Not Everyone DESERVES Secondary School Education

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like someone from flyover who wants cheap labor for their meatpacking plant.

In order to have educated voters, everyone needs to study American government. Trades people create jobs because many run their own businesses. They need secondary math. Geometry proofs help people learn logic an reasoning skills. Literature helps people to empathize with others from different walks of life. Half of the recent innovations in tech started life on sci-fi shows.

European countries silo their kids early. It's not good preparation for the more flexible US job market. It also means that a lot of voters in Europe are low info; a lot of these countries have fascist parties and vote for insane GDP-wreckers like Brexit.

Looking at the composition it reads like a well-educated immigrant who can’t afford a high performing pyramid and resents FCPS for not getting the “ bad kids” out so that their child can have a different high school experience.

[Anonymous]

[code]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This sounds like someone from flyover who wants cheap labor for their meatpacking plant.

In order to have educated voters, everyone needs to study American government. Trades people create jobs because many run their own businesses. They need secondary math. Geometry proofs help people learn logic an reasoning skills. Literature helps people to empathize with others from different walks of life. Half of the recent innovations in tech started life on sci-fi shows.

European countries silo their kids early. It's not good preparation for the more flexible US job market. It also means that a lot of voters in Europe are low info; a lot of these countries have fascist parties and vote for insane GDP-wreckers like Brexit.

Looking at the composition it reads like a well-educated immigrant who can’t afford a high performing pyramid and resents FCPS for not getting the “ bad kids” out so that their child can have a different high school experience.

Right about immigration status and relative pyramid status as one of a Westfield, Herndon, South Lakes, West Potomac. But upper quartile income. Many in the same income range cannot fathom how rapidly how down the road how heavily impoverished certain school pyramid la have become.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. Everyone needs k-12. But it doesnt have to be college track for everyone. There is a lot of practical knowledge (like taxes and how govt works) that we need for people to know. All these people will be able to vote for people and policies, they need to know what they are choosing.

I would agree with you if it weren’t for the fact that so many college students are taking and paying for remedial classes bc kids are graduating with sufficient skills. Watched one program on a student who graduated from top of her class and went to the Air Force academy. There she learned how far behind she was when she was put on academic probation there. This student was robbed IMO by her public school system. Shame, shame, shame.

[Anonymous]

One of many issues with OP’s plan— girls prefrontal cortexes develop before boys and they Have much stronger executive functioning skills in middle school (high school, often college, sometime life). For everyone so upset that women earn more degrees than men in everything except engineering/CS, wait until you start weeding the boys out in middle school.

[Anonymous]

Germany tracks early and has some schools that end after 9th or 10th grade. Those kids then usually complete 3 year apprenticeships to learn a job. It’s not just trades, but a variety of office jobs as well. Though honestly the kids who only make it through 9th grade often don’t do well finding and completing apprenticeships.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One of many issues with OP’s plan— girls prefrontal cortexes develop before boys and they Have much stronger executive functioning skills in middle school (high school, often college, sometime life). For everyone so upset that women earn more degrees than men in everything except engineering/CS, wait until you start weeding the boys out in middle school.

Valid.

[Anonymous]

I’m an FCPS substitute. I think it should be easier to send a few problem kids to the alternative schools. In my experience, most kids are reachable and want to learn. There are a few kids that have absolutely no interest, at least right now, and would be better off learning life lessons working. When that 1 (usually it’s just 1 and some classes have 0 like this) kid per class is in the room, they have a huge influence over 5-6 kids which means less learning happens. It takes too long to get these kids out.

[Anonymous]

I didn't get it together until 9th/10th grade and went on to grad school. My sis got it together in college. Public school doesn't need to be either taking 20 APs or illiterate. I think there are several issues:
-Passing kids along no matter their mastery of content means it's impossible for those kids to do well in HS
-Least restrictive environment should mean least restrictive appropriate environment. Kids who are barely verbal, need 1 on 1 , or a threat to others do not belong in gen ed. It's not fair to the teachers or other students.
-Bring back some semblance of discipline
-Stop suggesting trades for kids who are not motivated. Many trades still require a good grasp of HS content. You want an electrician who doesn't understand basic math and science? Or a plumber who doesn't show up? Trades to me just mean a different skill set than college.

[Anonymous]

Kids get passed along without content knowledge due to standardized testing. Teachers are required to move on to new units after a short window because they're assigned a strict test prep schedule, even if there's kids who need more time to understand the content.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kids get passed along without content knowledge due to standardized testing. Teachers are required to move on to new units after a short window because they're assigned a strict test prep schedule, even if there's kids who need more time to understand the content.

No they get passed along bc teachers have been told they have no choice. And now this craziness is spilling over to colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There was a time when vocational training was part of a high school curriculum. There was shop class, automotive class, etc... It's too bad those were phased out because I think there are lots of kids who are attracted to that sort of hands on learning.
I agree that the Great Gatsby isn't for everyone.

They are still there--there are so many vocational programs in FCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am believer that everyone should have access to a K-8 education and this benefits the kids who have an opportunity to explore academics of interest and strength, and allows society to give a rough measurement of the intellectual capability of each student. However, education is an investment, and a very costly one at that.

At some point we should ask is spending $15,000 per pupil on so many students who sleep through class, generally lazy, and have limited academic aptitude the right move? These kids could be better served by working a full time job or learning a trade building up their financial net worth rather than attend high school, but instead these masses proliferate the classrooms with distractions and negatively impact the reputation standings of many high schools. Say top 70% make the cut to be able to attend high school.


Since FCPS has all but made it exceedingly painful to fail any single student, under the disguise of equity of promoting equal outcomes, which lead to too many bad apples being a classroom that they shouldn’t, that further increase costs. Other countries, that don’t automatically give everyone a secondary school education such as Germany and Netherlands seem to do well. It would solve many complaints of parents afraid of their kids attending schools with too many rotten apples, so why not remove them? But alas this school board will never do such a thing. They will call you racist.m

Let me guess- you think America was at its best when kids worked in mines and factories, right?

[Anonymous]

I wonder if they should add a technical diploma which might be less academic and yet still have a concentration of at least 3 classes in a vocational area.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a time when vocational training was part of a high school curriculum. There was shop class, automotive class, etc... It's too bad those were phased out because I think there are lots of kids who are attracted to that sort of hands on learning.
I agree that the Great Gatsby isn't for everyone.

They are still there--there are so many vocational programs in FCPS.

+1. There are some great academy courses in FCPS and they're well attended. The students who do well in those courses, however, are not the students OP is talking about. The ones who miss 40 days of school with no explanation and spend most of their time when they are in the building cussing out teachers or roaming the halls or playing on their phones are not going to suddenly get it together because they're placed in auto shop.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am believer that everyone should have access to a K-8 education and this benefits the kids who have an opportunity to explore academics of interest and strength, and allows society to give a rough measurement of the intellectual capability of each student. However, education is an investment, and a very costly one at that.

At some point we should ask is spending $15,000 per pupil on so many students who sleep through class, generally lazy, and have limited academic aptitude the right move? These kids could be better served by working a full time job or learning a trade building up their financial net worth rather than attend high school, but instead these masses proliferate the classrooms with distractions and negatively impact the reputation standings of many high schools. Say top 70% make the cut to be able to attend high school.


Since FCPS has all but made it exceedingly painful to fail any single student, under the disguise of equity of promoting equal outcomes, which lead to too many bad apples being a classroom that they shouldn’t, that further increase costs. Other countries, that don’t automatically give everyone a secondary school education such as Germany and Netherlands seem to do well. It would solve many complaints of parents afraid of their kids attending schools with too many rotten apples, so why not remove them? But alas this school board will never do such a thing. They will call you racist.m

Let me guess- you think America was at its best when kids worked in mines and factories, right?

OP. Yes and No. Only 2.5 percent of this graduating class will receive an engineering degree, 1 percent for a doctorate in medical/pharmacy/dental education and a further 1.5 percent of the population a degree in a physical science.

Yet, the current educational system seeks to subject the other 95 percent of the population to post basic algebra math, along with physics, physics, chemistry, biology, in the educational curriculum. Some would add what is the practical usage of reading Charles Dickens and Scott Fitzgerald. Is this not possibly a waste of resources?

Children should be able to pursue educational opportunities that are both more practical and aligns with their interests even starting post middle school. That is my belief.

You say that I believe children should be working what amounts to menial jobs and take that as a bad outcome. But at the end of the day SOMEONE has to be working those jobs. Whether that is Jose, the illegal immigrant who can’t speak English picking up fruit on a farm or Nick, the pampered kid who slept his way through class to become a waiter. Even under the current system there are a large number of Nicks.

I’m just saying maybe those Nicks should be able to start working earlier and be able to earn and put more wages towards retirement earlier and in greater value, instead of failing upwards until they become a college dropout and wasted all their time. And, to add the significant savings that would have on an ever constrained and tighter educational budget, that could be returned to the hardworking taxpayers or for other social programs.

You always will have your Nicks under a free system whether you wish it or not, I’m not an idealist, I see reality.