B+ in AP Calc AB--UPenn still an option?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One B+ in a difficult math class, particularly when she's signaling a humanities major, is not going to make a difference. For engineering or Wharton it definately would. She would need an A in BC. But sounds like that's not her thing. She hit the Calculus AB threshold for selective schools and did reasonably well. She's not going to be rejected because of that.

There will be other reasons.

Check out the DMV area admits for Penn. It's almost impossible for unhooked kids. The mid-Atlantic is not a desirable geography for Penn. There are so many smart, accomplished kids that want to go up the road to Penn. There is so much legacy. And there are so many wealthy contributors.

And absolutely none of it compares to what's coming from the NY privates. More accomplished. Richer. More connected. Same general region. Plus New Jersey. Plus Pennsylvania.

Take a look at your high school Penn admits in recent years. How many? Undoubtedly there was a hook of some sort.

Both of my kids are at top 20 colleges presently. We visited Penn. And then we studied the situation for unhooked kids from the burbs in DC.

And determined that it's not worth any attention at all.

Better to lay the facts to her early. And definitely do not throw an ED card towards Penn unless you're besties with the Chancellor. The mid-Atlantic is not good for Penn. It is an incredibly difficult admit from the suburbs in Maryland or Virginia. If you want to spend $75 on a lottery ticket in regular, go for it. But would suggest being more strategic about where you want to direct the passion.

Snap. Agree with all of this.

+100. One of the best responses I've seen in a long time. Good advice here beyond this thread.

[Anonymous]

I'm in the DC private world and the ONLY (and I mean ONLY) Penn admits I've known in the past 5 years are:

1)Crew recruits
2)URM, generally plus legacy and often plus big $$
3)legacies, generally plus big $$
4)valedictorians who have grades that make you go "how was that even possible?" (because they got As in every class where the teacher gives maybe one A per year).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My niece is at Penn with 2 Bs (physics and Calc). No hooks. Middle of the road public. Stron everything else. She is a history major.

The key here is it’s a middle of the road public, not helpful/applicable when our kids are in strong schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Are you for real? You very well know that even if she got an A in Calc AB, she STILL wouldn’t get into Penn. So please reassure your child that she will be more than fine.

This is the answer, sadly enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This will be a big reach. I am just trying to be honest with you. You need to lower her expectations NOW. DS got into Penn and had a 3.97 from a DC private with near perfect scores and high rigor. He went to different Ivy. Graduate school legacy matters very little at Penn. It is a harder admit for non STEM girls, too. To increase her chances, I would zero in on a very arcane major (one that they have trouble filling classes for) and write a lot about it in the essays (authentically). Consider having her apply ROTC, a big booster as a female applicant. Be very specific about what she brings to the Penn community in the essays. Have her fight to raise that B+ to at least a A-. AB Calculus just isn’t deemed very hard from a school like Penn’s perspective. Your daughter is being compared to her classmates (especially other girls) so if there is a hooked classmate or one with a better total package, it will be hard for her to stand out. Find matches and likelies. Good luck!

I don't see how you write authentically about an arcane major unless you were in fact interested in an arcane major prior to HS Jr year, and show something tangible to indicate that interest.

Don't have your daughter magically develop an interest in something obscure and then ruining her JR and 1/2 her SR year of HS trying to prove the interest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She’s fine. I know several kids with 2-3 B+ at Penn….

Really depends on the high school and their relationship w/Penn..

The HS part matters a lot. Larger public school that rarely sends anyone there and she shows interest in just the right way? Maybe. Public or private school that always sends kids there? It will be hard if she is competing again recruited athlete or true (undergrad) legacy classmates.

She should apply and also develop an healthy list of alternatives. Ask her to describe what she specifically loves: city setting? Philly specially? Traditions? Size? Specific majors? Then find other similar schools and help her imagine herself there, too.

Bingo. She SHOULD be fine. But there are no guarantees for anyone, even if all As.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will be a big reach. I am just trying to be honest with you. You need to lower her expectations NOW. DS got into Penn and had a 3.97 from a DC private with near perfect scores and high rigor. He went to different Ivy. Graduate school legacy matters very little at Penn. It is a harder admit for non STEM girls, too. To increase her chances, I would zero in on a very arcane major (one that they have trouble filling classes for) and write a lot about it in the essays (authentically). Consider having her apply ROTC, a big booster as a female applicant. Be very specific about what she brings to the Penn community in the essays. Have her fight to raise that B+ to at least a A-. AB Calculus just isn’t deemed very hard from a school like Penn’s perspective. Your daughter is being compared to her classmates (especially other girls) so if there is a hooked classmate or one with a better total package, it will be hard for her to stand out. Find matches and likelies. Good luck!

I don't see how you write authentically about an arcane major unless you were in fact interested in an arcane major prior to HS Jr year, and show something tangible to indicate that interest.

Don't have your daughter magically develop an interest in something obscure and then ruining her JR and 1/2 her SR year of HS trying to prove the interest.

It’s not that hard to be honest.
Create a club at school; add one or two other things and college counselors can help create a narrative. Search on CC for ideas .

Take the elective classes in that subject offered at your high school.

We’re trying it this year. I’ll let you know how it goes

[Anonymous]

I can't believe nobody has asked this but what was her first quarter grade and where does the grade stand now? Unless you are talking about working up from a C, I don't understand why in NOVEMBER, you already know she will get a B+. Get a tutor, work to get that grade up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will be a big reach. I am just trying to be honest with you. You need to lower her expectations NOW. DS got into Penn and had a 3.97 from a DC private with near perfect scores and high rigor. He went to different Ivy. Graduate school legacy matters very little at Penn. It is a harder admit for non STEM girls, too. To increase her chances, I would zero in on a very arcane major (one that they have trouble filling classes for) and write a lot about it in the essays (authentically). Consider having her apply ROTC, a big booster as a female applicant. Be very specific about what she brings to the Penn community in the essays. Have her fight to raise that B+ to at least a A-. AB Calculus just isn’t deemed very hard from a school like Penn’s perspective. Your daughter is being compared to her classmates (especially other girls) so if there is a hooked classmate or one with a better total package, it will be hard for her to stand out. Find matches and likelies. Good luck!

I don't see how you write authentically about an arcane major unless you were in fact interested in an arcane major prior to HS Jr year, and show something tangible to indicate that interest.

Don't have your daughter magically develop an interest in something obscure and then ruining her JR and 1/2 her SR year of HS trying to prove the interest.

It’s not that hard to be honest.
Create a club at school; add one or two other things and college counselors can help create a narrative. Search on CC for ideas .

Take the elective classes in that subject offered at your high school.

We’re trying it this year. I’ll let you know how it goes

How random could it be if your HS offers elective classes in it?

I was thinking you find a major that has maybe less than 10 kids at Penn graduate with that major each year...whatever the heck that might be?

[Anonymous]

This is why you shouldn't rush your kids ahead of their comfort level in math.

If OP's kid stayed on a sustainable track, the kid could be in Honors Precalc that year instead of AB, and then take Calc BC at the same time as they are in reality, but with As and a solid understanding, instead of rushing and hitting a wall.
Now the kid looks like someone chasing higher levels without learning lower levels well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My daughter is a junior who has taken a rigorous courseload over the last 3 years. All As thus far, but she is most likely going to end up with a B+ in AP Calc AB.

Her dream school is UPenn. She always knew this was a reach school (the only IVY on her list), but now feels that she has no chance with a B in AP Calc AB. Is it accurate that this probably takes her out of the running? She is really upset and I want to console her, but want to also be realistic. She is well aware that Penn admissions is a lottery even amongst the most competitive candidates, and there is no pressure from me/husband about going to a T20 school. Still, it's where she truly, deeply believes she will be happiest....

She is well-rounded and has strong ECs (all local though, no state/national awards). Her LORs and essays will be excellent, as she is well-liked by her teachers and a wonderful writer. SAT 1550. FWIW, she will be a humanities major and never wants to take another math class after HS. Her father and I are both legacy at Penn grad schools.

Either way, you’ve got to push back on the “it’s where she truly believes she will be happiest” stuff. It’s distorted thinking. The most likely thing is she won’t get in (even with an A) and it’s really important to make that part of the conversation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will be a big reach. I am just trying to be honest with you. You need to lower her expectations NOW. DS got into Penn and had a 3.97 from a DC private with near perfect scores and high rigor. He went to different Ivy. Graduate school legacy matters very little at Penn. It is a harder admit for non STEM girls, too. To increase her chances, I would zero in on a very arcane major (one that they have trouble filling classes for) and write a lot about it in the essays (authentically). Consider having her apply ROTC, a big booster as a female applicant. Be very specific about what she brings to the Penn community in the essays. Have her fight to raise that B+ to at least a A-. AB Calculus just isn’t deemed very hard from a school like Penn’s perspective. Your daughter is being compared to her classmates (especially other girls) so if there is a hooked classmate or one with a better total package, it will be hard for her to stand out. Find matches and likelies. Good luck!

I don't see how you write authentically about an arcane major unless you were in fact interested in an arcane major prior to HS Jr year, and show something tangible to indicate that interest.

Don't have your daughter magically develop an interest in something obscure and then ruining her JR and 1/2 her SR year of HS trying to prove the interest.

It’s not that hard to be honest.
Create a club at school; add one or two other things and college counselors can help create a narrative. Search on CC for ideas .

Take the elective classes in that subject offered at your high school.

We’re trying it this year. I’ll let you know how it goes

I'll pass on this recommendation to encourage DC to lie/be dishonest and fabricate an interest where none exists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will be a big reach. I am just trying to be honest with you. You need to lower her expectations NOW. DS got into Penn and had a 3.97 from a DC private with near perfect scores and high rigor. He went to different Ivy. Graduate school legacy matters very little at Penn. It is a harder admit for non STEM girls, too. To increase her chances, I would zero in on a very arcane major (one that they have trouble filling classes for) and write a lot about it in the essays (authentically). Consider having her apply ROTC, a big booster as a female applicant. Be very specific about what she brings to the Penn community in the essays. Have her fight to raise that B+ to at least a A-. AB Calculus just isn’t deemed very hard from a school like Penn’s perspective. Your daughter is being compared to her classmates (especially other girls) so if there is a hooked classmate or one with a better total package, it will be hard for her to stand out. Find matches and likelies. Good luck!

I don't see how you write authentically about an arcane major unless you were in fact interested in an arcane major prior to HS Jr year, and show something tangible to indicate that interest.

Don't have your daughter magically develop an interest in something obscure and then ruining her JR and 1/2 her SR year of HS trying to prove the interest.

It’s not that hard to be honest.
Create a club at school; add one or two other things and college counselors can help create a narrative. Search on CC for ideas .

Take the elective classes in that subject offered at your high school.

We’re trying it this year. I’ll let you know how it goes

How random could it be if your HS offers elective classes in it?

I was thinking you find a major that has maybe less than 10 kids at Penn graduate with that major each year...whatever the heck that might be?

It’s adjacent - fits into the whole narrative. Map out all of the students’ interest.

Look at majors at the schools and try and find ones that are adjacent. Then try to find corresponding classes this week to it, have the kid do an independent study on a niche topic, and have that teacher write the recommendation about that niche interest. Apply for a couple of awards or local or state recognition from really random obscure places.

This is not rocket science at all, but it does require a ton of research and it’s not something a 16-year-old can do alone.

There are a lot of ideas about this on college confidential, and Reddit

[Anonymous]

Honestly, if you were doing all this, you should start freshman year and you should hire a professional to help you create the narrative.

I have no idea how you would find out which majors have low enrollment at any school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This will be a big reach. I am just trying to be honest with you. You need to lower her expectations NOW. DS got into Penn and had a 3.97 from a DC private with near perfect scores and high rigor. He went to different Ivy. Graduate school legacy matters very little at Penn. It is a harder admit for non STEM girls, too. To increase her chances, I would zero in on a very arcane major (one that they have trouble filling classes for) and write a lot about it in the essays (authentically). Consider having her apply ROTC, a big booster as a female applicant. Be very specific about what she brings to the Penn community in the essays. Have her fight to raise that B+ to at least a A-. AB Calculus just isn’t deemed very hard from a school like Penn’s perspective. Your daughter is being compared to her classmates (especially other girls) so if there is a hooked classmate or one with a better total package, it will be hard for her to stand out. Find matches and likelies. Good luck!

I don't see how you write authentically about an arcane major unless you were in fact interested in an arcane major prior to HS Jr year, and show something tangible to indicate that interest.

Don't have your daughter magically develop an interest in something obscure and then ruining her JR and 1/2 her SR year of HS trying to prove the interest.

It’s not that hard to be honest.
Create a club at school; add one or two other things and college counselors can help create a narrative. Search on CC for ideas .

Take the elective classes in that subject offered at your high school.

We’re trying it this year. I’ll let you know how it goes

How random could it be if your HS offers elective classes in it?

I was thinking you find a major that has maybe less than 10 kids at Penn graduate with that major each year...whatever the heck that might be?

It’s adjacent - fits into the whole narrative. Map out all of the students’ interest.

Look at majors at the schools and try and find ones that are adjacent. Then try to find corresponding classes this week to it, have the kid do an independent study on a niche topic, and have that teacher write the recommendation about that niche interest. Apply for a couple of awards or local or state recognition from really random obscure places.

This is not rocket science at all, but it does require a ton of research and it’s not something a 16-year-old can do alone.

There are a lot of ideas about this on college confidential, and Reddit

So, I hope it works for you...because you are absolutely proving the point of making your kid fairly miserable to go down this rabbit hole. I will agree that if you are willing to hire a 6-figure+ college consultant, I would assume they will essentially do all the legwork for you.

However, how do you make any of this happen if you are current a HS Jr. You won't be able to take these HS electives until next year, so you can't have your HS teacher write the recommendation about this niche interest.

Your kid must be younger. My comments were also factoring in time constraints.