Russian School of Math for average math kid?

[Anonymous]

My advanced math kid did it. I would not do it for a child who is average in math.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do people do RSM only if their kid is super good at math? Our DC is in 3rd, very bright but doesn't love the academic aspect of school and scores in the lower "at grade level" range in math. We think it might be a self-confidence issue (gets bored/doesn't try very hard/refuses help from us). Looking for ways of making them feel better about their academic skills.

I would consider Mathnasium. They gameify things and give out awards. I don't love that aspect of it in theory but can't dispute that it turned my kid's enthusiasm for math around as well as her confidence. And it didn't create a situation where she now only needs rewards to do math. She's an enthusiastic above-average student now who will hang in there through the struggle of a math problem, where this really frustrated her before because she wasn't used to struggling in anything academic.

+1 I wouldn't put an average math kid in Russian School of Math. RSM classes are large, and while they're well-done, they're not *fun*. Mathnasium is much better for a kid who is looking for basic enrichment, and they have a much smaller student: instructor ratio and prizes and ice cream parties and stuff.

+1 these are challenging classes and the homework is time consuming. It’s great for kids who really excel at math and are not getting enough of a challenge at school. It’s just not for your average kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Both Kumon and RSM are awful choices for any kid. They kill and existing love for Math and do not make a kid love it either. I know 100+ kids who did one or the other and they really do not understand or love Math. Just become little robots..

I also know a substantial number of students who enrolled in Kumon and RSM because my kids were enrolled as well. The vast majority of the top math students at their high school did math enrichment.

It is bizarre that you know so much about whether or not 100+ kids understand or love Math. All the kids who went through at least level E at Kumon we know are glad they did it. They might not have enjoyed doing a packet everyday but they all realized how much faster they are able to finish math classwork and homework compared to most peers who never did math enrichment. And the kids doing RSM appreciated that school math is so easy. We aren't Asian but most of the students doing Kumon for advancement when my kids attended were Asian or Eastern European. Their parents realize how much enrichment in math helps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do people do RSM only if their kid is super good at math? Our DC is in 3rd, very bright but doesn't love the academic aspect of school and scores in the lower "at grade level" range in math. We think it might be a self-confidence issue (gets bored/doesn't try very hard/refuses help from us). Looking for ways of making them feel better about their academic skills.

I would consider Mathnasium. They gameify things and give out awards. I don't love that aspect of it in theory but can't dispute that it turned my kid's enthusiasm for math around as well as her confidence. And it didn't create a situation where she now only needs rewards to do math. She's an enthusiastic above-average student now who will hang in there through the struggle of a math problem, where this really frustrated her before because she wasn't used to struggling in anything academic.

+1 I wouldn't put an average math kid in Russian School of Math. RSM classes are large, and while they're well-done, they're not *fun*. Mathnasium is much better for a kid who is looking for basic enrichment, and they have a much smaller student: instructor ratio and prizes and ice cream parties and stuff.

+1 these are challenging classes and the homework is time consuming. It’s great for kids who really excel at math and are not getting enough of a challenge at school. It’s just not for your average kid.

If your child is struggling with the RSM lower level class and the homework is taking a long time you should be seeking help from the school. AoPS is not for most kids, it is meant to be a challenging class for kids who are advanced. There were kids in my son’s class who needed help after class on a regular basis, you could see that the class was not a good fit. Beast Academy is not for every kid, it is for kids that are more advanced or have parents who are able to help them.

RSM has a level for the vast majority of kids. I will agree that it is not fun for most kids, it is a math class, and the the kids in the lower level classes are probably kids who need to improve in math, not kids there for the challenge. The advanced class is the class that does not fit most kids needs, it moves quickly and touches on material that is not taught at school. I do think that they are moving too many kids into the advanced group, DS’s 6th grade class spent weeks on concepts instead of days, he was bored and dropped the grade level class that year.

The thing is, RSM, while not cheap, is less expensive than tutoring. I kid who is struggling with math and needs help might be able to attend something like RSM and not pay for tutoring. Mathnasium of Kumon might be a better fit, parents should look at all of the options.

[Anonymous]

DP but with a similar kid. Mathnasium seems great in theory but it's so expensive! Are there any other more affordable options to shore up math skills that incorporate fun and/or rewards so a kid who doesn't like math will do them willingly or at least semi-willingly? Or fun computer programs/apps/etc?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do people do RSM only if their kid is super good at math? Our DC is in 3rd, very bright but doesn't love the academic aspect of school and scores in the lower "at grade level" range in math. We think it might be a self-confidence issue (gets bored/doesn't try very hard/refuses help from us). Looking for ways of making them feel better about their academic skills.

I would consider Mathnasium. They gameify things and give out awards. I don't love that aspect of it in theory but can't dispute that it turned my kid's enthusiasm for math around as well as her confidence. And it didn't create a situation where she now only needs rewards to do math. She's an enthusiastic above-average student now who will hang in there through the struggle of a math problem, where this really frustrated her before because she wasn't used to struggling in anything academic.

+1 I wouldn't put an average math kid in Russian School of Math. RSM classes are large, and while they're well-done, they're not *fun*. Mathnasium is much better for a kid who is looking for basic enrichment, and they have a much smaller student: instructor ratio and prizes and ice cream parties and stuff.

+1 these are challenging classes and the homework is time consuming. It’s great for kids who really excel at math and are not getting enough of a challenge at school. It’s just not for your average kid.

If your child is struggling with the RSM lower level class and the homework is taking a long time you should be seeking help from the school. AoPS is not for most kids, it is meant to be a challenging class for kids who are advanced. There were kids in my son’s class who needed help after class on a regular basis, you could see that the class was not a good fit. Beast Academy is not for every kid, it is for kids that are more advanced or have parents who are able to help them.

RSM has a level for the vast majority of kids. I will agree that it is not fun for most kids, it is a math class, and the the kids in the lower level classes are probably kids who need to improve in math, not kids there for the challenge. The advanced class is the class that does not fit most kids needs, it moves quickly and touches on material that is not taught at school. I do think that they are moving too many kids into the advanced group, DS’s 6th grade class spent weeks on concepts instead of days, he was bored and dropped the grade level class that year.

The thing is, RSM, while not cheap, is less expensive than tutoring. I kid who is struggling with math and needs help might be able to attend something like RSM and not pay for tutoring. Mathnasium of Kumon might be a better fit, parents should look at all of the options.

I don't think the lowest class and middle class are as different as you think. Neither covers the same math content as public school, nor any remedial content. My kid was in the lowest level for 3rd grade and is in the middle level for 4th. She tested 99th percentile for math all along and needed more challenge, which is why we started in RSM. She was placed in the lowest level to start because she hadn't done prior enrichment and wasn't familiar with concepts like variables, parentheses, balancing equations or multiplication without an "×" (e.g., 2x or 2•x). Moving to the middle level hasn't been noticably more challenging for her.

I've seen the homework for both levels and the difference is basically that the middle level has 3-4 harder challenge questions, while the lower level has 3-4 questions that introduce new concepts, out of 20-25 questions. RSM will tell you that most kids in the lowest level move up to the middle level the following year, so the goal is to catch them up with the kids already in the middle level. The lower level isn't remedial concepts to get kids to grade level, but works on early algebra and problem solving just like the middle level.

If you have a kid below grade level, RSM isn't the right place.

[Anonymous]

I think RSM is pretty challenging. I wouldn’t put a kid who is struggling on math in any RSM class. And the person saying the typical RSM class is remedial is on something.

[Anonymous]

My daughter likes math and did a trial class at RSM. They put her in the middle class. I went over what she brought home a few days later and she had not retained it as expected. I decided to go talk to mathnasium. Mathnasium did say she is advanced, but it sounds more personalized and will go at her pace with less pressure. Thinking about enrolling my older kid who is also good at math but doesn't like it there too, but it's more expensive than I thought so we'll see.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do people do RSM only if their kid is super good at math? Our DC is in 3rd, very bright but doesn't love the academic aspect of school and scores in the lower "at grade level" range in math. We think it might be a self-confidence issue (gets bored/doesn't try very hard/refuses help from us). Looking for ways of making them feel better about their academic skills.

I would consider Mathnasium. They gameify things and give out awards. I don't love that aspect of it in theory but can't dispute that it turned my kid's enthusiasm for math around as well as her confidence. And it didn't create a situation where she now only needs rewards to do math. She's an enthusiastic above-average student now who will hang in there through the struggle of a math problem, where this really frustrated her before because she wasn't used to struggling in anything academic.

+1 I wouldn't put an average math kid in Russian School of Math. RSM classes are large, and while they're well-done, they're not *fun*. Mathnasium is much better for a kid who is looking for basic enrichment, and they have a much smaller student: instructor ratio and prizes and ice cream parties and stuff.

+1 these are challenging classes and the homework is time consuming. It’s great for kids who really excel at math and are not getting enough of a challenge at school. It’s just not for your average kid.

I had my average kid attend a summer enrichment math program that is superior to the chain programs you mention. She did fine. She was two levels lower than her classmates that attended but she’s easy going. It helped her prepare for the next grade.

Those programs might cater to a certain type student but you should look to see if there are other options.

[Anonymous]

Lots of good comments here already. I’ll just add that our RSM director and an RSM teacher both told us there is a big big jump in 3rd grade at RSM. They said even for the top level kids, some struggle and have to move to regular middle level (and it’s still challenging). We had our kid do RSM in 1st-2nd, so I can’t really confirm this myself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lots of good comments here already. I’ll just add that our RSM director and an RSM teacher both told us there is a big big jump in 3rd grade at RSM. They said even for the top level kids, some struggle and have to move to regular middle level (and it’s still challenging). We had our kid do RSM in 1st-2nd, so I can’t really confirm this myself.

What exactly do they do differently in 1st and 2nd than they do in school?