Middle school Math

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Go on AoPS and do the free enrichment stuff for pre algebra and algebra, number theory and counting. That will be interesting and challenging and avoid the lopsidedness of pushing ahead in MAP/Khan grade-level content with no depth or breadth.

Second AoPS. If you have a mathy kid and don't want to fight the school to get algebra in 6th then competition math is a very useful brain bending outlet.

What is AoPS?

Art of Problem Solving. A paid tutoring/enrichment class. They have online and in person enrichment classes. Along with Russian Math, some of the outside tutoring that DCUM loves to hate for contributing to the outside MCPS enrichment arms race for "wealthy" families .

You'll note that the first comment about AoPS specifically called out the free resources.

https://artofproblemsolving.com/videos

https://artofproblemsolving.com/alcumus

https://artofproblemsolving.com/mathcounts_trainer

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please ask your middle school math coordinator right now for a placement test into Algebra 1. Some math coordinators try their best to avoid placing 6th graders in that class, but you can always ask for the placement test in the summer.

My kid did that. It was the best decision we made. She was in the most advanced classes her middle school offered in orchestra, language and math, and it was the only way for her to avoid utter misery and boredom. Thank goodness now she's going into high school, where AP courses make it easier to cater to academic kids.

Okay, you had me at "most advanced middle school orchestra class" because there isn't really a such thing. The "advanced" options for middle-school-aged kids who are accomplished strings musicians are all outside of school (e.g., MCYO). Also unclear what you mean by "advanced language" (foreign language? Advanced English which isn't advanced?)

Listen, my DC was also very good at math and took AIM in 6th and granted it was pretty easy. But to say a kid will suffer from "utter misery and boredom" at school unless they can take Algebra 1 in 6h grade is pretty dramatic. They can join the math club, the drama club, write for the school paper, play sports, take a coding class, participate in advanced orchestras or chamber groups outside of school, etc..... The possibilities are endless!

OP, I do agree with the advice to reach out to the middle school math content specialist (you can find which teacher this is on the school website). But don't immediately ask for a placement test for Algebra 1. Just start by asking them about your child's math placement. If it's AIM or AMP7+, this is already the accelerated class which is likely fine for a student with a 260 MAP-M (which is a good score, but not so ridiculously high that skipping over pre-algebra fundamentals is necessarily a good idea). If it's AMP6 or 6+, then I would ask to have your child considered for the advanced class, which as folks have said, is either AIM6 or AMP7+. (essentially the same material, but different curriculum providers as not all schools have switched over yet).

I'm the poster you were happy to poke, with your inane "you had me at" comment. This kid is my youngest, my oldest is in college already. I meant what I said. DD has been in MCYO for years, and for school orchestra, has always placed in whatever orchestral group is most experienced. For example, she is going into the Philharmonic in 9th. She finished middle school in Spanish 3 (and attends a weekend native language school in our own language). She was in Global Humanities, etc.

OP has a child who seeks to avoid boredom by exploring academic concepts that are not usually taught to their age group. It can be depressing for such a child to spend 8am to 3pm every blasted day revisiting work they have already grasped. It was certainly depressing for all of my children! Enrichment outside of school is great, and necessary, but acceleration at school is also necessary and I am giving OP a blueprint in how to go about it for math, because MCPS will not tell her.

Try not to be too smug. You never know who has more experience than you.

Give me a break. You don't know how "experienced" I am, and I didn't even read your lengthy paragraph about your child's resume because I don't care, and it's not relevant to other students' experiences nor helpful to the OP.

My advice to the OP was to reach out to the MS math content specialist and first find out what placement their child *already* has, as this appears to be an unknown. Then you can go from there. My other piece of advice is that, no matter how brilliant you think your child may be - and let's face it, kids of DCUM posters are always above average - math placement above the already-accelerated track is not always a good idea.

You seem to be coming from a place where you are assuming all of the MS math content specialists are terrible. Maybe some are, but some of them are actually very knowledgeable (this is their job!), and may be able to provide helpful advice on appropriate math placement, whether that's the regular accelerated track or trying to place in to Algebra 1. If placement in Alg. 1 is a possibility, the content specialist could also advise on whether this means placement in a class with most/all 7th graders or will it be mixed 7/8 (depends on the MS and how big a cohort exists for 7th grade Algebra 1). Socially/emotionally, there is a big difference between 6th graders, and 7th/8th graders. OP's child may prefer to be with other (smart) 6th graders.

Not PP, but there is maybe about 5% of children for whom curriculum is too watered down and they would very much benefit from differentiation. We, the parents, are rightfully upset that MCPS is making this so difficult in middle school. You don't know our children better than we do. You won't be able to impose false equality on the back of our children, sorry.

Honestly, you people on this board are cuckoo. Wherever did I say that I knew "your children better" than you or tried to "impose false equality on the backs of [your] children"? What does that even mean? I recommended reaching out to the MS math department to talk to them about appropriate placement for their child academically, as well as considering how OP's child would feel as a 6th grader taking a class with 7th or 8th graders if placed in Algebra 1. I didn't place a judgment on whether that was bad or not.

[Anonymous]

Please, don't play dumb. You said "on DCUM all children are above average" implying that PP's child is one of those average children their parents believe is so special.

In reality, there are many kids who are, in fact, not average. If you take only top 2%, that's still 50 kids per large HS. Prior to HS, these kids are in their middle and elementary schools and their parents need to fight tooth and nail to put their kids into appropriate level classes. In return they are constantly lectured that there is no need to rush blah blah blah by the experts you are referring to.

It's plain evil. If a child spends their summer doing khan academy etc, like OP's, why not let them take a higher level class? Test them if they are ready and then just let them and their parents decide.

Stop patronizing us. A lot of us know way more math than you do and figuring out classes is really not that hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please ask your middle school math coordinator right now for a placement test into Algebra 1. Some math coordinators try their best to avoid placing 6th graders in that class, but you can always ask for the placement test in the summer.

My kid did that. It was the best decision we made. She was in the most advanced classes her middle school offered in orchestra, language and math, and it was the only way for her to avoid utter misery and boredom. Thank goodness now she's going into high school, where AP courses make it easier to cater to academic kids.

Okay, you had me at "most advanced middle school orchestra class" because there isn't really a such thing. The "advanced" options for middle-school-aged kids who are accomplished strings musicians are all outside of school (e.g., MCYO). Also unclear what you mean by "advanced language" (foreign language? Advanced English which isn't advanced?)

Listen, my DC was also very good at math and took AIM in 6th and granted it was pretty easy. But to say a kid will suffer from "utter misery and boredom" at school unless they can take Algebra 1 in 6h grade is pretty dramatic. They can join the math club, the drama club, write for the school paper, play sports, take a coding class, participate in advanced orchestras or chamber groups outside of school, etc..... The possibilities are endless!

OP, I do agree with the advice to reach out to the middle school math content specialist (you can find which teacher this is on the school website). But don't immediately ask for a placement test for Algebra 1. Just start by asking them about your child's math placement. If it's AIM or AMP7+, this is already the accelerated class which is likely fine for a student with a 260 MAP-M (which is a good score, but not so ridiculously high that skipping over pre-algebra fundamentals is necessarily a good idea). If it's AMP6 or 6+, then I would ask to have your child considered for the advanced class, which as folks have said, is either AIM6 or AMP7+. (essentially the same material, but different curriculum providers as not all schools have switched over yet).

I'm the poster you were happy to poke, with your inane "you had me at" comment. This kid is my youngest, my oldest is in college already. I meant what I said. DD has been in MCYO for years, and for school orchestra, has always placed in whatever orchestral group is most experienced. For example, she is going into the Philharmonic in 9th. She finished middle school in Spanish 3 (and attends a weekend native language school in our own language). She was in Global Humanities, etc.

OP has a child who seeks to avoid boredom by exploring academic concepts that are not usually taught to their age group. It can be depressing for such a child to spend 8am to 3pm every blasted day revisiting work they have already grasped. It was certainly depressing for all of my children! Enrichment outside of school is great, and necessary, but acceleration at school is also necessary and I am giving OP a blueprint in how to go about it for math, because MCPS will not tell her.

Try not to be too smug. You never know who has more experience than you.

Another MCYO family. Our high level orchestra's are a joke compared to MCYO. They are a blow off class for an easy A.

They generally don't allow philharmonic in 9th.. that doesn't make sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Please, don't play dumb. You said "on DCUM all children are above average" implying that PP's child is one of those average children their parents believe is so special.

In reality, there are many kids who are, in fact, not average. If you take only top 2%, that's still 50 kids per large HS. Prior to HS, these kids are in their middle and elementary schools and their parents need to fight tooth and nail to put their kids into appropriate level classes. In return they are constantly lectured that there is no need to rush blah blah blah by the experts you are referring to.

It's plain evil. If a child spends their summer doing khan academy etc, like OP's, why not let them take a higher level class? Test them if they are ready and then just let them and their parents decide.

Stop patronizing us. A lot of us know way more math than you do and figuring out classes is really not that hard.

DP. Doing Khan Academy over the summer is not a good enough reason to place and skip a grade to higher level math. It does make sense to talk to the math coordinator at school, there are assessments, placement tests etc, that can provide a better picture of student capabilities. I’ve seen on this forum parents complaining that the math placement test in algebra contained algebra questions, which shown how little some parents know about school curriculum. A lot of algebra 1 topics are covered in grades 6-8. The school can’t just take your word for it that the student should skip grades, there’s need to be an independent evaluation and often through multiple measures. Sometimes parents are delusional and chase a math placement as a validation of their parenting. In the end it may be a disservice to the child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please, don't play dumb. You said "on DCUM all children are above average" implying that PP's child is one of those average children their parents believe is so special.

In reality, there are many kids who are, in fact, not average. If you take only top 2%, that's still 50 kids per large HS. Prior to HS, these kids are in their middle and elementary schools and their parents need to fight tooth and nail to put their kids into appropriate level classes. In return they are constantly lectured that there is no need to rush blah blah blah by the experts you are referring to.

It's plain evil. If a child spends their summer doing khan academy etc, like OP's, why not let them take a higher level class? Test them if they are ready and then just let them and their parents decide.

Stop patronizing us. A lot of us know way more math than you do and figuring out classes is really not that hard.

DP. Doing Khan Academy over the summer is not a good enough reason to place and skip a grade to higher level math. It does make sense to talk to the math coordinator at school, there are assessments, placement tests etc, that can provide a better picture of student capabilities. I’ve seen on this forum parents complaining that the math placement test in algebra contained algebra questions, which shown how little some parents know about school curriculum. A lot of algebra 1 topics are covered in grades 6-8. The school can’t just take your word for it that the student should skip grades, there’s need to be an independent evaluation and often through multiple measures. Sometimes parents are delusional and chase a math placement as a validation of their parenting. In the end it may be a disservice to the child.

Please, don't lie. The student in question was given a full Algebra 1 test and missed only a few questions. Nobody is complaining that there is "some algebra" on the algebra placement test. My own kids have been doing algebra since 1st grade. We are a very mathy family and very likely know more math than all of MCPS combined.

Nobody is saying "take my word" for it. Only give children the opportunity to test out of classes that are not suited for their level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. We don't know yet what DC was recommended for. I checked the school website and saw that the school offers AMP6+, AMP7+ in 6th grade for the advanced track in 6th grade. In 7th they offer AMP 7+, Math 8, Algebra 1* . In 8th grade they offer Algebra 1* and Honors Geometry.

I do not know what all this is.

In this case 7+ sounds right.

Yes. So the pathway would be:

AMP7+ in 6th
Algebra 1 in 7th
Honors Geometry in 8th

This is the typical MCPS fast track right now. I don't know how many schools still have AIM - my understanding is that AMP largely replaced/is replacing it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. We don't know yet what DC was recommended for. I checked the school website and saw that the school offers AMP6+, AMP7+ in 6th grade for the advanced track in 6th grade. In 7th they offer AMP 7+, Math 8, Algebra 1* . In 8th grade they offer Algebra 1* and Honors Geometry.

I do not know what all this is.

In this case 7+ sounds right.

Yes. So the pathway would be:

AMP7+ in 6th
Algebra 1 in 7th
Honors Geometry in 8th

This is the typical MCPS fast track right now. I don't know how many schools still have AIM - my understanding is that AMP largely replaced/is replacing it.

Ok here. The Math counselor reached out and said that Aim6 is same as Amp7+ and 6th, 7th and 8th grade Math would be covered. Next year it would be Algebra and then Geometry. I believe they don't normally test since the kids would be with 7th and 8th graders for Algebra and would have to be bussed to high school and miss lunch. And that Algebra2 would be with 11th graders and may be a problem socially.

To those of you whose kids were bussed or in classes with 8th graders, how did it affect your child socially?

The counselor felt that this is the right placement since many kids with similar Map scores would be in that class

[Anonymous]

Op, not ok

[Anonymous]

I meant in 8th grade they would be bussed if they start with Algebra 1 in 6th

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. We don't know yet what DC was recommended for. I checked the school website and saw that the school offers AMP6+, AMP7+ in 6th grade for the advanced track in 6th grade. In 7th they offer AMP 7+, Math 8, Algebra 1* . In 8th grade they offer Algebra 1* and Honors Geometry.

I do not know what all this is.

In this case 7+ sounds right.

Yes. So the pathway would be:

AMP7+ in 6th
Algebra 1 in 7th
Honors Geometry in 8th

This is the typical MCPS fast track right now. I don't know how many schools still have AIM - my understanding is that AMP largely replaced/is replacing it.

Ok here. The Math counselor reached out and said that Aim6 is same as Amp7+ and 6th, 7th and 8th grade Math would be covered. Next year it would be Algebra and then Geometry. I believe they don't normally test since the kids would be with 7th and 8th graders for Algebra and would have to be bussed to high school and miss lunch. And that Algebra2 would be with 11th graders and may be a problem socially.

To those of you whose kids were bussed or in classes with 8th graders, how did it affect your child socially?

The counselor felt that this is the right placement since many kids with similar Map scores would be in that class

My child wasn't bussed but they've been fine in classes with older kids. Sometimes the other kids have gossiped but never had an issue. Come HS, things like band are mixed depending on skill level so its very possible your freshman will be in classes with Seniors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please ask your middle school math coordinator right now for a placement test into Algebra 1. Some math coordinators try their best to avoid placing 6th graders in that class, but you can always ask for the placement test in the summer.

My kid did that. It was the best decision we made. She was in the most advanced classes her middle school offered in orchestra, language and math, and it was the only way for her to avoid utter misery and boredom. Thank goodness now she's going into high school, where AP courses make it easier to cater to academic kids.

Okay, you had me at "most advanced middle school orchestra class" because there isn't really a such thing. The "advanced" options for middle-school-aged kids who are accomplished strings musicians are all outside of school (e.g., MCYO). Also unclear what you mean by "advanced language" (foreign language? Advanced English which isn't advanced?)

Listen, my DC was also very good at math and took AIM in 6th and granted it was pretty easy. But to say a kid will suffer from "utter misery and boredom" at school unless they can take Algebra 1 in 6h grade is pretty dramatic. They can join the math club, the drama club, write for the school paper, play sports, take a coding class, participate in advanced orchestras or chamber groups outside of school, etc..... The possibilities are endless!

OP, I do agree with the advice to reach out to the middle school math content specialist (you can find which teacher this is on the school website). But don't immediately ask for a placement test for Algebra 1. Just start by asking them about your child's math placement. If it's AIM or AMP7+, this is already the accelerated class which is likely fine for a student with a 260 MAP-M (which is a good score, but not so ridiculously high that skipping over pre-algebra fundamentals is necessarily a good idea). If it's AMP6 or 6+, then I would ask to have your child considered for the advanced class, which as folks have said, is either AIM6 or AMP7+. (essentially the same material, but different curriculum providers as not all schools have switched over yet).

I'm the poster you were happy to poke, with your inane "you had me at" comment. This kid is my youngest, my oldest is in college already. I meant what I said. DD has been in MCYO for years, and for school orchestra, has always placed in whatever orchestral group is most experienced. For example, she is going into the Philharmonic in 9th. She finished middle school in Spanish 3 (and attends a weekend native language school in our own language). She was in Global Humanities, etc.

OP has a child who seeks to avoid boredom by exploring academic concepts that are not usually taught to their age group. It can be depressing for such a child to spend 8am to 3pm every blasted day revisiting work they have already grasped. It was certainly depressing for all of my children! Enrichment outside of school is great, and necessary, but acceleration at school is also necessary and I am giving OP a blueprint in how to go about it for math, because MCPS will not tell her.

Try not to be too smug. You never know who has more experience than you.

Give me a break. You don't know how "experienced" I am, and I didn't even read your lengthy paragraph about your child's resume because I don't care, and it's not relevant to other students' experiences nor helpful to the OP.

My advice to the OP was to reach out to the MS math content specialist and first find out what placement their child *already* has, as this appears to be an unknown. Then you can go from there. My other piece of advice is that, no matter how brilliant you think your child may be - and let's face it, kids of DCUM posters are always above average - math placement above the already-accelerated track is not always a good idea.

You seem to be coming from a place where you are assuming all of the MS math content specialists are terrible. Maybe some are, but some of them are actually very knowledgeable (this is their job!), and may be able to provide helpful advice on appropriate math placement, whether that's the regular accelerated track or trying to place in to Algebra 1. If placement in Alg. 1 is a possibility, the content specialist could also advise on whether this means placement in a class with most/all 7th graders or will it be mixed 7/8 (depends on the MS and how big a cohort exists for 7th grade Algebra 1). Socially/emotionally, there is a big difference between 6th graders, and 7th/8th graders. OP's child may prefer to be with other (smart) 6th graders.

Not PP, but there is maybe about 5% of children for whom curriculum is too watered down and they would very much benefit from differentiation. We, the parents, are rightfully upset that MCPS is making this so difficult in middle school. You don't know our children better than we do. You won't be able to impose false equality on the back of our children, sorry.

And in elementary school too. Shame on those counselors who say they don't handle math classes, the Principals who don't do anything to meet the students where they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op here. We don't know yet what DC was recommended for. I checked the school website and saw that the school offers AMP6+, AMP7+ in 6th grade for the advanced track in 6th grade. In 7th they offer AMP 7+, Math 8, Algebra 1* . In 8th grade they offer Algebra 1* and Honors Geometry.

I do not know what all this is.

In this case 7+ sounds right.

Yes. So the pathway would be:

AMP7+ in 6th
Algebra 1 in 7th
Honors Geometry in 8th

+1
This is the accelerated path and I would stick with it.
And if you can afford it pay for math enrichment. You'll gain nothing by moving forward in school more quickly. They don't teach math well in MCPS and there's more to be gained by using your child's interest to go more into depth with outside math. Enroll him or her in contest math too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Please, don't play dumb. You said "on DCUM all children are above average" implying that PP's child is one of those average children their parents believe is so special.

In reality, there are many kids who are, in fact, not average. If you take only top 2%, that's still 50 kids per large HS. Prior to HS, these kids are in their middle and elementary schools and their parents need to fight tooth and nail to put their kids into appropriate level classes. In return they are constantly lectured that there is no need to rush blah blah blah by the experts you are referring to.

It's plain evil. If a child spends their summer doing khan academy etc, like OP's, why not let them take a higher level class? Test them if they are ready and then just let them and their parents decide.

Stop patronizing us. A lot of us know way more math than you do and figuring out classes is really not that hard.

DP. Doing Khan Academy over the summer is not a good enough reason to place and skip a grade to higher level math. It does make sense to talk to the math coordinator at school, there are assessments, placement tests etc, that can provide a better picture of student capabilities. I’ve seen on this forum parents complaining that the math placement test in algebra contained algebra questions, which shown how little some parents know about school curriculum. A lot of algebra 1 topics are covered in grades 6-8. The school can’t just take your word for it that the student should skip grades, there’s need to be an independent evaluation and often through multiple measures. Sometimes parents are delusional and chase a math placement as a validation of their parenting. In the end it may be a disservice to the child.

Please, don't lie. The student in question was given a full Algebra 1 test and missed only a few questions. Nobody is complaining that there is "some algebra" on the algebra placement test. My own kids have been doing algebra since 1st grade. We are a very mathy family and very likely know more math than all of MCPS combined.

Nobody is saying "take my word" for it. Only give children the opportunity to test out of classes that are not suited for their level.

If the kid only missed a few questions on a full algebra1 test, there wouldn’t be any issue with the placement. It seems like your kid was given the opportunity to test out, but wasn’t at the required level for now.

Whats a “full” algebra test, how do you personally know what was in the test etc. couple that with the arrogant claim you know more math than the entire MCPS combined, and I’m skeptical of your entire post. This attitude won’t help you in dealing with the school.

[Anonymous]

I am not talking about my own kid, moron.