Vent—I hate it when people give God credit for modern medicine

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Christian and it bothers me, too. Christians do recognize that "every good and perfect gift comes from God" (Epistle of James). But Jesus also said that God sends the sun to shine and the rain to fall on both the righteous and the unrighteous.

Recently, I was visiting my sister and went to church with her. A friend of hers said something complimentary about my family, and I responded that I was "very lucky". She corrected me, saying that I was "blessed" to which I said nothing.

Christ himself uses the language of "chance" in the parable of the Good Samaritan: "Now by chance a priest was going down that road...", with "chance" having its ordinary meaning; that is, "for no reason apparent to us".

I agree that singling oneself out as extraordinarily blessed is usually the worst kind of humblebrag.

As an atheist I appreciate it when a religious believer reflects on things like this. I do have a question though. You said that “every gift comes from god”. Do you actually believe he’s up there making things go one way or another? By the way I do know people that think that and it’s extraordinarily insane to me

PP. Yes, I do. That doesn't mean I think there is some kind of slam-dunk explanation for the problem of evil. But the traditional Christian belief is that God is sovereign over all things that come to pass.

When I was an atheist, it seemed insane to me, too. Now it seems insane that it wouldn't be true. Such is the nature of the thing.

Thanks for answering . But wow. So you think, for example, a 5 year old girl getting raped is “God’s sovereignty”? Just curious how you square that circle.

We agree that it is evil. And I do not think it is the action of God. For instance, in Job we see all kind of evil things done by Satan to Job. Those things were not acts of God; they were acts of Satan. But they were indeed all performed under the sovereignty of God, with Satan having to seek God's permission to afflict Job. God could have stopped Satan.

As I said, I don't have an answer or explanation for the problem of evil. Some Christians try to use "free will" as the scapegoat or reason that evil "must" exist. But I don't think God's hands are so tied that he is beholden to some concept of "free will" that exists outside and above Himself.

So, as Job said, "Though He slay me, yet will I trust in Him."

TLDR summary, God allowed it happen.

PP. Yes, that is an accurate summary. I'm not here to defend God. It is not He who answers to us, but the other way around.

[Anonymous]

James 1:17 - Every good and perfect gift is from above. We give God credit for everything. Does that mean we'll always have a great outcome that science and medicine isn't important? No, but of course science and medicine advances are also something to be grateful to God for.

On the outcome front, I read a good book that we can pray to God for the best possible outcome (within the range of reality). Miracles are by definition rare.

Lastly, I'll add that we pray not just because we want certain things to happen - we worship God, give thanks, recognize our sin and need for forgiveness, etc. (see Lord's Prayer).

[Anonymous]

Sorry for typos, typing quickly on phone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:James 1:17 - Every good and perfect gift is from above. We give God credit for everything. Does that mean we'll always have a great outcome that science and medicine isn't important? No, but of course science and medicine advances are also something to be grateful to God for.

On the outcome front, I read a good book that we can pray to God for the best possible outcome (within the range of reality). Miracles are by definition rare.

Lastly, I'll add that we pray not just because we want certain things to happen - we worship God, give thanks, recognize our sin and need for forgiveness, etc. (see Lord's Prayer).

Praise God for giving us modern science which in turn gives us modern medicine. Too bad about all those people who died before a lot of stuff was invented.

God's will, you know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:James 1:17 - Every good and perfect gift is from above. We give God credit for everything. Does that mean we'll always have a great outcome that science and medicine isn't important? No, but of course science and medicine advances are also something to be grateful to God for.

On the outcome front, I read a good book that we can pray to God for the best possible outcome (within the range of reality). Miracles are by definition rare.

Lastly, I'll add that we pray not just because we want certain things to happen - we worship God, give thanks, recognize our sin and need for forgiveness, etc. (see Lord's Prayer).

Given that Jesus was also God, didn't he already know about things like antibiotics and vaccines and could have taught them to humanity 2000 years ago...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:James 1:17 - Every good and perfect gift is from above. We give God credit for everything. Does that mean we'll always have a great outcome that science and medicine isn't important? No, but of course science and medicine advances are also something to be grateful to God for.

On the outcome front, I read a good book that we can pray to God for the best possible outcome (within the range of reality). Miracles are by definition rare.

Lastly, I'll add that we pray not just because we want certain things to happen - we worship God, give thanks, recognize our sin and need for forgiveness, etc. (see Lord's Prayer).

Miracles are rare because you attribute a statistically rare event as God's work. Nevermind the statistically probable events that don't result in a positive outcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I lived in AL and GA for 8 years and often when encountering people in public I'd say "hey, how are you?" and get a response "Blessed and highly favored." Always annoyed me to no end. It's Christian virtue signaling, that's all.

That's...really weird.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I was a church goer I hated it when people said god chose these children for us, or these children chose us because of our belief etc. Meanwhile, people struggling with infertility are receiving the message that children would rather live with a meth head or in a war zone than with them.

I can’t imagine what those poor women were feeling hearing that kind of crap. Awful.

My sister got similar messages when she adopted her baby. That God chose that baby for her and she was meant to be with her and stuff along those lines. And these women also knew my sister had a stillbirth and as a result couldn't have children anymore. She got what they were going for, but it was this weird "your first baby died because God had this baby planned for you" sentiment.

Oh my word. I don’t mean to be morose, but in order for your sister to get her baby, someone else had to suffer terribly. Maybe it was a sacrifice willingly made, but in the post-Dobbs era, many women don’t get that choice anymore. You can hear it - God allowed that 14 year old girl to be raped by her uncle so you could have your baby. Gross.

[Anonymous]

Bad things happen because of sin and the fact that we live in a broken world. There can still be redemption and something good emerging out of bad, like when someone who has suffered works for change or comes along those also suffering. This doesn't diminish the gravity of the original hurt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Bad things happen because of sin and the fact that we live in a broken world. There can still be redemption and something good emerging out of bad, like when someone who has suffered works for change or comes along those also suffering. This doesn't diminish the gravity of the original hurt.

Here we have an example of the reason so many of us became atheists. Thank you for pointing it out. I would bet many here feel the same way, and I know for a fact that many outside of DCUM agree. Not to mention that it is such canned apologetics as to be boring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Bad things happen because of sin and the fact that we live in a broken world. There can still be redemption and something good emerging out of bad, like when someone who has suffered works for change or comes along those also suffering. This doesn't diminish the gravity of the original hurt.

Oh yeah, right. Cancer is our fault.

FU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:James 1:17 - Every good and perfect gift is from above. We give God credit for everything. Does that mean we'll always have a great outcome that science and medicine isn't important? No, but of course science and medicine advances are also something to be grateful to God for.

On the outcome front, I read a good book that we can pray to God for the best possible outcome (within the range of reality). Miracles are by definition rare.

Lastly, I'll add that we pray not just because we want certain things to happen - we worship God, give thanks, recognize our sin and need for forgiveness, etc. (see Lord's Prayer).

Pp is grateful to God for everything -- even for advances in science and medicine made by people who don't believe in him!

Pp has it all worked out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bad things happen because of sin and the fact that we live in a broken world. There can still be redemption and something good emerging out of bad, like when someone who has suffered works for change or comes along those also suffering. This doesn't diminish the gravity of the original hurt.

Oh yeah, right. Cancer is our fault.

FU.

Not saying the existence of cancer is any individual's fault. Things go wrong in the world. Drought, famine, illness. Humanity has made contributions as well through our negative impact on climate change, reliance on plastics, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bad things happen because of sin and the fact that we live in a broken world. There can still be redemption and something good emerging out of bad, like when someone who has suffered works for change or comes along those also suffering. This doesn't diminish the gravity of the original hurt.

Oh yeah, right. Cancer is our fault.

FU.

Not saying the existence of cancer is any individual's fault. Things go wrong in the world. Drought, famine, illness. Humanity has made contributions as well through our negative impact on climate change, reliance on plastics, etc.

BS backpedaling. None of that is caused by "sin".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Bad things happen because of sin and the fact that we live in a broken world. There can still be redemption and something good emerging out of bad, like when someone who has suffered works for change or comes along those also suffering. This doesn't diminish the gravity of the original hurt.

Oh yeah, right. Cancer is our fault.

FU.

Not saying the existence of cancer is any individual's fault. Things go wrong in the world. Drought, famine, illness. Humanity has made contributions as well through our negative impact on climate change, reliance on plastics, etc.

Aren't droughts, hurricanes, tornadoes, etc considered acts of god? What does that mean when a tsunami washes away a catholic orphanage and kills all the children, nuns, etc? Is that god's will? Is it part of the "bigger plan" that only he "knows" why?

What a load of BS.