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Jeff, What do you think about Helen Thomas' comments?
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Anonymous
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"If I said something like this at my employer (all Hispanics need to just go back to Mexico or whatever), I'd be rightly fired."
What exactly did Helen say? I thought she said Israel should get the hell out of Palestine not all jews should get out of the middle east. Big difference and I'm not sure why people are conflating the two. I am pro-Israel but I don't think people who think Israel does not have a right to take palestinian land are racist. Israel is a nation and not above criticism. |
Anonymous
| PP, I think you are misunderstanding what Thomas said. She was not saying that Israel should leave Gaza or the West Bank (i.e., the occupied territories), she was saying that the Jewish people should leave Israel and go back to where they came from (be it Eastern Europe, the US or elsewhere). This is essentially saying that Israel should no longer exist and everything should at least go back to the way it was pre-1948. That is by any measure a radical position that in this day and age would involve millions of Jews who have lived in Israel for generations leaving. While there is lots of disagreement (legitimate) about the policies of Israel toward its Arab citizens and about its dealings with those who live in the areas outside Israel but previously occupied by Israel and now under the control of Hamas and the Palestinian Authority, and Israel's treatment of Palestinians who had lived inside Israel prior to its establishment and their descendants, there are very few who would take the position that Jews should leave the state of Israel and no longer live in that area of the world. |
Anonymous
I think she was referring to the biblical area called Palestine, not specifically the territories. She told them to go back to European countries, so it seems like she's not just saying retreat from West Bank/Gaza. |
Anonymous
Exactly. She is not even recognizing Israel. |
Anonymous
No, not few. If the Palestinians could make the adjustment 60 years ago, then the Jews can do it now. |
Anonymous
| The fact that Israel has existed does not automatically mean that considering it not existing is horrific. Nations have broken up before. Personally, I think Israel is here to stay, no matter whose rights were violated as a result of its founding. It is unproductive to imagine alternate realities. |
Anonymous
Speaking of alternate realities, one of the alternate futures one can imagine is a one-state solution modeled on South Africa, where Palestinians and Israelis agree that peace is important enough to overlook the past and live together in a one-person-one-vote commonwealth uniting all the lands west of the Jordan. I know it would not be easy, but I am pretty sure there are many Israelis and many Palestinians who would be comfortable living in such a country. The big question is where does another Mandela come from? |
Anonymous
| Keep dreaming... |
Anonymous
| I think that there are many supporters residing in the U.S. who help finance Israel that really do not want what you propose 15:03 |
Anonymous
| The Israelis would not accept such an arrangement. They want an explicitly Jewish state because as minorities worldwide, they have been treated horribly in so many countries in the past. The only way this happens is if they cannot settle anything in the coming decades. Then the demographics will shift and make it so. |
Anonymous
It may get to the point where no one asks them. |
Anonymous
That is what I am afraid of, that they are digging such a wide and deep whole for themselves with continuing build new settlments and rejecting an compromises at all. I do think what happened with the deaths on the Turkish vesssel at the blockade may not have been the fault of the Israelis at all but they have recently done other things that make it impossible to consider them the victims. In particular, the new settlements. |
Anonymous
I'm the dreamer of 15:03, and I am absolutely sure that you are right. But there were a lot of people here and in South Africa who thought Truth and Reconciliation was an unrealistic dream. It was, but the right dreamer came along. Probably won't happen again -- sigh! |
Anonymous
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Yes, but it's not all peace, love, and happiness there. Right now IMO it kind of works because blacks have political power and whites have the economic clout. But when economic redistribution hits (and it should), there is going to be conflict just like elsewhere. And there are racial tensions today.
It is a great outcome for blacks, and not necessarily a bad one for whites, but Israelis would lose a lot that they want. |
Anonymous
They would gain too, diversity and multiculturalism. I love that about DC, they should give it a try. |