCPS. That's true. Our center school does a good job going deeper into topics in the AAP curriculum.

They really, really, really aren't. Teachers are great at zeroing in on the kids who are above average, eager to please, have great memories, and are able to parrot things that they've read or they've heard from parents or other classmates. They're pretty awful at identifying kids who are way out there. In a lower SES school, it's especially difficult for a teacher to differentiate between a regular above average kid and a gifted kid because they get so very little time with the higher achieving groups. In that limited time, the extroverted, eager to please, above average kid will stand out much more than a shy, gifted kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

If your chid can go deeper/more abstract why can't they get 4's? It is an ADVANCED ACADEMIC program.

Maybe you don't hear your kids' friends having a deep conversation with your kid because they are dumbing it down for your kid because they know they get better grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

If your chid can go deeper/more abstract why can't they get 4's? It is an ADVANCED ACADEMIC program.

Maybe you don't hear your kids' friends having a deep conversation with your kid because they are dumbing it down for your kid because they know they get better grades.

ADHD

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

If your chid can go deeper/more abstract why can't they get 4's? It is an ADVANCED ACADEMIC program.

Maybe you don't hear your kids' friends having a deep conversation with your kid because they are dumbing it down for your kid because they know they get better grades.

lol! Wow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

Shy, quiet kids aren't dumb.... they are just shy

You have to know the basics before being able to go deeper. How do you assess how well a kid knows the basics ? Tests and grades !

I know plenty of people who know the basics, made good grades, but they can't have a deep, intellectual conversation about anything. They aren't creative. They aren't problem solvers. IDK I don't think your logic holds up.

I know plenty of parents who think their kid is more creative, a better problem solver, and deeper than other kids, when the reality is that their kid would be indistinguishable from everyone else. I understand that your kid doesn't have the scores or grades to suggest that she belongs in AAP, and you're desperate to believe that your kid has some special something to justify her inclusion. Maybe she does. Maybe she doesn't. There are a lot of kids in AAP who don't. There are also a lot of gen ed kids who would be indistinguishable from your child or any other child in AAP.

That sounds great and all, but this thread is not about AAP kids being distinguishable from general ed kids. Someone asked a question about why they don't reevaluate based on grades or SOL. There are many reasons they don't reevaluate, and the fact that some super smart kids don't make great grades is one of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

Shy, quiet kids aren't dumb.... they are just shy

You have to know the basics before being able to go deeper. How do you assess how well a kid knows the basics ? Tests and grades !

I know plenty of people who know the basics, made good grades, but they can't have a deep, intellectual conversation about anything. They aren't creative. They aren't problem solvers. IDK I don't think your logic holds up.

I know plenty of parents who think their kid is more creative, a better problem solver, and deeper than other kids, when the reality is that their kid would be indistinguishable from everyone else. I understand that your kid doesn't have the scores or grades to suggest that she belongs in AAP, and you're desperate to believe that your kid has some special something to justify her inclusion. Maybe she does. Maybe she doesn't. There are a lot of kids in AAP who don't. There are also a lot of gen ed kids who would be indistinguishable from your child or any other child in AAP.

That sounds great and all, but this thread is not about AAP kids being distinguishable from general ed kids. Someone asked a question about why they don't reevaluate based on grades or SOL. There are many reasons they don't reevaluate, and the fact that some super smart kids don't make great grades is one of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

Shy, quiet kids aren't dumb.... they are just shy

You have to know the basics before being able to go deeper. How do you assess how well a kid knows the basics ? Tests and grades !

I know plenty of people who know the basics, made good grades, but they can't have a deep, intellectual conversation about anything. They aren't creative. They aren't problem solvers. IDK I don't think your logic holds up.

I know plenty of parents who think their kid is more creative, a better problem solver, and deeper than other kids, when the reality is that their kid would be indistinguishable from everyone else. I understand that your kid doesn't have the scores or grades to suggest that she belongs in AAP, and you're desperate to believe that your kid has some special something to justify her inclusion. Maybe she does. Maybe she doesn't. There are a lot of kids in AAP who don't. There are also a lot of gen ed kids who would be indistinguishable from your child or any other child in AAP.

That sounds great and all, but this thread is not about AAP kids being distinguishable from general ed kids. Someone asked a question about why they don't reevaluate based on grades or SOL. There are many reasons they don't reevaluate, and the fact that some super smart kids don't make great grades is one of them.

Using grades and SOL/MAP/whatever scores would work for nearly all kids who don't have SN or a LD. Kids with SN of some type would obviously need other criteria.
Reevaluation would honestly be extremely simple. At the end of the year, the AAP teacher should be able to check a box indicating that the teacher thinks the kid is struggling, is holding back the rest of the class, or needs way too much help. If the kid fails to meet whatever end of year benchmarks, and the teacher has indicated that the kid is incorrectly placed in AAP, the kid should be removed.

The only real reason that they don't reevaluate is that they don't want to deal with upset parents, force kids to switch back to a base school, or make (AAP) kids feel bad about themselves. Every school can already on an annual basis determine which kids belong in advanced math. They already move kids up and down based on performance against various benchmarks. It would be trivial to do so more broadly with the entire AAP system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:AAP is about providing more opportunity for deeper/more abstract analysis for kids who can participate in that and thrive. My kid can 100% participate in that and enjoys it, but her grades are never going to be all 4's. She has friends in regular classes making all 4's who can't hold a conversation beyond the most basic shallow level of a topic. It's an obvious difference. So I'm not sure how you would reevaluate every year for AAP, but grades and SOL aren't it.

Shy, quiet kids aren't dumb.... they are just shy

You have to know the basics before being able to go deeper. How do you assess how well a kid knows the basics ? Tests and grades !

I know plenty of people who know the basics, made good grades, but they can't have a deep, intellectual conversation about anything. They aren't creative. They aren't problem solvers. IDK I don't think your logic holds up.

I know plenty of parents who think their kid is more creative, a better problem solver, and deeper than other kids, when the reality is that their kid would be indistinguishable from everyone else. I understand that your kid doesn't have the scores or grades to suggest that she belongs in AAP, and you're desperate to believe that your kid has some special something to justify her inclusion. Maybe she does. Maybe she doesn't. There are a lot of kids in AAP who don't. There are also a lot of gen ed kids who would be indistinguishable from your child or any other child in AAP.

That sounds great and all, but this thread is not about AAP kids being distinguishable from general ed kids. Someone asked a question about why they don't reevaluate based on grades or SOL. There are many reasons they don't reevaluate, and the fact that some super smart kids don't make great grades is one of them.

But...the fact that they are indistinguishable warrants reevaluation and movement between the classes

[Anonymous]

Is the singular standard for making AAP somehow superior to the multi level GPA and standardised testing that occurs over the following years? No! It’s not.

What is happening is that nice white middle class parents with nice white middle classes kids got tutors and nagged teachers and AAP committees to get themselves special treatment by getting small classes with more experienced teachers and less of the unwashed masses and they don’t want people to take too close a look at actual ability otherwise their unfair privilege would be removed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: Is the singular standard for making AAP somehow superior to the multi level GPA and standardised testing that occurs over the following years? No! It’s not.

What is happening is that nice white middle class parents with nice white middle classes kids got tutors and nagged teachers and AAP committees to get themselves special treatment by getting small classes with more experienced teachers and less of the unwashed masses and they don’t want people to take too close a look at actual ability otherwise their unfair privilege would be removed.

There isn't even a singular standard for making AAP. The whole admissions process is pretty arbitrary and depends more on the teacher's impression than on any objective data. Even in a 3rd grade AAP classroom, there will be 5 or so kids there who don't fit the profile of an AAP kid in any way. At my kids' center, they published the ones receiving the president's award at the end of 6th. Around 20% did not get it, effectively meaning that they didn't score pass advanced on any of their 5th grade SOLs.