Cornell versus CMU CS

[Anonymous]

I have attended both schools and I think you cannot lose, but I would choose Cornell for the campus culture, which is more well-rounded in my opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cornell hasn’t released decisions yet ?

Ivy Day is tomorrow.

Likely letters

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CMU average CS grad salary is 201K. Pretty jaw dropping. They are super into it. Doubt its fun to attend but it does not get more cutting edge. Of course my kid was WL.

Cornell though it is high ranked is going to be more preppy and honestly I still don't think of of it for CS. Im in software and have yet to see a Cornell developer. We cant afford the CMU ones. If you are vibe-ing with Cornell, by all means, you cant go wrong, its Ivy. But if your kid is a super geek gonna-make-a-billion in CS, CMU is the place.

That said, It seemed like your kid wanted a more balanced life so maybe Cornell.

Cornell ranks #6 in the country according to USNews so it is very strong for CS (though below CMU which is #2)

It's strong but not incredible, IMO very overranked on US News for CS. One of the best proxies for which schools have the best CS talent is which schools have recently produced the most early stage funded startups. According to https://news.crunchbase.com/business/stanford-harvard-mit-funded-startup-founders/:

1. Stanford
2. MIT
3. Harvard
4. Berkeley
5. Columbia
6. Cornell
7. Duke
7. USC
9. Carnegie Mellon
9. Penn
9. UT Austin
9. Yale
13. Michigan
14. UIUC
15. UCLA
16. NYU
17. Northwestern
18. Princeton
19. Brown
19. Georgia Tech

This is by raw numbers, so schools with larger populations get significantly benefitted. Cornell has 2x the undergrad population as CMU yet is only slightly better at producing startup founders. If adjusted for undergrad population CMU has nearly 2x startup founders per capita.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DS got into both CMU and Cornell for CS, and if it was only between those two, would have gone to CMU. He ended up choosing a different option altogether but was extremely impressed by the caliber of the faculty and other students at CMU CS. Cornell was more of a mixed bag. My son preferred a more well-rounded experience than both those schools could offer though.

Thanks for the insight! Where did your DS choose instead, MIT or something?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DS got into both CMU and Cornell for CS, and if it was only between those two, would have gone to CMU. He ended up choosing a different option altogether but was extremely impressed by the caliber of the faculty and other students at CMU CS. Cornell was more of a mixed bag. My son preferred a more well-rounded experience than both those schools could offer though.

Thanks for the insight! Where did your DS choose instead, MIT or something?

No he chose Duke. Having a great time there and is very impressed by his classmates, and still has time for fun. Was the right choice for him but for others CMU CS is hard to beat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CMU average CS grad salary is 201K. Pretty jaw dropping. They are super into it. Doubt its fun to attend but it does not get more cutting edge. Of course my kid was WL.

Cornell though it is high ranked is going to be more preppy and honestly I still don't think of of it for CS. Im in software and have yet to see a Cornell developer. We cant afford the CMU ones. If you are vibe-ing with Cornell, by all means, you cant go wrong, its Ivy. But if your kid is a super geek gonna-make-a-billion in CS, CMU is the place.

That said, It seemed like your kid wanted a more balanced life so maybe Cornell.

Cornell ranks #6 in the country according to USNews so it is very strong for CS (though below CMU which is #2)

It's strong but not incredible, IMO very overranked on US News for CS. One of the best proxies for which schools have the best CS talent is which schools have recently produced the most early stage funded startups. According to https://news.crunchbase.com/business/stanford-harvard-mit-funded-startup-founders/:

1. Stanford
2. MIT
3. Harvard
4. Berkeley
5. Columbia
6. Cornell
7. Duke
7. USC
9. Carnegie Mellon
9. Penn
9. UT Austin
9. Yale
13. Michigan
14. UIUC
15. UCLA
16. NYU
17. Northwestern
18. Princeton
19. Brown
19. Georgia Tech

This is by raw numbers, so schools with larger populations get significantly benefitted. Cornell has 2x the undergrad population as CMU yet is only slightly better at producing startup founders. If adjusted for undergrad population CMU has nearly 2x startup founders per capita.

Are you including Cornells entire undergrad population or just CS? I hope you are not comparing the Ag School and Hotel schools!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does any9one have recent experience with Caltech? It seems super small and would have fewer opportunities than MIT for a kid that could get accepted to that kind of place

I’m the MIT PP from page one and I had a good friend from caltech in college (she was doing her master’s at MIT while I was an undergrad). They’re both excellent schools but have a bit of a different vibe. Caltech is much smaller and more intimate; I got the impression students tend to know a good percentage of their class, there are school wide things that most people participate in, etc. Kind of like a small liberal arts college (although coursework wise lol). MIT is much more a big universities where students need to find their own groups and intro classes have 100s of students. I definitely was much happier at MIT (I was absolutely wild to try on my newfound adulthood and independence) but my friend who’d had a rough time as a teen definitely made a better choice for her going to caltech. As with CMU or Cornell, you’ll get an excellent education and lots of opportunities at either, it’s more a question of which school will suit the student’s personality and what opportunities they want.

Thanks for the helpful info. My husband went to MIT (and is partial to it), but I have a DD interested in Caltech. She is very into CS but also has interests in Econ / public policy etc. It’s obviously super hard to get into any of these schools, but we are also trying to understand how well the schools will allow her to develop her interest with the intersection of CS and other areas. CA seems far to me…. But she likes it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DS got into both CMU and Cornell for CS, and if it was only between those two, would have gone to CMU. He ended up choosing a different option altogether but was extremely impressed by the caliber of the faculty and other students at CMU CS. Cornell was more of a mixed bag. My son preferred a more well-rounded experience than both those schools could offer though.

Thanks for the insight! Where did your DS choose instead, MIT or something?

No he chose Duke. Having a great time there and is very impressed by his classmates, and still has time for fun. Was the right choice for him but for others CMU CS is hard to beat.

Thanks - this is helpful. My DD was wondering how the CS experience is at Duke as she’s investigating a lot of these same schools.

[Anonymous]

I love these threads where a couple phenomenal programs are compared and then reference is made to some subjective rankings. The differences are usually miniscule, like picking the fly poop from the pepper. When looking at CMU and Cornell, how can you really go wrong. Pick the best fit.

That being said, CMU's Software Engineering Institute (SEI) is unrivaled as a historically revered leader in software engineering research and publication. SEI has been a thought leader for decades. The option to be affiliated with SEI and contribute wins the day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD is going to transfer from CMU, CS major, to another school after her freshman year there. CS is a very tough program and DD feels miserable there. CS @CMU is for someone who is smart, works hard, and does nothing but studying all day long. DD feels like it is not the place for her.

May I ask where she is considering for a transfer? Op here. Thank you for all the responses. My student is not one who will be happy or even able to study all day over a sustained period. That's why the question, CMU is obviously the bigger brand name, Pittsburgh more convenient, but ultimately fit is what sustains

DD will transfer from CMU to a school in the West Coast, a place where the weather is beautiful almost all the time.  The school was her 2nd choice but she chose CMU because of CMU's prestige, brand name, and bragging rights with her HS friends, which looking back, is a huge mistake.  You want to develop yourself as a well rounded individual during your college years, not chaining yourself to the chair and studying all the time.  She knows that she will be much happier at the new school.

[Anonymous]

My own kid started thinking of college Jr year of HS and due to interest in AI/CS, assumed CMU would be the hands-down top choice.

Visited the campus in December that year and met with 4 current students, and spoke with one student that had just graduated. The recent grad loved his experience. Started as a Math Major and ended up switching to CS which he admitted is very hard to do...had top grades and I guess one of his Math profs also taught a CS class, so worked out. Three of the four current CS students (two juniors and a senior) were miserable...like nearly suicidal according to my kid. They said the workload was intense...they often missed one class to complete the work for another, which of course then compounded things. They saw no rhyme or reason for the intense workload.

The fourth was a freshman and loved it...of course he admitted he still had the Freshman glow and hadn't been there long, so I guess time will tell.

The December cold and gray didn't help things. Found the CS/Engineering vibe very depressing. Visited the incredible, new business school and of course the mood was much happier. Many students and the tour guide said it is hard to take classes in other schools. In other words, you will have a hard time as a Business major trying to take CS classes (one approach was considering)...and it is hard as a CS major to take entrepreneurship and other business classes in the business school.

Loved Pittsburgh, but decided not to apply. Chose an overall top 10 school and wishes could plop it down in Pittsburgh because the city is one of the three top regional hubs in the country for AI. Someone mentioned there are not as many unicorn start-ups at CMU vs. say Stanford, MIT, etc. There are actually many CMU start-ups in AI and Robotics that are likely to achieve unicorn status in the near-future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD is going to transfer from CMU, CS major, to another school after her freshman year there. CS is a very tough program and DD feels miserable there. CS @CMU is for someone who is smart, works hard, and does nothing but studying all day long. DD feels like it is not the place for her.

+1

I did grad school at CMU (decades ago) in a EE/CS/Business program. the CS undergrads did NOT look like happy kids then, I can only imagine now. Same for the CS grad students. They are very focused, driven, students who have to spend 100%+ of their time with their studies because the program is brutal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD is going to transfer from CMU, CS major, to another school after her freshman year there. CS is a very tough program and DD feels miserable there. CS @CMU is for someone who is smart, works hard, and does nothing but studying all day long. DD feels like it is not the place for her.

+1

I did grad school at CMU (decades ago) in a EE/CS/Business program. the CS undergrads did NOT look like happy kids then, I can only imagine now. Same for the CS grad students. They are very focused, driven, students who have to spend 100%+ of their time with their studies because the program is brutal.

yea, this is why ultimately, DC decided against CMU for CS. Neither DC nor us parents want DC to be not happy where they are at.

And I agree about the prestige thing. I think this was one of the reasons why DC wanted CMU, but I think DC realized that that is not as important as them being happy for the next four years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CMU average CS grad salary is 201K. Pretty jaw dropping. They are super into it. Doubt its fun to attend but it does not get more cutting edge. Of course my kid was WL.

Cornell though it is high ranked is going to be more preppy and honestly I still don't think of of it for CS. Im in software and have yet to see a Cornell developer. We cant afford the CMU ones. If you are vibe-ing with Cornell, by all means, you cant go wrong, its Ivy. But if your kid is a super geek gonna-make-a-billion in CS, CMU is the place.

That said, It seemed like your kid wanted a more balanced life so maybe Cornell.

Cornell ranks #6 in the country according to USNews so it is very strong for CS (though below CMU which is #2)

It's strong but not incredible, IMO very overranked on US News for CS. One of the best proxies for which schools have the best CS talent is which schools have recently produced the most early stage funded startups. According to https://news.crunchbase.com/business/stanford-harvard-mit-funded-startup-founders/:

1. Stanford
2. MIT
3. Harvard
4. Berkeley
5. Columbia
6. Cornell
7. Duke
7. USC
9. Carnegie Mellon
9. Penn
9. UT Austin
9. Yale
13. Michigan
14. UIUC
15. UCLA
16. NYU
17. Northwestern
18. Princeton
19. Brown
19. Georgia Tech

This is by raw numbers, so schools with larger populations get significantly benefitted. Cornell has 2x the undergrad population as CMU yet is only slightly better at producing startup founders. If adjusted for undergrad population CMU has nearly 2x startup founders per capita.

Are you including Cornells entire undergrad population or just CS? I hope you are not comparing the Ag School and Hotel schools!

DP

founders / approx CS undergrads per year
Cornell 92 / 300 = .31
CMU 80 / 250 = .32

Doesn’t look like a significant difference

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CMU average CS grad salary is 201K. Pretty jaw dropping. They are super into it. Doubt its fun to attend but it does not get more cutting edge. Of course my kid was WL.

Cornell though it is high ranked is going to be more preppy and honestly I still don't think of of it for CS. Im in software and have yet to see a Cornell developer. We cant afford the CMU ones. If you are vibe-ing with Cornell, by all means, you cant go wrong, its Ivy. But if your kid is a super geek gonna-make-a-billion in CS, CMU is the place.

That said, It seemed like your kid wanted a more balanced life so maybe Cornell.

Cornell ranks #6 in the country according to USNews so it is very strong for CS (though below CMU which is #2)

It's strong but not incredible, IMO very overranked on US News for CS. One of the best proxies for which schools have the best CS talent is which schools have recently produced the most early stage funded startups. According to https://news.crunchbase.com/business/stanford-harvard-mit-funded-startup-founders/:

1. Stanford
2. MIT
3. Harvard
4. Berkeley
5. Columbia
6. Cornell
7. Duke
7. USC
9. Carnegie Mellon
9. Penn
9. UT Austin
9. Yale
13. Michigan
14. UIUC
15. UCLA
16. NYU
17. Northwestern
18. Princeton
19. Brown
19. Georgia Tech

This is by raw numbers, so schools with larger populations get significantly benefitted. Cornell has 2x the undergrad population as CMU yet is only slightly better at producing startup founders. If adjusted for undergrad population CMU has nearly 2x startup founders per capita.

Are you including Cornells entire undergrad population or just CS? I hope you are not comparing the Ag School and Hotel schools!

DP

founders / approx CS undergrads per year
Cornell 92 / 300 = .31
CMU 80 / 250 = .32

Doesn’t look like a significant difference

Your numbers are off, Cornell has close to double the CS undergrads as CMU.