Asked to break a (small? Inconsequential?) law 2 times in my career. Anyone else?

[Anonymous]

I worked for a property managemnet firm here in Arlington right out of college and got asked ALL THE TIME to backdate security deposit disposition statements and mailings to make it look like they had been processed within the statutory deadline period (45 days) when they were actually past due by weeks at a time.

I refused so many times that they fired me and made me sign an NDA to get my last paycheck. I did because I was broke and needed the money but 'm still dissapointed in myself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

You are a petty, awful boss. Why do you have to have a Christmas time meeting BEFORE work instead of starting the holiday breakfast DURING work hours? People like you think you are great bosses and so generous because you pass out a few prizes. Do you understand some people don't have morning care for their kids so can't just drop them off early somewhere. I don't want to come to work an hour early for some cheap prizes.

For example she works 8am to 430 pm. Takes a 30 minute lunch. We did a hour hour 15 minute lunch at fancy restaurant next to office. She left at 430 pm and billed me time and a half for 30 minutes for "skipping" lunch.

If she is required to attend the lunch, she's absolutely correct she's working and you owe her time and a half if she's non-exempt. Why do you wish to break the law?

[Anonymous]

I report violations whenever. There was a situation I was in where the people in my company were baking the numbers. The thing is it was pretty obvious that the management got to where they were by doing that.

It's like wait a minute that's my job, I'm not kowtowing and shoring up a cheater. It's more of a work ethic thing. Like the company was skimping on analytics. Likely money laundering or something. I mean it's one thing if it was a good place to work, good management, but they were awful people that were making messes just hide their bull. I reported it, and the company was bought out in a few days. Hostile takeover.

Investors had better not invest in a dumpster fire.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

You are a petty, awful boss. Why do you have to have a Christmas time meeting BEFORE work instead of starting the holiday breakfast DURING work hours? People like you think you are great bosses and so generous because you pass out a few prizes. Do you understand some people don't have morning care for their kids so can't just drop them off early somewhere. I don't want to come to work an hour early for some cheap prizes.

For example she works 8am to 430 pm. Takes a 30 minute lunch. We did a hour hour 15 minute lunch at fancy restaurant next to office. She left at 430 pm and billed me time and a half for 30 minutes for "skipping" lunch.

If she is required to attend the lunch, she's absolutely correct she's working and you owe her time and a half if she's non-exempt. Why do you wish to break the law?

Not required. I hate her as I get asked to ask people to voluntarily go to things as we never say required. However in above case her actual coworker she like she insisted we do lunch for hon living, named the restaurant and I expensed and she then left early that day as “worked” through lunch. I have a budget to take staff out or do stuff. I stopped doing it as just too much headache with her.

I guarantee she will quit, ask for goodbye lunch and put it in her timesheet

[Anonymous]

Give her a box lunch as she walks out the door. Put a goodbye card on it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

Sounds like you like to take advantage of people.

Not giving overtime for a company holiday party is taking advantage?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

Strongly, strongly disagree with this conclusion. I'm neurodivergent, too, in a way that is not obvious to others. You are right, OP. This poster is wrong. Trust your gut.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

You are a petty, awful boss. Why do you have to have a Christmas time meeting BEFORE work instead of starting the holiday breakfast DURING work hours? People like you think you are great bosses and so generous because you pass out a few prizes. Do you understand some people don't have morning care for their kids so can't just drop them off early somewhere. I don't want to come to work an hour early for some cheap prizes.

For example she works 8am to 430 pm. Takes a 30 minute lunch. We did a hour hour 15 minute lunch at fancy restaurant next to office. She left at 430 pm and billed me time and a half for 30 minutes for "skipping" lunch.

If she is required to attend the lunch, she's absolutely correct she's working and you owe her time and a half if she's non-exempt. Why do you wish to break the law?

Not required. I hate her as I get asked to ask people to voluntarily go to things as we never say required. However in above case her actual coworker she like she insisted we do lunch for hon living, named the restaurant and I expensed and she then left early that day as “worked” through lunch. I have a budget to take staff out or do stuff. I stopped doing it as just too much headache with her.

I guarantee she will quit, ask for goodbye lunch and put it in her timesheet

You said she left at 4:30, which isn't early? I thought you were describing 2 different scenarios. If you are correct or even if not, why aren't you referring her to HR so they can enforce the time keeping rules? Everything you are saying is very confusing and seems like you want it both ways.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

You are a petty, awful boss. Why do you have to have a Christmas time meeting BEFORE work instead of starting the holiday breakfast DURING work hours? People like you think you are great bosses and so generous because you pass out a few prizes. Do you understand some people don't have morning care for their kids so can't just drop them off early somewhere. I don't want to come to work an hour early for some cheap prizes.

For example she works 8am to 430 pm. Takes a 30 minute lunch. We did a hour hour 15 minute lunch at fancy restaurant next to office. She left at 430 pm and billed me time and a half for 30 minutes for "skipping" lunch.

If she is required to attend the lunch, she's absolutely correct she's working and you owe her time and a half if she's non-exempt. Why do you wish to break the law?

Not required. I hate her as I get asked to ask people to voluntarily go to things as we never say required. However in above case her actual coworker she like she insisted we do lunch for hon living, named the restaurant and I expensed and she then left early that day as “worked” through lunch. I have a budget to take staff out or do stuff. I stopped doing it as just too much headache with her.

I guarantee she will quit, ask for goodbye lunch and put it in her timesheet

You said she left at 4:30, which isn't early? I thought you were describing 2 different scenarios. If you are correct or even if not, why aren't you referring her to HR so they can enforce the time keeping rules? Everything you are saying is very confusing and seems like you want it both ways.

Guess you never supervised “on the clock” “professionals”

No lunch. Holiday party, ball game, is “mandatory” I specifically invite them or tell them and will dance per HR instructions. Example the ball game outing our CEO attending their spouse and kids and we invited Board members, I am attending with wife and kids as an important networking opportunity and want to show support to the CEO and network the other areas outside of work that our dept relies on. Plus with CFO, Head of HR there good opportunity for all of us. I can’t say mandatory. The ironic part to be prompted she like me will be expected t attend these things

Yea that lunch left 430 did not ask OT but she literally was at lunch she organized for an hour 15 minutes then believe it or not “punched for lunch” 30 minutes and took a break.

Around 45 minutes after lunch went by her desk to ask and was reminded of she was at lunch, she claimed she worked through lunch so now taking it.

Can’t go to HR as she is using loopholes. She also can’t be promoted as mgt is expected to go to these things and she refuses. So she will die on this bridge. When she quits I won’t care she will be someone else’s problem

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

You are a petty, awful boss. Why do you have to have a Christmas time meeting BEFORE work instead of starting the holiday breakfast DURING work hours? People like you think you are great bosses and so generous because you pass out a few prizes. Do you understand some people don't have morning care for their kids so can't just drop them off early somewhere. I don't want to come to work an hour early for some cheap prizes.

For example she works 8am to 430 pm. Takes a 30 minute lunch. We did a hour hour 15 minute lunch at fancy restaurant next to office. She left at 430 pm and billed me time and a half for 30 minutes for "skipping" lunch.

If she is required to attend the lunch, she's absolutely correct she's working and you owe her time and a half if she's non-exempt. Why do you wish to break the law?

Not required. I hate her as I get asked to ask people to voluntarily go to things as we never say required. However in above case her actual coworker she like she insisted we do lunch for hon living, named the restaurant and I expensed and she then left early that day as “worked” through lunch. I have a budget to take staff out or do stuff. I stopped doing it as just too much headache with her.

I guarantee she will quit, ask for goodbye lunch and put it in her timesheet

You said she left at 4:30, which isn't early? I thought you were describing 2 different scenarios. If you are correct or even if not, why aren't you referring her to HR so they can enforce the time keeping rules? Everything you are saying is very confusing and seems like you want it both ways.

Guess you never supervised “on the clock” “professionals”

No lunch. Holiday party, ball game, is “mandatory” I specifically invite them or tell them and will dance per HR instructions. Example the ball game outing our CEO attending their spouse and kids and we invited Board members, I am attending with wife and kids as an important networking opportunity and want to show support to the CEO and network the other areas outside of work that our dept relies on. Plus with CFO, Head of HR there good opportunity for all of us. I can’t say mandatory. The ironic part to be prompted she like me will be expected t attend these things

Yea that lunch left 430 did not ask OT but she literally was at lunch she organized for an hour 15 minutes then believe it or not “punched for lunch” 30 minutes and took a break.

Around 45 minutes after lunch went by her desk to ask and was reminded of she was at lunch, she claimed she worked through lunch so now taking it.

Can’t go to HR as she is using loopholes. She also can’t be promoted as mgt is expected to go to these things and she refuses. So she will die on this bridge. When she quits I won’t care she will be someone else’s problem

I still have absolutely no idea what you are saying. Is she exempt or non-exempt? She probably doesn't want to work for you anyway because you clearly resent her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

You are a petty, awful boss. Why do you have to have a Christmas time meeting BEFORE work instead of starting the holiday breakfast DURING work hours? People like you think you are great bosses and so generous because you pass out a few prizes. Do you understand some people don't have morning care for their kids so can't just drop them off early somewhere. I don't want to come to work an hour early for some cheap prizes.

For example she works 8am to 430 pm. Takes a 30 minute lunch. We did a hour hour 15 minute lunch at fancy restaurant next to office. She left at 430 pm and billed me time and a half for 30 minutes for "skipping" lunch.

If she is required to attend the lunch, she's absolutely correct she's working and you owe her time and a half if she's non-exempt. Why do you wish to break the law?

Not required. I hate her as I get asked to ask people to voluntarily go to things as we never say required. However in above case her actual coworker she like she insisted we do lunch for hon living, named the restaurant and I expensed and she then left early that day as “worked” through lunch. I have a budget to take staff out or do stuff. I stopped doing it as just too much headache with her.

I guarantee she will quit, ask for goodbye lunch and put it in her timesheet

You said she left at 4:30, which isn't early? I thought you were describing 2 different scenarios. If you are correct or even if not, why aren't you referring her to HR so they can enforce the time keeping rules? Everything you are saying is very confusing and seems like you want it both ways.

Guess you never supervised “on the clock” “professionals”

No lunch. Holiday party, ball game, is “mandatory” I specifically invite them or tell them and will dance per HR instructions. Example the ball game outing our CEO attending their spouse and kids and we invited Board members, I am attending with wife and kids as an important networking opportunity and want to show support to the CEO and network the other areas outside of work that our dept relies on. Plus with CFO, Head of HR there good opportunity for all of us. I can’t say mandatory. The ironic part to be prompted she like me will be expected t attend these things

Yea that lunch left 430 did not ask OT but she literally was at lunch she organized for an hour 15 minutes then believe it or not “punched for lunch” 30 minutes and took a break.

Around 45 minutes after lunch went by her desk to ask and was reminded of she was at lunch, she claimed she worked through lunch so now taking it.

Can’t go to HR as she is using loopholes. She also can’t be promoted as mgt is expected to go to these things and she refuses. So she will die on this bridge. When she quits I won’t care she will be someone else’s problem

I still have absolutely no idea what you are saying. Is she exempt or non-exempt? She probably doesn't want to work for you anyway because you clearly resent her.

And why are you putting "mandatory" in quotes? It's either mandatory or she's free to go eat lunch at her desk, not both. Which is it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the second time in my career I was asked to do something that I refused to do because I think it’s illegal and my managers all seemed baffled by my concern. I am neurodivergent but not in a way that’s always apparent - I don’t know, but suspect, that’s at play.

(1) About 25 year ago I was supposed to get something like 3,000 color copies of a magazine article (let’s say Time magazine) that mentioned our company so we could send it out with a letter

Kinkos refused to do the job because it violated copyright law and so did FedEx for the same reason. My mangers instructed me to do it, I refused. They said things like “you’re not going to get in trouble” it won’t matter and I said I’m just not comfortable. I think they were right but also if I care and they don’t they shouldn’t do it.

(2) the second was being told to help another project - maybe 2 hrs of work - when my authorization during shutdown says I can’t help other projects. I said I would but I needed something in writing to confirm management agreed that this was included in the work I was authorized to do. Instead of me agreeing or them putting it in writing after a day they sent an email “thanks much for your hard work. Considering the push, and what excellent shape your project is in, please do any final steps you deem necessary and go on furlough.”

You are difficult. Look techincially in college and grad school I would go to library and use xerox machines to copy things. Technically that is what you were doing and no one cares. However, you are correct putting that printed copy in a commercial mailing for for potential financial gain is a copyright violation. But you were not doing that you were just making copies.

And project stuff you are playing a game of being difficult. I started a govt type job and they have a quarterly town hall. My new boss said it was week before I started (on phone) and although he does not have authority to ask me to go, I cant get paid if I decided to attend on my own it be great chance to meet everyone and get overview of priorities next three months and meet your new staff. There will be breakfast served and just two hours. WTF would I ask him to put that in writting. I went, was a great chance. Otherwise I would not have met my co-workers, got a update for three months. It is common. Of course he cant make me go.

I have a difficult staff right now. She makes a stink with is it required and can you confirm with anything. Meanwhile She drives me nuts as fights everything and she is like a greyhound dog. Crazy lady we had a breakfast meeting before work, a lunch meeting wanted to bill OT or get comp time. I said then skip it. Or my favorite it is always not her job unless in the job description. So I do her job sometimes as too much headache. Why I dont know. We litterally had one lunch meeting and one breakfast meeting last year. She did not go. She must be like you. It says since she is on the clock if mandatory she must get paid and she refuses to go unless mandatory. No the the free breakfast at xmas time where we give our prizes and gifts for 45 minutes is not OT.

You are a petty, awful boss. Why do you have to have a Christmas time meeting BEFORE work instead of starting the holiday breakfast DURING work hours? People like you think you are great bosses and so generous because you pass out a few prizes. Do you understand some people don't have morning care for their kids so can't just drop them off early somewhere. I don't want to come to work an hour early for some cheap prizes.

For example she works 8am to 430 pm. Takes a 30 minute lunch. We did a hour hour 15 minute lunch at fancy restaurant next to office. She left at 430 pm and billed me time and a half for 30 minutes for "skipping" lunch.

If she is required to attend the lunch, she's absolutely correct she's working and you owe her time and a half if she's non-exempt. Why do you wish to break the law?

Not required. I hate her as I get asked to ask people to voluntarily go to things as we never say required. However in above case her actual coworker she like she insisted we do lunch for hon living, named the restaurant and I expensed and she then left early that day as “worked” through lunch. I have a budget to take staff out or do stuff. I stopped doing it as just too much headache with her.

I guarantee she will quit, ask for goodbye lunch and put it in her timesheet

You said she left at 4:30, which isn't early? I thought you were describing 2 different scenarios. If you are correct or even if not, why aren't you referring her to HR so they can enforce the time keeping rules? Everything you are saying is very confusing and seems like you want it both ways.

Guess you never supervised “on the clock” “professionals”

No lunch. Holiday party, ball game, is “mandatory” I specifically invite them or tell them and will dance per HR instructions. Example the ball game outing our CEO attending their spouse and kids and we invited Board members, I am attending with wife and kids as an important networking opportunity and want to show support to the CEO and network the other areas outside of work that our dept relies on. Plus with CFO, Head of HR there good opportunity for all of us. I can’t say mandatory. The ironic part to be prompted she like me will be expected t attend these things

Yea that lunch left 430 did not ask OT but she literally was at lunch she organized for an hour 15 minutes then believe it or not “punched for lunch” 30 minutes and took a break.

Around 45 minutes after lunch went by her desk to ask and was reminded of she was at lunch, she claimed she worked through lunch so now taking it.

Can’t go to HR as she is using loopholes. She also can’t be promoted as mgt is expected to go to these things and she refuses. So she will die on this bridge. When she quits I won’t care she will be someone else’s problem

I still have absolutely no idea what you are saying. Is she exempt or non-exempt? She probably doesn't want to work for you anyway because you clearly resent her.

And why are you putting "mandatory" in quotes? It's either mandatory or she's free to go eat lunch at her desk, not both. Which is it?

Also specifically what loopholes is she using? If she's non-exempt, there shouldn't really be loopholes.